Boards.ie

gaffmaster · 20-05-2012, 22:02

Hi there.

Sorry if this topic is done to death, I had a quick search of this forum but didn't find what I was looking for.

I was wondering if any of you could recommend an indoor Aerial for recieving saorview. The space is a fourth floor apartment in Dublin City Centre with no outdoor space - so no option for an outdoor aerial.

Would one of these suffice?

Thanks for any tips.

The Cush · 20-05-2012, 22:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffmaster

Would one of these suffice?

Maybe, depends on Saorview signal strength/quality in your apartment.

Galia · 20-05-2012, 22:07

Any good UHF aerial will do. No such thing as a digital/saorview aerial.
That one will do just fine .

However a good attic aerial is recommended.

zg3409 · 20-05-2012, 22:29

You need to mount the antenna on the South Side of the apartment Facing Saandyford (3rock). It needs to be flat (horizontal) rather than vertical. If not have no Window facing South then you need to point it out any other Window and scan for a signal. The TV should stop at radio frequency 54 and show all the channels.

Something like this is better value and will either work or not:
http://www.ebay.ie/itm/Lloytron-A422...item1e68741f08

Don't mind the hype on other makes. This one will work as good as any indoor unit.

http://www.saorview.ie/make-the-switch/coverage-map/

If a portable does not work consider hanging it outside the window, or using a small rooftop aerial, but mounted inside the apartment.

Most apartment blacks should have some TV options. If your property company is only offering UPC/Sky, and they are not totally broke, consider asking them to offer Saorview and/or free satellite channels to all tenants. It's much simpler to set up yourself but if that does not work ask for an apartment wide system.

If they are offering Sky, a Freesat box plugged into the Sky outlet may get you the UK channels free with no monthly bills.

superleedsdub · 20-05-2012, 23:00

Try one of these:

http://www.4ife.ie/dvbt50.html

I think D.I.D. are stocking them, they are more discreet than the aerials in the links in this thread and should do the trick:-)

zg3409 · 20-05-2012, 23:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by superleedsdub

Try one of these:

http://www.4ife.ie/dvbt50.html

I think D.I.D. are stocking them, they are more discreet than the aerials in the links in this thread and should do the trick:-)

I would be hesitant to recommend a type like this. For an aerial to work well it needs to be directional. In this way it boosts the signal in the direction of the nearest mast, and blocks signals (noise) from the wrong direction.

Built in boosters/amplifiers in 99.9% of cases do not help. The amplify the signal and noise an do nothing to make the aerial more directional. They generally just add to the price, so retailers can justify charging more.

Retailers like to sell pretty things, like this one, that look space aged, but may work far worse than a basic model half the price.

If the aerial is not directional, then it is not doing the job it should do. It's like buying a telescope that is not directional!

Ideally aerials should list things like front to back gain, beamwidth etc. Gain without including the amplifier etc.

For an idea of how to properly compare aerials see here:
http://www.aerialsandtv.com/tvaerialtests.html

Quote:

The results are interesting to put it mildly, we rely on our own data now and more or less ignore manufacturers figures

It might not help the original poster but it gives a good idea of hype vs reality.

The Cush · 20-05-2012, 23:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by superleedsdub

Try one of these:

http://www.4ife.ie/dvbt50.html

I think D.I.D. are stocking them, they are more discreet than the aerials in the links in this thread and should do the trick:-)

It didn't work for this poster in his ground floor apt., might work in the OPs 4th floor apt but again will depend on Saorview signal strength/quality where the aerial is located.

superleedsdub · 20-05-2012, 23:37

I was wondering if anyone else on boards had any experience with this aerial.
I discovered it in my brothers house in Blessington and it works perfectly there. I borrowed his one as I was having problems with an old aerial I had bought a few years back, during the rugby world cup last year with bad signal etc...
i`m in D15 and I believe the northside of the liffey is not well served by saorview.
The results I got from the aerial were impressive, haven`t had any major probs with it myself (admittedly I don`t watch saorview that often) so bought one.

