TOO WAY INTERNET

patrick whitty · 30-03-2009 3:24pm #1

has anybody got tooway internet in ireland,if so iwould like some information on it as my cannot get broadband.
patrick

Lu Tze · 30-03-2009 3:47pm

patrick whitty wrote: »

has anybody got tooway internet in ireland,if so iwould like some information on it as my cannot get broadband.
patrick

I have no idea what you are asking. Are you looking for an internet connection with the same upload and download speeds?

If you can give more details, or clarify what you mean you may be better off posting in computers and technology.

Eurorunner · 30-03-2009 4:37pm

There are two way sat broadband providers in ireland. However, V-SAT is very expensive in terms of the monthly service costs, initial installation and cost of the equipment.
In addition to the above, there are latency issues for some applicaitons and I would imagine that there would be a cap on data transfer.

Its not an option for a domestic situation. Usually, those that do have it use it for business purposes (and probably justify the cost by offsetting it as an expense item).

irishgrover · 30-03-2009 4:57pm

Hi,
as Eurorunner said, it's expensive.
I got 2 way installed from digiweb a few years ago and I think the equip + install was in the region of 1500 and service was 129 ex vat per month
However as you can see from this link their prices have come way down...
On as side note: I've got the dish attached to my house and still have the modem, I'd be happy to give it to anyone who wanted to take it away...

patrick whitty · 30-03-2009 6:04pm

thanks all for early reply.
IRISH GROVER
can you let me know if it was one way or two way you had and was it a success.was there any problems with it apart from the cost.

watty · 30-03-2009 6:11pm

2 way Internet via Satellite is generic VSAT

TooWay is new service. It's not in Ireland yet, but Digiweb may be selling it soon.

Exhaust possibilities of Cable (you don't need to take the TV package), DSL, Fixed Wireless / Metro and Fibre.

irishgrover · 30-03-2009 7:05pm

patrick whitty wrote: »

thanks all for early reply.
IRISH GROVER
can you let me know if it was one way or two way you had and was it a success.was there any problems with it apart from the cost.

Hi Patrick,

it was two way, specifically 512/128. In reality the download was averaging ~350 and the upload what sh!te > rarely more than 50 or so.

The mail issue with satellite is latency, when a request is made it goes from your pc to your modem, to your disk, to outer space, to a ground station, to the internet and then back again. Ping times were always horrible, due the the laws of physics etc.

I selected satellite at the time as I really had no other option. Line was not dsl enabled, no local wireless providers, no 3G sigals etc.
I had isdn but that was before comreg mandated the provision of flat fee packages and Eircon consequently screwed my at every opportunity and charged per minute per channel. I was (due to remote working) on line about 50 hrs per week, so my bill was literally many hundreds a month, so for me the dish option was actually a cost saver :eek:

So from a usability point of view the latency issue is a big issue and is noticeable. However generally speaking is was very reliable. If is was really really bucketing down it might effect the signal but that was very rare. In fact my dsl goes down far more often than the satellite ever did.

hope this helps, shout if ya want anything else

Sorry, also should have mentioned that there are various other issues related to latency that cause significant limitations. For example VOIP and VPN software will not work effectively

patrick whitty · 30-03-2009 7:22pm

i am very gratefull to you for all the information and trouble you went to. i have the same problem as you had that is why i wanted information on it before i get it installed.bently walker supplys a kit for about 600euros and 40euros a month (self install). they are broadcasting from 13% hotbird its called tooway satellite. that is why i would like to hear from some person that has one installed.
thanking you again
patrick.

watty · 30-03-2009 10:36pm

VPN works as long as it it is VPN suported directly by the ISP

gerky · 31-03-2009 1:59am

watty wrote: »

TooWay is new service. It's not in Ireland yet, but Digiweb may be selling it soon.

Is that not what this crowd sell?
www.satellitebroadbandireland.ie

35notout · 31-03-2009 1:29pm

Digiweb have also just launched this Tooway service in Ireland, prices slightly cheaper than above

http://digiweb.ie/business/satellite/

Dr. Nick · 31-03-2009 1:47pm

35notout wrote: »

Digiweb have also just launched this Tooway service in Ireland, prices slightly cheaper than above

http://digiweb.ie/business/satellite/

same link as above?

Does 'available traffic' mean max. download per month? I'll stick with my o2 and dovado.

patrick whitty · 31-03-2009 9:10pm

doctor nick
i will give digiweb a call as the price has dropped but i would to hear from somebody that has it as it is a lot of money if it did not work.
thanks for all your time
patrick.

Sean55 · 20-04-2009 2:37am

Tooway™ is provided by Bentley-Walker (not Digiweb) and is available in Ireland. See http://www.bentley-walker.com/services_tooway.php

A "2-way" satellite connection (as opposed to a one-way or ADSL, which is via phone line for upload and satellite for download) is a generic term.

I would also like to know if anybody has experience of Tooway in rural Ireland.

Also is anybody using VoIP on 2-way satellite.

watty · 20-04-2009 8:41pm

I think you will find it is TooWay that Digiweb is offering

Digiweb Tooway typically offers 4 times current satellite speeds for less than ½ the current price, and with a much reduced upfront cost for the satellite modem. This is an attractive offering for end-users resulting in much higher speeds and better reliability than can be achieved today with any competing satellite offerings, and at an entry price point that is comparable with fixed line or 3G. The new Digiweb satellite service is an innovative product known as Tooway. It is a unique joint venture between a satellite operator (Eutelsat), an equipment manufacturer (Viasat) and a successful European based teleport operator (Skylogic).

http://media.digiweb.ie/pr/2009/03/31/digiweb-offers-affordable-satellite-broadband-across-ireland/

Bently Walker are not an Irish ISP. Digiweb are. I'd imagine Bently Walker's main market is the UK.

patrick whitty · 20-04-2009 9:44pm

i asked if anybody has tooway sat internet but only got one reply which was the old system.i would like to hear from sombody that has it before i purchase to know if it is a success.
patrick.

