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Fine Gael's credibility

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    #32
    joeguevara
    Registered Users Posts: 8,041 ✭✭✭joeguevara


    tipptom wrote: »
    But isn't that just admitting to the worst type of cute hoorism that this country has ever seen,and god knows there has been a lot of it.
    I know some people who are massive supporters of Michael Lowry and at the same time would laugh at how ridiculous it was that the people of Mayo could vote back in P Flynn and Beverly Flynn time and time again.


    I wonder if the Lowry supporters in noth Tipperary were asked to club together and pay back the state the money that the other tendering consortiums are rightly suing the state for, would that alter their view of Michael Lowry?,hardworking or not.

    But the flynns didn't do much for their constituents. Nowhere near as much as Mick.

    The second part is a hypothetical. I'd throw mother Teresa under a bus if I had to shell out for something that wasn't my fault. Still doesn't alter the fact of why Michael Lowry is popular. That was my original point.


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    #33
    Phoebas
    Registered Users Posts: 9,370 ✭✭✭Phoebas


    What kinds of good work does Lowry do for his constituents?
    He isnt in a position of any power and I can't imagine he has much influence with people who hold power.

    Is he just really good at filling in forms and writing letters?


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    #34
    tipptom
    Registered Users Posts: 4,219 ✭✭✭tipptom


    joeguevara wrote: »
    But the flynns didn't do much for their constituents. Nowhere near as much as Mick.

    The second part is a hypothetical. I'd throw mother Teresa under a bus if I had to shell out for something that wasn't my fault. Still doesn't alter the fact of why Michael Lowry is popular. That was my original point.
    Oh,i don't know about that,P Flynn must have been a good worker for his constituents as he couldn't have been returned on his self regard and arrogance alone.


    But when do you say enough is enough about ML, because you may go looking for Mother Theresa's body for that bus, because you will be paying for ML s dealings through his"profoundly corrupt to a degree that was nothing short of breathtaking" acts,according to the judge,and you have already paid for his tax evasion and he tried to make you pay again by trying to get a state company to pay more money per year to his mate Ben Dunne which would have "improperly enriched Mr Dunne and thereby burdened PUBLIC funds",never mind his other sleazy schemes with Mr Dunne.


    When does the "Im all right Jack",he got me the health card selfishness stop,so no matter what he does he will get my vote and I will pin any journalist to the wall who dares question Michael.


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    #35
    joeguevara
    Registered Users Posts: 8,041 ✭✭✭joeguevara


    tipptom wrote: »
    Oh,i don't know about that,P Flynn must have been a good worker for his constituents as he couldn't have been returned on his self regard and arrogance alone.


    But when do you say enough is enough about ML, because you may go looking for Mother Theresa's body for that bus, because you will be paying for ML s dealings through his"profoundly corrupt to a degree that was nothing short of breathtaking" acts,according to the judge,and you have already paid for his tax evasion and he tried to make you pay again by trying to get a state company to pay more money per year to his mate Ben Dunne which would have "improperly enriched Mr Dunne and thereby burdened PUBLIC funds",never mind his other sleazy schemes with Mr Dunne.


    When does the "Im all right Jack",he got me the health card selfishness stop,so no matter what he does he will get my vote and I will pin any journalist to the wall who dares question Michael.

    Going round in circles. The op said he found it unbelievable that tipp people vote in Lowry. I said that it was not unbelievable.


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    #36
    tipptom
    Registered Users Posts: 4,219 ✭✭✭tipptom


    But I am offering you irrefutable reasons why it is unbelievable and all you seem to counter with is,"He is the only TD in Tipperary who gets thing done",which is not true anyway.
    Believe it or not there is a large section of Tipperary people who are embarrassed by the fact that ML is returned each time and it reflects badly on the county and another court case of fresh tax evasion to come.


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    #37
    jackofalltrades
    Registered Users Posts: 3,242 ✭✭✭jackofalltrades


    tipptom wrote: »
    When does the "Im all right Jack",he got me the health card selfishness stop...
    It stops when politicians can no longer effect the results of things like applying for a medical card or other types of benefits.
    For this to happen we need a very efficient and accountable public sector.
    Where people can't skip the queue or get the rules bent for their own benefit.

    I've heard stories of people going to Michael Lowry because an application they had in for a grant was taking way too long.
    And they couldn't get a straight answer from whatever local/government department they were dealing with.
    A phone call to one of "Team Lowry" later and it was all sorted. You can kinda understand how people vote for him then.


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    #38
    tipptom
    Registered Users Posts: 4,219 ✭✭✭tipptom


    jackofalltrades wrote: »
    It stops when politicians can no longer effect the results of things like applying for a medical card or other types of benefits.
    For this to happen we need a very efficient and accountable public sector.
    Where people can't skip the queue or get the rules bent for their own benefit.

    I've heard stories of people going to Michael Lowry because an application they had in for a grant was taking way too long.
    And they couldn't get a straight answer from whatever local/government department they were dealing with.
    A phone call to one of "Team Lowry" later and it was all sorted. You can kinda understand how people vote for him then.
    I can understand how they would vote for the councillor who is supposed to be dealing with that stuff,and that type of cute hoorism is going to be made above board now in the health department by minister Reilly looking to give over the gift appealed for medical card to politicians.


    Team Lowry is just another evasive doge by ML to garner votes when the dual mandate was done away with led by a group of sycophantic tax dodge loving people who behave like they are in a cult and probably have a giant straw man made in an image of Michael some where on an island ready for the day when Michael takes over Ireland and those who don't worship him for his dodgy little ways will be sacrificed on his burning image.


