Are we a nation of idiots?

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 4:27pm #1

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/movies/movie-news/mrs-browns-boys-dmovie-takes-record-breaking-102m-at-the-irish-box-office-30394432.html

I want to say no. We have a great education system, we have provided culture with soul and depth to the world and produced some of the best artists in their generation.
But when I see this it really gets me thinking, why such low standards? We let politicians get away with f**king over entire generations and say "ah yeah" as if that slight sarcasm is what gives us a national identity. We pay extortionate amounts for things like transport and electricity and there is little we seem to be able to do about that and when push comes to shove, we feed minds on diets of filtered garbage like the aforementioned Mrs. Browns Boys.

The thing is, that shlock is only the latest in the long line of crap entertainment we have ingested over the years. Bad RTE talent shows, bad lowbrow reality shows (who remembers Fade Street), bad comedy and just a set of low low standards as to what entertainment and culture is. "Oh you can't sing or dance? Guess you are of no value. But wait, maybe we can stick you on a reality show because you seem like the kind of bellend that idiots would tune it to watch and complain about with their mates"

Jedward was an accepted thing.

There is a saying, you are what you eat and in a lot of ways thats true. You eat crap? you become crap. Your mind takes in crap? well guess what, those outward thoughts, yes, those opinions

become crap. I know its hard to avoid, just how this lowbrow pop culture seeps in from every crevice and the foreign imports, which seem infinite at this stage (from The Big Bang Theory to Geordie Shore) certainly don't help. But please, stop thinking that garbage is acceptable for your mind. There are other options out there, you dont have to watch, listen to or read the most available material. If the McDonalds is 5 minutes away and the farmers market is 10, do you eat at the McDonalds every day?

curlzy · 01-07-2014 4:27pm

Yes

comongethappy · 01-07-2014 4:29pm

Kinda.

uch · 01-07-2014 4:29pm

curlzy wrote: »

Yes

I concur also

K-9 · 01-07-2014 4:29pm

Not my cup of tea but that doesn't make people idiots for watching it. I thought the first series of Fr. Ted wasn't that great when it came out, so what do I know!

jimgoose · 01-07-2014 4:29pm

No more so than any other. :cool:

Hande hoche! · 01-07-2014 4:29pm

*bangs fists on keyboard*

iDave · 01-07-2014 4:29pm

You haven't described anything there that isn't rampant elsewhere

ancapailldorcha · 01-07-2014 4:30pm

I fail to see how one film can lead anyone to believe that a whole country is populated by idiots.

Turtwig · 01-07-2014 4:30pm

No, humour is a subjective and cultural thing. Rarely a measure of idiocy or lack thereof.

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 4:30pm

iDave wrote: »

You haven't described anything there that isn't rampant elsewhere

does that mean its ok? we just go with it?

01-07-2014 4:31pm

BMMachine wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/movies/movie-news/mrs-browns-boys-dmovie-takes-record-breaking-102m-at-the-irish-box-office-30394432.html

I want to say no. We have a great education system, we have provided culture with soul and depth to the world and produced some of the best artists in their generation.
But when I see this it really gets me thinking, why such low standards? We let politicians get away with f**king over entire generations and say "ah yeah" as if that slight sarcasm is what gives us a national identity. We pay extortionate amounts for things like transport and electricity and there is little we seem to be able to do about that and when push comes to shove, we feed minds on diets of filtered garbage like the aforementioned Mrs. Browns Boys.

The thing is, that shlock is only the latest in the long line of crap entertainment we have ingested over the years. Bad RTE talent shows, bad lowbrow reality shows (who remembers Fade Street), bad comedy and just a set of low low standards as to what entertainment and culture is. "Oh you can't sing or dance? Guess you are of no value. But wait, maybe we can stick you on a reality show because you seem like the kind of bellend that idiots would tune it to watch and complain about with their mates"

Jedward was an accepted thing.