So based I my experience I would recommend that aerial, however, it`s obvious from the thread the Cush linked to and zg`s info that this has not been the experience from other users and may not be suitable for the OP

P.S. I bought mine for €14 so was worth experimenting with:-)

zg3409 · 21-05-2012, 00:07

Here is a good list of indoor aerials with recommendations:
http://www.ricability-digitaltv.org....mendations.htm

and here:
http://www.ricability-digitaltv.org....d-products.asp

Note the North Side of Dublin has a fairly strong signal. If you can see the Dublin mountains this is where the signal comes from.

The signal is best in South East Dublin, Sandyford, and bad in very built up Dublin city centre. The worst spots are probably between christ church and the liffey and the ground rises then falls. The centre of Dublin is at sea level, but it rises again on the North side.

It all depends on how far you are from the mast, and what is between you and the mast. In Sandyford a coathanger will work 100%, less so the further you travel.

My main gripe is the amount charged, and the fact the most expensive ones often work less well than much cheaper models.

It's a pity RTE's coverage checker does not show low, medium and high signal levels like some other countries coverage charts. I was even considering making such a map myself, as I have the software and data, but there arn't enough hours in the day.

Here is a sort of a map showing signal strengths for Dublin. Red is strongest, then yellow, then green, then blue. Grey suggests no signal. It not exactly based on RTE's broadcasts but is similar:

blue note · 21-05-2012, 13:33

This is really annoying - I have a TV in my room with bunny ears, but I need to replace it now (or very soon). I don't have any cables in my room - does this mean that I'd either need an indoor ariel to get an electrician to route the wire from the roof to my room. I'm not sure if we have an ariel on the roof.

zg3409 · 21-05-2012, 13:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue note

This is really annoying - I have a TV in my room with bunny ears, but I need to replace it now (or very soon). I don't have any cables in my room - does this mean that I'd either need an indoor ariel to get an electrician to route the wire from the roof to my room. I'm not sure if we have an ariel on the roof.

Hi Blue Note,

What channels do you get at the moment at what quality are they? If you get TG4 at the moment then your current "rabbit ears" are probably OK. If not then you may need an outside aerial. If your TV is not Saorview compatable then on Otctober 24th 2012 it will stop working. Before then you need do something.

This thread is for indoor aerials. If your indoor aerial can get TG4 the aerial itself should be fine.

gaffmaster · 21-05-2012, 13:48

Thanks a million for all the replies. Very helpful.

lawhec · 21-05-2012, 22:40

That 4ife aerial looks like it's designed only for vertical polarised signals in mind, not the horizontal polarised transmissions for Saorview from Three Rock or Kippure in Dublin (though if Clermont Carn is strong, it might have a chance). More of a case of style over engineering and its gain almost certainly comes from the amp - there an argument that the built in amp in these aerials provide an active matching component to help transfer the received signal to the aerial lead better, but it's not likely to be worth much. That aerial looks like it's more designed for places where DTT transmissions are generally vertically polarised SFNs like in Switzerland or the Netherlands.

If you have a rabbit ears aka bunny ears aerial, what you can do with it for Saorview reception is try and use it as a form of half-rhombic aerial. It's the simplest and easiest to do for horizontal polarised signals where the rabbit ears has both elements that can be turned almost 360 degrees on the horizontal plane (parallel to the ground) - it can be done with aerials where the elements can only be adjusted on its tilt and/or vertically polarised signals but it may be more of a hassle getting it fixed right. Take the aerial, extend both whip rod elements out 180 degrees from each other and then form a V shape with the two elements where the join of the V shape has an angle of between 60 and 120 degrees. Point the aerial where the tips of the rods are aimed at the transmitter, then experiment with the placing of the aerial and the gap between the two tips being widened and narrowed. Ideally both rods should be at least at least 9/10ths of wavelength long for the lowest frequency sought (for Three Rock & Kippure this will be approx 36cm. In the position the aerial should have an approximate figure of 8 reception pattern that will provide a little bit of gain and null of signals around 90 degrees from it. If space is a problem in some parts of a room (say a window sill), moving the aerial 180 degrees in the horizontal plane with the angle of the V formed by the rods can be closer to the transmitter than the tips of the rods if desired as in theory it shouldn't make much difference (though there might be some cases where it does, especially as we're talking indoor reception). Moving the tips of the rods in closer together with the angle of the V becoming more acute will slightly increase gain and directivity; I find a gap of 1/2 the wavelength of the lowest frequency wanted to work the best - making the gap much smaller than this will kill the gain and directivity especially below 1/4 the wavelength. Tipping the tips up slightly (so that it's no longer parallel to the ground) by up to say 20 or 30 degrees might also help in a few places. If you have an old pair of rabbit ears lying about, it's worth trying this first before splashing out on any money that'll probably work no better.

blue note · 22-05-2012, 10:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by zg3409

Hi Blue Note,

What channels do you get at the moment at what quality are they? If you get TG4 at the moment then your current "rabbit ears" are probably OK. If not then you may need an outside aerial. If your TV is not Saorview compatable then on Otctober 24th 2012 it will stop working. Before then you need do something.

