Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2013/14

LuckyLloyd · 13-01-2014 1:10pm

We should be moving Gerrard up the pitch not down the pitch. Boggles my mind. He's far, far superior in an attacking go forward sense.

djPSB · 13-01-2014 1:10pm

Vicxas wrote: »

I find it odd too, as he doesnt really have the physical presence to be a CB, but this was spouted out by Carragher after the Stoke match, so he seems to think it could work.

Rodgers mentioned it a while back.

Bobeagleburger · 13-01-2014 1:10pm

Gerrard as back up keeper?

googled eyes · 13-01-2014 1:14pm

Why are people so aghast at the idea of Gerrard being dropped?

Would you still want Stevie around in 2 or 3 years when he really can't run, just because he was our driving force for so long.

I'll love Steven Gerrard for what he has given to the club but NOW is the time to start phasing him out of the team. The football is more fluid without him and although he still has an eye for the hollywood pass that shouldn't been enough to guarantee him a starting place.

Stevie can still bring alot to the team ( as seen at the start yesterday when he did well ) but it would be better to use him for 30-45 mins so he can play to his best without the risk of fading off ( as he did later on)

djPSB · 13-01-2014 1:15pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

We should be moving Gerrard up the pitch not down the pitch. Boggles my mind. He's far, far superior in an attacking go forward sense.

Everyones raving about Henderson's work rate and pressing from AM.. Would you expect a similar shift from Gerrard?

Knex* · 13-01-2014 1:17pm

Gerrard needs to be rested and managed right. Unfortunately, we don't have the personnel in the Club for that to happen right now, and as a result, we can't really justify putting him on the bench.

Look at it the last day - Aspas, Alberto & Moses. Putting any of them ahead of Gerrard is laughable.

Knex* · 13-01-2014 1:19pm

djPSB wrote: »

Everyones raving about Henderson's work rate and pressing from AM.. Would you expect a similar shift from Gerrard?

IMO, its the number one reason Rodgers won't play him there. He wants the AM to do some water carrying, donkey work at times.

He wants Gerrard as fresh as he can when he gets on the ball as Rodgers really values the penetrating pass he can bring forward.

I don't think we'll ever see Stevie playing off the striker again. I also don't think people will be complaining even nearly half as much if Gerrard was alongside Allen and Henderson.

Its deploying both himself and Lucas in the same midfield that is becoming the glaring issue.

Bobeagleburger · 13-01-2014 1:20pm

googled eyes wrote: »

Why are people so aghast at the idea of Gerrard being dropped?

Would you still want Stevie around in 2 or 3 years when he really can't run, just because he was our driving force for so long.

I'll love Steven Gerrard for what he has given to the club but NOW is the time to start phasing him out of the team. The football is more fluid without him and although he still has an eye for the hollywood pass that shouldn't been enough to guarantee him a starting place.

Stevie can still bring alot to the team ( as seen at the start yesterday when he did well ) but it would be better to use him for 30-45 mins so he can play to his best without the risk of fading off ( as he did later on)

I don't think too many are against him being dropped for a better player.

Yesterday Alberto and Moses were the other options.

Allen is the other player. Is he better? No. He is an ok player that will probably rotate with Lucas if he rotates with anyone.

The owners need to spend big on a proper world class midfielder. End of story. I would even say 2 of them.

Agueroooo · 13-01-2014 1:20pm

Gerrard is as good as we have got so no point in moaning about it, but to.ask him to play more deeper defensively is a bit much, no?

Francie Barrett · 13-01-2014 1:22pm

mike65 wrote: »

Don't exaggerate! He is not and will never be a good libero/regista (delete as applicable), I've been watching Gerrard for his whole career and feel its just not going to work. His whole instinct runs counter to a role that requires patience and a cool head at all times.

He's played in the defensive role for England in their last major tournament and was probably their player of the competition. If he can rein in the whole captain fantastic thing (which he generally did against Stoke), then I think he can play the position.

LuckyLloyd · 13-01-2014 1:26pm

djPSB wrote: »

Everyones raving about Henderson's work rate and pressing from AM.. Would you expect a similar shift from Gerrard?

Well no, but it's a trade off. Get Gerrard, Suarez and Sturridge in the same area of the pitch and bad things will happen to the opposition defense I'm certain of it. Gerrard has unreal quality and an eye for the sublime. The best football of his career was played in an advanced role and, as the likes of Totti has demonstrated, quality and an agile attacking mind can make you useful in that role after the legs have stopped firing.

I like my holding midfielders to be athletic, positionally aware, good in the tackle and simple but consistent with the ball. Gerrard can put in big tackles but lacks everything else.

