Smokey stove

BlackEdelweiss · 18-09-2011 1:24pm #1

We had a new inis stove installed in our new extension. We had a few problems with smoke coming out at the beginning, it is a low chimney as it is only a single story so the draw is not great. It gets so smoky inside sometimes that we cannot open the door to put more fuel on, the house smells like there has been a campfire burning in the sitting room. A guy looked at it and said the damper inside at the back was not open and the smoke had nowhere to go, he rearranged it and it made a great improvement but it seems to have gone back to the way it was. Does anybody have anu information on this as we are starting to regret getting a stove now.

Stove Fan · 18-09-2011 1:57pm

BlackEdelweiss wrote: »

We had a new inis stove installed in our new extension. We had a few problems with smoke coming out at the beginning, it is a low chimney as it is only a single story so the draw is not great. It gets so smoky inside sometimes that we cannot open the door to put more fuel on, the house smells like there has been a campfire burning in the sitting room. A guy looked at it and said the damper inside at the back was not open and the smoke had nowhere to go, he rearranged it and it made a great improvement but it seems to have gone back to the way it was. Does anybody have anu information on this as we are starting to regret getting a stove now.

Hi:) Was this damper fitted in the stoves flue collar? From your description it sounds as if the stove is flued from the rear? If it is how long is the horizontal run? Any chance of a photo of the stove and chimney? Is there an air vent fitted in the room for the stove?

When you open up the air controls does the fire roar? Is the chimney lined and has sufficient height above any obstructions, eg roof trees etc?
Does the smoke exiting from the chimney go upwards or downwards when lit? It could be a flue or downdraft problem. When opening the stove door do it gently do stabilize the air pressure, between stove and room.
Smoking out the room is not normal.

Stove Fan:)

BlackEdelweiss · 18-09-2011 3:48pm

Hi,
I dont know that much about stoves so I cant answer most of your questions. The damper is on the back wall of the stove and in the position it is in now it blocks off the hole where the flue gases are meant to escape(flue collar?)I tried rearranging it again but I dont know if it is in properly or just resting on something. There is an air vent in the room. There does not seem to be much difference when the air intake is adjusted, it goes from 1 to 8, 8 being the most air supplied. It is a single story room with the chimney at the furthest point from the original 2 story house, it is about 5 meters from the existing house wall. We have no neighbours to our left and none behind us, just a long field. The smoke from the chimney does blow down a lot of the time so down draft could be a factor but the builder is putting an extra 3 feet of piping onto the chimney pot someday soon, he says we would not need a rotating cowl but I think he just dosent want to spend the money to buy it. Another guy said we should get a H cowl.
When I open the door the smoke will continue to billow out on a bad day.
I just cant work out the damper thing, in its natural position it seems to close off the chimney as it rests on a hook, to enable smoke to go up the chimney I have to take it off this hook and is not completely stable.
This is the stove we got.

http://www.inisstoves.ie/index.php/stoves/boiler-stoves/inis-meain

Thanks.

Stove Fan · 18-09-2011 4:03pm

BlackEdelweiss wrote: »

Hi,
I dont know that much about stoves so I cant answer most of your questions. The damper is on the back wall of the stove and in the position it is in now it blocks off the hole where the flue gases are meant to escape(flue collar?)I tried rearranging it again but I dont know if it is in properly or just resting on something. There is an air vent in the room. There does not seem to be much difference when the air intake is adjusted, it goes from 1 to 8, 8 being the most air supplied. It is a single story room with the chimney at the furthest point from the original 2 story house, it is about 5 meters from the existing house wall. We have no neighbours to our left and none behind us, just a long field. The smoke from the chimney does blow down a lot of the time so down draft could be a factor but the builder is putting an extra 3 feet of piping onto the chimney pot someday soon, he says we would not need a rotating cowl but I think he just dosent want to spend the money to buy it. Another guy said we should get a H cowl.
When I open the door the smoke will continue to billow out on a bad day.
I just cant work out the damper thing, in its natural position it seems to close off the chimney as it rests on a hook, to enable smoke to go up the chimney I have to take it off this hook and is not completely stable.
This is the stove we got.

http://www.inisstoves.ie/index.php/stoves/boiler-stoves/inis-meain

Thanks.

Hi, Any chance of a picture of the damper and outside chimney? It sounds as if the damper keeps restricting the exit of smoke and resetting itself partially closed. If this is the case it may be faulty and should be replaced by the stove maker. Adding more height to the flue should help and the H pots are very good:). It does look as if there is a downdraft issue. The fire control thermostat may need adjusting to get it working well. It should roar into life when the knob is increased. Providing the stove has been installed to their instructions you may need the flue collar damper replaced and the manufacturers to look at the thermostat control. I would give there technical helpline a ring.

