Louis Theroux

fryup · 03-10-2016 10:10am

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

Almost seems like Jimmy was grooming Louis to use him as a vessel, be his new public relations guy.

i think he was wary that Theroux would turn against him, thats why he kept in touch with him

intheclouds · 03-10-2016 10:16am

Loveinapril wrote: »

I don't think it was supposed to be a hard hitting documentary. I wonder was it slightly cathartic for Louis, he certainly seems affected by the whole thing.

Sure, but it felt a bit "seen it all before" to me.

gucci · 03-10-2016 2:55pm

fryup wrote: »

i think he was wary that Theroux would turn against him, thats why he kept in touch with him

Yes I think that is very true. Considering Saviles supposed information network, he would probably have known everything that would be going on in a normal BBC production, but felt the need to do his own snooping as Louis' team were probably a bit more secure considering the nature of their work.

The show itself was interesting and it is very uncomfortable viewing at times. The victims are remarkable people to be able to function and speak as they do.

I would have liked to see Louis have had a similar type of casual conversation with some of the old BBC/Police/Hospital/Church staff to push them a little on what they thought was happening back in Saviles hay day, but I guess the goal of the documentary was not to point the finger of blame on someone else, but just show what a manipulative character he was.
I am sure its been said before, but seeing how he was so cosy and jovial with Maggie Thatcher and Charles and Di, is it any wonder why he seen himself as untouchable?

The PA and fundraising lady from Stoke were slightly soft targets, but still very interesting to hear from. Its amazing how the victims that spoke had such clarity on the abuse and his character, but the people closest to him just didn't want to open their mind up to the fact that they were completely hoodwinked for years too. I guess the burden of guilt that they have deep down just is too great to let rise up.

ligerdub · 03-10-2016 3:44pm

There is a reasonable question to ask re: Savile (and others like him) and their coincidental knighthoods. I'll say no more.

fryup · 03-10-2016 6:41pm

gucci wrote: »

Yes I think that is very true. Considering Saviles supposed information network, he would probably have known everything that would be going on in a normal BBC production, but felt the need to do his own snooping as Louis' team were probably a bit more secure considering the nature of their work.

yep, didn't he write on a piece of paper Theroux's address...even though it was ex-directory...a subtle threat by Savile i think

Trimm Trabb · 03-10-2016 6:59pm

intheclouds wrote: »

I enjoyed it but I didnt feel it showed us anything new.

Louis is at his best interviewing the bad guys and walking them into showing themselves up. Seeing him interviewing victims doesnt have the same punch.

I was surprised he didnt push harder with the woman who was in denial although perhaps she is a victim too.

Overall, it was ok, but not Louis's best by a long shot.

It does constantly amaze me now how obvious Savile was in his creepiness when we view him in retrospect. Its a pity justice was never served when he was alive.

I thought it was interesting look of how we view culpability of idviduals/institutions/society from Louis, who on this issue was uniquely placed as someone who had a friendly relationship with Saville and was willing to accept some culpability and explore how much/which individuals were to blame. It was a bit more of a philosophical than his usual docs

I thought his questioning of his aunt at the daily mail and the BBC staff member with her dogs were interesting as both were really uncomfortable with the idea they could have changed the course of events if they had acted upon the gossip/inklings they had.

Wanderer78 · 03-10-2016 9:19pm

its on youtube there now. not sure if im allowed post links here.

Agent Coulson · 03-10-2016 10:30pm

I'm one who grew up wanting to be on and have Jim Fix it for me and just thought of him being a leftover from the 60's just an eccentric man who did amazing things for people and charities.

I remember when it all started to come out that he was molesting and raping woman and girls my first reaction was nah that can't be right surely Jim is gay if these stories were about him doing this stuff to boys I probably would have believed it straight away.

Of course when the evidence became clear at the time it was quite shocking and what it opened up and then we saw all these tv and radio and music stars who my generation grew up with it was scary to be honest.

Looking at the doc last night and seeing the clip when Jim went into Louis office in his shorts and string vest was totally vile to see now as an adult who knows everything that happened. Hindsight is an amazing thing because at that time those shorts and vest were just those of that eccentric Jim'll Fix It.

