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Amazon: The Truth Behind the Click. BBC 2 Fri 00:20am

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  • 28-11-2013 7:46pm
    #1
    Patty O Furniture
    Registered Users Posts: 5,133 ✭✭✭


    Saw this in the schedule & thought i'd post it as its Black Friday week on Amazon.


    Time     - 00:20 to 00:50 (30 minutes long).
    When - Friday 29th November on BBC 2 NI/HD

    Amazon: The Truth Behind the Click.

    It's the online retailer that has transformed the way we shop, but how does Amazon treat the workers who retrieve our orders?
    Working conditions in the company's giant warehouses have been
    condemned by unions as among the worst in Britain. Panorama goes undercover to find out what happens after we fill our online shopping basket.
    (Stereo, Repeat, Widescreen, Subtitles, Signed, 4 Star)


    Happy shopping :)


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    #2
    evilivor
    Registered Users Posts: 2,613 ✭✭✭evilivor


    Patty O Furniture wrote: »
    Saw this in the schedule & thought i'd post it as its Black Friday week on Amazon.


    Time     - 00:20 to 00:50 (30 minutes long).
    When - Friday 29th November on BBC 2 NI/HD

    Amazon: The Truth Behind the Click.

    It's the online retailer that has transformed the way we shop, but how does Amazon treat the workers who retrieve our orders?
    Working conditions in the company's giant warehouses have been
    condemned by unions as among the worst in Britain. Panorama goes undercover to find out what happens after we fill our online shopping basket.
    (Stereo, Repeat, Widescreen, Subtitles, Signed, 4 Star)


    Happy shopping :)

    It wasn't very good. They showed it was a tough place to work but didn't land any heavy blows.


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    #3
    Zascar
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 12,778 Mod ✭✭✭✭Zascar


    Agreed. More like they were no a witch hunt. Yes a demanding schedule but nothing that bad


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    #4
    brian_t
    Registered Users Posts: 6,672 ✭✭✭brian_t




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    #5
    Patty O Furniture
    Registered Users Posts: 5,133 ✭✭✭Patty O Furniture


    brian_t wrote: »


    Shane.C had posted that link on the BA Black Fri thread, its just that i'd rather watch & surf at the same time & just happen to notice it was on the telly :P


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    #6
    The Pontiac
    Registered Users Posts: 3,417 ✭✭✭The Pontiac


    It was always rumored it's the worst place in the UK to work.

    I saw the docu, and thought it was a brutal regime. 10.5 hour shifts, working under that pressure is inhumane. £8.50 for working night shifts is also poor pay. Looked like Adam was ready to collapse at the end of the shift (and he was a fitness freak).

    Will try and avoid amazon where I can now.


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    #7
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Theres a few issues they could work on but overall theres nothing worth getting upset and boycotting it over.


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    #8
    The Pontiac
    Registered Users Posts: 3,417 ✭✭✭The Pontiac


    I really don't think anyone understands unless you do a full shift first.

    I worked in a place like that once - 50% of new employees left after doing 2 or 3 shifts. And this was in the height of the recession, when they had very little chance of getting another job.

    Now I work in a job that's probably five time physically harder - but it doesn't remotely compare to be under that sort mental pressure for 12 hours trying to reach impossible targets.


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    #9
    Dman001
    Registered Users Posts: 5,534 ✭✭✭Dman001


    Haven't watched the documentary yet, but recently read a book on Jeff Bezos and the creation and growth of Amazon (The Everything Store by Brad Stone). It didn't really go into too much depth of the work conditions in the distribution centres, but the term 'Frugal' was used a lot throughout the book. Doesn't surprise me that Amazon would try to get the most out of their employees for as little as possible.


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    #10
    AlmightyCushion
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,060 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion


    There are a few things that don't add up with that documentary. He said that he was constantly running about the place as fast as he can non stop and still wasn't able to keep up yet he was only doing about 6 miles per shift at the start. 6 miles over 9 hours is nothing. That's not even 1MPH. Even someone with below average fitness would struggle to walk that slow. I live a little over 3 miles from where I work and I walk there and back most days. Google maps says it should take about an hour walking. I've always been a quick walker and I do it comfortably in about 45 minutes. I'm not a fitness freak either, I don't even go to the gym or run a lot or play sports. Now obviously he was pushing a cart about which will make it more difficult but even still unless there is something else at play he should be well able for it. The 11 miles will be more difficult but over 9 hours it still isn't that bad. It's slightly more than 1MPH.