This thread is for indoor aerials. If your indoor aerial can get TG4 the aerial itself should be fine.

Thanks a million. I get the four Irish channels on the rabbit ears - TG4 is okish reception. A little fuzzy, but it's not difficult to make out or anything.

zg3409 · 22-05-2012, 11:05

Then there is a good chance if you get a Saorview set top box or new Saorview compatable TV then you will get the new stations. Do something before the end of October, possibly by August, in case it does not work, so you can get a different aerial, ideally rooftop, if the old one does not work.

Consider borrowing a Saorview TV or box from someone to test.

20-05-2012, 22:02	#1
gaffmaster Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 338 Adverts \| Friends	Indoor Saorview Aerial Hi there. Sorry if this topic is done to death, I had a quick search of this forum but didn't find what I was looking for. I was wondering if any of you could recommend an indoor Aerial for recieving saorview. The space is a fourth floor apartment in Dublin City Centre with no outdoor space - so no option for an outdoor aerial. Would one of these suffice? Thanks for any tips.

20-05-2012, 23:37	#8
superleedsdub Registered User Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 237 Adverts \| Friends	I was wondering if anyone else on boards had any experience with this aerial. I discovered it in my brothers house in Blessington and it works perfectly there. I borrowed his one as I was having problems with an old aerial I had bought a few years back, during the rugby world cup last year with bad signal etc... i`m in D15 and I believe the northside of the liffey is not well served by saorview. The results I got from the aerial were impressive, haven`t had any major probs with it myself (admittedly I don`t watch saorview that often) so bought one. So based I my experience I would recommend that aerial, however, it`s obvious from the thread the Cush linked to and zg`s info that this has not been the experience from other users and may not be suitable for the OP P.S. I bought mine for €14 so was worth experimenting with:-) Last edited by superleedsdub; 20-05-2012 at 23:40.

21-05-2012, 00:07	#9
zg3409 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 1,975 Adverts \| Friends	Here is a good list of indoor aerials with recommendations: http://www.ricability-digitaltv.org....mendations.htm and here: http://www.ricability-digitaltv.org....d-products.asp Note the North Side of Dublin has a fairly strong signal. If you can see the Dublin mountains this is where the signal comes from. The signal is best in South East Dublin, Sandyford, and bad in very built up Dublin city centre. The worst spots are probably between christ church and the liffey and the ground rises then falls. The centre of Dublin is at sea level, but it rises again on the North side. It all depends on how far you are from the mast, and what is between you and the mast. In Sandyford a coathanger will work 100%, less so the further you travel. My main gripe is the amount charged, and the fact the most expensive ones often work less well than much cheaper models. It's a pity RTE's coverage checker does not show low, medium and high signal levels like some other countries coverage charts. I was even considering making such a map myself, as I have the software and data, but there arn't enough hours in the day. Here is a sort of a map showing signal strengths for Dublin. Red is strongest, then yellow, then green, then blue. Grey suggests no signal. It not exactly based on RTE's broadcasts but is similar: Last edited by zg3409; 21-05-2012 at 00:19.

