shed door and roof

Seve OB · 17-02-2014 1:30am #1

I am going to "attempt" to fix my dad's shed for him. It's a decent bricks and mortar build but the roof has rotten over the years and the door disentigrated. It's a pitched roof. The aim is to fix it up cheap (hence me doing it) for him so that it's useable. Perfection is not expected, but I'm not completely useless and do have a few ideas on the construction, but maybe I'll leave that for another days discussion.

Having never done anything like this before I figured I would turn to you boardsies for some help and advice.

So for now, just a couple of questions on some basics.

What kind of wood should I be using? I presume some kind of marine ply , and I would cover it with felt....... Or is that the done thing these days?

For the joists, what wood and how far appart should they be?

I have gotten a good solid hall door and there is a seemingly sturdy half frame from the old door. Would it be ok to use this or should I replace the whole frame. What kind of wood for the frame?

Lastly and as I mentioned I'm on a budget here, where is the best place to buy the wood. I'm in Dublin.

Plan to do this on paddys weekend.... If we get the weather!

genuine leather · 17-02-2014 9:54am

stevieob wrote: »

I am going to "attempt" to fix my dad's shed for him. It's a decent bricks and mortar build but the roof has rotten over the years and the door disentigrated. It's a pitched roof. The aim is to fix it up cheap (hence me doing it) for him so that it's useable. Perfection is not expected, but I'm not completely useless and do have a few ideas on the construction, but maybe I'll leave that for another days discussion.

Having never done anything like this before I figured I would turn to you boardsies for some help and advice.

So for now, just a couple of questions on some basics.

What kind of wood should I be using? I presume some kind of marine ply , and I would cover it with felt....... Or is that the done thing these days?

For the joists, what wood and how far appart should they be?

I have gotten a good solid hall door and there is a seemingly sturdy half frame from the old door. Would it be ok to use this or should I replace the whole frame. What kind of wood for the frame?

Lastly and as I mentioned I'm on a budget here, where is the best place to buy the wood. I'm in Dublin.

Plan to do this on paddys weekend.... If we get the weather!

Hey stev
Fair play, planning renovating the shed for your dad. A photo would be handy to visually see what timbers you may need for the roof. The door and frame would be fine considering budget, just undercoat with a few solid finished coats and it ll be good for a few years at least.

Seve OB · 17-02-2014 11:36am

genuine leather wrote: »

Hey stev
Fair play, planning renovating the shed for your dad. A photo would be handy to visually see what timbers you may need for the roof. The door and frame would be fine considering budget, just undercoat with a few solid finished coats and it ll be good for a few years at least.

thanks for the feedback. yea, i might have jumped the gun asking with no photos. he lives a bit away from me, but hope to get out over the next week or so and take a few photos and measure up, so will post back then.

CMARTY10 · 20-02-2014 9:36pm

you could also buy galavanised steel sheeting,i was going to use felt on my build but went for the stel as its stronger and easier to put up and lasts a lot longer than felt,saying that as long as you take your time using the felt it should be a good roof,steel sheeting comes a couple of different lengths,you can also get it delivered to his house from local builders provides,shop around for best prices on your roof trusses online or ring them up..best of luck.

recipio · 21-02-2014 4:26pm

Certainly no need to use marine ply - far too expensive for a shed roof. Use 'WPB' ply instead. No experience with roofing but I've seen 'cedar shingles' used in TV programmes - much nicer to look at than felt or galvanize roof.

Seve OB · 21-02-2014 5:25pm

CMARTY10 wrote: »

you could also buy galavanised steel sheeting,i was going to use felt on my build but went for the stel as its stronger and easier to put up and lasts a lot longer than felt,saying that as long as you take your time using the felt it should be a good roof,steel sheeting comes a couple of different lengths,you can also get it delivered to his house from local builders provides,shop around for best prices on your roof trusses online or ring them up..best of luck.

recipio wrote: »

Certainly no need to use marine ply - far too expensive for a shed roof. Use 'WPB' ply instead. No experience with roofing but I've seen 'cedar shingles' used in TV programmes - much nicer to look at than felt or galvanize roof.

