Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

Carawaystick · 21-09-2015 8:47pm

WomanSkirtFan8 wrote: »

If you build a railway, the industry will eventually follow.:)

Most of the industry in Mullingar is beside the railway station, and I'd say none of it uses the rail line, to Dublin, so I doubt there is a pressing need to freight stuff to Athlone...

Grandeeod · 29-09-2015 8:06pm

No mention of the WRC in todays fantasy capital programme.:D

mayo.mick · 30-09-2015 1:14am

Meanwhile in Sligo, things are beginning to happen on the ground!

Western%20rail%20trail-Sligo%20Champion%2029th%20sep%202015_zpsx849lu3d.jpg

Muckyboots · 03-10-2015 11:14am

Grandeeod wrote: »

No mention of the WRC in todays fantasy capital programme.:D

Surprise, surprise. It's not how they see it Claremorris.

A spokesman for West on Track said:
“The planned rail freight study opens up the prospect of re-introducing freight capacity on currently disused routes such as Limerick-Foynes and the Claremorris-Athenry lines. In that context the protection of these routes as rail lines is vitally important and West on Track understands that the Claremorris-Athenry line will now be preserved and protected for rail use.
The provision of infrastructure is fundamental to the creation of jobs. As Irish rail freight continues to grow, expanding Ireland’s rail freight network will create further opportunities to attract new business here while consolidating existing employment.
The study will also need to consider the serious issue of Ireland's carbon emissions. It is recognized that railways have an important role to play in reducing carbon emissions from the transport sector. Currently transport is responsible for approximately 30% of carbon emissions across Europe. A significant modal shift away from road to rail freight is achievable by using the existing spare capacity of operational railway lines & by re-activating routes such as the Limerick-Foynes and the Claremorris-Athenry lines,” he added.
Reference:
"In advance of the Mid Term Review, the Government will commission a feasibility study to examine options for expanding freight transport on the railways."
(Page 23 of Infrastructure and Capital Investment 2016-2021)

IMO -Looks like they have finally cut loose on Sligo-Claremorris

Pete_Cavan · 03-10-2015 12:22pm

Fair play Sligo. Once they open their section of greenway, I will be there with my bike and I will be encouraging everyone I know to cycle it too. I will be delighted for the forward-thinking people of Sligo taking in the income from it while their blinkered brethren to the south are sitting round looking at rusting tracks repeating "any minute now...".

MayoForSam · 03-10-2015 3:31pm

Well, looks like the Ballyglunin bridge is coming down:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2J-9tbBdnLweHp3eHl1cHRSbGM/view?usp=sharing

Pro-WOT Galway county councillors tried to have the vote adjourned but to no avail, the vote was carried to enable the road improvements to go ahead.

It remains to be seen if a pedestrian crossing for a greenway might be included when the road is widened. Hard to see a train ever passing this way again in the short to medium term.

The Tuam Herald seems to becoming a stronger advocate of a greenway through Tuam in recent times - very important to get local support built up.

Muckyboots · 03-10-2015 6:03pm

The WOT Councillors have made themselves look quite stupid, harking on about connectivity and rural regeneration, while at the same time showing a willingness to delay/block connectivity to the M17 for a whole community and all for the sake of their nostalgia for a mythical rail line. One of these boys will be looking for votes in the general election. He’ll get short shift in around Abbeyknockmoy, Lackagh and Monivea who’ll benefit from the road widening scheme when it goes ahead.

westtip · 07-10-2015 1:11pm

Muckyboots wrote: »

A spokesman for West on Track said:
“In that context the protection of these routes as rail lines is vitally important and West on Track understands that the Claremorris-Athenry line will now be preserved and protected for rail use.

IMO -Looks like they have finally cut loose on Sligo-Claremorris

And Athenry Tuam as well

judging by the Ballyglunin decision!!!

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2J-9tbBdnLweHp3eHl1cHRSbGM/view

Muckyboots · 07-10-2015 8:54pm

mayo.mick wrote: »

Meanwhile in Sligo, things are beginning to happen on the ground!

