New Passat or Citroen?

Stevie Dakota · 03-06-2008 1:53pm #1

The shortlist has narrowed further to...

C5 2.0HDI Exclusive manual around €35K
or
Passat 1.4TSI Highline with 7 speed DSG around €32K

The styling, interior, diesel performance and comfort really appeal with the C5, the VW has a great engine and auto gearbox, and while a relatively dull design is still a solid overall package, it is also quite a but cheaper.

If someone put a gun to your head which would you choose and why?

Please don't suggest Mondeos, Mazda 6, Avensis, etc, considered them all and its one of these 2...(I think)...

peasant · 03-06-2008 1:59pm

I've never driven one of those 1.4 TSI's. On paper they seem to be a fantastic engine, but I'd have some doubts if such a small, highly strung engine could push something as heavy as a Passat reliably and durably over time.

How long is that engine out now? Are there any reports how reliable it is in such a heavy car?

Zube · 03-06-2008 2:04pm

Stevie Dakota wrote: »

If someone put a gun to your head which would you choose and why?

The Citroen: more style and a simpler, more relaxed engine.

ambro25 · 03-06-2008 2:10pm

The Citroen, without hesitation.
Moreover, re. the "manual vs autobox", doesn't the HDI Exclusive manual come with that "cruise control for manual diesels" thingy as standard?
My Dad's got that thingy on his C5 (which is an 07 HDI Exclusive), it's the best car gadget since... well... ever! Works fabulously well.

Anan1 · 03-06-2008 2:15pm

ambro25 wrote: »

The Citroen, without hesitation.

Me too.

Mailman · 03-06-2008 2:26pm

Are those prices with trade-in? they seem quite cheap.

Stevie Dakota · 03-06-2008 3:01pm

Mailman wrote: »

Are those prices with trade-in? they seem quite cheap.

No trade in, straight deal prices(ish). To be honest I think the Passat is just too dull, however that DSG box is a wonder. No ideas on reliability of the TSi engine, it is rather new.

The C5 may be the one, if I can just get much head around paying that much for a Citroen....

Mailman · 03-06-2008 3:12pm

VW's Irish July prices for the 1.4 litre TSI are according to their website as follows:
Engine L/CC VRT Band Price
1. 1.4 COMFORTLINE TSI 122BHP 1.4/1390 D € 29,090
2. 1.4 COMFORTLINE TSI DSG 122BHP 1.4/1390 C € 30,550
3. 1.4 HIGHLINE TSI 122BHP 1.4/1390 D € 31,090
4. 1.4 HIGHLINE TSI DSG 122BHP 1.4/1390 C € 32,460
5. 1.4 SPORTLINE TSI 122BHP 1.4/1390 D € 29,385
6. 1.4 TSI 122BHP 1.4/1390 D € 26,760

How are you negotiating such large discounts?

Stevie Dakota · 03-06-2008 3:18pm

Mailman wrote: »

VW's Irish July prices for the 1.4 litre TSI are according to their website as follows:
Engine L/CC VRT Band Price
1. 1.4 COMFORTLINE TSI 122BHP 1.4/1390 D € 29,090
2. 1.4 COMFORTLINE TSI DSG 122BHP 1.4/1390 C € 30,550
3. 1.4 HIGHLINE TSI 122BHP 1.4/1390 D € 31,090
4. 1.4 HIGHLINE TSI DSG 122BHP 1.4/1390 C € 32,460
5. 1.4 SPORTLINE TSI 122BHP 1.4/1390 D € 29,385
6. 1.4 TSI 122BHP 1.4/1390 D € 26,760

How are you negotiating such large discounts?

Ah ha! Sorry typos now corrected, yes, those would be good discounts!

Mailman · 03-06-2008 3:24pm

Stevie Dakota wrote: »

Ah ha! Sorry typos now corrected, yes, those would be good discounts!

Yes, in that case why aren't you negotiating larger discounts.

BTW I noticed that Michael Moore has a bunch of '06 1.9 TDI Passats on his web site so perhaps there is a good discount going on them. He had more than any dealer would be comfortable with on a forecourt.

Stevie Dakota · 03-06-2008 3:29pm

Mailman wrote: »

Yes, in that case why aren't you negotiating larger discounts.
.