Stove Fan:)

BlackEdelweiss · 18-09-2011 6:05pm

I cant upload the picture of the damper for some reason but here are an outside pic and a pic of the stove and first bit of the flue. Hope they are of some help.

BlackEdelweiss · 18-09-2011 8:38pm

Here is the inside of the stove and an outside shot showing distance from the chimney to the original roof. Another thing about the stove is that there is always some coal left in the grate in the morning, I have heard that all the fuel should be consumed in a stove.

Stove Fan · 18-09-2011 11:03pm

BlackEdelweiss wrote: »

Here is the inside of the stove and an outside shot showing distance from the chimney to the original roof. Another thing about the stove is that there is always some coal left in the grate in the morning, I have heard that all the fuel should be consumed in a stove.

Hi:) From the pictures I would say that there may be a downdraft problem. It looks from the sooting on the chimney pot that the smoke blows to the left of the picture. That the wind blows over the main house roof. You could burn some scrunched up newspaper on various days to see if the wind/breeze comes from over the main roof of the house on the right and blows the smoke to the left. If this is the case you could try raising the flue and see how that goes. I think the flue should be raised. The flue does look quite short. Most stoves need a minimum height of 4.5 metres but some stoves need 5.5m+ to work properly. When was the stove installed? If over 3 months and burning wood the flue could need sweeping.

With regards to having fuel left it can happen if the fuel was added too late and the fire had died down too much or the stove controls were turned down to minimum or if there is insufficient draw on the chimney. If the possible downdraft issue is resolved and the smoke goes up the chimney you could then test the stove thermostat to see if it draws the fire on full and slumbers as you turn it down. If not get the manufacturers to look at it, or open the door a bit to draw the fire. With regards the damper I can't comment further.
Let us know how you get on:)
Stove Fan:)

BlackEdelweiss · 27-09-2011 3:36pm

The damper I was referring to is actually the baffle, I wasent sure of my terminology. I was talking th the guy from Inis and he is sending me a new baffle with some holes drilled in it to hopefully improve the draw.

o0brien0o · 08-01-2012 12:48pm

Hi 'Black Edelweiss',
I got the same stove beginning december and have an almost identical scenario. Did you manage to get the problem solved?

Carlow52 · 08-01-2012 1:03pm

o0brien0o wrote: »

Hi 'Black Edelweiss',
I got the same stove beginning december and have an almost identical scenario. Did you manage to get the problem solved?

in what way almost identical?
can u describe it a bit more and post pics of ur chimney stack etc , see part k here

http://www.environ.ie/en/Publications/DevelopmentandHousing/BuildingStandards/FileDownLoad,1650,en.pdf

As to the OP: the chimney is too short and the roof structure set up makes it worse

It is possible to get a galvanised 'extension' that will fit into the existing flue.
fits best if existing pot is cut down to the capping level.

Stove Fan · 08-01-2012 4:40pm

Carlow52 wrote: »

in what way almost identical?
can u describe it a bit more and post pics of ur chimney stack etc , see part k here

http://www.environ.ie/en/Publications/DevelopmentandHousing/BuildingStandards/FileDownLoad,1650,en.pdf

As to the OP: the chimney is too short and the roof structure set up makes it worse

It is possible to get a galvanised 'extension' that will fit into the existing flue.
fits best if existing pot is cut down to the capping level.

Hi, I think another option for the original poster is a H cowel. It would be a good option.

Stove Fan:)

http://www.fluesystems.com/shop/H_Cowl_SW316_150.html

o0brien0o · 08-01-2012 7:31pm

hello, Its a ca.1930 semi-detached bungalow. The stove is under the chimney (inset like black edelweiss pic below) with an enamel flue piece 500mm connected to a 6"- 6" adaptor and then with approximately 4.5m of 6" flexi flue terminating at the chimney top. with no cowel at the moment. I installed the flexi flue, hoping it would make a difference to the pull of the chimney and for ease of cleaning. The setup is not exactly the same as below, because the chimney is the highest point of the house. The chimney is approx. 600mm above the apex of the roof. Today i cleaned the stove again (every three days of use approx.) swept the flexi flue for the first time and quite a bit of soot was removed. It is not in the chimney for more than three weeks. But obviously the clean seems to make some difference. The doors have never been clear for all that long since the first fire, except with a big fire, when some of the soot would crack off the glass and become somehow transparent. There is a second disused chimney beside the one in question, through which the water pipes from the back boiler connect to the hot press on the other side. The reason i mention this is because the diameter of the holes that the pipes pass through are obviously larger the the 1" pipe, So my question is does this cap (ca. 2") around the pipes leading into the disused chimney have any effect on the stove or the chimney that i am using? I plan to concrete around the pipes and therefore seal off the disused chimney, hopefully tomorrow. I will also try to contact inis stoves in the morning to see if they can offer any advice. Thanks very much for your responses, looking forward to hear your opinions.