Cllr. Canney has an article in this week's Tuam Herald poo poo-ing the Sligo Co op/ Irish rail agreement and reasserting the WOT freight is a coming soon argument. Say's he has copy of a letter, circulated to all Sligo CC's, from a "senior official" in Sligo Co Co stating that there is no such deal and that the Council are adhereing to the Western Development Plan. You don't need anti-Greenway Councillors in Sligo when we can export them from Galway to do the job and you don't need elected Councillors when you have "senior officials" making executive decisions.

savagethegoat · 08-10-2015 11:46am

https://www.facebook.com/WestOnTrack

optimism from WoT

sonnyblack · 08-10-2015 12:10pm

savagethegoat wrote: »

https://www.facebook.com/WestOnTrack

optimism from WoT

What does this mean? Could anyone tell me? Are numbers genuinely up on the line or is it just spin?

Lenton Lane · 08-10-2015 2:35pm

sonnyblack wrote: »

What does this mean? Could anyone tell me? Are numbers genuinely up on the line or is it just spin?

You won't get the actual answer in this thread, just anti rail spin. From my understanding numbers are up and up significantly.

Muckyboots · 08-10-2015 2:49pm

Lenton Lane wrote: »

You won't get the actual answer in this thread, just anti rail spin. From my understanding numbers are up and up significantly.

€10 return student fare might expain the increase in numbers and the fact that every single person in the photograph looks like a student. Can't argue with the numbers. Good luck to everyone involved, including the Irish tax payer.
(Spin)

serfboard · 08-10-2015 3:14pm

sonnyblack wrote: »

What does this mean? Could anyone tell me? Are numbers genuinely up on the line or is it just spin?

With the recovery going on now, all forms of transport are experiencing increases - you just have to look at how busy the roads have gotten all around the country.

Combine that with spiralling rents in urban areas and more people being priced out of renting/buying in Galway/Limerick and are commuting from outlying areas.

The WOT Facebook page puts it down to "the particular success of Iarnród Éireann’s promotional scheme for students".

I've just priced an online student return from Ennis to Galway. €9. Don't think anyone's going to beat €4.50 each way.

By way of comparison, a Bus Eireann Ennis-Galway online student return is €14.

A student will make the fiver saved stretch a long way ...

mayo.mick · 08-10-2015 3:16pm

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/transport-and-tourism/train-of-thought-what-next-for-the-western-rail-corridor-1.2056514

SueA · 08-10-2015 3:37pm

If there were a line between Ballymote and Galway it would open up more employment opportunities.

It could be part of the tourist Wild Atlantic Way; join up Knock airport with railway transport rather than having to hire a car or take a bus to Galway/Sligo etc.

I would definitely use the line.

Del.Monte · 08-10-2015 3:40pm

SueA wrote: »

If there were a line between Ballymote and Galway it would open up more employment opportunities.

It could be part of the tourist Wild Atlantic Way; join up Knock airport with railway transport rather than having to hire a car or take a bus to Galway/Sligo etc.

I would definitely use the line.

Railways are yesterday's technology (in Ireland anyway) and what money there is would be better spent tarring over as much of the countryside as possible.

end of the road · 08-10-2015 3:50pm

Del.Monte wrote: »

Railways are yesterday's technology (in Ireland anyway) and what money there is would be better spent tarring over as much of the countryside as possible.

well thats according to some. however, reality is much much different. ireland could have a good rail network however its much easier for government, and i believe irish rail to play politics with it rather then making it, and operating it, to the best it can be.

savagethegoat · 08-10-2015 4:01pm

I should be delighted if the figures are real after all the investment made. It's still a long way below the estimates though and losing lot of money better spent elsewhere. This applies to other lines too of course.

It's there now so hopefully it will be staying. There is no case though for re-opening more of it, not even as a freight red-herring

eastwest · 11-10-2015 5:21am

SueA wrote: »

If there were a line between Ballymote and Galway it would open up more employment opportunities.

It could be part of the tourist Wild Atlantic Way; join up Knock airport with railway transport rather than having to hire a car or take a bus to Galway/Sligo etc.

I would definitely use the line.

How would you 'join up Knock Airport with railway transport'?
By using a funicular up the hill to the airport? Or maybe a tunnel under the hill and a high-speed lift bored down through the ground?
In fact, why not build an underground rail terminal under the hill while you're at it, to cater for all the rail freight coming out of the Apple plant in Athenry.
You might be on to something there!

westtip · 11-10-2015 10:40am

end of the road wrote: »

well thats according to some. however, reality is much much different. ireland could have a good rail network however its much easier for government, and i believe irish rail to play politics with it rather then making it, and operating it, to the best it can be.