Those VW prices do not include the "Delivery and related charges" or metallic.

leincar · 03-06-2008 5:13pm

I recently bought a passat. With the Monaco sports pack it dosen't look dull at all.

Having said that, I bought the Passat on the strength of its residuals. If It was a company car I would have bought the C5 as it is the nicest looking car in its class by a mile. I was just to nervous about its second hand values.

The DSG gearbox is good though!

GERMAN ROCKS · 03-06-2008 6:52pm

ambro25 wrote: »

The Citroen, without hesitation.
Moreover, re. the "manual vs autobox", doesn't the HDI Exclusive manual come with that "cruise control for manual diesels" thingy as standard?
My Dad's got that thingy on his C5 (which is an 07 HDI Exclusive), it's the best car gadget since... well... ever! Works fabulously well.

+2

drunkmonkey · 03-06-2008 7:03pm

My Dads 2002 C5 2.0HDI

Is a complete bucket of ****....no not buy a citroen as you will loose a testicle and have no money in your wallet....If it's a compnay car buy an Alfa as you can be broke down in style!!

3 weeks ago he took it to citroen for it's regular service, Got a new timing belt fitted, water pump and general service....cost €900, they told him there's knuckle gone in the stearing colm, that's €275+vat and fitting, the clutch is on the way out, another €1000......and this morning he put 3 liters of coolant into it......He now needs to get the head gasket done....another €1000....you get my drift.....there a complete bucket of **** I can not stress this enough....he's had a BX, Xantia and C5 and was never got any money back out of them.....be warned....they are ****, ****, ****....:mad:

drunkmonkey · 03-06-2008 7:06pm

Just to add, there's only 92,000 miles on it with a full main citroen dealer service history, he's had it since new....

he'd probaly do you a savage deal on it right now.....actually he'd probably pay you to drive it....

"Think Citroen, Think like a muppet"

ramanujan · 03-06-2008 7:06pm

peasant wrote: »

.....1.4 TSI's. .....

How long is that engine out now? Are there any reports how reliable it is in such a heavy car?

Only negative reports I've heard from the VW crew relate to the 170bhp version, and it over heating. Still early days yet to make a comment on long term reliability.

I've driven the 170bhp variant in the mk5 golf, and didn't feel it was up to much. Even though it's a high horsepowered engine it didn't feel that fast to me, when compared to say the 1.8t 150bhp engine. So in a heavier saloon i would recommend a more torquey diesel.

(I think a tuned 1.4tsi would be great fun in a polo or similar hatch)

drunkmonkey · 03-06-2008 7:21pm

ramanujan wrote: »

Still early days yet to make a comment on long term reliability.

I'd rather have a VW which "might have a problem" rather than a citroen which will "definatley have a problem"

If the gun was to my head and I had to pick one of the cars you mentioned I'd go for the VW.......but If I was holding a gun to your head you'd be driving home in a second hand mercedes or bmw....:D

return guide · 03-06-2008 7:50pm

drunkmonkey wrote: »

you get my drift.....there a complete bucket of **** I can not stress this enough....he's had a BX, Xantia and C5 and was never got any money back out of them.....be warned....they are ****, ****, ****....:mad:

Have you tried to express your concerns to your father ? maybe your not getting your point across or is it he just likes them.

crosstownk · 03-06-2008 7:59pm

I'm a big VW fan and I've driven both cars.

My verdict - the Citroën C5. If you've test driven both you'll know what I mean. OK, residuals with the C5 may be some cause for concern, but already, word has it that larger European leasing companies have increased the residuals on the new C5 vs the C5 series II. I haven't seen proof of this, but I do honestly think that the C5's residuals will increase, but time will tell.

Robertr · 03-06-2008 9:16pm

I have an 06 Passat for sale

http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=51945&cat=500

Willing to consider any offer!

drunkmonkey · 03-06-2008 9:25pm

return guide wrote: »

Have you tried to express your concerns to your father ? maybe your not getting your point across or is it he just likes them.

Dad bought himself a second hand range rover 3 years ago which he really really loves.......my mum is lumped with the citroen......no he does not like them anyomore, the romance is over!!!!

