Haven't they heard of Google? It's free!

CrazyRabbit · 05-01-2010 5:39pm #1

Can you believe that the DoE are going to pay €450,000 per year in licence fees to Britannica & World Book so schools can access their online Encyclopaedia?

What's wrong with just using Google to find free resources?

Total waste of money. I wonder which school is going to have to continue using run-down prefabs as schoolrooms because they wasted this money?

Oh, and here's the linky to the story.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0105/school.html

quinnthebin · 05-01-2010 5:45pm

Great - wonder did the short sighted minister give any thought to provision of adequate and up to date IT resources - access to online resources is of limited use if the school only have a few out of date computers and no timetabled IT classes.

My name is URL · 05-01-2010 5:48pm

Britannica etc are verifiable sources of information for students.. Google really isn't

Doctor DooM · 05-01-2010 5:54pm

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

Can you believe that the DoE are going to pay €450,000 per year in licence fees to Britannica & World Book so schools can access their online Encyclopaedia?

What's wrong with just using Google to find free resources?

Total waste of money. I wonder which school is going to have to continue using run-down prefabs as schoolrooms because they wasted this money?

Oh, and here's the linky to the story.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0105/school.html

Google doesn't verify information, merely presents it.

chin_grin · 05-01-2010 5:54pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Britannica etc are verifiable sources of information for students.. Google really isn't

Now, now. Don't be suprised if your son/daughter is doing Honours LOLCat and gets accepted to Meme College.

eden_my_ass · 05-01-2010 5:56pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Britannica etc are verifiable sources of information for students.. Google really isn't

And one of the best skills for anyone planning on working near a computer in the future is the ability to both search the worlds largest information repository efficiently and to differentiate between valid sources of information and fluff. The government haven't provided me with a free subscription to Britannica, but I'm capable of using the internet without joining any cults, swallowing any conspiracy theories etc. School books are the primary source of reference for education, secondary should be solid broadband internet access (with proper education about how to use it). This is a waste of our taxes, and a poor use of students time. Not that many will ever see these sites, as mentioned already.

ScumLord · 05-01-2010 5:56pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Britannica etc are verifiable sources of information for students.. Google really isn't

There's your answer. Just look at all the poor fools who end up in here looking to get their school work done for them.

eden_my_ass · 05-01-2010 5:58pm

ScumLord wrote: »

There's your answer. Just look at all the poor fools who end up in here looking to get their school work done for them.

They've been given internet access but never taught how to use it.

General Zod · 05-01-2010 5:59pm

chin_grin wrote: »

Now, now. Don't be suprised if your son/daughter is doing Honours LOLCat and gets accepted to Meme College.

hey, I got my PhD in Internet Studies from Oxfoord University.tk

mathie · 05-01-2010 5:59pm

Because **** like After Hours turns up on Google.

CrazyRabbit · 05-01-2010 6:16pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Britannica etc are verifiable sources of information for students.. Google really isn't

What I mean is that Google can be used to find free and 'verifiable sources of information'.

Britannica is good, but it doesn't cover everything. And using only one source leads to a biased and ignorant understanding of the world.

It would have been far better for the students if they were taught how to research properly, instead of being given all the 'useful' information in a single website.

entropi · 05-01-2010 6:24pm

Sure they have to use the money wisely these days ya know...

DoE had around 220m euro left to spend at the end of the last year, they got budget cuts this year because they were not spending the cash like they should.

Hank_Jones · 05-01-2010 6:34pm

I remember during my primary school education, we were educated in these run down pre-fabs that were freezing during the winter and also had quite a bit of leakage.

Those crappy ''buildings'' were supposed to be temporary.

That was 20 years ago....

They are still there.

Capt'n Midnight · 05-01-2010 11:56pm

No ones mentioned http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Aaaaaaa yet :eek:

jenga-jen · 06-01-2010 12:57am

A teacher I know tried to Google a picture of a certain plant for her primary school class and instead got back a load of pictures of a topless girl with the same name.

Britannica etc might be the safer route

tudlytops · 06-01-2010 1:03am

What did all kids do before the internet. oh I remember we had books, went to the library, cost a lot less money, yes that what we did and we still manage to go to university.