You won't get good rail transport by campaigning for nineteenth century infrastructure to be patched up. that is what WOT campaigns for. The Ennis/Athenry service is poor due to the alignment, the athenry turnaround etc and it does not go near Shannon Airport. The bends the twists the turns the hundreds of easement crossings over the old route will not deliver a good railway network, this is a core issue, what WOT are campaigning for - re-opening the old route is not about modern infrastructure, the railway campaigners should take a leaf out of the road lobby book - and campaign for entirely new rail routes to be opened, then you might get what you want and more to the point what is actually needed for rail transport.

westtip · 11-10-2015 11:01am

SueA wrote: »

If there were a line between Ballymote and Galway it would open up more employment opportunities.

It could be part of the tourist Wild Atlantic Way; join up Knock airport with railway transport rather than having to hire a car or take a bus to Galway/Sligo etc.

I would definitely use the line.

OK lets just examine your Knock Ireland West Airport argument, take today Sunday 11th october as an example, http://www.irelandwestairport.com/flightinformation/live_flight_information.aspx

There are nine flights in and nine out of Knock today, tomorrow there are six in and out. Even on summer schedules it will rarely go above 13 flights a day.

I presume the rail link you are talking about is based on Charlestown station with a shuttle bus link to Knock (about 6km), I cannot imagine you do actually mean a "spur" off the closed railway from Charlestown up the boggy mountainside to Knock. That we know is pure fantasy.

Lets go back to those nine flights today, I have just looked at flight information for Luton Airport - which has about 150 flights in and out today, last year it had just over 10 million passengers. It is served by good bus and motorway links, but it too has a railway some way from the airport - only about 2 km which is fortunate but it happens to be a mainline station on the east midland line into London St Pancras. There is a rail/air shuttle bus every ten minutes, its one of those bendy buses which carries about 200 people at full capacity. I use it all the time and even in off peak hours every bus (every ten minutes) will have 50 or so people on, thats 300 people an hour using this service, which probably accounts for no more than 8% of all passengers going to and from the airport.

For a rail air service to be meaningful it needs to be near a rail system taht can provide a meaningful service. The train service to London from Luton runs about every 15 minutes, the shuttle service to the airport takes about 5 minutes and runs every ten minutes. Are you seriously suggesting to cater for at most in summer time 14 flights a day from Knock a meaningful rail/air link from Charlestown with train frequencies passengers would expect, and transfer buses every ten minutes is going to be sustainable at Knock?

Just because someone has suggested it as an idea, does not mean to say it is a good idea. So please do go think about it.

However we must all be prepared to listen so please do expand on your arguments about one of the key parts of the western rail corridor I have heard about the rail/air link to Knock? I'm fascinated.

savagethegoat · 11-10-2015 11:10am

westtip wrote: »

OK lets just examine your Knock Ireland West Airport argument, take today Sunday 11th october as an example, http://www.irelandwestairport.com/flightinformation/live_flight_information.aspx

There are nine flights in and nine out of Knock today, tomorrow there are six in and out. Even on summer schedules it will rarely go above 13 flights a day.

I presume the rail link you are talking about is based on Charlestown station with a shuttle bus link to Knock (about 6km), I cannot imagine you do actually mean a "spur" off the closed railway from Charlestown up the boggy mountainside to Knock. That we know is pure fantasy.

Lets go back to those nine flights today, I have just looked at flight information for Luton Airport - which has about 150 flights in and out today, last year it had just over 10 million passengers. It is served by good bus and motorway links, but it too has a railway some way from the airport - only about 2 km which is fortunate but it happens to be a mainline station on the east midland line into London St Pancras. There is a rail/air shuttle bus every ten minutes, its one of those bendy buses which carries about 200 people at full capacity. I use it all the time and even in off peak hours every bus (every ten minutes) will have 50 or so people on, thats 300 people an hour using this service, which probably accounts for no more than 8% of all passengers going to and from the airport.

For a rail air service to be meaningful it needs to be near a rail system taht can provide a meaningful service. The train service to London from Luton runs about every 15 minutes, the shuttle service to the airport takes about 5 minutes and runs every ten minutes. Are you seriously suggesting to cater for at most in summer time 14 flights a day from Knock a meaningful rail/air link from Charlestown with train frequencies passengers would expect, and transfer buses every ten minutes is going to be sustainable at Knock?