    He made a big deal out of the beep the scanner makes when he scans the wrong item and how often he heard it and how he could still hear it in his head when he was trying to sleep. Firstly, it just makes sense to have a different sound for when the wrong product is scanned. Secondly, he really shouldn't be hearing the sound a lot. If he was doing his job right he'd be scanning the right products. Mistakes will be made from time to time and that's fair enough but it sounds like he was making a lot of mistakes. All this goes on the presumption that it's not Amazon's fault for all this e.g. items labelled incorrectly or directions/locations on the scanner being incorrect.

    The targets are a hard one to gauge. They seem quite tough but it depends on how close they are to each other. If you're constantly darting from one side of the warehouse to the other then it's a joke. Whereas if the products you have to scan are close together it's not as bad. They don't seem all that strict on them either. One manager/supervisor said he'd get a disciplinary or sacked if he didn't hit them yet when he was talking to managers/supervisors about his targets when he wasn't hitting them, they didn't seem all that pushed about it. One said they expected him to be doing better by now but he didn't forceful on it. Having high targets isn't that bad if there are no real consequences to not hitting them. I don't know how long he was there but he never received any points for not hitting targets and he was never put on a disciplinary either despite him saying that he would only hit targets the odd time. This matches up with Amazon saying that they only fired 2 people for under-performance. I imagine it only becomes a problem if you are doing under a certain percentage of the target on a regular basis.

    The lights not working is a big problem. If that is happening regularly then it needs to be sorted. It's just straight up dangerous. Also, getting a half a point for being two minutes late is just petty and stupid. 2 minutes every one in a while is nothing and giving a point for it will just piss off your staff.


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    #11
    Jet Black
    Registered Users Posts: 3,843 ✭✭✭Jet Black


    Watched it and just seems sensational.
    The whole target thing with 'pressure' is just motivational. If people see a countdown the will think they need to be getting things rather than standing around. Managers just seem to be working off a script to increase x workers accuracy by y.

    Being on your feet all day is common in a lot of jobs. He only walks 1 mile an hour which should be a piece of piss for a 23yo who considers himself 'fit'. Funny how someone who is shown running down a mountain doesn't know about proper foot care to avoid blisters.

    Everything he said was bs with the exception of the telxon beeping. That I can understand.

    Nice little poem he threw in there.
    For those ten hours,
    We are basicly machines
    We are robots

    We plug in our scanner
    Holding it
    We might as well be plugging it in to ourselves.

    We don't think for ourselves
    Maybe the don't trust us to think for ourselves?
    As human beings, I don't know


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    #12
    Jet Black
    Registered Users Posts: 3,843 ✭✭✭Jet Black


    Problem (not that there is any) solved.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWsMdN7HMuA


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    #13
    iguana
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 12,915 Mod ✭✭✭✭iguana


    AlmightyCushion wrote: »
    He said that he was constantly running about the place as fast as he can non stop and still wasn't able to keep up yet he was only doing about 6 miles per shift at the start. 6 miles over 9 hours is nothing. That's not even 1MPH.

    I thought someone working in a busy restaurant or deli counter will easily walk that much in a shift. I worked on an extremely busy deli counter for a few months many years back and it used to feel like I was doing a mild aerobic work out throughout the majority of the shift we were so busy
    AlmightyCushion wrote: »
    He made a big deal out of the beep the scanner makes when he scans the wrong item and how often he heard it and how he could still hear it in his head when he was trying to sleep.
    I worked on a grocery checkout in Dunnes during college and in a few different call centres during my time. I was always awakened just as I was drifting off to sleep by the feeling that someone had just rolled up to my checkout or that a call was coming through.

    I've had targets in most jobs I had, whether the more menial/mind-numbing jobs I had when I was younger or in my later career. They are just a fact of life in the working world. The worst were those in the call centres as they were often unrealistic and out of your control.

    I don't think Amazon sounds like a brilliant place to work but I also don't think that (apart from the lights issue) anything that was reported was that different to to the expectations of staff in any similar level job. And at least in a warehouse job you never need to worry about getting abuse from irate customers like frontline staff.


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    #14
    mitosis
    Registered Users Posts: 2,000 ✭✭✭mitosis


    The Pontiac wrote: »
    It was always rumored it's the worst place in the UK to work.

    I saw the docu, and thought it was a brutal regime. 10.5 hour shifts, working under that pressure is inhumane. £8.50 for working night shifts is also poor pay. Looked like Adam was ready to collapse at the end of the shift (and he was a fitness freak).