dalyn · 12-02-2014 3:54pm

Replaced a stove approx. 4 months ago with an Inis Meain Boiler (multifuel) stove. The new stove really billows out smoke when reflueing, damper doesn't seem to make much difference. Have tried the following in individual and various combinations: opening the door slowing, only loading small amounts at a time, lighting the fire at the back of the box, the grate in open and shut and midway position, the side dial from 1-8, a window open in case the stove isn't getting enough draft, chimney cleaned, external soot box sealed up, etc. Burning turf/peat and sticks. Never had any such issue with the old stove which ran perfectly before dying aged 25 years. So bad my kids think I have suddenly developed a '60 a day habit' and to top it all bought the cream version.

Wearb · 12-02-2014 4:49pm

dalyn wrote: »

Replaced a stove approx. 4 months ago with an Inis Meain Boiler (multifuel) stove. The new stove really billows out smoke when reflueing, damper doesn't seem to make much difference. Have tried the following in individual and various combinations: opening the door slowing, only loading small amounts at a time, lighting the fire at the back of the box, the grate in open and shut and midway position, the side dial from 1-8, a window open in case the stove isn't getting enough draft, chimney cleaned, external soot box sealed up, etc. Burning turf/peat and sticks. Never had any such issue with the old stove which ran perfectly before dying aged 25 years. So bad my kids think I have suddenly developed a '60 a day habit' and to top it all bought the cream version.

Is the flue properly sized and insulated all the way to the top of the chimney?
You may have to chose some sort smokeless startup until you get it up to temperature.

dalyn · 12-02-2014 8:47pm

Not sure about size as it's the same flue as the last stove was connected to without any problems but is insulated. Not at it's worst during startup, very bad when refueling especially with turf/peat, literally one single piece sets it off not quite as bad when using wood.

scudo2 · 12-02-2014 8:59pm

dalyn wrote: »

Replaced a stove approx. 4 months ago with an Inis Meain Boiler (multifuel) stove. The new stove really billows out smoke when reflueing, damper doesn't seem to make much difference. Have tried the following in individual and various combinations: opening the door slowing, only loading small amounts at a time, lighting the fire at the back of the box, the grate in open and shut and midway position, the side dial from 1-8, a window open in case the stove isn't getting enough draft, chimney cleaned, external soot box sealed up, etc. Burning turf/peat and sticks. Never had any such issue with the old stove which ran perfectly before dying aged 25 years. So bad my kids think I have suddenly developed a '60 a day habit' and to top it all bought the cream version.

I do hope you have a carbon monoxide alarm in the room, for obvious reasons.

Whacker paddy · 12-02-2014 9:56pm

Have you tried a chimney cowl to help with airflow?

dalyn · 13-02-2014 2:10pm

Yes we have a carbon monoxide alarm but don't have a cowl. Didn't seem to need a cowl with the last stove but then the damper opening on this one is much smaller than the last one, or there was a separate door for the ash tray so we could leave that open. Thanks for suggestions.

crock! · 13-02-2014 3:33pm

dalyn wrote: »

Yes we have a carbon monoxide alarm but don't have a cowl. Didn't seem to need a cowl with the last stove but then the damper opening on this one is much smaller than the last one, or there was a separate door for the ash tray so we could leave that open. Thanks for suggestions.

Ive gone to a few houses with the same complaint.half the time the baffle (throat plate)was put in wrong.have a look it might be that simple

dalyn · 14-02-2014 4:20pm

Have gone back to the manufacturer this time. They ae, hopefully, sending a set of modified baffles which will increase the airflow, allow more hot air into the chimney which should result in the gases/smoke rising quicker out of the chimney. This may reduce the efficiency of the boiler but I would be happy with the compromose if it solves the smoking issue.

therealmccoy · 17-02-2014 3:26pm

BlackEdelweiss wrote: »

I cant upload the picture of the damper for some reason but here are an outside pic and a pic of the stove and first bit of the flue. Hope they are of some help.

Hi there,
It looks more like an Irish Isle Stove rather than an Inis stove but thats neither here nor there.

The stove should never really have been fitted into that chimney as it, it was never realistically going to work unfortunately. Right now the best thing that I can recommend is to either extend the flue by about 5 meters or to put on a motorised spinning cowl. Either way it will cost you around 300 euro or more.

Sorry couldnt bring better news.

Smokey stove

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