Formula 1 2014: General Discussion Thread

mickdw · 20-10-2014 5:30pm

I find it hard to believe that any engineer would certify it fit for the track if it wasn't a suitable repair. If they certified a botched fix and that went on to kill the driver, they would be jailed.
I'm going with the theory that it just needed stiffening to improve handling stability and was never in danger of breaking.
Why would an engineer put their head on the block for a dying team. They simply wouldn't.

Scotty # · 20-10-2014 8:30pm

Ghost Train wrote: »

Horner has announced their line up as Dani and Danial

Alonso and Vettel haven't officially said who they'll be with yet

I'll be very disappointed if the (probably) best F1 driver in F1 today is not actually in F1. McLaren is really his only option at this stage unless they buy out Massa or a totally new team is coming that we don't know about yet.

RedBull have slipped up here big time in my opinion, if Alonso was available and they didn't sign him. I know they like to stick to their young driver programme but missed opportunity I think.

Infoanon · 20-10-2014 10:39pm

mickdw wrote: »

I find it hard to believe that any engineer would certify it fit for the track if it wasn't a suitable repair. If they certified a botched fix and that went on to kill the driver, they would be jailed.
I'm going with the theory that it just needed stiffening to improve handling stability and was never in danger of breaking.
Why would an engineer put their head on the block for a dying team. They simply wouldn't.

It would not be the first time this has happened in a financially struggling F1 team.

HRT were 'racing' with parts well past their maximum mileage - though both drivers were made aware and were given the chance to withdraw.

MaggotBrain · 21-10-2014 12:48am

Alonso gone to Honda yet??

Frank Bullitt · 21-10-2014 2:56am

Infoanon wrote: »

It would not be the first time this has happened in a financially struggling F1 team.

HRT were 'racing' with parts well past their maximum mileage - though both drivers were made aware and were given the chance to withdraw.

You would think that the FIA would have some safety standards about parts going beyond their work life.

Cookie_Monster · 21-10-2014 3:35am

Gintonious wrote: »

I think Kamui was right to be a bit afraid of what might happen.

it's not like they're able to go fast enough for it to matter :pac:

seriously though if it's signed off by FIA fine, if not then it's a bit much and they should not have been allowed put the car on track at all.

bbability · 21-10-2014 8:28am

It looks like Nico Hulkenberg retains his seat at Force India for 2015. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/sports/racing/top-stories/Nico-Hulkenberg-to-continue-with-Force-India-in-2015-season/articleshow/44887082.cms

Myrddin · 21-10-2014 2:57pm

This is something I should know the answer to by now, but how is ERS deployed this year? Is it still manual deployment by the driver, or are particular circuits 'mapped' & it's automatically deployed (removed from the driver in other words)?

mickdw · 21-10-2014 3:13pm

Myrddin wrote: »

This is something I should know the answer to by now, but how is ERS deployed this year? Is it still manual deployment by the driver, or are particular circuits 'mapped' & it's automatically deployed (removed from the driver in other words)?

There is no button to release extra energy like other years, is all on the accelerator pedal but obviously they have numerous modes which they can toggle through that define harvesting rates and I guess output.
I don't think they are allowed to map the system in terms of setting up automatically for didn't tracks. I think it must be driver controlled.

Myrddin · 21-10-2014 3:16pm

mickdw wrote: »

There is no button to release extra energy like other years, is all on the accelerator pedal but obviously they have numerous modes which they can toggle through that define harvesting rates and I guess output.
I don't think they are allowed to map the system in terms of setting up automatically for didn't tracks. I think it must be driver controlled.

I see, so if it's all done through the pedal & circuits can't be mapped for it...its operation must be controlled by specific engine maps (ERS deployment always ON / ERS harvesting mode ON deployment OFF etc etc)?

mickdw · 21-10-2014 3:18pm

Myrddin wrote: »

I see, so if it's all done through the pedal & circuits can't be mapped for it...its operation must be controlled by specific engine maps (ERS deployment always ON / ERS harvesting mode ON deployment OFF etc etc)?

