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Residents at Athlone asylum seekers centre refusing to eat

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  • 04-09-2014 9:16pm
    #1
    Crann na Beatha
    Registered Users Posts: 11,763 ✭✭✭✭


    This post has been deleted.


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    #2
    Augmerson
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭Augmerson


    Some of those people have been in the Direct Provision system for years. What is that costing the government? I'd imagine all of them just want to get out, get a home, find work, move on with their lives. A family member teaches one lad from Africa in one of her classes. Lovely lad, very respectful, always does his work. Lives in one of these places. It must be depressing as ****.

    Maybe that's the point. Make it so depressing and hard that people won't want to come here?


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    #3
    Tokyo
    Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,655 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tokyo


    Wouldn't mind seeing the stats on "escaped from conflict"? My guess is, those that have actually come from a place where their lives were in constant danger, and people were dropping around them from starvation, hunger striking is probably the last thing on their minds...


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    #4
    Molester Stallone II
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,459 ✭✭✭Molester Stallone II


    If I go on hunger strike will the gubberment look after me too!


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    #5
    Augmerson
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭Augmerson


    Molester Stallone II wrote: »
    If I go on hunger strike will the gubberment look after me too!

    Actually yeah I think the emergency services would have a duty to keep you alive?


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    #6
    Crann na Beatha
    Registered Users Posts: 11,763 ✭✭✭✭Crann na Beatha


    This post has been deleted.


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    #7
    Crann na Beatha
    Registered Users Posts: 11,763 ✭✭✭✭Crann na Beatha


    This post has been deleted.


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    #8
    skyhighflyer
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,149 ✭✭✭skyhighflyer


    You can't throw people in a camp and treat them like animals, which is effectively what's happening. This is a separate question from whether or not someone's asylum claim is genuine.

    I'd like if my tax money wasn't being used to house asylum seekers for years but I'd prefer even more if people who are stuck in these centres were allowed to work and *pay* tax rather than absorb it.

    What needs to be done is to speed up the processing of applications so that those who genuinely need asylum are granted it and non-genuine applications refused. In the meantime, it wouldn't hurt to treat those waiting with a bit of decency and respect.


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    #9
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    skyhighflyer wrote: »
    You can't throw people in a camp and treat them like animals, which is effectively what's happening. This is a separate question from whether or not someone's asylum claim is genuine.

    I'd like if my tax money wasn't being used to house asylum seekers for years but I'd prefer even more if people who are stuck in these centres were allowed to work and *pay* tax rather than absorb it.

    What needs to be done is to speed up the processing of applications so that those who genuinely need asylum are granted it and non-genuine applications refused. In the meantime, it wouldn't hurt to treat those waiting with a bit of decency and respect.


    Where do you plan on housing them?

    They will never integrate with the Irish and sure the way this island is going there is nearly nothing irish left about it.


    Rents are crazy even to the point ordinary hard workers can no longer afford it and have to move out of Dublin and other towns so as to keep a roof over their heads.


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    #10
    humanji
    Registered Users Posts: 19,976 ✭✭✭✭humanji


    Okay, I've had to delete several posts and have moved it over to Politics. Please note the forum charter.


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    #11
    skyhighflyer
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,149 ✭✭✭skyhighflyer


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Where do you plan on housing them?

    They will never integrate with the Irish and sure the way this island is going there is nearly nothing irish left about it.


    Rents are crazy even to the point ordinary hard workers can no longer afford it and have to move out of Dublin and other towns so as to keep a roof over their heads.

    If they get jobs they can pay for housing like you and me do? I figure I'm already paying for housing for vast numbers of Irish people who've never worked a day in their lives so I wouldn't mind paying to temporarily house a genuine asylum seeker who's looking for work.


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    #12
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    Augmerson wrote: »
    Some of those people have been in the Direct Provision system for years. What is that costing the government? .....

    someone is making plenty
    Currently, the average PPPD rate for direct provision centres is €29.49

    while the same contract rate for State-owned centres averages at €15.50.