    Will try and avoid amazon where I can now.

    So, will you also do without your iphone/pad? Your Adidas/other big brand sportswear?


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    #15
    The Pontiac
    Registered Users Posts: 3,417 ✭✭✭The Pontiac


    mitosis wrote: »
    So, will you also do without your iphone/pad? Your Adidas/other big brand sportswear?

    Why would I buy an Apple product, when I can the equivalent for much cheaper?

    Adidas, Nike etc. never did it for me. Rip-off brands..

    So basically what you're saying is I should be treating EU employment laws (which you and I elect politicians to vote on), the same as employment laws that are totally out of our control?

    How can I be sympathetic to middle-eastern regimes when we're practicing it ourselves? You can be guaranteed there's a few hundred Irish people working for amazon.co.uk.


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    #16
    April O Neill II
    Closed Accounts Posts: 536 ✭✭✭April O Neill II


    AlmightyCushion wrote: »
    6 miles over 9 hours is nothing.

    Totally. I volunteered at a branch of the SPCA this summer, and in a 2 hour "shift", I'd frequently walk ~8km with various canine friends, some of them quite strong and wilful. :) And my fitness at the time wouldn't have been great at all. It was very doable.


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    #17
    fryup
    Registered Users Posts: 18,067 ✭✭✭✭fryup


    like others have alluded to, i thought it was very petty and wasn't worthy of a panorama investigation

    at one point the guy complains about blisters on his feet, i mean come on everyone has to put up with hardships in the workplace..try sending him out to a building site then he'll have something to complain about

    and it wasn't like the team leaders were constantly on his back telling him to work harder...they just mentioned he would be expected to increase his pick rate, nothing out of the ordinary there really.. every workplace has targets to be met


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    #18
    DubTony
    Registered Users Posts: 3,269 ✭✭✭DubTony


    Jet Black wrote: »
    Problem (not that there is any) solved.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWsMdN7HMuA

    Guess who owns that company. Yup!
    All those pickers are going to lose their jobs soon.

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/markpmills/2012/03/23/amazons-kiva-robot-acquisition-is-bullish-for-both-amazon-and-american-jobs/


    And here's a real world presentation of the robots in action. Not sure it fit's the Amazon warehouse as the title claims.

    http://www.chonday.com/Videos/how-the-amazon-warehouse-works


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    #19
    kneemos
    Registered Users Posts: 20,420 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    Didn't see it but every Panorama program I've ever seen was at best sensationalist and sometimes just patently ridiculous.
    How far does a postman walk every day?


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    #20
    alll
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭alll


    Amazon is not the exception. I worked a few weeks for online shop Zalando in Berlin. I can tell you, it was worse then what I've seen in this video. http://facesofberlin.org/the-prison-of-online-shops/ :eek:


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    #21
    Cliona99
    Registered Users Posts: 374 ✭✭Cliona99


    I only just realised that this is Television. (I swear I read the whole thread and didn't notice!) So this post is very off topic and I apologise.



    24 hours ago I was googling to try and figure out if we're allowed join Amazon Prime from Ireland. (in the interests of fairness I'll say this; it sounds amazing. Fifty quid a year and free supersaver delivery on every order. You'd make back the €50 in about a month).

    I am a huge, HUGE fan of Amazon; since 1999 when they had a book that I couldn't find anywhere else. I had to promise my dad that Amazon wouldn't take his credit card fishing... After about two weeks the book arrived and I was converted.

    15 years later, my one-click is linked to my very own visa debit, and Amazon is probably one of my top ten websites.

    What I'm trying to say is; I LOVE Amazon. Fast, cheap, easy. But I am not going to shop there anymore.

    *gasp!*

    I know. It's shocking. But so are a lot of things about Amazon.

    I felt a lot more sympathetic towards the guy undercover than most of the people posting here. I've had similar-ish jobs. To all the people knocking the poor guy, working under presure isn't on a par with going out for a walk. So while you might stroll along at 5mph for two hours, it's not comparable to Adam's walking 11 miles in 10.5hours. (maths not my strong suit, I didn't actually work anything out, it's all a guess and irrelevant to the point I'm trying to make...badly)
    The working conditions in the UK and Europe sound ... sweat shoppy.


    Anyway, I googled a bit after and it turns out the conditions in the "fulfilment centers" are just the beginning....dundunduuun

    This post already sounds like it should be in Conspiracy Nuts so I'm going to shut up now; except to say, as much as I love it, I won't shop at Amazon anymore.


    THE END.


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