I believe they have various rates of harvesting and stored power deployment altered via steering wheel toggles.

Myrddin · 21-10-2014 3:25pm

mickdw wrote: »

I believe they have various rates of harvesting and stored power deployment altered via steering wheel toggles.

As in ERS@50/60/70/80/90% deployment & similar for harvesting? How will all this play out when the radio bans on assistance tighten up next season?

mickdw · 21-10-2014 3:38pm

Myrddin wrote: »

As in ERS@50/60/70/80/90% deployment & similar for harvesting? How will all this play out when the radio bans on assistance tighten up next season?

I'm sure it's more complex than we can imagine, they deploy some stored power to spin up the turbo to prevent lag etc so im certain there are 100s of variables at play.
At the end of the day, im sure it's bundled for the drivers into understandable packages such as fuel saving, hammertime, engine saving or at least will be if radio instruction is banned.

Myrddin · 21-10-2014 3:44pm

mickdw wrote: »

I'm sure it's more complex than we can imagine, they deploy some stored power to spin up the turbo to prevent lag etc so im certain there are 100s of variables at play.
At the end of the day, im sure it's bundled for the drivers into understandable packages such as fuel saving, hammertime, engine saving or at least will be if radio instruction is banned.

But within all of that, ERS is managed by modes on the steering wheel? Grand, cheers

21-10-2014 4:09pm

The complexity of harvesting is the main reason for the use of fly-by-wire braking this year, it's too complex to expect a driver to change brake balance, harvesting etc. before each corner and then predict how that change will affect the braking effect for the next corner. Moving the brake-bias interacts with how much harvesting will occur in the next braking zone as well.
For fuel saving I assume there's a few different modes which will change at different tracks. Somewhere like Monaco with short acceleration zones and short braking zones will be different to somewhere like China or Canada. Hypothetically Canada with heavy braking and longish straights may lead to the ERS being deployed early in acceleration to allow better traction with less fuel use until later in the straights, obviously tuned for different engines.
Then again I'm not sure how the KERS is most efficient at harvesting. Maybe the consistent braking somewhere like Monaco is actually the most efficient way to harvest rather than fewer bigger braking events.
It's all very complicated. :P

Infoanon · 21-10-2014 7:53pm

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

it's not like they're able to go fast enough for it to matter :pac:

seriously though if it's signed off by FIA fine, if not then it's a bit much and they should not have been allowed put the car on track at all.

FIA 'sign off ' the cars at the beginning of the weekend, the suspension was damaged during practice and the reality is that the team were the only ones aware of the spare parts shortage.

Cars then get scrutineered again at the end of the race, except of course the car was retired due to brake issues....

flazio · 22-10-2014 12:28am

I thought the cars get scrutineered after quali when put into Parc Ferme?

Going Strong · 22-10-2014 8:28am

More problems for Caterham. The administrators won't allow the cars to leave the factory for Austin until some money turns up. Looks like they might not last the season.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/10/21/uk-motor-racing-caterham-idUKKCN0IA1UQ20141021?type=formulaOne

Infoanon · 22-10-2014 8:32am

Going Strong wrote: »

More problems for Caterham. The administrators won't allow the cars to leave the factory for Austin until some money turns up. Looks like they might not last the season.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/10/21/uk-motor-racing-caterham-idUKKCN0IA1UQ20141021?type=formulaOne

Was it not reported that the cars went to Germany to avoid this scenario ?

_rebelkid · 22-10-2014 12:29pm

OSI wrote: »

They can be randomly selected for scrutineering, but I don't think every car is. And I believe they only things checked are the likes of weight, wing heights etc

This was the post qualy check at the Russian GP

Frank Bullitt · 22-10-2014 7:24pm

PitLaneTalk @pitlanetalk · 1h 1 hour ago
According to Autosprint, there are alarming bells coming from Maranello that the 2015 Ferrari could be slower than the current one.

Oh my, Vettel might be having second thoughts.

22-10-2014 7:25pm

Impressive stuff from Ferrari. :P

Frank Bullitt · 22-10-2014 7:31pm

If this is true, and it's a big IF, Ferrari are very much in trouble., but it's still very early yet.

