National Anthem Tomorrow Night?

dulpit · 23-08-2007 11:18am #1

Hey, so was wondering which anthems will be played before the Ireland -v- Italy game tomorrow evening...

Obviously Ireland's Call & the Italian anthem will be played but will God Save The Queen or Amhrán na bhFiann also be played?

I had heard earlier this year that God Save The Queen would be played but haven't heard much else since...

burnedfaceman · 23-08-2007 11:22am

irelands call will be the only song peformed tonight i believe, i went to a schoolboy international a while back in ravenhill and thats what happened then

Naos · 23-08-2007 11:27am

Morning...

I've just been introduced to Rugby in the last year or so and must admit I love it. Never knew it required the tactical play that it does etc.

However, I am perplexed at this. Why would God Save the Queen be played?

Can only assume it's to do with NI players being allowed on the team(or not I have zero idea) ?

dulpit · 23-08-2007 11:33am

Mear wrote:

However, I am perplexed at this. Why would God Save the Queen be played?

Can only assume it's to do with NI players being allowed on the team(or not I have zero idea) ?

Em, i think the argument is this:

Ireland's rugby team does not represent a country per se, but instead the island of Ireland... As such they don't have a national anthem, so that's where Ireland's Call comes from.

They played Amhrán na bhFiann for all home Irish matches becasue the games were in Dublin, and it's the hosting country's (Republic of Ireland) national anthem...

Now that they're playing a home game in the North, they should return favour and play the home country's (Northern Ireland) national anthem, which is God Save The Queen...

TBH I really don't mind either way, but if they play Amhrán na bhFiann in Dublin, why not God Save The Queen in Belfast?

Edit: Actually according to wikiepedia at least, while God Save The Queen is the National Anthem for all of the UK, The Londonderry Air is the de facto anthem of the north, much like Flower of Scotland or Land of my fathers (Scotland & Wales)... So maybe that'll be played?

High&Low · 23-08-2007 12:06pm

I heard that in the 1950s Ireland played up North and God Save the Queen was played, this resulted in one of the Irish players sitting on the ground during the anthem.

The issue with what anthem would be played was raised last year with some Unionist politician calling for GSTQ to be played. The IRFU responded that only "Ireland's Call" would be played. The issue is still continuing though;http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Unionists-calling--foul-over.3140716.jp

heggie · 23-08-2007 12:27pm

why would god save the queen be played? is this played during scottish games? during welsh games? seriously, why would that be played???

Punchbowl · 23-08-2007 12:34pm

There is NO chance that God save the Queen will be played, and as liberal as I am, I would take huge offence if it was. As correctly stated above, each of the countires in the UK have their own anthems (land of hope and glory for England etc) but they also can, if they choose to, play the UK anthem, like England do. However, does anyone here really think that Paul O'Connell et all will stand to attention if it was played.

This is the type of situation that 'Irelands Call' was made for

Jigsaw · 23-08-2007 12:35pm

heggie wrote:

why would god save the queen be played? is this played during scottish games? during welsh games? seriously, why would that be played???

Because a contingent of small minded and bigoted pricks would continue to whinge until the authorities capitulated and allowed GSTQ to be played.

Grrrrrrr:mad:

evil_seed · 23-08-2007 12:40pm

I thought Irelands call was the Irish rugby anthem....

Spud83 · 23-08-2007 12:45pm

evil_seed wrote:

I thought Irelands call was the Irish rugby anthem....

He but normally the hosting nations national anthem is also played. That is why Amhrán na bhFiann is played when we play at Lansdowne, I would expect A Londonderry Air to played tomorrow or GSTQ. What is normally played before Northean Ireland football matches. I know this is a different sport but it will at least show what is 'normally' played before Northean ireland games GTSQ or A Londonderry Air. I am surprised this is still an issue, Amhrán na bhFiann is always well respected in Lansdowne.

smashey · 23-08-2007 12:55pm

There was an article in the Sunday Times about this and the last time it became an issue in the 1950s. I cant find a link for it but basically the players from the Republic were going to refuse to play. A compromise was made and only a "salute" version of GSTQ was played. The IRFU at the time made the decision that this would never happend again/

dulpit · 23-08-2007 2:56pm

Punchbowl wrote:

However, does anyone here really think that Paul O'Connell et all will stand to attention if it was played.

I would think so, unless they are ridiculously bigoted or racist or something... If any anthem is playing all players stand at attention... You seriously think that players would walk away or something at the anthem???

tHE vAGGABOND · 23-08-2007 3:13pm

who cares either way tbh..