By contrast, I like my attacking midfielders to be technically gifted, have creativity and flair in spades and an eye for goal or the killer pass.

Of course, I may be looking at this too simplisticly...

Knex* · 13-01-2014 1:28pm

I'd love to be able to sit down with Kenny, Rodgers and Benitez, and talk to them about Gerrard now, and the last few years, who has never been deployed higher up the pitch than CM, since the days playing behind Torres.

Just one hour. There's got to be a lot more to it than we are seeing. As Lloyd just said, perhaps it all too simplistic.

LuckyLloyd · 13-01-2014 1:28pm

Francie Barrett wrote: »

He's played in the defensive role for England in their last major tournament and was probably their player of the competition. If he can rein in the whole captain fantastic thing (which he generally did against Stoke), then I think he can play the position.

Yeah, but England's setup in that competition rarely left him exposed in the way Rodgersball consistently exposes our deepest lying midfielder. I agree he had a brilliant Euro 2012, but the entire context of how they were playing helped magnify the things he does well.

Francie Barrett · 13-01-2014 1:29pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

We should be moving Gerrard up the pitch not down the pitch. Boggles my mind. He's far, far superior in an attacking go forward sense.

He is too slow to play in the front three positions and doesn't have quick passing to play in the AM role. He is still our best midfielder, so right now the best solution is to try and shoehorn him into the DM role.

LiamoSail · 13-01-2014 1:29pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

We should be moving Gerrard up the pitch not down the pitch. Boggles my mind. He's far, far superior in an attacking go forward sense.

While this would have been my preference, I do wonder if there is good reason Rodgers hasn't done so.

Part of what made Gerrard so effective further forward was his burst of pace. That's gone, and with it his ability to create the space past a defender he used to have. Another aspect of his game he has lost is his ability to strike through the ball as he used to (eg v Olympiakos). Hasn't he been told by the doctors that doing so in the future will cause long term damage?

My point is, based on the above and any other medical advise we may not be privilege to, there's got to be good reason why the obvious solution to the Gerrard problem has been ignored.

murpho999 · 13-01-2014 1:30pm

Regarding Gerrard, as an attack minded player will it not be almost impossible for him mentally to adjust to a defence role?

Francie Barrett · 13-01-2014 1:35pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Get Gerrard, Suarez and Sturridge in the same area of the pitch and bad things will happen to the opposition defense I'm certain of it.

The Gerrard of old would be perfect in this system, but the Gerrard going on 34 years wouldn't, he's just too slow. When you looked at Sterling/Countinho, Suarez and Sturridge all breaking at once, the Stoke defence literally sh@t themselves because our lads were so damm quick and incisive. If you put Gerrard into that trio, I guarantee everything will slow down and opposition defenders will have those extra few seconds that they need to organise themselves.

Boom_Bap · 13-01-2014 1:37pm

Playing Gerrard as a DM yesterday makes perfect sense. Our front 4/5 play a high pressing game out of possession, and lots of position switching and scampering around in possession while driving forward. Gerrard doesn't have the stamina for that type of game.
Yesterday we were playing Stoke who line up mostly with 1 striker, and a player playing off the striker, but less of a CAM that we would play.
So the DM area where Gerrard occupied yesterday shouldn't have been too troublesome or busy. He's played the position before, but positionally, not great at reading the game in that position. He went to ground a few time for tackles, comparable to Lucas who rarely goes into a slide. That is because Lucas is ahead of the game and knows where he needs to be, Gerrard plays catch up.

We also need Lucas to be more adaptive in midfield, and he has to get it back into his system to get over the half way line. we could see this a bit yesterday, but at times, Lucas is back helping out Gerrard to get into place.
They even were in the same place at the same time in the build up to the Adam goal, they were probably the cause by both being in the same place where the DM should be. Lucas should have let Gerrard handle it, but I guess instinct took over. But that was what yesterday was about for Lucas and Gerrard, learning each others position so they can be more fluent in position change throughout a game, much the same as how the front 3/4 are fluently moving around and filling in in each others spot.

mike65 · 13-01-2014 1:37pm

Francie Barrett wrote: »

The Gerrard of old would be perfect in this system, but the Gerrard going on 34 years wouldn't, he's just too slow. When you looked at Sterling/Countinho, Suarez and Sturridge all breaking at once, the Stoke defence literally sh@t themselves because our lads were so damm quick and incisive. If you put Gerrard into that trio, I guarantee everything will slow down and opposition defenders will have those extra few seconds that they need to organise themselves.