I wonder if Vettel is having second thoughts.

smellslikeshoes · 22-10-2014 8:07pm

Caterham press release.

Sounds like some cluster****, hopefully it can be resolved but it doesn't look good.

Killinator · 22-10-2014 10:19pm

Didn't see it posted already but according to SSN Mclaren's Sam Michael will be leaving at the end of the year.

mickdw · 22-10-2014 11:04pm

Killinator wrote: »

Didn't see it posted already but according to SSN Mclaren's Sam Michael will be leaving at the end of the year.

Thats mclaren back to winning ways then.
That fella is a disaster. Whenever he walks into a senior position in a team, they go backwards.

Jordan 199 · 23-10-2014 12:47am

Blast from the past here: the six-wheeled Williams FW07D.

Article about it here.

23-10-2014 1:00am

mickdw wrote: »

Thats mclaren back to winning ways then.
That fella is a disaster. Whenever he walks into a senior position in a team, they go backwards.

I'll never understand the logic in signing someone who resigned after presiding over Williams' worst ever start to a season. But that's just me.

Frank Bullitt · 23-10-2014 6:00am

I wonder who they will get to replace him.

Ross Brawns name to be mentioned in 3...2...1

Going Strong · 23-10-2014 8:34am

mickdw wrote: »

Thats mclaren back to winning ways then.
That fella is a disaster. Whenever he walks into a senior position in a team, they go backwards.

And yet wasn't he in so much demand thanks to his race strategies at Jordan in 1998/99? He must have been doing something right.

Re: Caterham, there's rumours now on Twitter that the doors are shut in Leafield this morning. Tomorrow is the freight deadline for getting the team to Austin so I don't think Caterham will be on the grid.

Infoanon · 23-10-2014 8:50am

On Caterham - if a team misses MORE than 3 races it is excluded from the F1 championship, only 3 races left and since the chances of finishing in the top 10 are slim, Caterham have nothing to lose.

Charlie-Bravo · 23-10-2014 9:33am

Weird tweet by Fernandes: "If you buy something you should pay for it. Quite simple"

Did the investors pay-up for the race company?!!

Going Strong · 23-10-2014 10:22am

astrofluff wrote: »

Weird tweet by Fernandes: "If you buy something you should pay for it. Quite simple"

Did the investors pay-up for the race company?!!

I think it's more about *what* they actually bought. Fernandes says they've bought everything while the new owners claim that there were some of Fernandes' own debts hidden within the sale items. Either way, Caterham is done for. The factory at Leafield has been confirmed as being closed today and staff told not to show up for work.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/10/23/uk-motor-racing-caterham-idUKKCN0IC0TV20141023

Scotty # · 23-10-2014 12:10pm

Bernie is on the case...

BBC SPORT wrote:

Formula 1 boss Bernie Ecclestone is trying to resolve the dispute threatening the future of Caterham.
The team's participation in next week's US Grand Prix is in doubt after administrators locked down their factory on Thursday.
"We're trying to help in any way we, which we do with anybody that has run into a bit of difficulty," Ecclestone told BBC Sport.
"All I know is what I've been told. Not too sure it's all true either."
Ecclestone said he could not say whether the team had a future because "it is a little bit too complicated to be able to say anything with any real knowledge".

Read the rest here: http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/formula1/29737238

Going Strong · 23-10-2014 12:16pm

Yet he won't 'resolve' the issue of himself and his myriad of shell companies along with CVC taking millions out of F1 but putting nothing back in. And that's before we get to the joke that is bonus legacy payments to the likes of Ferrari and McLaren who are currently being thrashed by cash-strapped midfield teams. :rolleyes:

_rebelkid · 23-10-2014 1:08pm

Now the "buyer" has chimed in...

PopePalpatine · 23-10-2014 1:36pm

So, in a way, Fernandes has defrauded them?

_rebelkid · 23-10-2014 1:51pm

PopePalpatine wrote: »

So, in a way, Fernandes has defrauded them?

