begging

rob316 · 22-09-2014 10:54pm #1

The begging in the city is getting worse and worse. Walk down town in the evening and you are likely to be asked for change 5 or 6 times.

I'm not talking about lads sitting on the pavement, people who actually walk up to you asking for money. Some heavily intoxicated which I imagine would intimidate some people.

minidazzler · 22-09-2014 11:53pm

Been noticing it more and more outside shops and ATMs. And for some reason the beggars seem quite young in a lot of cases, early 20s.

Jimmy Bottles · 23-09-2014 9:09am

Remember walking over Patrick's Bridge in the late 80s. No joke you would have had up 10 beggers on each side of the bridge.

whisky_galore · 23-09-2014 9:13am

Either the services aren't working or people are being soft touches which encourages more of it.
Or all of the above?

Red Nissan · 23-09-2014 9:20am

whisky_galore wrote: »

Either the services aren't working or people are being soft touches which encourages more of it.
Or all of the above?

But this message cannot get through to people. Beggars can earn €50 to €200 and hour at peak times and peak locations. Every time a UCC or CIT student does an undercover report they caome back supporting this amount of earnings.

mcko · 23-09-2014 9:26am

don't give and they will disappear, I was in town last week and there were some pretty scary people hanging around, it is beginning to look a bit like Dublin with junkies hanging around.

whisky_galore · 23-09-2014 9:37am

There was a wan standing over a guy who appeared to be in a bad way in a doorway on Oliver P street a few months ago. Tries to call me, I walk past and then shes spouts a tirade of abuse for ignoring her.

Thought it was a 'double act' so don't want to get involved in that.

The ones that ask to 'borrow' €2 are some laugh, as if they're going to give it back to you at some point!

northgirl · 23-09-2014 9:39am

There's definitely an element of soft touch around this. Many of these individuals are "professionals" in their activity. I've noticed in the last number of months more and more of them have dogs with them which seems to garner them more attention and donations.

Balmed Out · 23-09-2014 9:44am

Red Nissan wrote: »

But this message cannot get through to people. Beggars can earn €50 to €200 and hour at peak times and peak locations. Every time a UCC or CIT student does an undercover report they caome back supporting this amount of earnings.

Ill never forget being in college and waiting for a bus. I went to head into the shop to get cigarettes something to eat and a drink. Feeling sorry for a beggar I gave him some money so I couldn't afford the cigarettes. There were two tills and even though the same beggar came in after me he got served before me. He pulls out a massive roll of notes.
Takes one 100 pound note out and buys several boxes of major. The roll seemed to have a fair few more 100 pound notes and this at a time that they were few and far between. He was out begging while having thousands in his pocket. Ill give soup and sandwiches but slow to give money since.

whisky_galore · 23-09-2014 9:47am

northgirl wrote: »

There's definitely an element of soft touch around this. Many of these individuals are "professionals" in their activity. I've noticed in the last number of months more and more of them have dogs with them which seems to garner them more attention and donations.

People should cop on to this as a heartstring-pulling stunt, but there will always be the 'ah shure God luv dem' attitude which makes it such a cash cow for them.

Manach · 23-09-2014 9:48am

In some cases there does appear to a measure of genuine need or other issues that propel people to ask for alms. Unfortunately these are now seem to be eclipsed by a those who would seek to aid in supplementing their income. The areas around the railway seem to have much more than usual people looking for fare to travel back to their destination than recent years.

gimmick · 23-09-2014 9:52am

I am obviously one of those "soft touches" who "encourages" these people then. While some are masters of their own downfall others are genuine tough luck stories. Though I will make an assumption before giving anything.

rob316 · 23-09-2014 10:25am

Red Nissan wrote: »

But this message cannot get through to people. Beggars can earn €50 to €200 and hour at peak times and peak locations. Every time a UCC or CIT student does an undercover report they caome back supporting this amount of earnings.

People are been soft touches or has I mentioned above feel intimidated.
The people that walk up to ya in street should be given academy awards for some of the acting, I have had a junkie cry in front of me before. My girlfriend wanted to empty her purse but I just walked on.

Regarding your point on the money been made, just yesterday I was in Centra on Washington St, there is a begger in every doorway along there. I spotted a young girl on the way in, as I was in the queue she was ahead of me and asked the fella behind the counter to change her coin to a note, no world of a lie she must of produced 30/40 €2 coins.

I never give these people money, what I will do when I'm going into a shop and the lad camped outside looks genuine I'll ask would you like something to eat? A genuine case will say please if they aren't you'll be told to **** off give me money. I wouldn't see someone go hungry.

