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  • 26-02-2012 9:58pm
    #1
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭


    I was going to PM the mods about this, but figured including everyone in the discussion would clear up whether my problem is "just me" or not.
    --

    Can we have something in the charter about the kind of threads that are acceptable? Speaking from an FPL point of view, we've already had too many threads made that are basically about the same thing.

    We're new, so we're bound to have problems to start with, but I fear that as we gain popularity, it's only going to get worse if we don't have our mods point it out.

    Basically, there are two problems so far from what I've seen;

    Firstly, dedicating a thread to yourself and your own team - or pretty much anything that can/should instead go in the "Rate My Team" thread. One was already closed by a mod, which is cool, but there have been others so far, so perhaps an update to the charter could help sort that.

    Secondly, there seems to be a "rush" to get as many threads as possible out there. I commend the eagerness, but we have next weeks GW threads popping up when we're only 3 hours into the current match day thread... which was posted the day after a GW team news thread... which was posted after a GW Transfer thread. And now I just see another separate one dedicated to this weeks bonus points.

    All seems a bit much to me. Again, we're new, so I'm not complaining (especially since I made one of the threads in question)... just suggesting that we may agree on some standard weekly threads and maybe reduce GW-related threads to 2 or 3 per week, or something like that. Surely "GW XX Team News", "GW XX Captain Poll" and "Rate My Team" are enough to get us by, covering injuries, suspensions, form, transfers, etc? Then, of course, the match-day thread.

    IMO, asking about transfers or who to leave on your bench is fit for "Rate My Team". And discussion about bonus points has a place in the GW thread for the corresponding match day. Of course, there should still be "less crucial" threads than these overall (like captain poll mentioned above, or discussing a big player like RVP, etc), so I'm not asking for a halt of thread-creating at all.

    I just think leaving us to have free-reign, making 5, 6, 7 dedicated posts for one GW seems like over-kill. Maybe it's just me, and everyone else is fine with it... which is why I posted it publicly to see.

    And again, I don't need to be told "it's not that bad"... I know that, I really do. I'm just thinking ahead, as the forum grows and we've got more people posting. As soon as someone new who doesn't know how the forum works sees these threads they'll think it's a cool idea and create their own... and so the downward spiral begins.


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    #2
    jimw1988
    Closed Accounts Posts: 73 ✭✭jimw1988


    carlcon wrote: »

    And again, I don't need to be told "it's not that bad"... I know that, I really do. I'm just thinking ahead, as the forum grows and we've got more people posting. As soon as a newbie sees these threads they'll think it's a cool idea and create their own... and so the downward spiral begins.

    I'm a poor unfortunate soul who didnt have the whopping 50 posts to gain access to the soccer forum. I have however followed the fantasy football thread all season and the debate on gaining a new forum.

    I was delighted to see a new place where I could finally post. I was just wondering if I started a thread would I be considered a "newbie" as you so eloquently put it. Will I be slated? Will I contribute to the "downward Spiral"?


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    #3
    eagle eye
    Registered Users Posts: 37,796 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    jimw1988 wrote: »
    I'm a poor unfortunate soul who didnt have the whopping 50 posts to gain access to the soccer forum. I have however followed the fantasy football thread all season and the debate on gaining a new forum.

    I was delighted to see a new place where I could finally post. I was just wondering if I started a thread would I be considered a "newbie" as you so eloquently put it. Will I be slated? Will I contribute to the "downward Spiral"?
    Its not about how many posts you have, its all about the quality of what you post.

    First thing anybody should do before starting a new thread is check the forum for a thread that would be relevant to what they want to post. If you find one then just post in it and don't start a new thread.

    There have been two guys that started up threads about their own team. We have a thread called 'rate my team' already. This is the type of thing that Carlcon is on about. Starting up different threads for each gameweek is silly too I think. We can have everything discussed in the gameweek thread like transfers etc. I think its ok to have another thread dedicated to the captain's poll and discussion on that.


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    #4
    jimw1988
    Closed Accounts Posts: 73 ✭✭jimw1988


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Its not about how many posts you have, its all about the quality of what you post.


    This.


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    #5
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭carlcon


    jimw1988 wrote: »
    I'm a poor unfortunate soul who didnt have the whopping 50 posts to gain access to the soccer forum. I have however followed the fantasy football thread all season and the debate on gaining a new forum.

    I was delighted to see a new place where I could finally post. I was just wondering if I started a thread would I be considered a "newbie" as you so eloquently put it. Will I be slated? Will I contribute to the "downward Spiral"?