Essentially yes. They paid the money for the shares, and he never transferred them. It's weird that it's taken over 3 months for this to come to a head really...

_rebelkid · 23-10-2014 4:10pm

Guess what, Fernandes says the exact opposite.

Frank Bullitt · 23-10-2014 6:03pm

Tony Fernandez's involvement with F1 has been nothing short of a farce, at least with HRT they were honest and never hid the fact that they were crap.

With Fernandez he always barked on about progress up the grid, and its been a circus ever since, and even now after he has apparently "sold" the team.

Peoples jobs are at risk over this, and its nothing more than a pissing contest for him and the new buyers, shame on him.

_rebelkid · 23-10-2014 7:09pm

Guess what 2.0, Engavest have said the opposite to Fernandes... again...

mickdw · 23-10-2014 7:40pm

Going Strong wrote: »

And yet wasn't he in so much demand thanks to his race strategies at Jordan in 1998/99? He must have been doing something right.

Yes, no doubt he is a super intelligent chap, did alot of work with Jordan in setting up suspension simulation rigs as far as I've heard.
Most likely a better hands on tech guy that a senior manager though and has therefore moved teams backwards in the senior positions.

SamAK · 23-10-2014 9:04pm

On an unrelated topic, It's curious how JEV doesn't remember what his first race trophy looked like. I presume this means that it's long been lost, which must sting a bit!

http://www.formula1.com/news/interviews/2014/10/16520.html

Cookie_Monster · 23-10-2014 9:26pm

The Fernandes press release reads like a childs understanding of buying a business tbh. You give me the money and then pay all the bills and if I feel like it I'll give you the shares at some point. Seriously shady dealings in there and I reckon that he's trying to hide something between the F1 company itself and the management company...

AMKC · 23-10-2014 11:05pm

Oh my, Vettel might be having second thoughts.

A ferrari thats slower than the last one lol. Will that be a new first lol.

Buttonftw. Friends Impressive stuff from Ferrari.

Ha lol indeed Maybe they decided to make the next car a bit slower so the current one will not look as bad and maybe the one after next years might look better then lol as they will have made that one a bit faster.

greedygoblin · 23-10-2014 11:55pm

I think it's a bit early to judge yet if next years Ferrari is going to be slower than the current one. It's still only october like!

Jordan 199 · 24-10-2014 12:19am

Going Strong wrote: »

And yet wasn't he in so much demand thanks to his race strategies at Jordan in 1998/99? He must have been doing something right.

Sam Michael the race engineer for Ralf Schumacher and Heinz Harald Frentzen at Jordan. The Michael and Frentzen partnership worked very well in 1999 with HHF getting two wins at Magny Cours* and Monza as well as a load of podiums. Frentzen was awesome in '99

*At the wet French GP in '99 Heinz-Harald finished the race with about half a litre of fuel in the tank :eek:

Going Strong · 24-10-2014 10:12am

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

The Fernandes press release reads like a childs understanding of buying a business tbh. You give me the money and then pay all the bills and if I feel like it I'll give you the shares at some point. Seriously shady dealings in there and I reckon that he's trying to hide something between the F1 company itself and the management company...

He seems to have left a lot of the running of the team to others which would explain why it was so over-staffed and under-performing. I saw it said elsewhere that Mike Gascoyne "did a number on him" when it came to promises of success and what have you.

I'm not a soccer fan but does anyone know if Fernandes has a different attitude towards that sport with his ownership of QPR? I've seen stuff where people said he was a lot happier with his football club than with his F1 team.

Zcott · 24-10-2014 11:04am

Apparently Marussia are struggling badly and need a cash injection to get to Austin and Brazil. Tough times at the back of the grid :-(

wobbles · 24-10-2014 12:27pm

Not looking good for the smaller teams at all. Wasnt there ment to be an American team starting next year or has that been cancelled.

With so many teams in financial trouble and the option for 3 car teams, what kind of notice do the teams need in order to have a 3rd car ready in time. Can you imagine the frenzy trying to sign up an extra race driver from all the teams if it were to happen.

Formula 1 2014: General Discussion Thread

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