Private Schools.

Pighead · 09-08-2006 8:44am #1

Well, What do you think?

Would you put the fruit of your loins/ladybits into a Private School to give him/her the best possible chance to get a decent education?

These schools cost 1000's of euros and Pighead would imagine the facilities would be better? Is it worth it? Are they all snobby mammys boys who check each others bits out in the showers and then retire to their dorms for games of soggy biscuit?

Pighead needs to know - an old chum of mine went to a private school and he used to get quite a lot of slagging from from the local tough boys who thought he was a smarmy little rich boy with notions of upperosity. He wasn't. He was smashing.

On top of that, it was an all boys school so he was obviously a homosexual in their eyes.

So. would you?

Femelade · 09-08-2006 9:00am

nope, being a single mother i could never afford it. Also i don't know any near me, so the travel expences would be too much alone.

Pighead · 09-08-2006 9:06am

Femmy wrote:

nope, being a single mother i could never afford it. Also i don't know any near me, so the travel expences would be too much alone.

How about if you married one of the Admins from boards and money was no longer an issue. Would you put your little angel through Private school or would you send him/her to Public school thinking it was much of a muchness.

The Hill Billy · 09-08-2006 9:09am

Hill Billy wouldn't be bothered with that malarky.
Hill Billy will send his son & heir to the local primary school & then the local secondary.
They were good enough for Hill Billy & they'll be good enough for Junior too.

While the facilities may be better (& God knows the facilities in the local primary near us aren't great) Hill Billy thinks that the standard of teachers & edgeukashun is great.

Hill Billy also thinks that he'd be fcuked if he was going to put his child through a tortuous commute to far-far-away "better" schools.

Hilly Billy wouldn't have it in his heart to get Junior up at ungodly hours of the morning to spend a couple of hours on packed trains to get there & back again when he'd be better off spending that time with with an extra hour in bed & then in the afternoon with his mates kicking ball or riding his bike.

Femelade · 09-08-2006 9:11am

erm...if i married one of the Admins....i'd prob still stick with public. I turned out fine. She is now going to the same primary school that i went to, most of the same teachers, and she will most probably go to the same secondary school too.

Thirdfox · 09-08-2006 9:11am

Yep, depends on what your child wants to get out of the experience of going to a private school. If it's just for games of rugby/hockey and soggy biscuit then s/he can join the local sports club, but if s/he wants to go to a school that has more motivated and experienced teachers, better facilities etc. etc. then it is very good value for money.

There are the posh people... but really it is much better to be looked down upon by them then to be beaten up by the more "rough" people in some public schools. Of course many public schools are really well funded and have good teachers (seems like the Cork area is doing pretty well in second level education) so do your research first I suppose.

Ruu_Old · 09-08-2006 9:12am

spurious · 09-08-2006 9:16am

There's no connection between fee-paying and better facilities.

Probably the best equipped school in Dublin is an inner-city VEC school - full gym, astro-turf pitch, climbing wall, two large computer rooms, 30 laptops for individual use, completely networked building, library with proper qualified librarian, etc.

The advantage private schools give people is networking. The State owned schools (VEC and Community Colleges) get higher government funding per student, have stricter qualification requirements for staff, smaller class sizes etc..

A bright motivated child with supportive parents will do well in any school. A child with difficulties is usually better off with people who are trained to cope with them, rather than languishing at the back of a big class. Traditionally, the fee-paying schools always selected who they wanted in their school, so they had a remarkable 'lack' of children with major learning problems. This unsurprisingly meant their average results were better - since they weren't on a level pitch.

Most of a child's educational 'destiny' is set in place before they even go to primary school.

Pighead · 09-08-2006 9:22am

spurious wrote:

The advantage private schools give people is networking. The State owned schools (VEC and Community Colleges) get higher government funding per student, have stricter qualification requirements for staff, smaller class sizes etc..

You sure about this, your information sounds kinda spurious to Pighead. Would have thought that private schools would have smaller classes.

spurious · 09-08-2006 9:24am

I have taught for 22 years in the VEC and never had a class group bigger than 20.