There is a saying, you are what you eat and in a lot of ways thats true. You eat crap? you become crap. Your mind takes in crap? well guess what, those outward thoughts, yes, those opinions become crap. I know its hard to avoid, just how this lowbrow pop culture seeps in from every crevice and the foreign imports, which seem infinite at this stage (from The Big Bang Theory to Geordie Shore) certainly don't help. But please, stop thinking that garbage is acceptable for your mind. There are other options out there, you dont have to watch, listen to or read the most available material. If the McDonalds is 5 minutes away and the farmers market is 10, do you eat at the McDonalds every day?

The only thing I have a greater problem with than people consuming what I might consider substandard fare - whether that's cultural, intellectual or physical, is people deciding they have an insight into what people should be consuming.

A society that doesn't allow for individual taste is a restrictive one. People have a right to their preferences and taste.

Even bad taste is better than dictated taste.

iDave · 01-07-2014 4:31pm

BMMachine wrote: »

does that mean its ok? we just go with it?

Not ok but perhaps we shouldn't be singled out for criticism.

AdolfHipster · 01-07-2014 4:33pm

We're kind've dumb but we seem to cloak that fact well. The trick is to add big words to your sentences so that you sound photosynthesis.

jimgoose · 01-07-2014 4:33pm

AdolfHipster wrote: »

We're kind've dumb but we seem to cloak that fact well. The trick is to add big words to your sentences so that you sound photosynthesis.

I can certainly neurofibromatosis that.

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 4:34pm

iDave wrote: »

Not ok but perhaps we shouldn't be singled out for criticism.

its an Irish website where I would be communicating to mostly Irish people.

Candie wrote:

The only thing I have a greater problem with than people consuming substandard fare - whether that's cultural, intellectual or physical, is people deciding they have an insight into what people should be consuming.

A society that doesn't allow for individual taste is a restrictive one. People have a right to their preferences and taste.

Even bad taste is better than dictated taste.

yup. completely right. but how does one develop such a high volume of bad taste

Sunnyisland · 01-07-2014 4:34pm

Of course were not...I don't and never liked the d unbelivebles, that does not make the people that do so are idiots, and like wise for any other show on tv.

Ficheall · 01-07-2014 4:36pm

K-9 wrote: »

I thought the first series of Fr. Ted wasn't that great when it came out, so what do I know!

*removes K-9 from "Would Bang" list.*

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 4:36pm

Turtwig wrote: »

No, humour is a subjective and cultural thing. Rarely a measure of idiocy or lack thereof.

what if its not about humour and about how casually someone accepts blunt stupidity.

AdolfHipster · 01-07-2014 4:37pm

Adds K-9 to "Kill List" *puts on bright pink lipstick* *sighs as laying down on a couch*

K-9 · 01-07-2014 4:38pm

BMMachine wrote: »

does that mean its ok? we just go with it?

Wtf are we supposed to do with it?

uch · 01-07-2014 4:41pm

Hande hoche! wrote: »

*bangs fists on keyboard*

No if you banged your fist on the keyboard it would look like this rtfguybujh rtfv yHUJHYtcv TGGHv

ScumLord · 01-07-2014 4:41pm

If we're idiots because Mrs browns boys is popular then so are the Brits and Yanks because they like it too.

I haven't watched much of the show but what I did see was entertaining. It's all very obvious slapstick but I think they make it work if you're into that kind of thing.

If you want to judge a country by the TV it's produces then the Americans are both idiots and geniuses. They have a show like ancient aliens that shows an ancient societies walls and say "it's impossible for us to make this even today". Then the next show shows how the same culture made the walls because if the ancient alien video had panned the camera left it would have shown the wall half made and it becomes clear how they made the wall.

K-9 · 01-07-2014 4:42pm

Ficheall wrote: »

*removes K-9 from "Would Bang" list.*

Its all right, I was converted with the second series.

AdolfHipster wrote: »

Adds K-9 to "Kill List" *puts on bright pink lipstick* *sighs as laying down on a couch*

That asterick thing is fecking annoying!