.red. · 23-09-2014 1:03pm

I remember reading a report in a paper a few years back on "homeless" people living on a beach somewhere across europe. Cant remember where but it was one of swanky resorts. They lived on a beach in tents during the summer and rented security boxes for personal belongings. They begged for the summer and moved into hostels for the winter. It was estimated they earned anything between 50k and 80k per year. It was a lifestyle choice and it was thought that they earned more in a year than most of the people who were giving them money.
Not every "homeless" person or beggar is the same and some genuinely need the money but i dont give anything to any of them. A friend years ago wouldnt give money to a lad with a dog on the grand parade. Instead he bought a bottle of coke and a sandwich and gave it to him. He was very gratefull and thanked him for his kindness. We looked back a minute later to see the dog eating the sandwich. When he asked why the dog got it the beggar said he didnt like mayo. LOL.

Daisy03 · 23-09-2014 10:22pm

I have noticed this more and more too.

One saturday night, myself and two friends were walking by the back of the courthouse. It was relatively early (maybe 10.30) when a woman walked over to us. We kept our heads down and kept walking but she wouldn't let us go until we stopped. She had some spiel ready about some man giving her his cardigan which she was wearing and my friend offered her a large umbrella as it was pelting down and she was only wearing the cardigan and shorts.

She ignored the offer even though she said it her at least twice. Obviously only after one thing. We were afraid that she had people with her and it was pitch dark so we gave her some money. It was very intimidating, the way she called us first made us think she needed help.

darkdubh · 23-09-2014 11:15pm

The Roma professional beggars are easy to spot.Always the same ones in the same places.There are a lot of people out there who have fallen on hard times but I agree there seems to be a lot of heroin addicts around lately who are very forthright in their begging and they can be quite intimidating.

Henry94 · 24-09-2014 10:29am

The city is looking terrible these days with so many empty shops, beggars and low-life types. Very sad to see and I'm not sure how it can be turned around.

whisky_galore · 24-09-2014 10:39am

Can't tell the chancers and Oscar nominees from the genuine cases so none of them are getting anything from me. If they get intimidating they'll be running the risk of a smack. I'll support real local charities and not the dawfake collectors with 'charities' that I've never heard of before.

biko · 24-09-2014 10:46am

I only give to local homeless people I've seen around town (Galway) for some time and I know they have problems.
There's also a cafe here that does coffee "on hold" (you pay for extra coffee and they give it to a homeless person).

Cybercommando · 24-09-2014 11:10am

There are two young girls going around town asking for money for a bus to Midleton.

They asked me for 50 cent about a month ago, saying they just need it to pay for a bus ticket. They were only about 17 or 18 and didn't really seem like junkies, just maybe emo types who hang around outside Tesco Paul street. I gave them the 50cent anyway as they seemed genuine.

Two weeks later, I came across them again. "Excuse me, we're trying to get to Midleton and we just need 50cent to get the ticket". They didn't recognize me. I asked them "Are you still stuck in Cork? I gave you money for the bus ticket a few weeks ago!" They looked shocked and started to make up an excuse "Yeah but, but.. but.. yes... but.." I just told them to feck off.

So watch out for two young girls looking for bus money. Maybe they're junkies in the early stages. First met them on Cornmarket street, second encounter was around the dodgy carpark on Grattan street.

whisky_galore · 24-09-2014 11:23am

Asking for bus ticket money is the oldest trick in the book, used to be 20p to 'phone home' before, they can't pull that one anymore now that nearly all the phone boxes are gone.

northgirl · 24-09-2014 11:30am

Henry94 wrote: »

The city is looking terrible these days with so many empty shops, beggars and low-life types. Very sad to see and I'm not sure how it can be turned around.

I was around town yesterday evening between 5 and 6 and nearly every time I go in these days I think it's getting rougher and rougher. Some manic / menacing looking groups of people around.

Cybercommando · 24-09-2014 12:34pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

Asking for bus ticket money is the oldest trick in the book, used to be 20p to 'phone home' before, they can't pull that one anymore now that nearly all the phone boxes are gone.

I don't entertain those requests, but the thing is, they were just two teenagers who didn't look scummy. Just Emo-ish. I didn't know we had Emo beggers. Now I do.

The_Banker · 24-09-2014 4:22pm

Jaysus, Im lost....
Whats an "emo" ?

whisky_galore · 24-09-2014 4:23pm

The_Banker wrote: »

Jaysus, Im lost....
Whats an "emo" ?