    Not at all what I meant. In this context, "newbie" = person who sees the forum for the first time and doesn't know how it works. Wasn't used as a derogatory term or with a presumption of their ability to post.

    It was just a word I used, and had no other connotations than that. Didn't mean it in the "shut up noob" internet-nonsense-speak way, which I'm presuming you took it by your passive-aggressive response.

    I think you put too much weight on that one word I used, and not the 500 others. No attack on new posters at all.


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    #6
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭carlcon


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Its not about how many posts you have, its all about the quality of what you post.

    First thing anybody should do before starting a new thread is check the forum for a thread that would be relevant to what they want to post. If you find one then just post in it and don't start a new thread.

    There have been two guys that started up threads about their own team. We have a thread called 'rate my team' already. This is the type of thing that Carlcon is on about. Starting up different threads for each gameweek is silly too I think. We can have everything discussed in the gameweek thread like transfers etc. I think its ok to have another thread dedicated to the captain's poll and discussion on that.

    Well said. It has been regular posters who have made most of the posts in question, and I don't see how my post suggested otherwise.


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    #7
    jimw1988
    Closed Accounts Posts: 73 ✭✭jimw1988


    carlcon wrote: »

    I think you put too much weight on that one word I used, and not the 500 others. No attack on new posters at all.

    The reason I didnt mention the rest of your post is because I actually agreed with everything you said. I just felt you let yourself down by the last part.

    Labels like "newbie" is the sort of nonsense you find in all the other soccer forum threads. They only serve to seperate posters. Us and them. The fantasy football thread should be in my opinion a delightful little corner of the internet where that dosent happen.


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    #8
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭carlcon


    jimw1988 wrote: »
    The reason I didnt mention the rest of your post is because I actually agreed with everything you said. I just felt you let yourself down by the last part.

    Labels like "newbie" is the sort of nonsense you find in all the other soccer forum threads. They only serve to seperate posters. Us and them. The fantasy football thread should be in my opinion a delightful little corner of the internet where that dosent happen.

    I can only repeat that the word "newbie" is only negative if you put that spin on it. It's not wrong to be new. I'll edit my post to avoid that confusion, but again... it was just a shortened version of "new posters" or "new members". No negative connotations meant at all.


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    #9
    POKERKING
    Registered Users Posts: 2,198 ✭✭✭POKERKING


    Im happy enough for new match week thread to be started as soon as previous gameweeks window closes, this happens on fiso and for me i start to pick my team from min it closes(opens after update) so i would be happy for that trend to continue.


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    #10
    Nuri Sahin
    Site Banned Posts: 26,456 ✭✭✭✭Nuri Sahin


    I do agree with the sentiment of carlcon and eagle eye's post and did take stock of the number of similar topic type threads. I'll try and get around to a clean up of sorts and overall make things more organised over the course of the next 5 days (little by little each day starting from later on tonight/early hours).


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    #11
    froog
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    seems like the following are threads that are up for discussion whether they should have a separate thread for each gameweek. the captaincy one with a poll is the only obvious one for me. all the others i'm 50/50 on.

    captaincy
    transfers
    who to bench
    bonus points
    team news


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    #12
    Mr Moon
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 5,175 Mod ✭✭✭✭Mr Moon


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Its not about how many posts you have, its all about the quality of what you post.

    First thing anybody should do before starting a new thread is check the forum for a thread that would be relevant to what they want to post. If you find one then just post in it and don't start a new thread.

    There have been two guys that started up threads about their own team. We have a thread called 'rate my team' already. This is the type of thing that Carlcon is on about. Starting up different threads for each gameweek is silly too I think. We can have everything discussed in the gameweek thread like transfers etc. I think its ok to have another thread dedicated to the captain's poll and discussion on that.

    Totally agree with this, I let things go to see how they would turn out for the first gameweek and we certainly don't need a new thread for every single thing people have on their mind, most of what's here can be merged into two or three super threads.