When the woman asked Louis did he think Jim was grooming him I honestly think the answer to that was Jim was grooming all of us! and he did it so well through the tv screen.

That's what's really scary one dangerous nasty vile human being was able to groom 10's of millions of people through the power of just being on tv.

learn_more · 03-10-2016 10:57pm

Agent Coulson wrote: »

I remember when it all started to come out that he was molesting and raping woman and girls my first reaction was nah that can't be right surely Jim is gay if these stories were about him doing this stuff to boys I probably would have believed it straight away.

I find that just a staggering thing to say and you said it without batting an eyelid. Appreciate your honesty though. I wouldn't want to be gay and ugly in this life or one wouldn't know what people think of you behind your back.

I think the whole notion of Savile waving his magic wand and beguiling everyone is overstated. It has a lot more to do with the attitudes of the people that surrounded him.

Agent Coulson · 03-10-2016 11:13pm

learn_more wrote: »

I find that just a staggering thing to say and you said it without batting an eyelid. Appreciate your honesty though. I wouldn't want to be gay and ugly in this life or one wouldn't know what people think of you behind your back.

I think the whole notion of Savile waving his magic wand and beguiling everyone is overstated. It has a lot more to do with the attitudes of the people that surrounded him.

It was his flamboyance and dress style and the way he acted in the era of the late 70's and 80's that made most people I know believe he was gay.

It's a horrible thing to say and I consider myself a very open minded person and I wasn't the only person saying it at the time thought that was al lot of people's thought at the time that I knew.

I even think someone said similar in the doc last night that a lot of people though he was gay and the accusations against women can't be true.

You can say the whole notion is overstated but at that time he was a hugely prominent man on tv raising 10's of millions for charity and that propaganda beguiled most people which was his plan no doubt this was a guy who was Knighted and was the face of the BBC even on this Island that meant something.

The guy was a psychopath/sociopath who manipulated everybody he met and everybody who grew up watching him on tv.

Pickpocket · 03-10-2016 11:18pm

The Savile Report states quite clearly that the BBC as a collective did not do enough to prevent Savile's predatory behaviour and that a "culture of fear" within the BBC made it difficult for people to come forward with complaints. As a corporate body the BBC was not found to be aware of Savile's abuses but as an organisation it missed a minimum of 5 opportunities to stop him. The same goes for convicted sex offender Stuart Hall. Worse even, as a number of actual BBC managers were aware of his crimes.

How Louis Theroux can ask a Mail journalist about her employer's inaction while keeping a straight face is simply beyond me. Louis the company man.

ligerdub · 03-10-2016 11:50pm

learn_more wrote: »

I find that just a staggering thing to say and you said it without batting an eyelid. Appreciate your honesty though. I wouldn't want to be gay and ugly in this life or one wouldn't know what people think of you behind your back.

I think the whole notion of Savile waving his magic wand and beguiling everyone is overstated. It has a lot more to do with the attitudes of the people that surrounded him.

I'd say you're on your own in the staggered stakes on that one to be fair.

ligerdub · 03-10-2016 11:52pm

Pickpocket wrote: »

The Savile Report states quite clearly that the BBC as a collective did not do enough to prevent Savile's predatory behaviour and that a "culture of fear" within the BBC made it difficult for people to come forward with complaints. As a corporate body the BBC was not found to be aware of Savile's abuses but as an organisation it missed a minimum of 5 opportunities to stop him. The same goes for convicted sex offender Stuart Hall. Worse even, as a number of actual BBC managers were aware of his crimes.

How Louis Theroux can ask a Mail journalist about her employer's inaction while keeping a straight face is simply beyond me. Louis the company man.

Is Theroux really a BBC man though? At a guess I'd say he works on a contract basis and runs his own production company. I would be very surprised if he were an employee, and assuming I'm correct I dare say his interactions with them are remote and probably infrequent.

afatbollix · 04-10-2016 12:10am

ligerdub wrote: »

Is Theroux really a BBC man though? At a guess I'd say he works on a contract basis and runs his own production company. I would be very surprised if he were an employee, and assuming I'm correct I dare say his interactions with them are remote and probably infrequent.

Its a BBC production so it was made in house.

He set up a company in 2014 called blobfish but looks like it's mostly an office as its biggest expense is depreciation on office equipment.