TheZohanS · 06-01-2010 1:03am

Judging by the sorry state of what passes for teachers these days in that tv program on RTE last night the poor kids need all the hep they can get.

Aoibheann · 06-01-2010 1:12am

TheZohan wrote: »

Judging by the sorry state of what passes for teachers these days in that tv program on RTE last night the poor kids need all the hep they can get.

A, B, C...? And if the kids are so badly off, why would you subject them to that kind of disease to go along with it.. :mad:

:pac:

TheZohanS · 06-01-2010 1:15am

Aoibheann wrote: »

A, B, C...? And if the kids are so badly off, why would you subject them to that kind of disease to go along with it.. :mad:

:pac:

Broken keyboard from giving lots of bans Aoibheann.

OutlawPete · 06-01-2010 1:23am

TheZohan wrote: »

Judging by the sorry state of what passes for teachers these days ...

Yeah, they sure are not what they used to be in my day I tell ya :eek:

http://www.hottforteacher.com/ *

*NSFW or at home if there is someone standing behind ya

TheZohanS · 06-01-2010 1:27am

OutlawPete wrote: »

Yeah, they sure are not what they used to be in my day I tell ya :eek:

http://www.hottforteacher.com/ *

*NSFW or at home if there is someone standing behind ya

Niiii....

tudlytops · 06-01-2010 1:48am

TheZohan wrote: »

Judging by the sorry state of what passes for teachers these days in that tv program on RTE last night the poor kids need all the hep they can get.

Maybe the teachers are the ones that need help.

You know retesting every so often, random inspections, if the whole class is doing badly then look at the teacher.

opinion guy · 06-01-2010 1:56am

Um haven't the government or any of you heard of Wikipedia ??:eek::eek::eek:
Or Google Scholar ????:eek::eek::eek:

My name is URL wrote: »

Britannica etc are verifiable sources of information for students.. Google really isn't

Studies have shown wikipedia is just as good as Britannica:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4530930.stm

citizen_p · 06-01-2010 2:00am

well we used to get projects to do on the internet in school...but i always ended up looking for videos or games that werent blocked. and then id do the project on my home computer.

some site blocking was stupid though...doing a project on ww2 for history, if you searched for anything related to it. blocked for viloence/ racism etc... with other subjects

ohh and stopped commiting to projects because i had to start dumbing down my projects as anything i handed up was followed by "<name> this is just copy n pasted"
when it wasnt copied at all

tudlytops · 06-01-2010 2:01am

opinion guy wrote: »

Um haven't the government or any of you heard of Wikipedia ??:eek::eek::eek:
Or Google Scholar ????:eek::eek::eek:

Studies have shown wikipedia is just as good as Britannica:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4530930.stm

Yeah but it's so much more like the goverment to spend 1000's unecesarly, why would they use Wikipedia that one is free.

oppenheimer1 · 06-01-2010 2:12am

opinion guy wrote: »

Um haven't the government or any of you heard of Wikipedia ??:eek::eek::eek:
Or Google Scholar ????:eek::eek::eek:

Studies have shown wikipedia is just as good as Britannica:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4530930.stm

While Wikipedia is good, and I've learned a lot off it, if you wrote a paper and cited it as a source you would be laughed at, you wouldn't if you cited Britannica. No what the department have done is a positive step. Something like an encyclopaedia presents data in a far more managable way rather than having youngsters trying to make sense of academic papers and sift through rubbish. Making research easy for them... maybe, but I'd rather it was easy for them rather than have them misinformed.

AlmightyCushion · 06-01-2010 2:15am

opinion guy wrote: »

Um haven't the government or any of you heard of Wikipedia ??:eek::eek::eek:
Or Google Scholar ????:eek::eek::eek:

Studies have shown wikipedia is just as good as Britannica:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4530930.stm

Have you read Pat Kennys page before the locked it. It was constantly changing. I think once it even said he was a type of cheese. Hilarious but by no means reliable information. Then there was that story of some guy who made up some artist and said they were dead or something. A load of newspapers reported it and had to retract the story a few days later.