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    #13
    GoldFour4
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 4,969 Mod ✭✭✭✭GoldFour4


    From the point of view of someone who plays a lot of fantasy sports but only a small bit of FPL I have to say that I think half these threads should be removed. In a few leagues I'm in we've had to move our threads back to the original forum because they would be covered up by soccer posts pretty quickly


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    #14
    manual_man
    Registered Users Posts: 15,263 ✭✭✭✭manual_man


    pre-gameweek chat
    captaincy poll
    matchday thread
    boards.ie league thread
    fpl resourses

    i think that would do. Transfer advice etc could all be lumped into the pre-gameweek thread, basically all the stuff people want to talk about in advance of a gameweek. I'm all for tidying things up


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    #15
    Panthro
    Registered Users Posts: 14,769 ✭✭✭✭Panthro


    I would go as far as suggest a mere 3 threads for FF.
    Resources thread
    general FF chat thread (which would house "rate my team" etc type threads)
    1 gameweek thread instead of one weekly thread (chit chat on who to captain for the week, who to transfer in/bench etc and the matchday points as they happen)


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    #16
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭carlcon


    I never mentioned it, but yeah the resources thread should be a given. Having that stickied is definitely a good call.


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    #17
    shangri la
    Registered Users Posts: 952 ✭✭✭shangri la


    The reason we wanted a dedicated forum was so we didn't have to lump 20+ topics into a single thread and be unable to have a proper discussion on any topic.

    This merging of threads may be a way to frustrate certain people who were a bit pushy on getting the forum but now that the forum is here if you are not going to moderate it in a suitable fashion then new moderators should be assigned and voted in by the people who actually use this forum!


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    #18
    Nuri Sahin
    Site Banned Posts: 26,456 ✭✭✭✭Nuri Sahin


    I've been away for the past few days as I'm up to my neck in uni assignments and what not, so I'll apolgise for that I suppose. But I don't see what Mr Moon did wrong for you to be upset by the new lay out :confused: Always open to suggestions, which you've certainly not provided and have used this thread to have a go at the moderators here is not the way of going about things. Goes for any forum, not just this one.

    Tbh, I feel some people just want create a new thread for the sake of doing so. This being perfect example as it's 1) a feedback forum issue at heart 2) could and should have gone in the other thread 3) I also note how you didn't voice your opinion on that thread neither which we left up to take in any feedback.

    Frankly the forum was a mess before the clean up a day or two ago. Threads over the most trivial of things. New threads will be created and if worth keeping, will be kept up and not merged for the time being. I think most folks who post here have the cop on to realise that this specific forum won't be properly settled till end of this season. Myself and Moon realise that. Creating it over halfway during the season was always gonna be a tad all over the place at times, we're (myself and Moon) just trying to lessen that.

    If you don't mind, I'll merge this with the thread it should been posted in.


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    #19
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭carlcon


    El LoCo Ade wrote: »
    I've been away for the past few days as I'm up to my neck in uni assignments and what not, so I'll apolgise for that I suppose. But I don't see what Mr Moon did wrong for you to be upset by the new lay out Always open to suggestions, which you've certainly not provided and have used this thread to have a go at the moderators here is not the way of going about things. Goes for any forum, not just this one.

    Tbh, I feel some people just want create a new thread for the sake of doing so. This being perfect example as it's 1) a feedback forum issue at heart 2) could and should have gone in the other thread 3) I also note how you didn't voice your opinion on that thread neither which we left up to take in any feedback.

    Frankly the forum was a mess before the clean up a day or two ago. Threads over the most trivial of things. New threads will be created and if worth keeping, will be kept up and not merged for the time being. I think most folks who post here have the cop on to realise that this specific forum won't be properly settled till end of this season. Myself and Moon realise that. Creating it over halfway during the season was always gonna be a tad all over the place at times, we're (myself and Moon) just trying to lessen that.

    If you don't mind, I'll merge this with the thread it should been posted in.

    Wait, I'm confused. Was that aimed at me for making this thread?

    If so, I think your Uni work has got the better of you in this case, because I posted this before Moon's clean-up, which came as a result of the OP (me) asking for it... in which I then backed up and defended Moon for doing so because it was the right thing to do.

    So at the time of posting this thread, there was no "other thread" to post in, just a mass of threads that were all over the place, which is what brought me to post this and ask for the clean up.

    Every post in this thread before yours and Shangri La's came before the cull, so there's definitely crossed wires somewhere.


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    #20
    manual_man
    Registered Users Posts: 15,263 ✭✭✭✭manual_man


    @ El loco are there have been numerous suggestions how to lay out things, I appreciate it's new to all of us yourself included, but I think the sooner we all agree on a structure for the forum the better, I'm not having a go but I think we can all agree it's a bit all over the place ATM. We have to find a middle ground in order to avoid too many threads, while keeping all the facets covered. Sorry to hear you're snowed under with assignments, I remember that feeling oh too well :(


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    #21
    Nuri Sahin
    Site Banned Posts: 26,456 ✭✭✭✭Nuri Sahin


    carlcon wrote: »
    Wait, I'm confused. Was that aimed at me for making this thread?