A bit like a Goth or a Curehead.
It's the new thing now, like.

the beer revolu · 24-09-2014 4:36pm

Emo. New?
Emos have been hanging around Paul Street for about a decade. Mostly middle class and wouldn't be seen dead begging but I guess when a movement/trend has been around as long as Emo has, it starts to attract people from all backgrounds.

evilivor · 24-09-2014 5:13pm

The_Banker wrote: »

Jaysus, Im lost....
Whats an "emo" ?

It's okay - nobody understands them…

SusieBlue · 24-09-2014 9:19pm

I agree that Cork city has become really rough, lots of dodgy characters hanging around.

I'm quite good at discerning the difference between actual homeless people and junkies, but I can still sometimes be fooled.

I've also noticed a lot of very young well dressed beggars lately - about two weeks ago there was a girl no older than 20 sitting by Uncle Pete's by Paul St. sitting with a cup in front of her, while texting off an iPhone! Also another girl outside Vera Moda immaculately dressed (well, she had decent clothes, clean shoes and a face full of make up on) asking for spare change. What's up with this?

Some of them do seem to make a career out of it and can always be seen in the same places, there's an elderly Roma lady consistently on the footbridge leading from Sullivan's Quay to Grand Parade, and I get really upset seeing other elderly people handing her notes, feeling sorry for her, none the wiser to the fact that she most certainly isn't homeless.

Just makes me sad that these fraudsters are getting money from good hearted people when those who genuinely need it are looked over.

54kroc · 24-09-2014 9:50pm

Anyone got a loan of a fiver? I need to pay for the broadband, I'll take paypal or bitcoin :pac:

Walking out of town I got asked for a smoke one night not so long ago by several chaps in their late teens, I refused and a few minutes later I was greeted with the bunch looking for a fight, twas pretty funny.

Straight Talker · 24-09-2014 10:45pm

Henry94 wrote: »

The city is looking terrible these days with so many empty shops, beggars and low-life types. Very sad to see and I'm not sure how it can be turned around.

I was back home for two weeks recently and i thought the city was in good shape tbh.I walked around town and i didn't have any problems.The tourists i saw seemed to be enjoying themselves as well.I did notice a lot of drug addicted young people begging alright but i walked around the city without feeling the slightest bit put out.I know Cork is not perfect and it has it's issues but i would argue that they are smaller towns around the country that are rougher than Cork.Times are hard with the economy the way it is but i don't agree with the notion that the city is falling apart with undesirables lurking about at every street corner.I think Limerick is worse for aggressive on street begging.

GoTheDistance · 24-09-2014 10:52pm

gimmick wrote: »

I am obviously one of those "soft touches" who "encourages" these people then. While some are masters of their own downfall others are genuine tough luck stories. Though I will make an assumption before giving anything.

That's the problem - it's very difficult for most of us to figure out who are the genuine cases and who are the 'professionals'. I've been noticing Patrick's Street is attracting more beggars of late particularly of the walk up kind rather than those sitting down at the side of the street. Many of us then just take the stance that we won't give just in case.

minidazzler · 24-09-2014 10:52pm

The young lads asking for money outside the shop on Washington Street are my biggest annoyance. Every single day there is a rotation of 3 people, all asking for money when I am going into get a pack of chewing gum or whatever before working my bollix off. You'd think they'd try to use some of their ample free time to improve their lot, but they're dead happy where they are.

Fabio · 25-09-2014 4:14am

How do you suggest they "use their ample free time to improve their lot" minidazzler? Where should they start, if you don't mind me asking?

pwurple · 25-09-2014 6:59am

Fabio wrote: »

How do you suggest they "use their ample free time to improve their lot" minidazzler? Where should they start, if you don't mind me asking?

Uh, the library for a start. Stuffed Full of free books to learn any skill they can imagine. If you can read you can learn absolutely anything you want.

FAS. Job-bridge. Volunteer work.

Do you have any idea what people in developing countries give for the services we have here?

I don't think it's too bad in town myself. In the daytime I've no issues bringing the kids in. I'd avoid the dodgey spot down by the bridge end of south mall, that's about it. There are a few people asking for change alright but they are generally polite and not intrusive. Never seen anyone get agressive about it.

mimihops · 25-09-2014 11:20am

Cybercommando wrote: »

There are two young girls going around town asking for money for a bus to Midleton.

They asked me for 50 cent about a month ago, saying they just need it to pay for a bus ticket. They were only about 17 or 18 and didn't really seem like junkies, just maybe emo types who hang around outside Tesco Paul street. I gave them the 50cent anyway as they seemed genuine.