Thanks for the replies guys. Not interested though in the galvanised steel sheeting because I think it looks pretty awful. Would be grand in a farmyard on a big building, but not in my opinion on a small garden shed.

I will certainly be looking into WPB ply though. Do the cedar shingles go on over the plywood similar to the felt option? They look great, but I imagine are quite expensive?

kadman · 22-02-2014 9:46am

You could use felt shingles, if thats the look you are after. Cedar shingles would be expensive, and I suspect hard to source.

http://www.roofshingles.ie/

Alternatively Nordman sheeting. Its a steel sheet system, but is profiled to look like roof tiles. Its more expensive than ordinary cladding though.

Torchon felt ect do have a limited lifespan. Cheapest and quickest option would be standard box profile cladding, looks ok on a garden shed, better than corrugated sheeting. And you should consider insulated sheets if you are going this route.

Good luck with your project.

Red Nissan · 22-02-2014 10:30am

stevieob wrote: »

Do the cedar shingles go on over the plywood similar to the felt option? They look great, but I imagine are quite expensive?

Shingles, not just the cedar would go on very similar to felt over a plywood floor over joints midpoint at 24 inches.

I found shingles to be quite expensive for a small shed running at €15 a piece at B&Q and most others were bulk or trade only.

You'll need a warm day for the felt as the tar/glue needs ambient temp over 10°C or else one would need to apply heat ~ I wouldn't.

You'll probably fall back on felt as you research locally further, do spend the extra for good quality, I see my own project from last summer has had the felt just ripped off at the edges.

Red Nissan · 22-02-2014 10:33am

One word of thought. once tools, tool hire, tool purchase, materials and inexperience is added together, a professional may well have the project done and dusted cheaper and to a higher spec.

recipio · 22-02-2014 4:06pm

Now that I think about it, cedar shingles on a brick shed would look ...........odd !
What about cheap fibre cement slates ?

Seve OB · 26-02-2014 11:44pm

So my task as it lies ahead.........as you can see, a reasonably solid and decent enough structure so hopefully can give it a new lease of life!

Well this roof has seen better days!

And kind of two sheds in one. we never really had a proper roof on the lean-to, just a bit of perspex, so i am going to try and run the roof down the second one also. As you can see the back wall is at the right angle to allow me to do this, but the front is slightly wider so could get tricky!

Seve OB · 26-02-2014 11:44pm

Red Nissan wrote: »

One word of thought. once tools, tool hire, tool purchase, materials and inexperience is added together, a professional may well have the project done and dusted cheaper and to a higher spec.

ah but where is the sense of achievement?

Seve OB · 26-02-2014 11:59pm

As you can see from the pics, there is still most of the old roof frame in place so it will give me a kind of template to work off. The left hand side as you look from the front will obviously be easier than the right, well that's if I try and run the roof down across the lean-to. That will be tricky though as the lean-to is wider at the front than the back so will take a bit of engineering!

I discovered the roof looks like it was previously made out of some kind of treated chipboard..... Do I look at this as an option or is the WPB ply the way to go?

The trusses are about 37cm apart. Do they need to be so close? Can I get away with spacing them out a bit further to cut down on un-necessary labour / cost?

Now for the novice question... how do I secure the roof frame to the building? Masonry nails, some kind of cement like that no more nails stuff or a combination?

Also can anyone recommend where to buy the required wood? I really don't want to be going to B&Q, Woodies etc. Is Kellys timber yard up stocking lane any good? I thought they were a bit pricy when i was in there last year for a nose.

genuine leather · 27-02-2014 3:03am

Hey stevie.
Structure looks good alright.
To run thru a few of your questions.
Run with the WBP.
370mm is prob inside measures, so the timbers were fitted at 400mm on centre.
You could fit the new timbers at 600mm centres, but i would suggest using 18mm WBP and fitting a timber bridging under where the ply butts together to prevent sagging.