    As at 8 June 2014, there were 4,353 persons availing of direct provision accommodation and supports in 34 accommodation centres across 16 counties. The expenditure outturn for the accommodation costs incurred by RIA in the last five years is as follows:
    Year Outturn
    2013 €55.2m
    2012 €62.3m
    2011 €69.5m
    2010 €79m
    2009 €86.5m


    http://www.nascireland.org/campaign-for-change/direct-provision/pq-direct-provision-expenditure-annual-cost/


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    #13
    johnnyskeleton
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 14,478 Mod ✭✭✭✭johnnyskeleton


    mike_ie wrote: »
    Wouldn't mind seeing the stats on "escaped from conflict"? My guess is, those that have actually come from a place where their lives were in constant danger, and people were dropping around them from starvation, hunger striking is probably the last thing on their minds...

    What if they are gay and come from a part of wedt africa where it is illegal to be gay, or they believe in democracy for their native Iran. The problem is that they cant live openly in their coubtry of origin and then they come to ireland and find themselves stuck in a system that doesnt allow them to have any self worth and limited freedom while it takes yesrs for their claims to be resolved or their cases to be heard? So you flee one oppressive state to a supposedly liberal democracy and are told "heres basic food and shelter, dont make a fuss, just be glad youre not in a hell hole where people are dying of starvation or armed conflict"?


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    #14
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Where do you plan on housing them?

    They will never integrate with the Irish and sure the way this island is going there is nearly nothing irish left about it.

    Rents are crazy even to the point ordinary hard workers can no longer afford it and have to move out of Dublin and other towns so as to keep a roof over their heads.

    Ohhh I dunno,Punisher5112...This lad appears to think different,albeit from more of a religious perspective...however,given his elevated status,Dr Ali Selim's opinions may well be somewhat more pertinent....;)

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/muslims-in-ireland-seek-integration-not-assimilation-1.1917937?fb_action_ids=635353163229296&fb_action_types=og.recommends&fb_ref=.VAiSNhMYayQ.like


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



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    #15
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    Ohhh I dunno,Punisher5112...This lad appears to think different,albeit from more of a religious perspective...however,given his elevated status,Dr Ali Selim's opinions may well be somewhat more pertinent....;)

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/muslims-in-ireland-seek-integration-not-assimilation-1.1917937?fb_action_ids=635353163229296&fb_action_types=og.recommends&fb_ref=.VAiSNhMYayQ.like


    I'm sorry, but could you explain what that post has to do with the thread?


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    #16
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,683 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    What's so bad about the free food they are being given? The link doesn't give much.


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    #17
    SilverScreen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,113 ✭✭✭SilverScreen


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    They will never integrate with the Irish and sure the way this island is going there is nearly nothing irish left about it.
    I find that most non-nationals are integrating with the Irish just fine. We're all stuck on the same small island, on a tiny planet floating in an infinite universe. I couldn't give a toss if there was nothing Irish left about this island. It would be of no significance in the grand scheme of things.
    Rents are crazy even to the point ordinary hard workers can no longer afford it and have to move out of Dublin and other towns so as to keep a roof over their heads.
    I find rent in Athlone just fine. No complaints there.


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    #18
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,683 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    SilverScreen wrote: »
    I couldn't give a toss if there was nothing Irish left about this island. It would be of no significance in the grand scheme of things.
    .

    Thank god not every Irish person is like you then...

    And it would have significance to plenty of Irish people.


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    #19
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    walshb wrote: »
    What's so bad about the free food they are being given? The link doesn't give much.

    Some more detail here

    "In a letter to management on August 3rd, residents say they do not receive enough food for children’s lunches or dinners and that families are paying for basic items out of their weekly allowances."
    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/asylum-seekers-refuse-food-in-protest-over-conditions-at-direct-provision-centre-1.1918296

    Seeing as this is an outsourced centre, its not too hard to imagine what's going on.


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    #20
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,683 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Nodin wrote: »
    Some more detail here

    "In a letter to management on August 3rd, residents say they do not receive enough food for children’s lunches or dinners and that families are paying for basic items out of their weekly allowances."
    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/asylum-seekers-refuse-food-in-protest-over-conditions-at-direct-provision-centre-1.1918296

    Seeing as this is an outsourced centre, its not too hard to imagine what's going on.

    Thanks for the link.