The VECs can spread their allocation over all the schools, so where they can have a class of say, 28+ at Post-Leaving, this frees up staff to take groups as small as 10 or 12 at Junior Cert. level in other schools.

Pighead · 09-08-2006 9:28am

spurious wrote:

I have taught for 22 years in the VEC and never had a class group bigger than 20.

The VECs can spread their allocation over all the schools, so where they can have a class of say, 28+ at Post-Leaving, this frees up staff to take groups as small as 10 or 12 at Junior Cert. level in other schools.

Well I never, Wasn't like that in Dundalk I tells ya. Pighead used to cram into a room with 30-40 smelly blokes and as far as I know all the rest of the schools around town were the same. We ended up building crappy freezing cold prefabs out the back of the school because of the sheer numbers.

homeOwner · 09-08-2006 9:28am

Private schools dont necessarily have any better facilities but you get taught a mindset of "succceeding" if you want to call it that, that I dont think you get in public schools. Its expected of you that you do well, participate in sports, music etc... and go to college. Networking is also a huge part of it. But its not all rich folk, plenty of middle income earners.

One other major thing is accent. You get a certain accent in a private school that you may get grief for later on. People make assumptions based on accents. If you dont want your kids saying dis, dat, dese, and dose, either drill his THs into him or send him to private.

connundrum · 09-08-2006 9:30am

There are a huge amount of parents who sent there kids to private schools in order to keep up with the Jones'... who are these fcukin Jones'??

I wouldn't send my kid to a private school for educational purposes - as I don't believe that the more one pays = the smarter one's kid will be.

The only circumstance which would lead me to send my kid to private would be to do with sport, and if I believed that a private school would offer better facilities etc.

LikeOhMyGawd! · 09-08-2006 9:36am

connundrum wrote:

There are a huge amount of parents who sent there kids to private schools in order to keep up with the Jones'... who are these fcukin Jones'??

I wouldn't send my kid to a private school for educational purposes ...
...The only circumstance which would lead me to send my kid to private would be to do with sport, and if I believed that a private school would offer better facilities etc.

Sport over education...you definitely have your priorities right :rolleyes:

spurious · 09-08-2006 9:42am

Pighead wrote:

Well I never, Wasn't like that in Dundalk I tells ya. Pighead used to cram into a room with 30-40 smelly blokes and as far as I know all the rest of the schools around town were the same.

God bless prefabs.

The bigger the VEC, the more they can play with, so County Dublin VEC or City of Dublin VEC with 20 plus schools have a lot of leeway. Poor old Dundalk may not have had a lot to play with.

The VECs in Dublin suffered badly from a mistaken notion that they were not 'academic' - in fact, when they were first set up, the brightest went to the 'Tech.' and many are heads of industry today. However, in Ireland, 'university' was seen as better than direct employment from school, so when 'free' education came in, the stampede to the traditional university suppliers, like brothers and convent schools occurred. This left the VEC to service the group the voluntary secondary sector didn't want - the kids with learning difficulties etc.

Nevertheless, they picked up the ball and ran with it, so much so that now, we get children coming to us after Junior Cert. having had 'problems' in their other schools, only to discover an undiagnosed learning problem. The City of Dublin VEC has its own educational psychological service, so no waiting up to four years for an appointment like in the secondary schools.

In my opinion, there's no such thing as a 'good' school - there are good teachers and good students, they're not always in the same place. There are children who want to learn and there are supportive and non-supportive parents. No amount of fee-paying will get an unmotivated child whose parents are not bothered about education top marks in the Leaving Cert. Likewise, there are many teachers in this country whose classes achieve top marks regularly who would not be able to cope with a child arriving at 12 reading at the level of a 6 yr old.

I'm not exaggerating - that is going on in schools. We had a kid last year improved four years in his reading in one school year - terrible, but his reading level was purely because of non-stimulation. Once he got into our library scheme and had to read at least one book a week, he flourished. Anyway, I could ramble for ever.