Green Hornet · 03-06-2008 9:32pm

Citroen are French rubbish. Reliability and resale are poor from what I hear. I'd say the Passat is the better option from the two.

crosstownk · 03-06-2008 9:48pm

Green Hornet wrote:

Citroen are French rubbish. Reliability and resale are poor from what I hear. I'd say the Passat is the better option from the two.

Yes - if you take it solely from the point of view of residual. Some people consider this important while others don't. From a pure residual point of view then the Passat wins hands down. However, from a style and driving point of view, the Citroën is the winner in my book. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I know, but I don't think I've heard a bad comment about the new Citroën C5's style. From a reliabilty perspective, the new C5 has the same old 1.6HDi design that has proven incredibly reliable over the past few years. Electronics in French cars has always been the downfall of French manufacturers - if Citroën have solved this problem then things just might be on the up for André Citroën's relations.....

colm_mcm · 03-06-2008 9:57pm

Much as I disliked the outgoing C5, I am a fan of the DS, the XM, and to a lesser extent - the Xantia. If I was spending company car money, I'd definately go French on this one. The residuals on the TSI Passat are hardly set in stone yet.

E92 · 03-06-2008 9:58pm

If it were my money - the VW.

If it's somebody else's money and/or the OP isn't bothered by depreciation - the Citroen.

Crosstownk: you might want to fix you quote(it's quoting the wrong person);)!

crosstownk · 03-06-2008 10:04pm

E92 wrote: »

Crosstownk: you might want to fix you quote(it's quoting the wrong person);)!

Oops!!

Thanks, E92!

kwalshe · 03-06-2008 10:08pm

I'm gonna be honest, Passats are not the same as they used to be, there is some serious problems with the all 05 and most of 06's. In my company we have approx. 17 Passats and about 75% have had major problems. 5 shut down completely with a known Fuel pump problem that VW are completely ignoring. Search the web for more on this. Mine cut out (everything!!) at 120 kph and the comment I got from VW was "Why don't you look out in the service lot at the 14 Passats with the same problem, what you want me to do!"
Other problems include Handbrake, clutch and ground issue which make car look electrics.
There is a reason why there is so many for sale in Micheal Moore, a good barometer for me is taxi drivers, I've yet to get into a new type Passat Taxi

pburns · 04-06-2008 9:33am

Just to point out the C5 has atrocious CO2 and therefore road-tax in comparison with the competition - mostly 'cos it's too heavy.

Personally I'd plump for it over the VW though - it'll be at least as reliable as the over-rated German. I'd have more faith in the 1.6HDi than a (potentially) over-stressed VW unit...

AlanD · 04-06-2008 9:46am

kwalshe wrote: »

I'm gonna be honest, Passats are not the same as they used to be, there is some serious problems with the all 05 and most of 06's. In my company we have approx. 17 Passats and about 75% have had major problems. 5 shut down completely with a known Fuel pump problem that VW are completely ignoring. Search the web for more on this. Mine cut out (everything!!) at 120 kph and the comment I got from VW was "Why don't you look out in the service lot at the 14 Passats with the same problem, what you want me to do!"
Other problems include Handbrake, clutch and ground issue which make car look electrics.
There is a reason why there is so many for sale in Micheal Moore, a good barometer for me is taxi drivers, I've yet to get into a new type Passat Taxi

I agree.....Passats cause trouble. A lot of it. My Dad does recovery for the AA and even still the Passat is the most common car on the back of his truck. Right up until '08 cars with delivery mileage recently.

My money would be with the Citroen. Proven engine and suspension. Only issue might be if they have new electronics on board.....

RedorDead · 04-06-2008 10:25am

Stevie Dakota wrote: »

The shortlist has narrowed further to...

C5 2.0HDI Exclusive manual around €35K
or
Passat 1.4TSI Highline with 7 speed DSG around €32K

The styling, interior, diesel performance and comfort really appeal with the C5, the VW has a great engine and auto gearbox, and while a relatively dull design is still a solid overall package, it is also quite a but cheaper.

If someone put a gun to your head which would you choose and why?

Please don't suggest Mondeos, Mazda 6, Avensis, etc, considered them all and its one of these 2...(I think)...

New Audi A4 2.0TDI 120 available for €35100, just to throw one into the melting pot!!

New Passat or Citroen?

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