Looks like a 4x3 wallplate, the new plate(Paint/spray on wood preserve before fitting) can be fixed down with 8mmx120mm express nails and a some wallplate straps, as can the lean to plate also. Just make sure the new plate sits exactly where the old plate was,so when you cut your new rafters from the old template they will fit as before.

With regards the lean to, your facia line cant encroach over the boundry so will have to be kept flush with the blockwork.Even though its running off parallel, it shouldnt be to much of a problem. the rafters will run off,as will the
facia line and WBP.

Are you still going to run with the mineral felt?
Kadmans suggestions on tile effect clad is worth some thought,a few calls might source some end line/offcuts that might suit the relatively short rafter lenghts.

Give heiton/chadwicks/Kellys a call on materials see how they compare on prices and go from there.
Suggestions for timber size to price
4"x3"x16/18' wallplates
5"x2"16/18' rafters
7"x1"x16/18' facia
Not sure on dimensions so possibly 16s or 18s to get two cuts out of one.

Red Nissan · 27-02-2014 11:52pm

stevieob wrote: »

ah but where is the sense of achievement?

The sense of achievement is priceless.

For what I spent on my own project to build a shed that lasted 12 months, I could have had a metal one down from the North and plonked on my prepared foundations in something like three hours and a lump sum payment.

Red Nissan · 28-02-2014 12:01am

stevieob wrote: »

The trusses are about 37cm apart. Do they need to be so close? Can I get away with spacing them out a bit further to cut down on un-necessary labour / cost?.

No you can't, you'll actually end up with other products that will need separate support or hanging down where they should be supported.

This will be a heavy roof and should stay in place on its own. There is a variety of 'hurricane' brackets ideally to pin wood to wood [strut to upright] but I'm sure they can be modded for wood too stone.

You really cannot go to B&Q ~ everything will cost you about three times as much ~ but they do do sell offs that can be real bargains, but you'd need time.

genuine leather · 28-02-2014 1:29am

Red Nissan wrote: »

No you can't, you'll actually end up with other products that will need separate support or hanging down where they should be supported.

This will be a heavy roof and should stay in place on its own. There is a variety of 'hurricane' brackets ideally to pin wood to wood B]strut to upright[/B but I'm sure they can be modded for wood too stone.

You really cannot go to B&Q ~ everything will cost you about three times as much ~ but they do do sell offs that can be real bargains, but you'd need time.

Hey Red, could you go into a bit more detail on these?

Seve OB · 07-03-2014 2:42am

Guys

appreciate all your feedback and have had a bit of time to digest it over the last couple of days and get my plan in action.

If my da goes for it and the price is right, I like the look of those Onduvilla tile strips

Can someone please tell me what is OSB board? It looks like a much cheaper option than WBP ply.

genuine leather · 07-03-2014 5:11pm

Hey steve.
OSB Oriented strand board also called sterling board.
WBP Water Boiled Proof

IMO the quality of ply/strand boards has gone down somewhat over the last few years(like a lot of materials), especially WBP.

Considering budget i would run with OSB.
The onduvilla looks good and would work and look well for you.

Reader1937 · 08-03-2014 8:41am

Just a note on osb - grade 3 is moisture resistant to any extent. If there is any grade 2 about it's best to avoid as it is only structurally sound if completely sealed from moisture. I have used grade 3 and am happy with the results against accidental contact with moisture.

Seve OB · 12-05-2014 1:12am

guys, figured i better stick up a few pics of the finished article, took a while, couple of weekends, and a few evenings, maybe about 40-50 hours of hard graft, but i'm mighty chuffed with the results

IMAG0197 by stevieob, on Flickr

IMAG0199 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0201_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0203_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0207_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0216_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0218_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0229_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0231_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0241_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0263_1 by stevieob, on Flickr

ZOE_0255-A3597335_17-44150029 by stevieob, on Flickr