Duckworth_Luas · 01-07-2014 4:44pm

According to the link

Mrs Brown's Boys D'Movie has taken a record breaking €1.02m at the Irish box office on its opening weekend, representing almost 20% of the UK and Irish box office total.

So the film took in about €4m at the UK box office meaning they are 4 times stupider!

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 4:44pm

K-9 wrote: »

Wtf are we supposed to do with it?

ignore it and not give it the ratings and money so more can't be made and instead support better shows/music/films/books. Lessen the amount of crap, ya know, fight the good fight

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 4:46pm

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

According to the link

So the film took in about €4m at the UK box office meaning they are 4 times stupider!

this isn't meant to be an "Ireland Vs. x" thread or "BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE OTHER COUNTRIES...." thread. its about us and what we do.

Valetta · 01-07-2014 4:46pm

BMMachine wrote: »

ignore it and not give it the ratings and money so more can't be made and instead support better shows/music/films/books. Lessen the amount of crap, ya know, fight the good fight

Brendan O'Carroll and his family are part of our nation.

Are they idiots?

01-07-2014 4:46pm

BMMachine wrote: »

yup. completely right. but how does one develop such a high volume of bad taste

Cost is what drives it's production.

Reality and talent shows cost very little to produce, music with little to commend it other than catchiness appeals to the most prolific buyers - the pocket money chart music fan.

The more worthy is out there, it's still being read or listened to or watched. It's just not on the national broadcaster. It's just a shame that anything more challenging than X-Factor is now considered to be bordering on the esoteric.

uch · 01-07-2014 4:47pm

I Like Cake !

Arbiter of Good Taste · 01-07-2014 4:47pm

BMMachine wrote: »

ignore it and not give it the ratings and money so more can't be made and instead support better shows/music/films/books. Lessen the amount of crap, ya know, fight the good fight

So what do you define as "better"? Entertainment that you like?

I can't stand Mrs Brown, but can we not respect that everyone has their own tastes?

RayM · 01-07-2014 4:48pm

Uh i dunno lol

Adamantium · 01-07-2014 4:48pm

This mightn'd be much consolation, but imagine if the likes of Carl Sagan, Einstein were born in a middle aged village, who hell would they share their ideas with out being cast out as lunatics?

I think have a niggling theory that a lot of our escape into fantasy fromthe 20th century on or low brow experiences has to do with numbing ourselves to the fact that we are very aware of our mortality in a way that our recent ancestors were not, we found out the world was only one of countless others and that the Lord didn't make it all specially for us or it wasn't created at all. It looks to be infinitely random and god damn that is hard to face black hole.

That's a humanity wide situation, we opened Pandora's box with science, and the majority are pretty damn dislusioned. I think.

We also don't know how to believe except ourselves and even then we're told it's just an "opinion". Indiffrent tolerance
People are just as dogmatic and convinced of their opinions now as the religions of old, but they have embraced the logically contradictory position that they are absolutely right in insisting that nobody is absolutely right

So no, not just Ireland's problem.

01-07-2014 4:48pm

K-9 wrote: »

That asterick thing is fecking annoying!

*shrugs*

Sorry, I agree - it's very annoying

Valetta · 01-07-2014 4:51pm

Adamantium wrote: »

This mightn'd be much consolation, but imagine if the likes of Carl Sagan, Einstein were born in a middle aged village, who hell would they share their ideas with out being cast out as lunatics?

I think have a niggling theory that a lot of our escape into fantasy fromthe 20th century on or low brow experiences has to do with numbing ourselves to the fact that we are very aware of our mortality in a way that our recent ancestors were not, we found out the world was only one of countless others and that the Lord didn't make it all specially for us or it wasn't created at all. It looks to be infinitely random and god damn that is hard to face black hole.

That's a humanity wide situation, we opened Pandora's box with science, and the majority are pretty damn dislusioned. I think.

