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I want to be a blues guitarist but I'm not sure how to go about it.

  • 03-07-2014 9:06pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭


    I'm fairly proficient on the acoustic but being self thought I've no idea about scales, pentetonics (if that's what its called) and I can't read music.
    Would lessons, books or YouTube vids be the way to go?

    I'd love some feedback by anyone who knows their stuff blues wise (specifically 12 bar). But any help would be greatly appreciated.

    Ya never know, I could be the next Rory Gallagher (HAH!!) and I'll remember ye all when I make the big time:-)

    Edit: That last part was utter sarcasm for those who don't quite get it.


Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 172 ✭✭Yogosan


    I'm not the most proficient guitarist (yet). But I love the blues. I particularly like the Black Keys. I just go to Ultimate Guitar, get their tabs and learn their songs that way. I'm not fussed about scales and that kinda thing yet, it's a bit boring and doesn't mean much for a beginner like me. (Just in case you don't know, tab is just an easy form of written guitar music which only relies on you knowing how the song sounds)

    If a song of theirs is mostly easy with a few tricky bits, I'll learn it and get through the hard parts. If a song is quite difficult, I'll leave it on the back burner, because it is frustrating trying to learn a song when you make very slow progress.

    Eventually I pick up the difficult techniques from a cumulation of learning their easy songs. Then some time later, I'll go back to the difficult song again and suddenly it's not as difficult as it once seemed.

    I generally just rinse and repeat this process and it seems to be working so far! The good thing about the Black Keys is they are a 2 piece, so you can learn the guitar parts in one go. What I mean by is some bands have 2-3 guitarists, and when you try to play their songs, it just doesn't sound the great.

    So if you can get into the Black Keys it would be useful! Plus their early stuff is absolutely class,very fun to learn and not too difficult!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    Yogosan wrote: »
    I'm not the most proficient guitarist (yet). But I love the blues. I particularly like the Black Keys. I just go to Ultimate Guitars, get their tabs and learn their songs that way. I'm not fussed about scales and that kinda thing yet, it's a bit boring and doesn't mean much for a beginner like me.

    If a song of theirs is mostly easy with a few tricky bits, I'll learn it and get through the hard parts. If a song is quite difficult, I'll leave it on the back burner, because it is frustrating trying to learn a song when you make very slow progress.

    Eventually I pick up the difficult techniques from a cumulation of leaning their easy songs. Then some time later I'll go back to the difficult song again and suddenly it's not as difficult as it once seemed.

    I generally just rinse and repeat this process and it seems to be working so far! The good thing about the Black Keys is they are a 2 piece, so you can learn the guitar parts in one go. What I mean by is some bands have 2-3 guitarists, and when you try to play their songs, it just doesn't sound the great.

    So if you can get into the Black Keys it would be useful! Plus their early stuff is absolutely class and very fun to learn!

    The Black Keys are class but the stuff I listen to are waaayy back. Robert Johnson, Buddy Guy, Steve Ray Vaughan even B.B King (who I idolize).

    But I get your point, tab a song, listen to said song, rinse and repeat until it sounds some way right..
    So basically put in the time until I see results.. Ugh, I'm too impatient...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 172 ✭✭Yogosan


    GerB40 wrote: »
    The Black Keys are class but the stuff I listen to are waaayy back. Robert Johnson, Buddy Guy, Steve Ray Vaughan even B.B King (who I idolize).

    But I get your point, tab a song, listen to said song, rinse and repeat until it sounds some way right..
    So basically put in the time until I see results.. Ugh, I'm too impatient...
    The problem with the gutarists you mentioned is that they're absolute guitar virtuosos, the pinacle of guitar playing, and trying to emulate their sound from the get go would be very difficult and frustrating.

    I might be wrong, as I don't know what your skill level is, but it would be easier and more fun to start with something a bit easier. You're trying to run before you can crawl! (Which coincidently, my 10 month old nephew has actually just acheived:D)

    Edit- Either way, it sounds like you are going to give it your best shot, and you will find your own pattern of learning, but their really is no shortcut to getting their and that is ultimatley what make learning the guitar such a joy in the end.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,453 ✭✭✭Rigsby


    I would not get too hung up on tabs. My advice is to listen, listen, listen !!!.... to as much blues as you can. Try to copy what you hear. That's how the early blues men learned their trade. The artists you list are among the best.

    Contrary to "Yogosan's "opinion, I think it would be beneficial to learn some basic theory. Anything you learn wont go to waste.

    If you can afford lessons then IMO they are worth it. Even a half a dozen would get to off to a good start.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 172 ✭✭Yogosan


    Rigsby wrote: »
    I would not get too hung up on tabs. My advice is to listen, listen, listen !!!.... to as much blues as you can. Try to copy what you hear. That's how the early blues men learned their trade. The artists you list are among the best.