Pickpocket · 04-10-2016 12:38am

I don't know the exact nature of his relationship with the BBC but based on what I saw tonight I suspect I know what it means to him.

It's a BBC production so I knew what to expect from their side. I'm just surprised to see his name on it. He's made a career out of asking important and awkward questions. Tonight he had the right question but the wrong person.

learn_more · 04-10-2016 4:16am

ligerdub wrote: »

I'd say you're on your own in the staggered stakes on that one to be fair.

What youz are suggesting is that if he was gay the accusations would have been taken more seriously.

That's a revolting comment and I think when people have really wrapped prejudices then that is a contributory factor to why Saville got away with it all.

Agent Coulson wrote: »

It was his flamboyance and dress style and the way he acted in the era of the late 70's and 80's that made most people I know believe he was gay.
.

See what happens when people adhere to stereotypes. "Oh he's just gay, leave him be". Can't ya'll see now anyone can be flamboyant and dress silly.

VW 1 · 04-10-2016 6:50am

learn_more wrote:

What youz are suggesting is that if he was gay the accusations would have been taken more seriously.

More believable when they started to surface is how I read the comment, there was no reference to the word serious nor any implication of holding more or less seriousness.

Agent Coulson · 04-10-2016 7:20am

learn_more wrote: »

What youz are suggesting is that if he was gay the accusations would have been taken more seriously.

That's a revolting comment and I think when people have really wrapped prejudices then that is a contributory factor to why Saville got away with it all.

See what happens when people adhere to stereotypes. "Oh he's just gay, leave him be". Can't ya'll see now anyone can be flamboyant and dress silly.

You seem to be reading something completely different into what I have written.

Also Saville having and letting people think he was gay was probably all part of his agenda to cover up his crimes.

When Louis asked him if he ever had a girlfriend and he no never not even for a few days the next logical question in that era would have been to ask him was he gay. This is a time when being openly gay was a career killer.

There was a don't ask don't tell going on in the media at that time.

learn_more · 05-10-2016 1:19am

Agent Coulson wrote: »

You seem to be reading something completely different into what I have written.

Also Saville having and letting people think he was gay was probably all part of his agenda to cover up his crimes.

.

Don't think I am.

This idea that Savile was covering up is exactly the point. He wasn't covering up. The point is he wasn't taken up on his activities when so many knew about it. That is exactly what the scandal is about.

In exactly the same way the scandal that transpired in the catholic church is not primarily about the abuse, but the fact that is was let continue when so many knew about it.

That's the real scandal.

And to suggest that people who actually knew what he was up to can now say that they were beguiled by him is total nonsense. They totally knew , and now they are saying they didn't read him correctly because they though maybe he was gay....what bull***t.

Agent Coulson · 05-10-2016 7:47pm

My Scientology Movie is out there in the big worldwide web.

Agent Coulson · 05-10-2016 9:28pm

Big fan of Louis but there is nothing new in My Scientology Movie that isn't covered in the last few very good doc released on Scientology

Going Clear covers much the same ground and is probably better over all.

05-10-2016 9:31pm

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Big fan of Louis but there is nothing new in My Scientology Movie that isn't covered in the last few very good doc released on Scientology

Going Clear covers much the same ground and is probably better over all.

My view exactly. Thought it was fairly shallow overall.

krustydoyle · 08-10-2016 11:28pm

Just turned it on.. Not sure what to expect

Loveinapril · 09-10-2016 8:34am

I was very disappointed. I feel like the whole set up/ movie piece was unnecessary. If it wasn't Louis, I would have turned it off ten minutes in. It didn't go anywhere.

Zascar · 10-10-2016 10:18am

Very disappointed by My Scientology movie. Very glad I did not spend money to see it in the cinema. Very little new stuff, Going Clear was miles better.

Paully D · 15-10-2016 11:30pm

Savile documentary for anyone interested:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C80iCa8ZRy8

intheclouds · 16-10-2016 5:48pm

^^ Eh, is that not copyrighted material? I can't imagine it lasting on youtube.

take everything · 16-10-2016 9:55pm

Great episode on acquired brain injury on now.

Mam of 4 · 16-10-2016 10:01pm

take everything wrote: »

Great episode on acquired brain injury on now.