We also don't know how to believe except ourselves and even then we're told it's just an "opinion". Indiffrent tolerance
People are just as dogmatic and convinced of their opinions now as the religions of old, but they have embraced the logically contradictory position that they are absolutely right in insisting that nobody is absolutely right

So no, not just Ireland's problem.

Ah here

Awkward Badger · 01-07-2014 4:51pm

Makes me wonder the more I see this incessant moaning about and absolute ignorance of people pissing on those who watch Mrs Browne.

Its a TV show/Movie. If you don't like it don't watch it, problem solved. If you think those who watch it are idiots then tbh you're only displaying your own ignorance in making such dumb and ill founded generalisations.

Mrs Browns boys regardless of its comedy value is still imo an intellectual step above the mass hatred and hysteria over it which comes across a lot of the time as nothing but a vain and petty attempt to feel superior by scoffing at and denigrating those who watch it.

Son Of A Vidic · 01-07-2014 4:54pm

BMMachine wrote: »

Are we a nation of idiots?

No, but I'd say most of us are surrounded by them.

K-9 · 01-07-2014 4:54pm

Adamantium wrote: »

This mightn'd be much consolation, but imagine if the likes of Carl Sagan, Einstein were born in a middle aged village, who hell would they share their ideas with out being cast out as lunatics?

I think have a niggling theory that a lot of our escape into fantasy fromthe 20th century on or low brow experiences has to do with numbing ourselves to the fact that we are very aware of our mortality in a way that our recent ancestors were not, we found out the world was only one of countless others and that the Lord didn't make it all specially for us or it wasn't created at all. It looks to be infinitely random and god damn that is hard to face black hole.

That's a humanity wide situation, we opened Pandora's box with science, and the majority are pretty damn dislusioned. I think.

We also don't know how to believe except ourselves and even then we're told it's just an "opinion". Indiffrent tolerance
People are just as dogmatic and convinced of their opinions now as the religions of old, but they have embraced the logically contradictory position that they are absolutely right in insisting that nobody is absolutely right

So no, not just Ireland's problem.

Wow, didn't expect Einstein and Sagan to come up on this thread!

Seriously, I'd say people respect other opinions and beliefs more these days, they can agree to differ more than years ago. It has its drawbacks but overall its for the better imo.

01-07-2014 4:56pm

Adamantium wrote: »

This mightn'd be much consolation, but imagine if the likes of Carl Sagan, Einstein were born in a middle aged village, who hell would they share their ideas with out being cast out as lunatics?

I dunno, Jehan Adam, Parameshvara, Damodara, Georg Von Pueurbach and Ali Qushji were all knocking around in the 15th century and were well regarded and influential at the time.

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 5:04pm

Arbiter of Good Taste wrote: »

I can't stand Mrs Brown, but can we not respect that everyone has their own tastes?

I can't respect someone that eats McDonalds everyday, nor can I respect someone that feeds their minds on a diet of crap everyday. I respect that they can be good honest people and nice people, hell, my parents watch Mrs Browns Boys. They don't gorge on the vast banquet that is rubbish culture though, once a month is okay for fast food right? Its the opinions and thoughts of those who are drowning in the lowbrow garbage culture which I don't respect.

catallus · 01-07-2014 5:08pm

http://xkcd.com/1386/

Valetta · 01-07-2014 5:08pm

BMMachine wrote: »

I can't respect someone that eats McDonalds everyday, nor can I respect someone that feeds their minds on a diet of crap everyday. I respect that they can be good honest people and nice people, hell, my parents watch Mrs Browns Boys. They don't gorge on the vast banquet that is rubbish culture though, once a month is okay for fast food right? Its the opinions and thoughts of those who are drowning in the lowbrow garbage culture which I don't respect.

Do you respect people that grossly exaggerate to make their point sound more plausible?

Adamantium · 01-07-2014 5:11pm

I suppose the problem with Ms.Brown and other 1 note stuff like it feels cheap and that's it, all it tries to be. This is not the Simpsons or Father Ted, The Wire, BSG, BB, that can be enjoyed on many different levels.