Fee-paying schools, go for it if it's what you want, but the most important factor in how a child will do is the home.

Dave! · 09-08-2006 9:46am

Whenever I have a kid I'll put them in public school probably... The main reason is that there's a better mix there... poor people can't afford to go to private schools, but rich people can still go to public schools. therefore there is a more even ratio of "poor" to "rich" kids in public schools, which I think it's good for your child to be exposed to (rather than just one class).

Also, while private schools do generally have better teachers (at least in my experience), that doesn't really mean sh*t if your child is lazy. Likewise, just cos they have a sh*tty teacher in a public school doesn't mean that they're gonna fail. The trends may show that private schooled kids in general get higher grades, but it's still easy to do well in public school if you want to. Lots of people get all A1's in public school.

And at the end of the day, school is more than just about grades...

(In general though, public school does suck on the sports front)

connundrum · 09-08-2006 9:54am

LikeOhMyGawd! wrote:

Sport over education...you definitely have your priorities right :rolleyes:

Eh, yeah.

What I said was that I don't believe there to be a difference in the quality of education given between private or public schools. A kid is either going to do well or badly depending on the parenting (my job) and his/her natural ability (God's job). There were as many 500+ point results coming out of my CBS school as there were out of most private schools back in 2001 (when I did my leaving).

If another school ie. boarding school/private school can offer notably better sporting facilities than the local public schools - then yes, I really would consider sending the kid there if he/she was mad into the sports.

I would have loved to have been sent to a private school with swimming pool facilities as I was mad into swimming and had to give it up in secondary school as the town's pool was closed for renovations.

Tchocky · 09-08-2006 9:54am

Pighead wrote:

Well I never, Wasn't like that in Dundalk I tells ya. Pighead used to cram into a room with 30-40 smelly blokes and as far as I know all the rest of the schools around town were the same. We ended up building crappy freezing cold prefabs out the back of the school because of the sheer numbers.

They were bleedin' awful alright.

I'd like to think I'd put my kids through normal school, not sure what types they'd be mixing with in fee-paying....

gah, such a snob I am

Pighead · 09-08-2006 10:02am

spurious wrote:

In my opinion, there's no such thing as a 'good' school - there are good teachers and good students, they're not always in the same place. There are children who want to learn and there are supportive and non-supportive parents. No amount of fee-paying will get an unmotivated child whose parents are not bothered about education top marks in the Leaving Cert. Likewise, there are many teachers in this country whose classes achieve top marks regularly who would not be able to cope with a child arriving at 12 reading at the level of a 6 yr old.

Wow Pighead didn't realise VEC's had come on so much. Thats impressive.

Regarding the bit I quoted above do you not think that little Johnny will prosper better in a private school if hes surrounded by lads who are generally getting better grades than him. In a public school if your grades are bad you can just start hanging out with the lost causes who know they're not gonna go to college and who are just going through the motions to keep their folks happy.

Being in those surroundings might make him buck up his ideas. Pigheads point here is that maybe privaye schools can be very beneficial for people to reach their potentials.

Jotter · 09-08-2006 10:04am

I would like to send my kids to the best school possible with the best facilities regardless of whether its fee paying or not. In saying that if there were 2 schools that rated exactly the same, one public and one private I would definately use the public school. I went to public school got on very well met a great mix of people rich middle of road and poor and not only got a good education but also got good life education, which I think is far more important- my friends that I grew up with in area all went to the same private school and to this day are more sheltered in their attitudes and their parents have commented to my parents about how myself and my sis have done well for ourselves a lot quicker and with more ease than their kids - this was in a conversation about school choices and by the parents own admission they sent their kids to this school bec it was private so they assumed a better education for their kids.

My husband went to private school and hated it so much he left in 5th yr and completed his leaving cert at home instead. Hes of the same opinion that what matters in a school is the facilities and the attitudes of teachers and students not whether its fee paying or not.

LikeOhMyGawd! · 09-08-2006 10:07am

connundrum wrote:

Eh, yeah.

