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LOG HOUSE "NOT CABIN"

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  • 24-02-2010 10:17pm
    #1
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭


    JUST WONDERING IF ANY1 HAS EXPERIANCE WIT LOG HOUSES AS IM LUKING INTO THEM AT THE MO,NOT THE CABINS AN ACTUAL HOUSE,OR DOES ANY KNOW ANYTING ABOUT CANADIAN STYLE LOG HOUSES THE COST TO BUY 1 CHEERS


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    #2
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    Are you looking at the machined interlocking logs, or the natural , cleaned cut pared and stacked logs, I assume the latter. Its possible to get a manufactured log cabin , made of site , and delivered and erected at you site.

    Traditionally , felled logs were delivered to site, and then cut and prepped, alternate taper stacked one on top of the other. At about a meter high , steel rebar was drilled down at about 1200 centers around the perimeter, and then rebar was inserted. This was repeated through out the construction. Then all the joints were caulked and sealed. Due to the use of non kiln dried material all the window and door fitments were made to allow for expansion and contraction of the solid timber walls, using sliding fitment techniques. Basically cladding with timber to allow movement.

    I think one of your biggest hurdles is going to be , finding a county that is amicable to that type of construction from a planning point of view. And finding an architect / engineer that will sign off on that method of construction. Google planning applications may help you to establish if its an acceptable build method in a particular county. Might be worth posting a similar thread in planning and construction forum, for their advice on the planning side. Although I doubt that the construction methodology will be widely knon there, as its a rare form of construction here.

    I hope this helps.

    kadman


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    #3
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    HEY KADMAN TANX FOR THE REPLY YES IM TALKING ABOUT THE LATTER,WHY WOULD IT REALLY BE THAT HARD TO GET PLANNING FOR THAT TYPE OF HOUSE,IL BE BUILDING IN SOUTH TIPP BUT IM NOT SURE ABOUT ANYTHING REGARDING PLANNING,THE SITE IM LOOKING AT IS IN A RURAL PART OF THE COUNTRY,DO YOU KNOW OF ANY OF THEESE STYLE HOUSES IN THE COUNTRY,


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    #4
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    The reason that you may have difficulty withg regards the planning is that some authorities may be reluctant to give planning permission to a build system that they may be unfamiliar with, fear of new concepts.

    There was great reluctance to timber framed manufactured houses here at one time, and now its more or less the norm. Even though a large number of them have been erected by in experienced framers, and its only a question of time before these errors become apparent, but thats for another thread.

    I have read on the forums somewhere of an experienced log cabin builder who went to great lengths to introduce the concept here years ago, but he was met with extreme opposition to the log cabin idea. Hopefully he persevered and is building them.

    From a building regs point of view, I,d assume that the stumbling block may be to find some one who will prove on paper that it meets all the energy regs. And as its a different build concept, most will shy away from it, through ignorance of the concept, moreso than its lack in build quality.

    Try a post on Construction and Planning, for the planning issues. You may find some one there that will sign off on a log cabin build, I doubt it though. If you are going to persue the idea, I worked with an extremely knowledgeable romanian engineer who has worked in canada on log cabin designs, and maybe a hook up between you 2, and you might source a cabin from there.

    kadman

    PS. take the caps lock of your keyboard and stop shouting in CAPITALS:)


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    #5
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    caps lock off,ya thats true most people are so small minded they"re afraid to try new things,as far as i know a log house is just as strong and dureable as a block house and they last for generations,ya im just researching everyting at the moment so nothings for certain yet,i have a good friend living out in canada at the mo too so thats handy if it is going to happen,i put this in the planning and construction and a mod got back to me and said they"re shouldn"t be any probs with planning


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    #6
    ednwireland
    Registered Users Posts: 14,291 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    your post reminded me of this finnish kit house built here:


    http://www.channel4.com/4homes/on-tv/grand-designs/episode-guides/kent-the-finnish-log-cabin-08-06-10_p_1.html


    http://www.erlund-house.com/

    My weather

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



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    #7
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    Good stuff.

    Did the mod elaborate. Is that his opinion, or did he ever get planning permission on a log cabin build. If he did, its good to know. If its just his opinion, then there,s a lot more digging for you to do.

    Personally I think they are an excellent build method, and would definitely tick all the boxes for me.

    Maybe you should send galwaydude a pm , as he,s extremely knowledgeable in the process, as he,s been involved in planning.

    kadman


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    #8
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    no he didnt really elaborate he just said you"d have a better chance if the site was in a wodded area which it is,ya they"re a beautiful house and looks well in the country side,the only thing is the cost i dont think there"d be much difference between 1 and a block house,prob cost that bit more than a block house,,i was checking a site in canada and they charge roughly 40-70 canadian dollars per sq foot and thats just your shell so you"ve to roof it doors windows etc your self.they charge higher for corners and slower work


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    #9
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    ednwireland wrote: »
    your post reminded me of this finnish kit house built here:


    http://www.channel4.com/4homes/on-tv/grand-designs/episode-guides/kent-the-finnish-log-cabin-08-06-10_p_1.html


    http://www.erlund-house.com/

    i actually saw that channel four 1 on grand designs a few weeks ago,nice job when it was done...