Erin Go Brath · 23-08-2007 3:18pm

I think they are just going to play Irelands call and leave it at that. Thats a fair enough compromise imo. Amhrán would likely piss off many of the locals, and GSTQ would likely piss off most of the players, and many of the fans too. The last thing we need is a political incident coming into the World Cup!

Amazotheamazing · 23-08-2007 3:47pm

I think it's time to stop play Amhrain na bFhiann in Dublin. Why should either anthem be played?

walshy123 · 23-08-2007 3:53pm

if the ulster lads can respect Amhrain na bFhiann and ROI plays cant do the same for GSTQ if it were to be played in belfast then **** them

Amazotheamazing · 23-08-2007 4:10pm

walshy123 wrote:

if the ulster lads can respect Amhrain na bFhiann and ROI plays cant do the same for GSTQ if it were to be played in belfast then **** them

I tend to agree, it portrays us in the Republic as small minded hicks, imo.

LostinBlanch · 23-08-2007 4:22pm

I agree as well. Play GSTQ and get over it. I would disagree with discarding Amhran Na bFhiann. How can anyone want to get rid of it after the England game in Croker? Both anthems played and respected and then we win! Seems like the perfect combination to me.

Punchbowl · 23-08-2007 4:24pm

walshy123 wrote:

if the ulster lads can respect Amhrain na bFhiann and ROI plays cant do the same for GSTQ if it were to be played in belfast then **** them

And do the Ulster lads respect Amhrain na bFhiann? I haven't seen any evidence either way. Certainly the loyalist element who support Ireland wouldn't be too keen on it.

Let's be honest here guys, I'm not saying POC would walk off the field, he wouldn't let it happen in the first place. Whatever about Rugby Ireland being a cross border, anti-sectarian union, the thought of a national side representing the island of Ireland being serenaded with GSTQ is frightening. And whatever again about this opinion being bigoted, it's not, it's nationalistic.. And isn't that why we support the team in the first place?

Amazotheamazing · 23-08-2007 4:29pm

Punchbowl wrote:

And do the Ulster lads respect Amhrain na bFhiann? I haven't seen any evidence either way. Certainly the loyalist element who support Ireland wouldn't be too keen on it.

Let's be honest here guys, I'm not saying POC would walk off the field, he wouldn't let it happen in the first place. Whatever about Rugby Ireland being a cross border, anti-sectarian union, the thought of a national side representing the island of Ireland being serenaded with GSTQ is frightening. And whatever again about this opinion being bigoted, it's not, it's nationalistic.. And isn't that why we support the team in the first place?

POC isn't a bigot.

How can it be nationalistic when the Irish team represents a geographical place, not a nation?

Ireland won our only Grand Slam listening the GSTK in Ravenhill. btw.

Spud83 · 23-08-2007 4:31pm

I think every one is jumping the gun and presuming GTSQ will be played and not A Londonderry Air which is the Northean Ireland national anthem.

Amazotheamazing · 23-08-2007 4:34pm

alanmurphy83 wrote:

I think every one is jumping the gun and presuming GTSQ will be played and not A Londonderry Air which is the Northean Ireland national anthem.

They play GSTQ in Windsor Park at the NI football matches, not the Londonderry Air (Danny Boy)?

Punchbowl · 23-08-2007 4:35pm

dulpit wrote:

I would think so, unless they are ridiculously bigoted or racist or something... If any anthem is playing all players stand at attention... You seriously think that players would walk away or something at the anthem???

Point missed dulpit, there's a difference between standing for an opponents anthem and standing for your own. When however, your own is not your own, then it gets complicated.

My previous post might help explain this. I'm far from being a republican but I do believe in national identity, and an anthem is a very important part of this. For those that don't care what's played, that's fair enough, but where does this argument go when your playing on neutral territory? Say Ireland V SA in Paris? By everyones most of the aboves logic, GSTQ, Amhrain AND Irelands call should be played??

My point? GSTQ is not a representative anthem of the Ireland rugby team. So why play it. Why even argue it?

Punchbowl · 23-08-2007 4:38pm

Amazotheamazing wrote:

They play GSTQ in Windsor Park at the NI football matches, not the Londonderry Air (Danny Boy)?

Well, yes. They would though, as it's a national side (Northern Ireland) and they have every right to play the national anthem of that country. The IRFU, like the GAA (and I don't see GSTQ blaring out in inter-county games in Ulster) represent the entire nation of Ireland (which, Amhrain claims to do too as an anthem for the entire island)

Plus soccer in the North is notoriosly sectarian, you will find very few republicans in windsor park as natuarally, most of them do not recognise the North, but only the island as a whole

0lordy · 23-08-2007 4:39pm

The idea of playing GSTQ for an Ireland home match would have always been a problem for me - however, it is part of the Ulster players tradition. They stand for AnbF at every home match, albeit tight-jawed.

