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Dish pics request - Elfordstown, RTÉ & Mt Gabriel

  • 20-01-2007 06:29PM
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭


    Just looking for more pics of the above earth stations.

    One of Elfordstown on web archive:
    363556995_f8163169d2_o.jpg
    Elfordstown, Ireland's largest earth station, entered service in 1984 and carries telecommunications traffic to Europe and North America. There are 3 antennae in the Earth station complex. The largest, a 32 meter Intelsat Standard A, carries the North American, Canadian and Saudi Arabian traffic. European destinations use the 11 meter antenna in Eutelsat TDMA system. The third antenna, a 13.5 meter Intelsat Standard B, is used for PTAT cable restoration.
    http://web.archive.org/web/20010428084828/indigo.ie/~eftirl/

    There was a link to the RTÉ uplink dishes mentioned here when they first went onto Astra. But the link therein is dead, and also broken on wayback. Anyone got these saved to hard drive?



    Finally there's a mention of Mt Gabriel, Schull on the Wiki entry on Echelon
    Any more info on this?


«13

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Mt Gabriel is Irish Aviation. Atlantic Approach Radio. I knew a guy that worked there. (died recently). The IRA bombed it once thinking it was NATO. It is only civil radar. Nothing to do with Echelon.


    Elfordstown Google Earth
    http://www.tageo.com/kml.php?lat=51.951&long=-8.164&place=Elfordstown


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭Zaphod


    Thanks watty. I hadn't heard of Mt Gabriel before and only came across it while looking for info on Elfordstown.

    I also recall a 6-8M dish right in the middle of Tralee town, near the courthouse but it was dismantled a few years back. Anyone know what became of it?

    On a similar note from the Armstrong website
    1995 Satellite Earth Station installed for RTE in Tralee, Co. Kerry.

    Again anyone know of this?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,227 ✭✭✭Solair


    It's amazing that old Telecom Eireann webpage is still online. The wonders of archiving! I would suspect however, that the Midleton dish no-longer plays a major role in Irish telecommunications. Almost all international calls and data go by fiber optic routes thesedays and Ireland's has pretty substantial connections to various fiber networks. The only role that dish would have thesedays is to serve as a back up, should there be a problem with fiber.

    Satellite links are generally prone to echos and delays so, for live phone traffic they're not great.

    It'd be interesting to know what traffic actually goes through it thesedays though.

    Any ideas?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Yes Middleton is mothballed. eircom are open to the right offer...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,716 ✭✭✭zilog_jones


    There's some dish about the same size as the smaller ones in that picture in Castletroy (Limerick) behind the old AIB. Any idea what it could be? Could it be something to do with UL? Looks pretty old and mossy anyway - I'll take pics some time if I remember to bring a camera to college.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭Zaphod


    AFAIK the one in Limerick near the Jewish graveyard is owned by TE/Eircom.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,819 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Background information on Mount Gabriel including some specificiations http://vekinis.org.lu/mtgabri.html

    I was on the mountain c. 1977 (please remember I was 5 at the time). The INLA blew up at least one in 1982, but I understand there are two again. They have built a fence. :) In 1977 it had two radomes that looked like this. http://www.flickr.com/photos/eoinoc/265122067/

    It would be possible that they are the same http://historical-debates.oireachtas.ie/S/0102/S.0102.198312140006.html

    Some pics all pointing in the wrong directions. :(

    Interesting links
    http://www.eurocontrol.int/asterix/gallery/content/public/documents/archives/part1/astx1v1e.pdf
    http://www.sei.ie/index.asp?locID=325&docID=-1
    http://www.sei.ie/getfile.asp?FC_ID=925&docID=260
    http://www.raytheon.com/businesses/stellent/groups/ncs/documents/content/cms04_019499.pdf

    List of aircraft radars http://www.aaiu.ie/upload/general/3500-0.PDF (MSSR = Monopulse Secondary Surveillance Radar)


    Dooncarton, Mayo http://images.google.ie/images?svnum=10&hl=en&q=Dooncarton+&btnG=Search


    UCC used to have an array of 3-5m dishes on their tall building (science?).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,716 ✭✭✭zilog_jones


    The one on Woodcock Hill (on that Flick link above) is quite visible on Google Earth:
    52°43'15.52"N
    8°42'26.54"W

    I think there may have been an older one there that was dismantled - I vaguely recall there being two up there for a while - or maybe I am imagining things.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭Zaphod


    443528340_ae4ac8dde3.jpg

    443528330_4bfba16e2e.jpg

    Looks like a Viasat setup similar to the one in Donnybrook.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    The one on Woodcock Hill (on that Flick link above) is quite visible on Google Earth:
    52°43'15.52"N
    8°42'26.54"W

    I think there may have been an older one there that was dismantled - I vaguely recall there being two up there for a while - or maybe I am imagining things.