Its even worse than that, if Gerrard were higher up the pitch he'd look to spray the ball wide to Johnson who wouldn't do anything with it! :pac:

darced · 13-01-2014 1:39pm

This post has been deleted.

Sappy404 · 13-01-2014 1:53pm

I wonder if Gerrard bringing up this new role was an attempt to change the subject from Sterling's handball and the subsequent 'soft' penalty. It gave the papers something else to talk about.

gafferino · 13-01-2014 1:57pm

So good to see these two back on the pitch together. Given injuries and suspensions they are only getting going really.

gafferino · 13-01-2014 1:58pm

Sappy404 wrote: »

I wonder if Gerrard bringing up this new role was an attempt to change the subject from Sterling's handball and the subsequent soft 'Spanish' penalty. It gave the papers something else to talk about.

FYP

billymitchell · 13-01-2014 2:02pm

rarnes1 wrote: »

I don't think too many are against him being dropped for a better player.

Yesterday Alberto and Moses were the other options.

Allen is the other player. Is he better? No. He is an ok player that will probably rotate with Lucas if he rotates with anyone.

The owners need to spend big on a proper world class midfielder. End of story. I would even say 2 of them.

This, a million times over. We have been making do in CM for the last few years with a fit Gerard as the only decent player in there that can do something on the ball. We need 1 player that can take Lucas's position and one that can fill in for Gerard. Have Lucas and Gerard then as support players.

jenno86 · 13-01-2014 2:03pm

Playing Lucas in front of Gerrard is the most mind boggling thing.

Knex* · 13-01-2014 2:08pm

Lucas did arrive to the club as an attacking midfielder, I suppose :pac:

smileyj1987 · 13-01-2014 2:12pm

I have said it before about gerrard that I'm a fan of resting him and using him less to get more but I will say one thing the amount of slack he had gotten is nothing compared to what Johnson should be getting .

Augmerson · 13-01-2014 2:16pm

Vicxas wrote: »

Even Carragher was saying that Stevie could be pushed back into a CB role in the next 12-18 months.

So they must have a replacement in mind if they're starting to phase Gerrard out.

Serious? What the hell.

Stargate · 13-01-2014 2:17pm

rarnes1 wrote: »

I don't think too many are against him being dropped for a better player.

Yesterday Alberto and Moses were the other options.

Allen is the other player. Is he better? No. He is an ok player that will probably rotate with Lucas if he rotates with anyone.

The owners need to spend big on a proper world class midfielder. End of story. I would even say 2 of them.

Thats it right there !!

Moving him back to suit Stevie is the wrong way to go ...Team comes first .
I'm sure Gerrard is aware his legs are not going to last forever but he would like to play on.

It's then when the manager has to manage and say sit this one out Stevie .

Vanolder · 13-01-2014 2:17pm

8 goal thriller yet man complains... Sorry, I thought from the Gk through to Midfield the team were very poor and almost lazy at times. It had potential to be another Southampton/Hull but thankfully the forwards rescued it this time... This team doesn't like it when teams get right in there face- The two teams mentioned, and Chelsea put us under immense pressure and cut out the space for a short passing game and it killed us, Stoke killed us at times yesterday too... There was an element of leaving it to the next man I found at times yesterday, which led to a lot of frantic defending. Hendo didn't have the best game, Johnson and Cissokho need to go, I'd rather a young lad in their than the muck Johnson is serving up.

Edit- I almost forgot, I almost turned the game off, or on mute, due to Niall Quinn... He is painfully bad to listen to.

joe123 · 13-01-2014 2:20pm

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I actually though Lucas had a good game yesterday.

I thought Gerrard was very poor.

Bowlardo · 13-01-2014 2:29pm

Vanolder wrote: »

Edit- I almost forgot, I almost turned the game off, or on mute, due to Niall Quinn... He is painfully bad to listen to.

There was times I came close to screaming at the telly ...The horse radish he comes out with is painful.

5live · 13-01-2014 2:31pm

I would hate to have tuned in here today if we had lost to Stoke.

The whole Gerrard/Lucas argument is just going around in circles. Each of us looks at the match with our own prejudices and see only what we want to see and nobody looks like backing down.

I'm out of here till tomorrow. Take care folks.

jcsoulinger · 13-01-2014 2:32pm

I reckon give Gerard a chance in the holding role,,, His long balls are exceptional when they come off, I'm not sure if Lucas knows what a long ball is. hendo and Allen have looked good together in the centre of the park until Allen got injured. I would much rather see us sign 2 wing backs one left and one right who can really challenge Johnson and Enrique.

googled eyes · 13-01-2014 2:32pm

I need some transfer news. Even slightly rubbish news. Its all too quite

Ardent · 13-01-2014 2:40pm

Vanolder wrote: »

Hendo didn't have the best game, Johnson and Cissokho need to go, I'd rather a young lad in their than the muck Johnson is serving up.