    So, these people are fleeing hardship I take it. Real hardship, otherwise they would hardly be traveling all the way here. I don't know the quality of the care provided or food provided, but seeing as it's all laid on and free, then maybe they are just chancing their arm. I wonder what their expectations are? It's an asylum centre, not a 4 star hotel. They should be fed/clothed and housed to a minimum standard at least. If the authorities can vouch for this and assure that it is happening then be grateful.

    I am surprised RAR haven't jumped on this yet...


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    #21
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    walshb wrote: »
    Thanks for the link.

    So, these people are fleeing hardship I take it. Real hardship, otherwise they would hardly be traveling all the way here. I don't know the quality of the care provided or food provided, but seeing as it's all laid on and free, then maybe they are just chancing their arm. ..........

    Or maybe the company which has the contract does the bare minimum to maximise profits, the world being the way it is.


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    #22
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,683 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Nodin wrote: »
    Or maybe the company which has the contract does the bare minimum to maximise profits, the world being the way it is.

    Sounds like a shrewd business model to me. Maybe those people in the center should do a pros and cons list for staying in the asylum process or returning to their home country. I bet staying put probably wins out.


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    #23
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,792 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    walshb wrote: »
    Sounds like a shrewd business model to me. Maybe those people in the center should do a pros and cons list for staying in the asylum process or returning to their home country. I bet staying out probably wins out.
    Posts like this depress the living crap out of me, because I would imagine they have a great deal of currency in the wider population. It would be comforting to think they were the views of only a tiny minority, but I sadly doubt it.


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    #24
    EunanMac
    Closed Accounts Posts: 454 ✭✭EunanMac


    Phoenix wrote: »
    Seems just weeks after another hunger striker at a direct provision centre in limerick

    We have another one,which brings into question what kind of facilities are these poor people kept in,they have already been through trauma escaping from conflict to experience this?
    I wonder if there is a government body that actually inspects these centre to make sure they are up to standard?

    I hope there is no abuses of power and bullying going on in there.
    Irish institutions and their staff would not have a great record for treating others well.


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    #25
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    walshb wrote: »
    Sounds like a shrewd business model to me. Maybe those people in the center should do a pros and cons list for staying in the asylum process or returning to their home country. I bet staying put probably wins out.


    It's hard to respond to that while staying within the charter.


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    #26
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,683 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Nodin wrote: »
    It's hard to respond to that while staying within the charter.

    How so? Just respond and obey the charter rules. Refugees supposedly fleeing extreme hardship in their countries are up in arms because the free food and accommodation they are receiving from a helping and caring foreign country is not to their standard. Head back home if it's not up to it.


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    #27
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,683 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    Posts like this depress the living crap out of me, because I would imagine they have a great deal of currency in the wider population. It would be comforting to think they were the views of only a tiny minority, but I sadly doubt it.

    Have you inspected the centers? Are you qualified to tell us that this protest is legitimate and correct? Are the standards sub human?


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    #28
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    walshb wrote: »
    How so? Just respond and obey the charter rules. Refugees supposedly fleeing extreme hardship in their countries are up in arms because the free food and accommodation they are receiving from a helping and caring foreign country is not to their standard. Head back home if it's not up to it.

    A remarkably ignorant post. They are entitled to decent standards by international law. This "head back home" nonsense wouldn't be acceptable for hospital patients, children in care or any other group in institutional care.


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    #29
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Apparently this particular centre has several issues brought up by residents over the last 12-18 months .
    The last time it on involved supplying fruit juices .
    Now there not on hunger strike there refusing food from the center itself and have apparently brought in food supplies from outside the center for themselfs

    Some are claiming the centre wanted to host a bbq and invite people to see the centre which in turn annoyed the residents
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




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    #30
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,792 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    walshb wrote: »
    Have you inspected the centers? Are you qualified to tell us that this protest is legitimate and correct? Are the standards sub human?
    I haven't. I'm sure you're right: they're probably just miffed because the jacuzzi wasn't at precisely the right temperature, and it spoiled their brunch.

    Asylum seekers are so bloody demanding.


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    #31
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,683 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    oscarBravo wrote: »

    Asylum seekers are so bloody demanding.

    Seems they could be. I'll wait for more details before slating the Irish who are paying for these people to reside here, sparing them pain and suffering in their home countries.


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