Watched this one before, very good but sad also.

Skyfarm · 16-10-2016 10:01pm

If you have never seen the doc he made on the American health system, it is amazing for the human storeys alone,the guy with cancer made my jaw drop,it made me realise what a great broken system we have.

Wanderer78 · 16-10-2016 10:35pm

Skyfarm wrote: »

If you have never seen the doc he made on the American health system, it is amazing for the human storeys alone,the guy with cancer made my jaw drop,it made me realise what a great broken system we have.

some people believe, america in particular, doesn't have a health care system but a sickness system! id have to agree with them and we re heading in a similar direction

AlanG · 17-10-2016 1:50pm

take everything wrote: »

Great episode on acquired brain injury on now.

Amazing doc, well put together and respectful. I particularly like the way he managed to get some insight into the personal and (non existent) physical relationship of the married couple and the idea that perhaps the woman was actually a different person and not really his wife any more. Really sad for that family and the kids in particular.

Additionally, it did show how amazing much of the NHS is, the woman staying with her husband had a 24 x 7 carer - not like the cases in Ireland where women in their 70s have been left caring for their loved ones and have to fight for a couple of hours community care.

take everything · 23-10-2016 10:24pm

Watching the alcohol dependence one now.
Quite depressing

ligerdub · 23-10-2016 10:26pm

This was one of the most compelling ones, a real human interest piece.

He really connected in this show.

frag420 · 24-10-2016 8:47am

take everything wrote: »

Watching the alcohol dependence one now.
Quite depressing

I think I said it earlier on this thread but that alcoholic doc was like a horror film, could identify similar characteristics in a few people I knew.

When they drained the fluid from that guys belly and Louis smelled it and commented that there was a head on it..........dunno if I wanted to puke or laugh!

That's the difference between these type of docs and his recent doc/film on Scientology. His best work is when he gets to immerse himself with the subjects of his docs, walk a mile in there shoes so to speak.

You cant do that with Scientology. Try and walk a mile in their shoes and they will sue you all the while filming it....

intheclouds · 24-10-2016 2:04pm

take everything wrote: »

Watching the alcohol dependence one now.
Quite depressing

I hope he comes back in 10 years and re-interviews those people.

It was just a snapshot of a very complex problem that has amazing longevity - sometimes people go on for decades progressively getting worse - or indeed, improving then dis-improving etc...

It would be good to see some of them actually beat their demons.

GoldFour4 · 24-10-2016 3:20pm

Yeah I was totally immersed in the alcohol dependence show last night. Really hoping the young guy can pull through with his life now. Felt like Louis was very attached to him from the moment he visited his home and saw all the pictures from only a few years ago.

StringerBell · 27-10-2016 11:39am

Watched his Scientology one a couple of nights ago, honestly felt its one of his weakest documentaries. Maybe its just because I have seen others on the subject and read up a lot myself but there was nothing new in it for me, Going Clear was much better I thought and he didn't really seem to achieve, anything with it, never felt like it got going for me at all, or maybe went anywhere is more what I mean. Shame as I am big fan of his.

Zascar · 27-10-2016 2:27pm

Agreed. I can't believe this is an actual movie. I certainly would not want to have paid €10 to see it in the cinema - more suited to tv really.

HoggyRS · 27-10-2016 9:16pm

I love most Louis docs but have to agree was really let down by the scientology movie. Going clear is such a superior doc (even better book) on the subject.

Really wished he properly called out that fella marty rathbun for being a bit of a psycho too

gucci · 21-12-2016 1:12pm

HoggyRS wrote: »

I love most Louis docs but have to agree was really let down by the scientology movie. Going clear is such a superior doc (even better book) on the subject.

Really wished he properly called out that fella marty rathbun for being a bit of a psycho too

I have to agree with all of the above. I dont think I have ever been disappointed by a Louis Theroux documentary before, but this was a complete mess.

The whole premise of making a movie was an unnecessary and uninteresting distraction and seemed to be used as bulk to carry the whole thing.