Yup, I was cursing our fullbacks all game.

Don't know what's going on with Johnson, he's usually really good going forward. Anyone else think he's look overweight these days?

Grayditch · 13-01-2014 2:41pm

googled eyes wrote: »

I need some transfer news. Even slightly rubbish news. Its all too quite

Football Tattoos will now be releasing a Liverpool Transfer pack.

Easy on, easy off, just like Joe Cole's debut!
Kolo Toure, now spelled correctly!
Daniel Agger lick and stick sleeve included.

MD1990 · 13-01-2014 2:43pm

jenno86 wrote: »

Playing Lucas in front of Gerrard is the most mind boggling thing.

i think he wll be dropped when Allen comes back

Sir Gallagher · 13-01-2014 2:44pm

darced wrote: »

I hope it is Rodgers picking the team and not Gerrard or else we need to look for a new manager sharpish.

How do people come to these conclusions?

Bobeagleburger · 13-01-2014 2:45pm

Gerrard thread?

Pilsbury Doughboy · 13-01-2014 2:48pm

Lucas must have been phenomenal yesterday, Gerrard is taking all the heat, should be dished out to both a lot more evenly IMO. When wee Joe Allen comes back I'd be in favour of benching Lucas.

Failing that maybe we can just sign a powerhouse midfielder who can immediately get straight in!

gafferino · 13-01-2014 3:05pm

This is a mini Monday meltdown.

K-9 · 13-01-2014 3:14pm

Might as well get it in early, Villa is a must win game.

Can't wait for the derby and Arsenal at home, missed huge matches like this for too long.

Play United Away on the 15th March and every second game after that is huge, Spurs, City, Chelsea and then Newcastle last day of the season, all at home. The Away games in between are against bottom half of the table teams.

joe123 · 13-01-2014 3:16pm

K-9 wrote: »

Might as well get it in early, Villa is a must win game.

Can't wait for the derby and Arsenal at home, missed huge matches like this for too long.

Play United Away on the 15th March and every second game after that is huge, Spurs, City, Chelsea and then Newcastle last day of the season, all at home. The Away games in between are against bottom half of the table teams.

With Chelsea v Man United next weekend and the possibility of one or both dropping points it is vital we pick up the three here.

Though I think we all realise every game is a must win at this stage. :cool:

Bobeagleburger · 13-01-2014 3:16pm

K-9 wrote: »

Might as well get it in early, Villa is a must win game.

Can't wait for the derby and Arsenal at home, missed huge matches like this for too long.

Play United Away on the 15th March and every second game after that is huge, Spurs, City, Chelsea and then Newcastle last day of the season, all at home. The Away games in between are against bottom half of the table teams.

3 points v Villa is so important after yesterday's win. Everton have a tricky away match v Swansea and could easily drop points.

Chelsea play Utd so at least one of them will drop points. Hopefully both.

Sappy404 · 13-01-2014 3:16pm

Grayditch wrote: »

Football Tattoos will now be releasing a Liverpool Transfer pack.

Easy on, easy off, just like Joe Cole's debut!

Kolo Toure, now spelled correctly!

Daniel Agger lick and stick sleeve included.

Note:
*Transfers will only become active on Jan 31st.
*Not all of these temporary transfers will work, e.g. Victor Moses.

Bobeagleburger · 13-01-2014 3:18pm

Speaking of the Utd game, it'll probably be moved to the Sunday 1.30pm kickoff I presume.

Seems the norm these days.

gafferino · 13-01-2014 3:21pm

rarnes1 wrote: »

3 points v Villa is so important after yesterday's win. Everton have a tricky away match v Swansea and could easily drop points.

Chelsea play Utd so at least one of them will drop points. Hopefully both.

Id prefer Chelsea to win this one. I think they will take 2nd spot and dont think we will catch them. Have a feeling it will come down to us, Utd and maybe Everton for 4th.

Knex* · 13-01-2014 3:24pm

gafferino wrote: »

This is a mini Monday meltdown.

Imagine if we lost? Christ.

The Narrator · 13-01-2014 3:26pm

You people are crazy.

Gerrard is just back from injury, Stoke haven't been beaten at home since September, we scored 5 and won by 2. Didn't play the best at times, but good teams make sure they get the win when playing below par, United of old made a habit of it and won title after title.

Good 3 points, bring on Villa.

Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2013/14

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