Two weeks later, I came across them again. "Excuse me, we're trying to get to Midleton and we just need 50cent to get the ticket". They didn't recognize me. I asked them "Are you still stuck in Cork? I gave you money for the bus ticket a few weeks ago!" They looked shocked and started to make up an excuse "Yeah but, but.. but.. yes... but.." I just told them to feck off.

So watch out for two young girls looking for bus money. Maybe they're junkies in the early stages. First met them on Cornmarket street, second encounter was around the dodgy carpark on Grattan street.

I have come across these girls twice over the past few months, first time in Wilton shopping centre and second time in town. Same story about the bus to Midleton. They just looked like your average emo type, wonder what their story is.

Herb Powell · 25-09-2014 12:27pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

A bit like a Goth or a Curehead.
It's the new thing now, like.

lol, emo has been dead since about 2008 I'd say, nothing new about them.

I'm just back in Cork after a year living in a decent-sized city in Germany, and I think it was much worse before, tbh.

Maybe the begging is just more aggressive in Germany (it can be pretty in-your-face, and there's lots of them) but I was really surprised when I got back, from all of the horror stories people had been telling.

As usual, bit of perspective needed, lads. Cork is not that bad.

mcko · 25-09-2014 1:09pm

Again it is a lack of a Garda presence on the streets, I can't remember when I last saw a Garda on the beat in town.

whisky_galore · 25-09-2014 1:49pm

mcko wrote: »

Again it is a lack of a Garda presence on the streets, I can't remember when I last saw a Garda on the beat in town.

All Guards can do is tell them to move. Once Guards are gone they're back at it again.

Ralf and Florian · 25-09-2014 2:46pm

WhiteRoses wrote: »

I agree that Cork city has become really rough, lots of dodgy characters hanging around.

I'm quite good at discerning the difference between actual homeless people and junkies, but I can still sometimes be fooled.

I've also noticed a lot of very young well dressed beggars lately - about two weeks ago there was a girl no older than 20 sitting by Uncle Pete's by Paul St. sitting with a cup in front of her, while texting off an iPhone! Also another girl outside Vera Moda immaculately dressed (well, she had decent clothes, clean shoes and a face full of make up on) asking for spare change. What's up with this?

Some of them do seem to make a career out of it and can always be seen in the same places, there's an elderly Roma lady consistently on the footbridge leading from Sullivan's Quay to Grand Parade, and I get really upset seeing other elderly people handing her notes, feeling sorry for her, none the wiser to the fact that she most certainly isn't homeless.

Just makes me sad that these fraudsters are getting money from good hearted people when those who genuinely need it are looked over.

You're right there,shes living on Evergreen St.

Aglomerado · 25-09-2014 3:10pm

Ralf and Florian wrote: »

You're right there,shes living on Evergreen St.

I used to see groups of Roma getting the bus into town from Rochestown in the mornings when I lived out that way.

I've stopped giving to beggars on the street now because I don't know who is genuine any more, which is sad. I suppose, the best way to help those truly in need would be to give to Simon/ Focus/ Cork Penny Dinners.

rob316 · 25-09-2014 4:53pm

mcko wrote: »

Again it is a lack of a Garda presence on the streets, I can't remember when I last saw a Garda on the beat in town.

They don't give a ****e, down daunt square last Saturday two junkies screaming at each other, can in the hand each, two cops stroll past just looked and did nothing.

They have more pressing issues to deal with anyway like checking car tax :rolleyes:

rob316 · 25-09-2014 4:58pm

Herb Powell wrote: »

lol, emo has been dead since about 2008 I'd say, nothing new about them.

I'm just back in Cork after a year living in a decent-sized city in Germany, and I think it was much worse before, tbh.

Maybe the begging is just more aggressive in Germany (it can be pretty in-your-face, and there's lots of them) but I was really surprised when I got back, from all of the horror stories people had been telling.

As usual, bit of perspective needed, lads. Cork is not that bad.

Its not that bad, Ive experienced Dublin and its much worse but why should we settle for the city centre going to ****. Near zero police presence and the ones that are around don't seem to care about this stuff.

Junkies, bums, homeless, beggers, shabby empty buildings left to rot, it doesn't exactly showcase the city in a good light.

Fabio · 25-09-2014 5:12pm

pwurple wrote: »

Uh, the library for a start. Stuffed Full of free books to learn any skill they can imagine. If you can read you can learn absolutely anything you want.

FAS. Job-bridge. Volunteer work.

Do you have any idea what people in developing countries give for the services we have here?

I don't think it's too bad in town myself. In the daytime I've no issues bringing the kids in. I'd avoid the dodgey spot down by the bridge end of south mall, that's about it. There are a few people asking for change alright but they are generally polite and not intrusive. Never seen anyone get agressive about it.