This thread in a nutshell:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV1LWhNpTJU

WilyCoyote · 01-07-2014 5:12pm

Mrs Brown going the same way as Fr Ted. Remember that was frowned upon by the cognescenti in Ireland 'til it started winning gongs abroad.

Go Mrs Brown (but not to town - with your knickers hanging down).

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 5:13pm

Valetta wrote: »

Do you respect people that grossly exaggerate to make their point sound more plausible?

about as much as I respect the people that ignore whats being said in order to get in a nice feel-good snipe

Valetta · 01-07-2014 5:15pm

BMMachine wrote: »

about as much as I respect the people that ignore whats being said in order to get in a nice feel-good snipe

I haven't ignored anything you have said, if that is what you are implying.

Beano · 01-07-2014 5:17pm

WilyCoyote wrote: »

Mrs Brown going the same way as Fr Ted. Remember that was frowned upon by the cognescenti in Ireland 'til it started winning gongs abroad.

Go Mrs Brown (but not to town - with your knickers hanging down).

Are you seriously comparing Mrs Brown to Fr Ted? A brilliant satire versus a pile of recycled rubbish.

CruelCoin · 01-07-2014 5:19pm

Half of us are, OP.

Adamantium · 01-07-2014 5:20pm

WilyCoyote wrote: »

Mrs Brown going the same way as Fr Ted. Remember that was frowned upon by the cognescenti in Ireland 'til it started winning gongs abroad.

Go Mrs Brown (but not to town - with your knickers hanging down).

This isn't true at all.

Ted is a diamond cut slab of gold, that perfectly gets "the west of Ireland". Live for a winter out in Galway and you'll understand.

Will Ms Brown Boys have us quoting paragraphs of dialogue, encyclopedic guide of mannerisms and tiniest of trivia, holding conversations in prose and be used at every possible oppurtunity and everybody gets the vibe you're on. Friendships forged on laughter and the recalling of incidental remarks, and making women laugh hysterically at pitch perfect Fr Noel Furlong impressions. The hard hitting satire, subversive, but gentle and warm, all done in childlike/unassuming manner that spoke to everybody on different levels. It's an innocent show and that is why it so loved

Ted has the best world building in anything I've ever seen (srs), hell I still imagine 16 years later, that they're living on Craggy Island. A master novelist would only dream of making charcters so vivid.

Ms. Brown Boys will never be any of these things, in fact it wouldn't even try.

The Savage Eye is far more deserving of the gongs if only that it's one of the few Irish things since Fr Ted, that got me giddy in the exact same way. Though nowhere even touching it obviously.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrHTEj03eHo

BMMachine · 01-07-2014 5:20pm

WilyCoyote wrote: »

Mrs Brown going the same way as Fr Ted. Remember that was frowned upon by the cognescenti in Ireland 'til it started winning gongs abroad.

Go Mrs Brown (but not to town - with your knickers hanging down).

no, its been around for 10+ years and has been the same shtick for that time too. Father Ted happened to have 2 very good writers behind it and the brilliantly cast Dermot Morgan and lasted exactly 3 seasons. Whereas Ted is the apex of sitcoms, Mrs Brown is the cash in 'fukit these people will swallow anything' kind of comedy. It has taken a long time for it to get to this point and its going to burn out extremely fast now that its popular. It will be an embarrassing footnote in Irish comedy while Ted will go down as the legend it deserves to be

Awkward Badger · 01-07-2014 5:22pm

BMMachine wrote: »

about as much as I respect the people that ignore whats being said in order to get in a nice feel-good snipe

BMMachine wrote: »

Its the opinions and thoughts of those who are drowning in the lowbrow garbage culture which I don't respect.

You don't seem to have much respect for anyone by the sounds of it. No respect for anyone who ignores what you're saying in favour of sniping while saying you have no respect for the thoughts and opinions of those who watch Mrs Brown and just calling them idiots.

Are we a nation of idiots?

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