I think for the once in a blue moon that an Ireland international is played in Raven Hill, it is reasonable that QSTQ is played, and indeed, a significant symbol of recognition of both traditions on the island.

Sabre0001 · 23-08-2007 4:42pm

Punchbowl wrote:

Point missed dulpit, there's a difference between standing for an opponents anthem and standing for your own. When however, your own is not your own, then it gets complicated.

My previous post might help explain this. I'm far from being a republican but I do believe in national identity, and an anthem is a very important part of this. For those that don't care what's played, that's fair enough, but where does this argument go when your playing on neutral territory? Say Ireland V SA in Paris? By everyones most of the aboves logic, GSTQ, Amhrain AND Irelands call should be played??

My point? GSTQ is not a representative anthem of the Ireland rugby team. So why play it. Why even argue it?

It isn't being touted as the anthem of the Irish team...GSTQ would be played and Ireland's Call (as Ireland's anthem) would also be played surely.....It's the anthem of the home ground (though yes, technically the N.I. anthem should be played).

Punchbowl · 23-08-2007 4:49pm

Amazotheamazing wrote:

POC isn't a bigot.

How can it be nationalistic when the Irish team represents a geographical place, not a nation?

Ireland won our only Grand Slam listening the GSTK in Ravenhill. btw.

Well, are we merely an island now? If we want to get all PC here, why bother even calling ourselves Ireland and maybe we should remove the Tricolour too??

I mean seriosuly, what flag will be flying to represent Ireland?

Right now, a blast of Irelands call (written by an Ulsterman) would be perfect, and completely appropriate. I will not accept that just because we're playing in Ulster, that was should adopt the anthem of the United Kingdom. I mean, even Ulsters links with GSTQ are tenuous and in a lot of cases it's only used a rabble rousing call to arms.. A previous post talks about the Welsh and the Scots playing their own anthems..even they don't dig GSTQ and they are actually in the UK

Punchbowl · 23-08-2007 4:51pm

Sabre0001 wrote:

It isn't being touted as the anthem of the Irish team...GSTQ would be played and Ireland's Call (as Ireland's anthem) would also be played surely.....It's the anthem of the home ground (though yes, technically the N.I. anthem should be played).

Ok, but at the World cup, won't we play the two anthems?

ANF and IC

Spud83 · 23-08-2007 4:52pm

Punchbowl wrote:

Ok, but at the World cup, won't we play the two anthems?

ANF and IC

Just Irelands Call.

Spud83 · 23-08-2007 4:54pm

Punchbowl wrote:

I mean seriosuly, what flag will be flying to represent Ireland?

Either both flags, or the Northean Ireland one.

Punchbowl wrote:

Right now, a blast of Irelands call (written by an Ulsterman) would be perfect, and completely appropriate. I will not accept that just because we're playing in Ulster, that was should adopt the anthem of the United Kingdom. I mean, even Ulsters links with GSTQ are tenuous and in a lot of cases it's only used a rabble rousing call to arms.. A previous post talks about the Welsh and the Scots playing their own anthems.. even they don't dig GSTQ and they are actually in the UK

But expect Ulster players and fans to accept Amhrán na bhFiann when we play in the south?

Sabre0001 · 23-08-2007 4:55pm

I agree that it shouldn't be GSTQ - it should be the N.I. one for the ground, Irelands Call for Ireland and the Italien anthem...

There are mixed views on the Tri-Colour and it is shown in some places as a flag of four quarters - incl. the Rugby Sweep Excel Sheet.

At Motorsport events for example - the anthem of the nation is played, the winning driver and the winning constructor...And people on the podium stand for these out of respect (they may not sing them but then again...a lot of Irish don't sing the national anthem or Ireland's Call, to relate back to Rugby).

I'm not sure yet what we are doing at the WC - I would agree with only having one anthem to represent Ireland (IC)...Otherwise we may as well seperate Rugby like we do Soccer

Punchbowl · 23-08-2007 5:01pm

As we're all willing to compromise, an agreement were these two anthems should be dropped should then be arranged. I have no afiliation with ANF but I do wish to have an anthem that I can be proud of and sing with affection each time a my country plays. We need consistency here guys. And let's be honest, there's only one reason the match is in the North, and that's the big hole in Ballsbridge right now.

daveirl · 23-08-2007 5:01pm

This post has been deleted.

Punchbowl · 23-08-2007 5:04pm

We're just trying to take our mind off it Dave

RuggieBear · 23-08-2007 5:09pm

same old ****e.

think i might make this topic a banning offence.

National Anthem Tomorrow Night?

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