He didnt even really cover the basics of the religion very well. From looking at it now and to what I remember from the Going Clear documentary Marty Ratburn seems alot more unstable and agressive.
Perhaps he spent many more hours with the makers of the Going Clear doc, and was in a better personal head space. He obviously didnt like Louis' direct form of question asking when he was in a perceived vulnerable position (unless of course Louis thought that vulnerability was feigned to avoid being pressed on certain subjects)

Anyway I felt the whole thing was a complete waste of time and considering he has quite a successful formula for documentaries, its very unusual for him to turn out such a turkey (especially with all the fanfare of an actual movie release?)

MadDog76 · 02-10-2017 12:20am

Louis Theroux's latest work, Dark States - Heroin Town, will air next Sunday night on BBC2.

Really looking forward to this as well as two other's (Murder in Milwaukee and Sex Trafficking Houston) in the series to follow.

adox · 08-10-2017 10:13pm

Well I have to say that’s some of Louis strongest work in a long time. A throwback to his early days really.

Utterly depressing but compelling viewing, I thought Louis handled the interviews brilliantly for the most part.

I also thought it was important to have the guy who was as happy as anything on heroin to show that not everyone wants to get off it and feels trapped.

BrianJD · 08-10-2017 10:27pm

It would be interesting to follow those guys stories. You’d have to wonder is there any hope for them.

DickSwiveller · 08-10-2017 10:30pm

adox wrote: »

Well I have to say that’s some of Louis strongest work in a long time. A throwback to his early days really.

Utterly depressing but compelling viewing, I thought Louis handled the interviews brilliantly for the most part.

I also thought it was important to have the guy who was as happy as anything on heroin to show that not everyone wants to get off it and feels trapped.

Did you watch it to the end? He pretty much admitted that his happy-go-lucky attitude was a shield to block away all the pain he feels. There's absolutely no way someone could be happy taking drugs and living in a tent.

EPAndlee · 08-10-2017 10:42pm

Always look forward to Louis Theroux documentaries. Sad to see so many lives ruined by an awful thing

John_Rambo · 08-10-2017 10:52pm

DickSwiveller wrote: »

Did you watch it to the end? He pretty much admitted that his happy-go-lucky attitude was a shield to block away all the pain he feels. There's absolutely no way someone could be happy taking drugs and living in a tent.

Yeah, a perfect, complete heroin barrier, the guy's a likable stoner with a dark side. Shagging the cute girl in the tent that's there not for love or thrills, but for a fix. He has a young boy that he never gets to see, but none of it hurts if he keeps high. Maintaining a zero empathy that only heroin can support.

Theroux is just the best for this type of thing. He's brilliant at asking the worst/best questions while keeping a natural, friendly rapport with his subjects.

His fathers books are excellent too.

NIMAN · 08-10-2017 10:55pm

A sad watch. That town really is in serious trouble

Yet again another programme that makes you wonder why someone ever starts taking drugs?

Does any drug addict anywhere ever think before their first ever hit, "I honestly know this is going to improve my life".

Alf Veedersane · 08-10-2017 11:02pm

Watched this with an extra degree of interest given that I'd recently watched Heroin(e) on Netflix and that follows the woman who became the Fire Chief in Huntingdon and who appeared at regular intervals, resuscitating OD cases tonight.

The characters tonight were all quite likeable which made it more impactful and poignant.

Louis again proving to be ideal to allow these people to tell their stories

adox · 08-10-2017 11:30pm

DickSwiveller wrote: »

Did you watch it to the end? He pretty much admitted that his happy-go-lucky attitude was a shield to block away all the pain he feels. There's absolutely no way someone could be happy taking drugs and living in a tent.

Yeah I watched it until the end and heard him talk about it but I also heard him talk candidly about being content with his addiction and feeling great most of the time when high, which I thought gave a bit of balance to those who clearly wanted to get off it but were trapped.
Reminded me a bit of another programme he did with a married couple who had both been addicts for decades and still functioned, had a House and their relationship and were content with their lifestyle for the most part.

Although I believed him at the end about the pain from the accident etc , I thought the earlier interview gave more of a glimpse into his mindset and added a bit of variance from the “I want to get clean...” sort of stereotype.

Look I’m trying to underplay his addiction or his predicament and lifestyle(I’ve only seen a few minutes of him being interviewed) but I thought it added a bit of shade to the black and white norm.

Louis Theroux

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