What I said was that I don't believe there to be a difference in the quality of education given between private or public schools. A kid is either going to do well or badly depending on the parenting (my job) and his/her natural ability (God's job). There were as many 500+ point results coming out of my CBS school as there were out of most private schools back in 2001 (when I did my leaving).

If another school ie. boarding school/private school can offer notably better sporting facilities than the local public schools - then yes, I really would consider sending the kid there if he/she was mad into the sports.

I would have loved to have been sent to a private school with swimming pool facilities as I was mad into swimming and had to give it up in secondary school as the town's pool was closed for renovations.

So, all things educational being equal, sporting facilities might tilt the balance for you? Fair enough, can't argue with that:)

Ballyman · 09-08-2006 10:18am

How much, approx, is it to send a child to one of these fee paying schools in Dublin for a year??

Would it be cheaper in say Clongowes in Kildare than it would be in Dublin??

magpie · 09-08-2006 10:19am

The benefits of a classical education, dear boy. Depends on whether you want your children to be successful, genteel, eloquent and worldly professionals or Marketing Managers for Spar with a Croke Park season ticket.

Would it be cheaper in say Clongowes in Kildare than it would be in Dublin??

Certainly not! Clongowes is where all the spud-thick farmers, property developers and other self-made persons from a 'trade' background send their half-witted children to try and turn them into gentlemen. They are expected to pay heftily for the priviledge.

toffo · 09-08-2006 10:28am

If they want to go, i'd have no problem with it. Personally I don't think it will make too much of a difference, every school has its swats/dossers/scumbags.

ferdi · 09-08-2006 10:35am

i was put through private school...probably made no real difference....everyone in my year went to college however. pretty much everyone from that school goes to college with decent/excellent grades and confidence created by a certain style of education and ethos..

ferdi · 09-08-2006 10:36am

magpie wrote:

Clongowes is where all the spud-thick farmers, property developers and other self-made persons from a 'trade' background send their half-witted children to try and turn them into gentlemen. They are expected to pay heftily for the priviledge.

i've never hear it put quite so well before

09-08-2006 10:36am

Pighead.Do you have sprogs yourself?

Sangre · 09-08-2006 10:39am

Probably send them to private, sure I'll be loaded anyway. Better facilities and usually a better attitute (LC wise).
Would probably send them to my school if I can, great facilities (gym, sports hall, pool, pitches, kiln, music room, theathre et.,), great teahers, great fun, great lads, small enough year.
25% of my year got over 500+, average away above the national.

Also in 8 years there I never once heard someone being slagged for being poor.

ferdi · 09-08-2006 10:39am

Deleted User wrote:

Pighead.Do you have sprogs yourself?

you mean piglets?

Cardinal · 09-08-2006 10:53am

Well I actually live closer to a private school than to the public secondary school that I went to. If I had kids and was choosing a school for them I'd definately choose to send them to the public school that I attended rather than the private school nearby. The public school I went to was excellent, well equiped and had some great teachers. I haven't heard such good things about the private school recently.

Pighead · 09-08-2006 10:56am

magpie wrote:

The benefits of a classical education, dear boy. Depends on whether you want your children to be successful, genteel, eloquent and worldly professionals or Marketing Managers for Spar with a Croke Park season ticket.

Certainly not! Clongowes is where all the spud-thick farmers, property developers and other self-made persons from a 'trade' background send their half-witted children to try and turn them into gentlemen. They are expected to pay heftily for the priviledge.

Ha ha, Pighead knows these lads only too well. A lad from back home went to Clongowes. He was raw as fcuking ropes before he went in there. Farmers son who probably arrived at the opening day in his wellies. Anyway by the time he finished in the school he'd developed this flat posh accent and had bagged himself a posh dublin chick.

Hes an accountant now and him and his posh ladyfriend got married last year. The wedding reception was a scream. The posh girls family were decked out in their Armani and Stella McCartney suits discussing the finer points French Champagne while the farmers were downing pints of bulmers arguing about how many acres the hotel and surrounding areas covered. Lets just say there was a definite segregation as the night progressed.

Private Schools.

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