    Contrary to "Yogosan's "opinion, I think it would be beneficial to learn some basic theory. Anything you learn wont go to waste.

    If you can afford lessons then IMO they are worth it. Even a half a dozen would get to off to a good start.
    I didn't mean scales and pentatonic were not beneficial, I just meant that even if you don't go down that route, it's not a big deal. Some of the most famous guitarists took no lessons and haven't a clue about music theory.

    But Rugsby is right it won't go to waste. Music theory is useful as it is applied across various instruments, and if you wanted to compose your own music, it is absolutely critical.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    Yogosan wrote: »
    The problem with the gutarists you mentioned is that they're absolute guitar virtuosos, the pinacle of guitar playing, and trying to emulate their sound from the get go would be very difficult and frustrating.

    I might be wrong, as I don't know what your skill level is, but it would be easier and more fun to start with something a bit easier. You're trying to run before you can crawl! (Which coincidently, my 10 month old nephew has actually just acheived:D)

    Edit- Either way, it sounds like you are going to give it your best shot, and you will find your own pattern of learning, but their really is no shortcut to getting their and that is ultimatley what make learning the guitar such a joy in the end.

    Oh believe me I know my limits. I was using those musicians as an example of how I came to love the blues... My aim is to just be able to do a few bars and sing in my most gravelly voice "I woke up this morning" etc. I still have to learn how to "crawl" so I've a bit of a way to go...


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    Rigsby wrote: »
    I would not get too hung up on tabs. My advice is to listen, listen, listen !!!.... to as much blues as you can. Try to copy what you hear. That's how the early blues men learned their trade. The artists you list are among the best.

    Contrary to "Yogosan's "opinion, I think it would be beneficial to learn some basic theory. Anything you learn wont go to waste.

    If you can afford lessons then IMO they are worth it. Even a half a dozen would get to off to a good start.

    Yeah I reckon a couple of lessons is on the agenda. Where could I find this basic theory? If it's on the net I'm sorted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,453 ✭✭✭Rigsby


    GerB40 wrote: »
    Where could I find this basic theory?

    http://www.billygreen.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/Music%20Theory%20-%20Basic,%20Intermediate,%20Advanced.pdf ;)


    My advice is to only spend five to ten minutes at a time, reading slowly through it for now. Otherwise your head will burst !! :pac:

    Combining a little basic theory, close listening to blues guitarists, and taking a few lessons from a good teacher, should go a long way towards helping you to learn to play the blues.

    Finally...two more very important ingredients ......time and patience.


    Best of luck with it !!!! :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 172 ✭✭Yogosan


    Rigsby wrote: »
    http://www.billygreen.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/Music%20Theory%20-%20Basic,%20Intermediate,%20Advanced.pdf ;)


    My advice is to only spend five to ten minutes at a time, reading slowly through it for now. Otherwise your head will burst !! :pac:

    Combining a little basic theory, close listening to blues guitarists, and taking a few lessons from a good teacher, should go a long way towards helping you to learn to play the blues.

    Finally...two more very important ingredients ......time and patience.


    Best of luck with it !!!! :)
    The site you linked is throwing up all kinds of red flags on my anti-virus programme!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    Rigsby wrote: »
    http://www.billygreen.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/Music%20Theory%20-%20Basic,%20Intermediate,%20Advanced.pdf ;)


    My advice is to only spend five to ten minutes at a time, reading slowly through it for now. Otherwise your head will burst !! :pac:

    Combining a little basic theory, close listening to blues guitarists, and taking a few lessons from a good teacher, should go a long way towards helping you to learn to play the blues.

    Finally...two more very important ingredients ......time and patience.


    Best of luck with it !!!! :)

    Nice one bud, I'll look into that..


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 740 ✭✭✭steveone


    Practice but remember when listening to great players what you are hearing is as much emotion as learned phrases-they could make a bin bag sound good.the sounds are in their hands.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,354 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    All good advice OP. But none of it really worth a damn if you don't got a good woman to done leave ya, and a faithful dog to done die.

    :(

    Or is that for country...?

    D'you live near a crossroads at all? I hear that helps sometimes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    endacl wrote: »
    All good advice OP. But none of it really worth a damn if you don't got a good woman to done leave ya, and a faithful dog to done die.

    :(

    Or is that for country...?

    D'you live near a crossroads at all? I hear that helps sometimes.