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    #39
    Red Pepper
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,567 ✭✭✭Red Pepper


    Kaiser2000 wrote: »
    Of course we'll have our day in 2016 but I fully expect that Kenny and the rest of the current leadership won't be there to see it. They'll be off to Europe or retired on full pensions like those that went before them while the electorate struggles with where to go next. I don't know if anyone here watched the "People's Debate" on TV3 last night but if THAT is the quality of the opposition/alternatives, then it's no wonder that the mainstream parties get away with the seemingly never-ending stream of corruption, scandal and incompetence.

    But to answer the title of the OP, FG lost all credibility the day after they were elected IMO.

    Yes I do think Kenny has been coasting for a while now and I do expect him to jump to a high paying soft European job in 2016.


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    #40
    fly_agaric
    Registered Users Posts: 4,810 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Red Pepper wrote: »
    Yes I do think Kenny has been coasting for a while now and I do expect him to jump to a high paying soft European job in 2016.

    Off topic, but I seem to see alot of these speculations about people (Enda Kenny the last while, think it was Bertie once upon a time) heading off to a "big job" in "Europe". Are our politicians so wonderful that they can just waltz into what are probably more important jobs in 'Europe' when they are tired of governing the "Celtic Superpower"? (don't mention the IMF!):eek: Or is it that we (well, the media) have a distorted sense of Ireland's importance which would be funny if it were not so pathetic?

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/kenny-tipped-for-plum-job-as-head-of-the-eu-29479247.html


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    #41
    ChicagoJoe
    Registered Users Posts: 372 ✭✭ChicagoJoe


    alastair wrote: »
    FG didn't have AIB do any such thing. Fitzgerald paid off everything he could, and AIB wrote off the remaining debt on the basis of Fiztgerald's inability to pay any more - he was retired at that point. FG were oblivious to his issues, because Fitzgerald kept that side of things to himself. It probably helped that he was high profile, and had saved AIB's bacon years before by bailing out ICI - a subsidiary of AIB. But there's nothing to suggest FG lobbying played any role in the banks decision to write off the remainder of Fitzgerald's loan after he had given them everything he had.

    Having said that - there's many other things in FG to get disillusioned by.
    FG very much had something to with the AIB do any such ' thing ' - the bailout by the Irish tax payer of the AIB subsidary ICI for £400 Million :rolleyes:

    And AIB also wrote off debts of almost IR£200,000 owed by FitzGerald following the collapse of the aircraft leasing company, Guinness Peat Aviation, in which he was a shareholder. Chairman of AIB at the time, Peter Sutherland, was also a former director of GPA and had served as Attorney General under FitzGerald - enough said. All part of the same cronyism that Bretie Ahern and others like him got with their "dig outs" and so on.

    It should also be pointed out that Fitzgerald at this time had plenty of nixers apart from his huge ex Taoiseach's pension such as been on the board of Aer Lingus, writing for the Irish Times and chauffeured around in a state car where Sir Garret could act out his greatest desire to act like a British aristocrat. But still he managed to go broke which says it all about Fitzgerald and FG's capacity to run a country.


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    #42
    fliball123
    Registered Users Posts: 7,445 ✭✭✭fliball123


    woodoo wrote: »
    93 people have viewed this thread in 12 hours yet only one replied. The unfortunately truth is that in Ireland we just aren't that exercised about corruption of politicians or a lack standards in office... so it will continue.


    I think its more a case of what can they do about it..The legal system and the cronyism within this country have it set up for the political elite to shaft, lie, steel and cause mayhem and they can walk away with hefty pensions, payouts and expenses.....But what can the people do except wait for 4 years to vote out the current shower


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    #43
    petronius
    Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭petronius


    Fine Gael have no credibility anymore -
    The broken promises of the pre-election 2011
    - Not a red cent?
    - Phil Hogan/Irish Water
    - Alan Shatter
    - Legislating for Abortion to appease labour
    - Redefining Marriage to appease labour
    - The McNulty Affair
    - No New Politics guillotining legislation
    - Forcing through an additional 2 members to the banking inquiry so they could control it
    - cow towing to the Troika
    - Quangos
    - Jobs for the boys
    - a tax on the family home is immoral (enda kenny once said)


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    #44
    For Reals
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,964 ✭✭✭For Reals


    As a two party country it's tough for those of us not born to one or the other.
    I do believe in giving new people a chance. What ever about DeValera being an unpatriotic fraudster, we then had Haughey. Still, those days are gone. Although I never voted Fianna Fail I did believe there were most likely decent folk in there but the party changed with the wind.
    Then we had Ahern and Biffo. At that point I was 'enough is enough'. The party is rotten. At this point they are a lost cause in my book. The only reason to support them would be for self improvement, financially, to the detriment of any non-party members, the lowly Irish person.
    Fine Gael really really disappointed me. They were never ones for having a finger on the pulse, but it seems they believe if they bend over backwards for big business and the books look good for Europe, mission accomplished. They forget they're here to serve everybody. As for Kenny, he's a liar, proven. Also the new way of doing things and end to Quango's never transpired as promised. I believe the phrase is, 'full of ****'. I wouldn't believe anything from Kenny at this point.


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    #45
    tipptom
    Registered Users Posts: 4,219 ✭✭✭tipptom


    petronius wrote: »
    Fine Gael have no credibility anymore -
    The broken promises of the pre-election 2011
    - Not a red cent?
    - Phil Hogan/Irish Water
    - Alan Shatter
    - Legislating for Abortion to appease labour
    - Redefining Marriage to appease labour
    - The McNulty Affair
    - No New Politics guillotining legislation
    - Forcing through an additional 2 members to the banking inquiry so they could control it
    - cow towing to the Troika
    - Quangos
    - Jobs for the boys
    - a tax on the family home is immoral (enda kenny once said)
    An end to upwards only rent.


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