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    #10
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    muff munch wrote: »
    no he didnt really elaborate he just said you"d have a better chance if the site was in a wodded area which it is,ya they"re a beautiful house and looks well in the country side,the only thing is the cost i dont think there"d be much difference between 1 and a block house,prob cost that bit more than a block house,,i was checking a site in canada and they charge roughly 40-70 canadian dollars per sq foot and thats just your shell so you"ve to roof it doors windows etc your self.they charge higher for corners and slower work


    Did you consider building it yourself as a self build at any stage.

    kadman


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    #11
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    my brothers a fairly **** hot carpenter so he"d be doing it anyways(for a SMALL fee),but the companys build them in their yards and take them apart again and then ship them to u with 1log house builder to erect them again for you,just the shel that ls,and thats all in the price i think:confused:it only takes a few days to erect them


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    #12
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    muff munch wrote: »
    my brothers a fairly **** hot carpenter so he"d be doing it anyways(for a SMALL fee),but the companys build them in their yards and take them apart again and then ship them to u with 1log house builder to erect them again for you,just the shel that ls,and thats all in the price i think:confused:it only takes a few days to erect them

    You can choose any type of build package you want, normally with off site construction.
    If your brother is a good chippy, I,d look at erecting it myself. You,d probably save a few bob, so its an option. Off site construction methods in log cabin builds, will have a full package of construction drawings, that are straight for ward to follow. Either in timberframe, ICF, or log cabin build, you will receive a complete set of panel drawings, so you wont be left in the dark.

    Any log cabin manufacturer you contact, ask them for a video of a cabin erection taking place. One should be available for you. If the manufacturer is outside of Ireland, then the savings by self build , could be substantial. Worth checking out.

    kadman


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    #13
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    ya i was thinking of just letting the bro do the whole lot if it did save a few bob,anyways ill know more when the time comes i suppose,tanx for the replys kadman,hopefully it happens:D


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    #14
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    muff munch wrote: »
    ya i was thinking of just letting the bro do the whole lot if it did save a few bob,anyways ill know more when the time comes i suppose,tanx for the replys kadman,hopefully it happens:D

    If you cant get your hands on a vid of a log cabin build, let me know, I have one somewhere, that shows an on site construction from scratch. It would have to be copied from video to dvd though.

    kadman


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    #15
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    there is a few on utube but there only a couple of mins long,but il ave a search and see what i can find


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    #16
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    muff munch wrote: »
    there is a few on utube but there only a couple of mins long,but il ave a search and see what i can find

    If memory serves me well, my vid is about an hour long. I,ll try and dig it out.

    kadman


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    #17
    LK_Dave
    Closed Accounts Posts: 376 ✭✭LK_Dave


    I did a bit of research on this topic a few years ago; I was interested in a self build project. I came across a guy in the States who ran courses on self build log homes. His name was DeWelle 'Skip' Ellsworth, he is dead now (RIP) but his organisation still lives on. Since your brother is a chippy, you should check this guy and his method out. There are loads of clips on you tube of log home construction including energy efficient discussions.

    I didn't pursue it back then because I could not get any bank to give me a mortgage for this type of build....I never got as far as pre-planning meetings. I would advise of getting a pre-planning meeting with the planners to discuss the build. They have to give you the meeting and will find out if they have any issues with log homes. Remember keep notes, inc date, time, planners name etc of this meeting.

    The only draw back of a log home over a traditional brick/block build is thermal mass for log is light.......but timber frame houses also have a light thermal mass.


    http://www.loghomebuilders.org/


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    #18
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    I dont think you will have any trouble proving the thermal mass qualities of a log cabin build. There are ample studies available that will prove that log cabins efficiency will hit the mark.

    http://www.log-cabin-connection.com/thermal-mass.html

    kadman


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    #19
    galwaydude18
    Registered Users Posts: 3,695 ✭✭✭galwaydude18


    I reckon you would have any amount of trouble looking for planning permission for this type of construction in this bloody country.. It's terrible to be honest that it would be so difficult to obtain planning permission for it as it would be a wonderful looking structre compared to block and plaster, brick etc...

    The main reason it would be so difficult is that it is a very different method of house building over here compared to you bog standard block house that ALL planners are familir with.. Planners DO NOT like houses here in this country that look any way out of the ordinary and a log house would come under this.

    You can apply for planning permission but believe me that the planners will immediatly refuse the application after the first two months or look for further information about it.. I would almost bet that they would look for further information about the project and absolutly break your heart over it.