    Well I'm "Gon git up in the mornin" a lot more for some inspiration...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38 cathal02


    Hey Ger,

    First off Rory Gallagher is the perfect place to start, Rory will also bring you in contact with the likes of Son Hourse, Blind Boy Fuller, Leadbelly, Robert Johnson, these are the guys that are really worth listening to and learning from. all of the top blues players will say RObert Johnson is unsurpased. This will seem strange at first when you listen to him and then listen to someone with faultless technique and incredibile ability such as Stevie Ray Vaughan (also a great player in his own right). But everything you need to know about blues is on a Robert Johnson Compliation. The hard part is putting in the time to really listen and dissect what he is doing. This requires a bit a of persistence but there's loads on help online. Then, as Rory did, you can infuse your own (Irish presumably) roots and put your own mark on it, learn from these guys but always be conscious of developing your own thing. I think it's worth learning the Minor pentatonic, Major Pentatonic, Blues Scale and Mixolydian Scales to start of with, don't neglect rythym playing it's just as important as lead playing, learn how to play dominant or '7th' chords, look into 'hybrid' picking, that is holding the pick but using your middle, ring and baby finger to pick the strings as well. The best progress is incremental, set realistic goals, when you pick up the guitar be serious about it, a half hour solid practice everyday is worth 5 hours just noodling, take pride in it, do the basic things over and over, perfect it, it's about having a great tone, a great feel and this comes through the solitary hours you put into it, that's my two cents anyways, It's worth it, as Charlie parker said (jazz but relevant to blues) learn all that **** and forget about it when you play


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    cathal02 wrote: »
    Hey Ger,

    First off Rory Gallagher is the perfect place to start, Rory will also bring you in contact with the likes of Son Hourse, Blind Boy Fuller, Leadbelly, Robert Johnson, these are the guys that are really worth listening to and learning from. all of the top blues players will say RObert Johnson is unsurpased. This will seem strange at first when you listen to him and then listen to someone with faultless technique and incredibile ability such as Stevie Ray Vaughan (also a great player in his own right). But everything you need to know about blues is on a Robert Johnson Compliation. The hard part is putting in the time to really listen and dissect what he is doing. This requires a bit a of persistence but there's loads on help online. Then, as Rory did, you can infuse your own (Irish presumably) roots and put your own mark on it, learn from these guys but always be conscious of developing your own thing. I think it's worth learning the Minor pentatonic, Major Pentatonic, Blues Scale and Mixolydian Scales to start of with, don't neglect rythym playing it's just as important as lead playing, learn how to play dominant or '7th' chords, look into 'hybrid' picking, that is holding the pick but using your middle, ring and baby finger to pick the strings as well. The best progress is incremental, set realistic goals, when you pick up the guitar be serious about it, a half hour solid practice everyday is worth 5 hours just noodling, take pride in it, do the basic things over and over, perfect it, it's about having a great tone, a great feel and this comes through the solitary hours you put into it, that's my two cents anyways, It's worth it, as Charlie parker said (jazz but relevant to blues) learn all that **** and forget about it when you play

    Thanks for that Cathal, I think what I really wanted to find out was what kind of theory I'd have to learn and with the scales you've told me about I feel ready to start my blues learnin quest...
    And I do have Robert Johnsons compilation so I reckon I'll just put "I believe I'll dust my broom" on repeat until my fingers bleed and I can hear it in my dreams.. Cheers


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38 cathal02


    Good on ya, Few more tips, sorry if anything is too basic

    In terms of theory and structure you're also talking about learning some of what's below. It can be confusing at first, but once you get your head around it you have it for life so don't be discouraged, If there's anything I haven't explained well please let me know and I'll try and make it clearer

    the 12-bar sequence, this normally involves the I chord , the IV Chord and V Chord. For example E, A and B7. In blues all of the major chords are often played as seventh chords, so you would have E7, A7, B7. So you could End up with a sequence like this

    E7 (4 Bars)
    A7 (2 Bars)
    E7 (2 Bars)
    B7 (1 Bar)
    A7 (1 Bar)
    E7 (2 Bars, the 'turnaround)


    By the 'I' Chord I mean C if we are in the key of C which has the notes C-D-E-F-G-A-B. If we harmonise the notes of the C Major Scale we get the following chords

    C-Major (the I Chord)
    D-minor
    E-minor
    F Major (The IV Chord)
    G Dominant (more commonly called G7th or the V Chord)
    A-Minor
    B-Diminished


    Turnarounds (you can never know enough, these occur usually on the 11th and 12th bar or just the 12th), turnarounds are basically a way of ending a sequence and giving the listener a signal of where we are in the sequence and that a new one is about to begin, trunarounds are essential as blues could be very repetitive without them

    It's good to know your 'relative' keys, for example a-natural minor has the same notes as c-major, so an a-minor scale
    sounds good over on a song in the key of C.

    The Key of C Major has the same notes as the key of A (natural) minor, just different root/bass/tonic/starting or ending point).