21-05-2012, 22:40	#13
lawhec Closed Account Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 1,743 Adverts \| Friends	That 4ife aerial looks like it's designed only for vertical polarised signals in mind, not the horizontal polarised transmissions for Saorview from Three Rock or Kippure in Dublin (though if Clermont Carn is strong, it might have a chance). More of a case of style over engineering and its gain almost certainly comes from the amp - there an argument that the built in amp in these aerials provide an active matching component to help transfer the received signal to the aerial lead better, but it's not likely to be worth much. That aerial looks like it's more designed for places where DTT transmissions are generally vertically polarised SFNs like in Switzerland or the Netherlands. If you have a rabbit ears aka bunny ears aerial, what you can do with it for Saorview reception is try and use it as a form of half-rhombic aerial. It's the simplest and easiest to do for horizontal polarised signals where the rabbit ears has both elements that can be turned almost 360 degrees on the horizontal plane (parallel to the ground) - it can be done with aerials where the elements can only be adjusted on its tilt and/or vertically polarised signals but it may be more of a hassle getting it fixed right. Take the aerial, extend both whip rod elements out 180 degrees from each other and then form a V shape with the two elements where the join of the V shape has an angle of between 60 and 120 degrees. Point the aerial where the tips of the rods are aimed at the transmitter, then experiment with the placing of the aerial and the gap between the two tips being widened and narrowed. Ideally both rods should be at least at least 9/10ths of wavelength long for the lowest frequency sought (for Three Rock & Kippure this will be approx 36cm. In the position the aerial should have an approximate figure of 8 reception pattern that will provide a little bit of gain and null of signals around 90 degrees from it. If space is a problem in some parts of a room (say a window sill), moving the aerial 180 degrees in the horizontal plane with the angle of the V formed by the rods can be closer to the transmitter than the tips of the rods if desired as in theory it shouldn't make much difference (though there might be some cases where it does, especially as we're talking indoor reception). Moving the tips of the rods in closer together with the angle of the V becoming more acute will slightly increase gain and directivity; I find a gap of 1/2 the wavelength of the lowest frequency wanted to work the best - making the gap much smaller than this will kill the gain and directivity especially below 1/4 the wavelength. Tipping the tips up slightly (so that it's no longer parallel to the ground) by up to say 20 or 30 degrees might also help in a few places. If you have an old pair of rabbit ears lying about, it's worth trying this first before splashing out on any money that'll probably work no better. Last edited by lawhec; 22-05-2012 at 03:08.

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20-05-2012, 22:07	#3
Galia Registered User Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 119 Adverts \| Friends	Any good UHF aerial will do. No such thing as a digital/saorview aerial. That one will do just fine . However a good attic aerial is recommended.

20-05-2012, 22:29	#4
zg3409 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 1,975 Adverts \| Friends	You need to mount the antenna on the South Side of the apartment Facing Saandyford (3rock). It needs to be flat (horizontal) rather than vertical. If not have no Window facing South then you need to point it out any other Window and scan for a signal. The TV should stop at radio frequency 54 and show all the channels. Something like this is better value and will either work or not: http://www.ebay.ie/itm/Lloytron-A422...item1e68741f08 Don't mind the hype on other makes. This one will work as good as any indoor unit. http://www.saorview.ie/make-the-switch/coverage-map/ If a portable does not work consider hanging it outside the window, or using a small rooftop aerial, but mounted inside the apartment. Most apartment blacks should have some TV options. If your property company is only offering UPC/Sky, and they are not totally broke, consider asking them to offer Saorview and/or free satellite channels to all tenants. It's much simpler to set up yourself but if that does not work ask for an apartment wide system. If they are offering Sky, a Freesat box plugged into the Sky outlet may get you the UK channels free with no monthly bills.

20-05-2012, 23:00	#5
superleedsdub Registered User Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 237 Adverts \| Friends	Try one of these: http://www.4ife.ie/dvbt50.html I think D.I.D. are stocking them, they are more discreet than the aerials in the links in this thread and should do the trick:-)

21-05-2012, 13:33	#10
blue note Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 507 Adverts \| Friends	This is really annoying - I have a TV in my room with bunny ears, but I need to replace it now (or very soon). I don't have any cables in my room - does this mean that I'd either need an indoor ariel to get an electrician to route the wire from the roof to my room. I'm not sure if we have an ariel on the roof.

21-05-2012, 13:48	#12
gaffmaster Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 338 Adverts \| Friends	Thanks a million for all the replies. Very helpful.

22-05-2012, 11:05	#15
zg3409 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 1,975 Adverts \| Friends	Then there is a good chance if you get a Saorview set top box or new Saorview compatable TV then you will get the new stations. Do something before the end of October, possibly by August, in case it does not work, so you can get a different aerial, ideally rooftop, if the old one does not work. Consider borrowing a Saorview TV or box from someone to test.