    If so, I think your Uni work has got the better of you in this case, because I posted this before Moon's clean-up, which came as a result of the OP (me) asking for it... in which I then backed up and defended Moon for doing so.

    So at the time of posting this thread, there was no "other thread", just a mass of threads that were all over the place, which is what brought me to post this.



    No, think you're jumping the gun here tbh man. It was directed at shangri la who created a new thread unnecessarily IMO. I merged his thread with yours. I'm all for keeping this thread open so gauge opinion. I think he was well aware that this thread was already here to voice opinions but felt the need for another thread.


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    #22
    Nuri Sahin
    Site Banned Posts: 26,456 ✭✭✭✭Nuri Sahin


    manual_man wrote: »
    @ El loco are there have been numerous suggestions how to lay out things, I appreciate it's new to all of us yourself included, but I think the sooner we all agree on a structure for the forum the better, I'm not having a go but I think we can all agree it's a bit all over the place ATM. We have to find a middle ground in order to avoid too many threads, while keeping all the facets covered. Sorry to hear you're snowed under with assignments, I remember that feeling oh too well :(

    I wholeheartedly agree, and I'm sure Moon does too. Genuinely want to sort this out asap, it's something we all can agree on :) but I think long term it might take a little while for things to set is my point. We'll get there in time for sure.


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    #23
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭carlcon


    El LoCo Ade wrote: »
    No, it was directed at shangri la who created a new thread unnecessarily IMO. I merged his thread with yours. I'm all for keeping this thread open so gauge opinion. I think he was well aware that this thread was already here to voice opinions but felt the need for another thread.

    Ah! Apologies. I had no clue La's was merged in here... just looked like you were replying to this thread. Like I said, crossed wires! :P


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    #24
    manual_man
    Registered Users Posts: 15,263 ✭✭✭✭manual_man


    El LoCo Ade wrote: »
    manual_man wrote: »
    @ El loco are there have been numerous suggestions how to lay out things, I appreciate it's new to all of us yourself included, but I think the sooner we all agree on a structure for the forum the better, I'm not having a go but I think we can all agree it's a bit all over the place ATM. We have to find a middle ground in order to avoid too many threads, while keeping all the facets covered. Sorry to hear you're snowed under with assignments, I remember that feeling oh too well :(

    I wholeheartedly agree, and I'm sure Moon does too. Genuinely want to sort this out asap, it's something we all can agree on :) but I think long term it might take a little while for things to set is my point. We'll get there in time for sure.

    Absolutely, I think some people are jumping the gun a bit, assuming the worst. I'm 100% sure it'll be fine, it needs a little time as you said. And for gods sake don't be fretting at it at the expense of your college work man!

    :pac:


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    #25
    Nuri Sahin
    Site Banned Posts: 26,456 ✭✭✭✭Nuri Sahin


    carlcon wrote: »
    Ah! Apologies. I had no clue La's was merged in here... just looked like you were replying to this thread. Like I said, crossed wires! :P

    No worries, has happened to the best of us too :pac:

    Changed the thread title to Forum feedback anyway. As I said, I'm very open to change so long as it's logical, improves the forum as a whole and approached in the right way of course. Having a go at mods for more or less not getting one's way isn't the way of going about things though. The vast majority of new forums take time to settle down is the gist of my main point.


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    #26
    Benimar
    Registered Users Posts: 7,779 ✭✭✭Benimar


    My 2c.

    I think the forum was in need of a clean up. There were too many similar threads - rate my team, help me beat my mate, the rest of the season etc. We also don't need separate weekly threads for team news and transfers (I can understand a weekly captaincy one as its a poll)

    Obviously these should all be put together BUT I do feel the clean up went too far.

    Some topics that were of interest ended up lumped into the General Chit Chat thread and now couldn't be located by sniffer dogs!! I also think it puts people off opening new threads that may be of interest as they now feel it will be lumped into the one thread.

    I really cannot fathom why threads with 2 or 3 pages of replies were closed and put into a general thread. Surely we want to ensure that if anyone comes over for a look, it seems as if its a thriving forum, not just a copy of the FF thread in the Soccer forum.

    I understand these are teething difficulties, but it is something we do need to sort out for the future.