The library is a good place to start yes but for almost any job you need both an address, a permanent one, and a qualification of some form. To get that qualification, indeed to get any state benefits really, you need a postal address. Homeless people do not have that and therefore it is incredibly difficult to even start the process of lifting yourself up again.

The stories of homeless people making another start are rare for a reason. Because it is very difficult given their external circumstances. You and I may think we have it hard from time to time but we're here debating and discussing something online knowing we can eat later on, some homeless people (not all) have no idea when they will eat next and can't whip out the smart phone to see what FAS course might suit them (even if it were possible to do).

In developing countries people on the streets may actually find it easier to pick up the odd bit of casual work because the gap between rich and poor is, on average, not as bad as it might be here but mainly because casual labour is also a lot more common on the streets of many developing countries. It is not here.

Straight Talker · 25-09-2014 7:28pm

rob316 wrote: »

Its not that bad, Ive experienced Dublin and its much worse but why should we settle for the city centre going to ****. Near zero police presence and the ones that are around don't seem to care about this stuff.

Junkies, bums, homeless, beggers, shabby empty buildings left to rot, it doesn't exactly showcase the city in a good light.

Well the beggers and drug addict types are another thing and i agree that the guards have given up on policing the city centre but there's a lot of talk about closed businesses and abandoned shop fronts in the city.A lot of new businesses have opened up as well in the city centre over the course of the last year so i think things are evening themselves out on that front.

Herb Powell · 26-09-2014 8:18pm

rob316 wrote: »

Its not that bad, Ive experienced Dublin and its much worse but why should we settle for the city centre going to ****. Near zero police presence and the ones that are around don't seem to care about this stuff.

Junkies, bums, homeless, beggers, shabby empty buildings left to rot, it doesn't exactly showcase the city in a good light.

I agree with you there, it doesn't do the city's image any favours, but the way a lot of people go on about it you'd swear we were living in the worst corners of Detroit.

The thing is, if most places are worse (which they are), then visitors are generally going to have a good impression of the city.

Of course problems should be solved, and the best rate of this shhite is 0%, but that's an impossible standard and I just think people should calm down before resorting to cracking open each others skulls and feasting on the goo inside.

The_Kew_Tour · 26-09-2014 10:39pm

Coming home from game tonight I saw amblenence attending homeless people who be always begging in Douglas Street.

Hope they are OK, but they must wreck the staff who work in Spar and off licence few doors up.

pwurple · 27-09-2014 10:59am

Fabio wrote: »

The library is a good place to start yes but for almost any job you need both an address, a permanent one, and a qualification of some form. To get that qualification, indeed to get any state benefits really, you need a postal address. Homeless people do not have that and therefore it is incredibly difficult to even start the process of lifting yourself up again.

Sorry, but that's pure bull. Here's a raft of jobs that need no qualification. Builders labourers, landscaping, painters assistant, waiter, kitchen worker, laundry work. Apprenticeships are the same. no address required for any of those, and if there is, no reason in the world a family member, po box, homeless shelter or friend can't be used as an address. There are services available for that too.

The stories of homeless people making another start are rare for a reason. Because it is very difficult given their external circumstances.

Or more likely, because homelessness is complex. It's a myriad of reasons ranging from mental health issues, to addiction, immigration, exploitation, to just being a frikken dickhead who has fallen out with every single member of their family and friends. People who are temporarily homeless can, and do pick themselves up and get back on track. People with serious underlying issues like alcoholism or drug addiction are likely quickly get back into the same homeless situation again, repeatedly. No matter what anyone gives them.

Ralf and Florian · 27-09-2014 10:15pm

Be wary of this big fat guy with a beard and balding curly hair about 30 and sounds like a traveller.He is very aggressive in his begging and is not averse to standing in front of people blocking their way and going up to people using ATMs.

ROY RACE · 28-09-2014 7:47am

Begging and heroin go hand in hand

Dave47 · 28-09-2014 3:22pm

Ralf and Florian wrote: »

Be wary of this big fat guy with a beard and balding curly hair about 30 and sounds like a traveller.He is very aggressive in his begging and is not averse to standing in front of people blocking their way and going up to people using ATMs.

fella got harassed today near atm and he had a small child with him. Incidentally didn't see a garda patrol all day.

darkdubh · 28-09-2014 10:21pm

Dave47 wrote: »

fella got harassed today near atm and he had a small child with him. Incidentally didn't see a garda patrol all day.

The beggar or the guy using the atm?

begging

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