If you need reliable information then by all means use wikipedia, but make sure to check the sources.

DarrenMSP · 06-01-2010 2:20am

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

While Wikipedia is good, and I've learned a lot off it, if you wrote a paper and cited it as a source you would be laughed at

Exactly.

In College last year, some of the lecturers refused to grade anything that used Wikipedia as a reference. (They told us before we started papers luckily).

lostexpectation · 06-01-2010 2:59am

My name is URL wrote: »

Britannica etc are verifiable sources of information for students.. Google really isn't

most of historial wikipedia is britannica, you can find sources on the internet through google...

the sources for wikipedia are at the bottom of the page, don't know why some people continue to pretend they don't know that.

stripysocks85 · 06-01-2010 3:10am

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

What I mean is that Google can be used to find free and 'verifiable sources of information'.

Britannica is good, but it doesn't cover everything. And using only one source leads to a biased and ignorant understanding of the world.

It would have been far better for the students if they were taught how to research properly, instead of being given all the 'useful' information in a single website.

Whilst it's a good idea, I think it would be too hard to monitor. There are so many bad/crap/disgusting sites, that it would be virtually impossible to block all of these from the children, and then who is help accountable if a child/teenager stumbles on a website they shouldn't be on?

It really is a ridiculous move from the DES though, considering the state some schools are in - mine included. Over half the school in cold, old prefabs - don't get me started on the cost of rental!

The laptop/ICT initiative they put forward around the time of the strike is also a joke. You have to meet specific requirements before you can even think about buying a much needed digital camera, or interactive whiteboard etc. Also they require you to buy from a list of buyers, so you can't even suss out a good deal! They must have some deal set up with some businessmen!! [Sorry for getting sidetracked!]

stripysocks85 · 06-01-2010 3:12am

opinion guy wrote: »

Um haven't the government or any of you heard of Wikipedia ??:eek::eek::eek:
Or Google Scholar ????:eek::eek::eek:

Studies have shown wikipedia is just as good as Britannica:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4530930.stm

My friend edited Wikipedia to list herself as a 'famous people from X'!! [X is a small village where she was just attending secondary school, and was in no way famous!]

So whilst it is great for learning information for yourself, I wouldn't cite it as any reference.

ashyle · 06-01-2010 3:46am

Give these children library cards!

opinion guy · 06-01-2010 5:12am

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Have you read Pat Kennys page before the locked it. It was constantly changing. I think once it even said he was a type of cheese. Hilarious but by no means reliable information. Then there was that story of some guy who made up some artist and said they were dead or something. A load of newspapers reported it and had to retract the story a few days later.

If you need reliable information then by all means use wikipedia, but make sure to check the sources.

stripysocks85 wrote: »

My friend edited Wikipedia to list herself as a 'famous people from X'!! [X is a small village where she was just attending secondary school, and was in no way famous!]

So whilst it is great for learning information for yourself, I wouldn't cite it as any reference.

Sure thing no bother. but still, the study said it is as accuarte as Brtiannica. Go figure.

Guy:Incognito · 06-01-2010 5:24am

eden_my_ass wrote: »

And one of the best skills for anyone planning on working near a computer in the future is the ability to both search the worlds largest information repository efficiently and to differentiate between valid sources of information and fluff. The government haven't provided me with a free subscription to Britannica, but I'm capable of using the internet without joining any cults, swallowing any conspiracy theories etc. School books are the primary source of reference for education, secondary should be solid broadband internet access (with proper education about how to use it). This is a waste of our taxes, and a poor use of students time. Not that many will ever see these sites, as mentioned already.

and I'm capable using using the lanes the M50 properly, yet when presented with the the very same circumstances, the vast majority of others cant manage it and simply move straight to the middle lane, stayign there until there exit is coming up and then briefly drive in the lane they shoudl have been in all along , just long enough to cross it into the slip lane. Why is it these people cant sort a much more serious issue than how to use Google properly?

eden_my_ass · 06-01-2010 10:13am

Stekelly wrote: »

and I'm capable using using the lanes the M50 properly, yet when presented with the the very same circumstances, the vast majority of others cant manage it and simply move straight to the middle lane, stayign there until there exit is coming up and then briefly drive in the lane they shoudl have been in all along , just long enough to cross it into the slip lane. Why is it these people cant sort a much more serious issue than how to use Google properly?