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    #27
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭carlcon


    Just to carry on from what Benimar said, let me mention a few closed threads that I thought should be "let slide", just to see where we stand on them.

    shangri la's "Free Money League" thread was an entirely self-contained thread that, IMO, either a) doesn't belong in general chat, or b) would (and did) get lost in general chat, rendering his post useless. In my mind, his content was was both interesting, and unique... and more relevantly; thread-worthy.

    roryc's "Missing Fixtures" thread; I'm 50/50 on that one. Ignore the fact that the issue itself was resolved by the PL... when the thread was made, there was a genuine "big deal" to be made of only a dozen teams playing in one GW. When the issue was finally resolved, I would have thought closing the thread to be the appropriate action. Moving it to general chat just seemed confusing.

    My GW team news thread; I think this is an important one to discuss. Last week we had that thread, which was followed by a separate match day thread. The team news thread was then later merged into the general chat thread, which was again confusing. If anything, I thought that might get merged with the matchday thread if it was going to be merged?

    Personally, I wouldn't have merged it at all. I simply would have left it be for the weekend, then closed it when there was no more relevant news to be had.

    For solving this one, I propose a combined "Team News & Match Day" thread to be made once every Friday evening, as a GW specific thread that can simply be closed before the next GW starts. In it, we can have all the pre-match injury/availability/etc chatter, with detailed team news (that I'm happy to work on myself), then all the actual match stuff ("RVP goal, no assist"... "Rooney missed a sitter"... "did anyone see Suarez and Evra kiss each other in the tunnel?", etc), then finally have a place to post all the bonus points.

    Because let's face it, "general chat" is fun, but I imagine it'd be even better if most (not all) of the BP complaining was focused elsewhere.

    And finally, it's important to point out that none of this is complaining, just highlighting some questions we should consider, and still wondering where we stand on what's acceptable as a new thread, or a weekly recurring thread.
    --
    *Edit* - Oh and on that point; Should you guys allow a regular team news/matchday thread each week, I'll personally take an interest in creating a nicely formatted run-down of every game, including what each manager said that week, who's injured, who's expected back, etc. I'll be doing it anyway as a side-project I'm doing for a sports journalism hobby, so it would be no bother to me, and might be a useful source for FF'ers.
    This is what I did last week. It'll be a similar format, but hopefully more detailed as I put more time into it.


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    #28
    froog
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    guys is it worth checking out FISO's fantasy premier league forum to see what we should be aiming for? they clean up threads there regularly. there's generally a separate thread for each player, gameweek transfers, gameweek captaincy, a specific tactical discussion (keeper rotation etc), their "general chit chat thread" is a matchday banter one which is where people post while a match is on.

    http://www.fiso.co.uk/forum/fantasy-premierleague-fpl-f18.html


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    #29
    Jax Teller
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,763 ✭✭✭Jax Teller


    carlcon wrote: »
    My GW team news thread; I think this is an important one to discuss. Last week we had that thread, which was followed by a separate match day thread. The team news thread was then later merged into the general chat thread, which was again confusing. If anything, I thought that might get merged with the matchday thread if it was going to be merged?
    .

    I think if you're going to start a team news thread you should start it early in the week . No point starting it with less than 12 hours to kick off IMO


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    #30
    carlcon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,844 ✭✭✭carlcon


    Coletrickle88 wrote: »
    I think if you're going to start a team news thread you should start it early in the week . No point starting it with less than 12 hours to kick off IMO

    Fair point. My reasoning behind saying Friday is because that's when managers come out with interviews and squad sheets. Anything before that tends to be speculation (Harry trying to rubbish talk of Bale's hamstring injury today being a good example). Plus merging it with the match day thread gives both threads more worth, IMO. Match day thread on its own can be very messy, and a team news thread without the resulting match-day info is incomplete.

    My thinking is that any other news is well and good in general chat during the week, and then "official" news, team sheets, line-ups, etc can go in the Friday thread that runs through the weekend. Think of it as just a "build up" for the match day.

    But again, I'm just thinking out loud here. Either/or.


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    #31
    Sideshow Mark
    Registered Users Posts: 1,155 ✭✭✭Sideshow Mark


    Have to say I'm disappointed at how this forum has turned out, it's become a vanity project for a couple of posters who see themselves as mods. If people aren't allowed create threads then there is no point having a forum. I'd agree that the "rate my team" posts need to be modded into the RMT Thread but everything else should have been left.


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