Just because someone has suggested it as an idea, does not mean to say it is a good idea. So please do go think about it.

However we must all be prepared to listen so please do expand on your arguments about one of the key parts of the western rail corridor I have heard about the rail/air link to Knock? I'm fascinated.

spot on westtip...for a railink to an airport to work it needs lots of flights and lots of rail services. Knock doesn't have that many flights and a single line link cannot handle many trains and in any case how many passengers would want to go to where the train would go? It's a red herring, like the suggested freight services, it doesn't stand up in reality.

alcaline · 11-10-2015 11:28am

If we want a proper country wide train service we have to forget about everywhere but the Dublin commuter lines for 5 years.
Serious passenger numbers and money are being left behind in the greater Dublin area, so they should concentrate all available funds on these lines, get the best possible service which will make profits.
Once good profits are made then pick one line in the country and pump these profits into it, make the best possible service and watch it become popular and make profit.
These micky mouse investments on lines here there and yonder wont be a success, just invest in Dublin first where there is money to be made and then grow profits to invest elsewhere.

Markcheese · 11-10-2015 12:47pm

alcaline wrote: »

If we want a proper country wide train service we have to forget about everywhere but the Dublin commuter lines for 5 years.
Serious passenger numbers and money are being left behind in the greater Dublin area, so they should concentrate all available funds on these lines, get the best possible service which will make profits.
Once good profits are made then pick one line in the country and pump these profits into it, make the best possible service and watch it become popular and make profit.
These micky mouse investments on lines here there and yonder wont be a success, just invest in Dublin first where there is money to be made and then grow profits to invest elsewhere.

What profit ?? Yes there should be investment on urban routes- but other than that why would you -bother with new lines - we've a motorway network that can / could a vast number of coaches - and the network's already there -

alcaline · 11-10-2015 12:49pm

Markcheese wrote: »

What profit ?? Yes there should be investment on urban routes- but other than that why would you -bother with new lines - we've a motorway network that can / could a vast number of coaches - and the network's already there -

Invest in more carriages and increase frequency, money to be made in the greater dublin area.

savagethegoat · 11-10-2015 1:20pm

Markcheese wrote: »

What profit ?? Yes there should be investment on urban routes- but other than that why would you -bother with new lines - we've a motorway network that can / could a vast number of coaches - and the network's already there -

you're missing the point there, he's talking about Commuter Services. Coaches on Motorways aren't relevant as they would need to negotiate the traffic to get into the city. The whole point of commuter rail is that it gets workers into the city's heart quickly and in bulk.

end of the road · 11-10-2015 2:41pm

Markcheese wrote: »

What profit ?? Yes there should be investment on urban routes- but other than that why would you -bother with new lines - we've a motorway network that can / could a vast number of coaches - and the network's already there -

coaches should have no baring what so ever on whether rail lines should be built. the motor way network needs a competing mode to it where possible. a properly built competing mode of course

savagethegoat · 11-10-2015 3:09pm

the motorways couldn't compete with a long distance high speed railway.....the trouble is finding long enough runs to coin in on that advantage,

eastwest · 11-10-2015 8:55pm

alcaline wrote: »

If we want a proper country wide train service we have to forget about everywhere but the Dublin commuter lines for 5 years.
Serious passenger numbers and money are being left behind in the greater Dublin area, so they should concentrate all available funds on these lines, get the best possible service which will make profits.
Once good profits are made then pick one line in the country and pump these profits into it, make the best possible service and watch it become popular and make profit.
These micky mouse investments on lines here there and yonder wont be a success, just invest in Dublin first where there is money to be made and then grow profits to invest elsewhere.

I don't think any of our rail services make significant profits, if any. I do know that the majority of the state subsidy for public transport goes to rail, although the passenger numbers carried are not proportionate to the subsidy levels.
The Ennis athenry route is at the upper end of the subsidy per passenger tables, but it would be overtaken in that league slot if athenry claremorris was rebuilt.
No government will repeat the mistake of Ennis athenry. In particular, the notions of connecting knock airport to a rail link, or running railway on the Burma Road section is total fantasy.
However fantasy is what some voters want to hear, and the WOT councillors know that, even though they also know that they are supporting an impossible promise.

Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

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