    You will need to be absolutly patient in applying for planning permission for it as it will not be easy.. It will take longer than your usual three months to be granted your planning permission for the application. I would advise you to get your drawings done up and try meet with the planning officer in your area and run through it with them and see what they say..

    Your major problem there is that you can't always believe what they tell you. I have on many many time heard them say oh ya no problem with the house and the client applies for the planning permission the are then turned down or further information sought for radical design alterations to the housed design after the planner has told them in their meeting it will be no problem.

    I know this is all negative but this is what you will face with the planners and you have to understand that it will be a very rocky road to go down and will more than likely take a long time..

    My best advice is get drawing of what you propose to do, arrange a meeting with the planning officer in your area, see what they say, lodge the application and get a very good local politican on your side so that they can possibly help you out with the application. Politicans can pull strings in them planning department. Oh ya it would be a good idea if you could get that politican to go along to the meeting with you as well as your architect / designer..

    Good luck and any further questions ask away!


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    #20
    Stephentlig
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,114 ✭✭✭Stephentlig


    Are log houses financially cheaper to buy than the normal average joey house?


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    #21
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    Stephentlig wrote: »
    Are log houses financially cheaper to buy than the normal average joey house?

    ive emailed a few manufacturers in canada and they average around 40-50 canadian dollars per sq ft carcass,it gets more expensive the more corners in the house


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    #22
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    galwaydude18 wrote: »
    I reckon you would have any amount of trouble looking for planning permission for this type of construction in this bloody country.. It's terrible to be honest that it would be so difficult to obtain planning permission for it as it would be a wonderful looking structre compared to block and plaster, brick etc...

    The main reason it would be so difficult is that it is a very different method of house building over here compared to you bog standard block house that ALL planners are familir with.. Planners DO NOT like houses here in this country that look any way out of the ordinary and a log house would come under this.

    You can apply for planning permission but believe me that the planners will immediatly refuse the application after the first two months or look for further information about it.. I would almost bet that they would look for further information about the project and absolutly break your heart over it.

    You will need to be absolutly patient in applying for planning permission for it as it will not be easy.. It will take longer than your usual three months to be granted your planning permission for the application. I would advise you to get your drawings done up and try meet with the planning officer in your area and run through it with them and see what they say..

    Your major problem there is that you can't always believe what they tell you. I have on many many time heard them say oh ya no problem with the house and the client applies for the planning permission the are then turned down or further information sought for radical design alterations to the housed design after the planner has told them in their meeting it will be no problem.

    I know this is all negative but this is what you will face with the planners and you have to understand that it will be a very rocky road to go down and will more than likely take a long time..

    My best advice is get drawing of what you propose to do, arrange a meeting with the planning officer in your area, see what they say, lodge the application and get a very good local politican on your side so that they can possibly help you out with the application. Politicans can pull strings in them planning department. Oh ya it would be a good idea if you could get that politican to go along to the meeting with you as well as your architect / designer..

    Good luck and any further questions ask away!

    ya i was thinking along the same lines my self but i suppose if you really want something youll have to fight for it,i know the local counsellor fairly well too,


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    #23
    galwaydude18
    Registered Users Posts: 3,695 ✭✭✭galwaydude18


    Well you will have a long and hard fight on your case. So long as you dont mind fighting it for between a year and at least three years. Best of luck with it


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    #24
    muff munch
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭muff munch


    galwaydude18 wrote: »
    Well you will have a long and hard fight on your case. So long as you dont mind fighting it for between a year and at least three years. Best of luck with it

    have you gone through this process your self or do you know some one who has,why do you think that so bad


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    #25
    Paddy777
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1 ✭Paddy777


    Hi everyone!

    There's this company "eco green future ltd". They offer unique hand-crafted log buildings. They built an office out of them massive logs for my brother-in-law in Garristown earlier this year, and i must say it's a true work of art. I mean it's a really really impressive stuff...
    Check their website www.ecogreenfuture.ie


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    #26
    jdmluder
    Registered Users Posts: 27 ✭jdmluder


    I was talking to an irish fella from ennis that builds log houses at the w10 show. Think i kept his card somewhere so will see if i can find it. He seemed to know his stuff. Just cant recall his name atm.


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    #27
    thierrys other hand
    Registered Users Posts: 41 ✭thierrys other hand


    hello. some really good advice on this thread. galwaydude-do you know what the story is with applying for planning after the log house is built? i heard of someone doing it but i don't know if its just a myth?


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    #28
    galwaydude18
    Registered Users Posts: 3,695 ✭✭✭galwaydude18


    You would have to apply for planning retention at a certain rate per square metre. I have clients seek retention before for normal concrete block built houses with great success but dont know about log houses


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    #29
    thierrys other hand
    Registered Users Posts: 41 ✭thierrys other hand


    thanks for that quick reply - i'll look into it a bit more


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