    Another example is G and Em, where an E-minor pentatonic scale would sound good or F and D-minor. A and F#minor, D and B-minor, E and C#minor.

    Dominant chords are basically major chords with a flat seventh, this is clearer if we compare a C-major seventh chord, which is just a major chord with the seventh note from the c Major scale added in as well to the chord giving us the notes C-E-G-B, a C-dominant chord would have C-E-G-Bflat.

    Chords are basically made up from scales. The C major scale is C-D-E-F-G-A-B. We make chords by 'stacking thirds', that means we start with C, count up three notes (including the C) to E, then frome E to G and finally G to B to give us C-E-G-B, A major C chord just has C-E-G, a major 7 chord has C-E-G. A Minor Chord has a flat third, this means C-Eb-G, a minor 7 chord has a flat third and a flat seventh, which for Cminor 7 would be C-Eb-G-Bb.

    It's good to get familiar with different time signatures and rhythtms

    Look up
    12/8 which is very common
    Texas Shuffle
    Blues Boogie
    Ragtime Blues

    Another thing to consider is call and response motifs

    It's good to know this stuff, it certainly does no harm but it is true you don't have to know theory to be a great player, BB king doesn't know how to play too many chords for example, but it helps to communicate your ideas to other players and it's better to know this stuff than not know it,

    and that's another point, the most important thing in your development is to play with other musicians, best of luck

    It's also worth developing a libary of 'licks', these are musical phrases that can be used again and again, remember what you don't say is often as effective as what you do, leave space between you melodic lines, or in other words have space between phrases in your solos, this is analoguos to someone who talks too much is never really listened to, where as the guy who says little but talks sense when he does is more sought after


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    Jaysus Cathal you've given me a lot to work on. Thanks a million


  • Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭Gobethewall


    Google ' justinguitar.com' it's free and he has a whole blues section


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    Google ' justinguitar.com' it's free and he has a whole blues section

    Yeah I've seen a couple of his videos and he is very good. I didn't know he had a section dedicated to blues so I'll look that up. Cheers


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 865 ✭✭✭MajorMax


    Becoming a blues guitarist is easy
    1. Get a guitar
    2. Learn to play the guitar
    3. sell your soul to the devil at a crossroads on a moonlit night


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  • Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭Gobethewall


    Also Marty Swartz on Youtube some good lessons there


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,047 ✭✭✭GerB40


    MajorMax wrote: »
    Becoming a blues guitarist is easy
    1. Get a guitar
    2. Learn to play the guitar
    3. sell your soul to the devil at a crossroads on a moonlit night

    Haha, I doubt my soul is worth that much to be honest.. And if I were to sell my soul to be a musician, I think I'd save it for something like the saxophone. Guitar is sooo mainstream...


  • Registered Users Posts: 16 newtoit73


    youtube has a ton of great ones, a recent one i saw was Buddy Guy
    sat for and hour playing blues to you and talking some history.
    search for Buddy Guy lesson, its one or multiple repeat viewings and listening.
    I see JustinGuitar mentioned above very good site, Remember take your time, keep posting too good to share:)


    Huey Morgan , sayed the pentatonic blues scale will save your life, i like that sheeaat
    N


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,421 ✭✭✭Lazare


    I've been learning going on four years now and like you I'm in love with Blues, it's all I wanted to play since I first picked it up.

    The number one most important thing I learned how to do was to play the pentatonic scale. It might seem incredibly boring at first, and you'll wonder if it's worth it, or if it's any use at all. But once you figure it out and can move up and down the neck seamlessly through it's different positions you will feel like a whole world has opened up for you.

    Start with Am position 1, practice it over and over and over slowly at first then gradually build up your speed until you can effortlessly run it up and down mistake free.

    Load up an Am blues jam track on youtube then using your new knowledge, mess about with those notes, slide between 5 & 7 on the G string, mess about with bends, pull offs, vibrato.

    Once you're comfortable with position 1, start learning 2 and 5 (positions either side) and keep jamming along to backing tracks, it gets easier and easier.

    Once you've figured out the five positions of the scale you can now play it in any key by simply starting on a different position on the neck, Gm blues is the most amazing sound imo.

    Have fun, it's the most euphoric thing once you start to finally get it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 119 ✭✭loveroflight


    Go see the best blues guitarist in Ireland.... Ed Deane....playing in Arthur's on Friday night or if you can't make that see him in Frank Ryan's on Thursdays.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 212 ✭✭HobbyMan


    Yep, learn your pentatonics first.

    Learn to play over the changes in one position and be able to mix major and minor pentatonic in the same position.

    Once you have one position down then move onto the next.

    This way you'll be solid all over the fretboard in no time. :-)


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