Sean55 · 21-04-2009 12:15am

I take it back! Thank you for the link to the Digiweb Tooway offer. They are apparently both supply to Ireland (with satellite, is there anymore anything like an 'Irish' or any other national supplier?), both in partnership with Skylogic. Similar rates.

Still interested in anyone with experience of VoIP on satellite in Ireland.

bigpaddy2004 · 21-04-2009 12:33am

A friend of mine from Cork rang me about 3 weeks ago from one of the Nbb satellite broadband systems with voip. I spoke to him for about 45 minutes and just had to keep repeating myself to him..."are you sure its a voip phone".!! I have to say it really was fixed line quality.

watty · 21-04-2009 9:15am

Quality can be perfect. The issue is the delay.

You can use VOIP on any satellite system and the voice quality should be fine. Latency though is 800ms+

bigpaddy2004 · 21-04-2009 10:14am

It was my very first time to talk to someone on VOIP through Satellite and I have to say I did not notice any delay in the conversation.

patrick whitty · 21-04-2009 1:22pm

its the up loading and down loading i would like to know about as i have a phone line but no broadband.
patrick

Sean55 · 22-04-2009 8:37pm

Satellite Broadband Ireland also offer Tooway™ presumably off the same satellite operator like the others mentioned here. They are VoIP and VPN compatible and claim max speeds of 2Mbs down, 256 Kbs up and have monthly limits of 1.2 to 6 GB (depending on which of four packages ranging from 45 to 120 euro). Installation is 899 euro, the most I've seen currently. See http://www.satellitebroadbandireland.ie/products.html

A 2-way connection is also offered by National Broadband (NOT the Tooway™ service above, off a different satellite it seems). See here http://www.nbb.ie/

They bundle voice calls and claim max speeds of 512Kbs-2048Kbs down and 96Kb-128 Kbs up (depending on which of three packages ranging from 50 to 75 euro). Not sure about VPN compatibility. It's self-install (with help) and the equipment is rented (75 euro a month all in), not sold, so it's cheaper than the others to set up (there is a 100 euro 'registration' fee just because they like the idea of it, though god knows what's actually DONE for this bit of dosh!)

I too would like to know if anyone has actual subscriber EXPERIENCE of either of these two or of the Digiweb or the Bentley Walker Tooway™ offerings as regards actual up/download speeds achieved, and also phone quality. (Phone is important to me Patrick because of the economics of it all, I can only justify buying into satellite broadband if I can get a moderately decent phone package/quality of line included, so I can ditch my landline).

So, anyone there out USING a 2-way connection from any of these or any of the others on the gov.ie list of satellite providers (http://www.broadband.gov.ie/List+all++Services/Home.htm)?

I don't care what country they're based in as long they are known to reliably supply a reasonably paced 2-way connection at a reasonable price, preferably with VoIP and VPN.

Does anybody know if, for example the Consumers' Association of Ireland or anybody else has done a comparative survey?

watty · 22-04-2009 11:40pm

Find out which satellite is used

go www.lyngsat.com see the footprint.

NBS uses Astra2Connect which is poor signal to the SouthWest/MidWest/West. It has limited upload speed as is only uses a 500mW transmitter.

Also there may be advantage to using a real Irish ISP, rather than someone that is just an selling / installer agent here, or even not based here at all but simply selling and using subcontract installer.

Unless you are good at DIY and very patient, don't consider self install. Get a professional installer.

You need to check that the PARTICULAR vpn you want is really supported. Most Modems/operators only support one specific VPN type or even need to know what the VPN server is.

The 128k up is a bit low to do good VOIP and anything else at the same time.

The only major issue with VOIP is the 890ms extra delay. International Voice calls used to use mix of satellite and cable. Now is all fibre. But in those days they only used satellite for one direction to 1/2 the delay compared to VOIP on Satellite. If you happen to call someone else that is via Satellite the round trip delay will be nearly 2 seconds.

patrick whitty · 23-04-2009 1:04pm

i have checked out all systems but i cannot conact anybody that has it and i would not like to be the first in case it is not a success as i would have to sign up for 1 year and pay 3 months in advance. fitting it my self would be no problem as it is from 13% east and i have a motorised satellite system.
thank you for all your trouble.
patrick

watty · 23-04-2009 1:36pm

VSAT needs it own dedicated dish and often a dedicated mount for the ODU (combo LNB and upconverter/transmitter). A motorised system is not suitable.

The ODU part is a lot heavier than a Receive only LNB. It has usually two coax to the Modem, transmit IF and receive IF.

Only the NBB system is self install (mainly to save money).

Here is a picture of NBB ODU on a multi-satellite fixed dish as an experiment (not recommended)

See how much bigger it is?

The better speed VSAT ODUs are bigger and heavier and usually have the power amplifier mounted on the dish arm.

A regular arm and holder usually doesn't work.

patrick whitty · 23-04-2009 1:49pm

bentley waker supply a complete system for about 600euroes which includes dish and bracket to suit location 80 cms for my location
again thanks for all the trouble.
patrick

watty · 23-04-2009 3:49pm

Bentley Walker are primarily a UK supplier with virtually no presence here. Often UK suppliers fit too small a dish and support is difficult. Only go with them if you are in UK mainland.

Some Irish ISP/Satellite suppliers have installed over 2500 terminals.

This is not like getting a set-box by mailorder.

TOO WAY INTERNET

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