New Internet Curriculum

Lesson 1 - Google Motorway etiquette....see it could work, bet Britannica doesn't have that section

sbsquarepants · 06-01-2010 10:45am

jenga-jen wrote: »

A teacher I know tried to Google a picture of a certain plant for her primary school class and instead got back a load of pictures of a topless girl with the same name.

Rose?
Lilly?
Violet?

You know, so i dont stray on to that site by accident!

hooradiation · 06-01-2010 11:40am

Just so I've got this right, the complaint here is that the DoE has spent money on a valuable and reliable teaching resource for children and people are somehow upset by this?

For fucks sake what the hell is wrong with you people?

douglashyde · 06-01-2010 11:48am

If you where/are a parent and where told that your kids don't need an Encyclopaedia because they have google/wikipedia, how would that make you feel?

Point of the matter is, peer reviewed texts/work for acedemic reasons is common practice in education for a good reason.

And even if wikipedia pages are cited, it does not make them peer reviewed - I wrote a paper last year in college that had around 50 citations in it ! It was an article on common sense - I suggest you read it OP.

3qsmavrod5twfe · 06-01-2010 11:56am

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Rose?
Lilly?
Violet?

You know, so i dont stray on to that site by accident!

Maybe it was a plant of the genus haze and it got picked up wrongly.:D

parker kent · 06-01-2010 2:26pm

ashyle wrote: »

Give these children library cards!

+1 If schools and libraries were used together wherever it is feasible (I know some schools are not near libraries etc) it would be much better. Then the libraries access to Britannica would be enough. Kids really need to learn how to search properly, difference between good and bad sources etc. It is shocking how bad some people are in college or work at searching online resources and using web searches in general.

Plus I'd love some of the new hot teachers to visit my library

stripysocks85 · 06-01-2010 3:06pm

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Rose?
Lilly?
Violet?

You know, so i dont stray on to that site by accident!

A teacher I know tried to google 'thrush' [as in the bird?] but got up some........eh.......interesting photos to say the least.

jenga-jen · 06-01-2010 4:51pm

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Rose?
Lilly?
Violet?

You know, so i dont stray on to that site by accident!

I believe it was 'Heather', I tell you this only to protect yourself obviously

pickarooney · 06-01-2010 5:16pm

Aoibheann wrote: »

A, B, C...? And if the kids are so badly off, why would you subject them to that kind of disease to go along with it.. :mad:

:pac:

I'd say 'Hep R' in his Irish exam and he's feeling resentful.

CrazyRabbit · 06-01-2010 6:24pm

stripysocks85 wrote: »

Whilst it's a good idea, I think it would be too hard to monitor. There are so many bad/crap/disgusting sites, that it would be virtually impossible to block all of these from the children, and then who is help accountable if a child/teenager stumbles on a website they shouldn't be on?

It really is a ridiculous move from the DES though, considering the state some schools are in - mine included. Over half the school in cold, old prefabs - don't get me started on the cost of rental!

The laptop/ICT initiative they put forward around the time of the strike is also a joke. You have to meet specific requirements before you can even think about buying a much needed digital camera, or interactive whiteboard etc. Also they require you to buy from a list of buyers, so you can't even suss out a good deal! They must have some deal set up with some businessmen!! [Sorry for getting sidetracked!]

Kids are going to come across these sites at home/in friends houses etc. Schools can have filters to block most of it, and they can be taught how to protect themselves from such sites.

You don't protect children from cars by preventing them from crossing the road. You teach them how to do it safely. Using the internet is no different. Pretending the bad sites don't exist leaves the children vulnerable to them when they are unmonitored.

I've lost count of how many times I've had to fix my 13yo cousins pc because he's visited warez/porn sites and the machine got infected with spyware, toolbards, viri & trojans. And he responds to spam/chain letters too. He's pretty ignorant of the dangers and is learning the hard way unfortunately.

Haven't they heard of Google? It's free!

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