    Yes there were two. The base may still be there.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,444 ✭✭✭Antenna


    Some photos of Mt Gabriel on the web.
    gabriel1.jpg
    gabriel2.jpg
    gabriel5.jpg

    one of the 2 Radomes has an RTE TV relay around its wall. 2 sets of UHF panels facing different areas (one set is H polarisation, the other Vertical), the receive aerials for Mullaghanish also visible


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 89 ✭✭Scottish paddy


    Has anyone got a pic of the Sky uplink dish at Donnybrook?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,321 ✭✭✭Foggy43


    Antenna!
    Looking at the close up pictures of Mount Gabriel can you tell me what the white rectangular panels are? There are in a group of 4.

    I have seen them at ground level and presumed they were either low power mobile phone base stations or handheld radio related?

    Just Curious!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,122 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Foggy - I'd suspect they're the RTE relay he mentioned just below the pics.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,321 ✭✭✭Foggy43


    MYOB!
    Just after hitting 'submit reply' I had this flash back to a picture of a deflector site on the Comeragh Mountains. A UHF Yagi Antenna and one of those 'panels'.

    I am sure it was somewhere in this website but it is unavailable at the moment.
    http://www.geocities.com/corkradio/tvch.html

    Not exactly the above but a link from it. http://www.geocities.com/corkradio/txgal5.html


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 89 ✭✭Scottish paddy


    Is the "Donnybrook Tower" still needed in these days of satellite links and fibre optic? Surely this anachronism can now be dismantled?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,819 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Back-up to the back-up? Although I suspect it is actually the primary.

    And mobile phones?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,444 ✭✭✭Antenna


    Zaphod wrote:
    I also recall a 6-8M dish right in the middle of Tralee town, near the courthouse but it was dismantled a few years back. Anyone know what became of it?

    I remember reading there was a passive deflector in the Slieve Mish Mountains to reflect microwave signals between Tralee and Limerick (for telephone network). I suspect this is what the dish was for (was it aimed at the mountains?).

    the microwave reflector is mentioned here:
    http://mountainviews.ie/mv/index.php?mtnindex=339 (COMMENTS for Barnanageehy )


    BTW folks the Mt Gabriel pics above are on free web hosting. If there is too much usage, they will be unavailable for periods of time (just try later if they dont appear).


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 61 ✭✭tea


    I took some photos at Elfordstown a few years ago. If memory serves correctly, the photos below is of the main dish there (I seem to recall there were three in total). I have a few more at ,
    http://www.cybercom.net/~mark/Ireland/Elfordstown 2004/ and I have a couple more offline - if it would be helpful I'll dig them out.CNV00009.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    It's not in use.

    They should make it available for Radio Astronomy for Transition year students to encourage science.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 950 ✭✭✭MiketheMechanic


    You're correct Antenna, this passive deflector on Slieve Mish was blown down during high winds some years ago. I don't believe it was still in use at that time. The Stack's mounatins were in the way of direct communications between Tralee and Limerick, hence the need in the first instance.

    Does anyone know where the transmitter/receiver at the Limerick end was based?

    73's
    MtM
    Antenna wrote:
    I remember reading there was a passive deflector in the Slieve Mish Mountains to reflect microwave signals between Tralee and Limerick (for telephone network). I suspect this is what the dish was for (was it aimed at the mountains?).

    the microwave reflector is mentioned here:
    http://mountainviews.ie/mv/index.php?mtnindex=339 (COMMENTS for Barnanageehy )


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,242 ✭✭✭Ulsterman 1690


    RE: The Donnybrook mast would they not need planning permission to demolish it ??

    And with the possibility that it might be needed for something in the future or that there may be mobile phone companies and suchlike wanting to rent space on it It would be madness to demolish it unless its getting in the way.

    Of course it has been suggested that RTE flog off the entire Donnybrook complex to property developers and move operations to someplace land is cheaper (next door to TG4 perhaps :D )


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭Zaphod


    Antenna wrote:
    I remember reading there was a passive deflector in the Slieve Mish Mountains to reflect microwave signals between Tralee and Limerick (for telephone network). I suspect this is what the dish was for (was it aimed at the mountains?).

    My shakey memory was that its was directed towards the sky, rather than the mountains, although it was on a Telecom Éireann site.
    watty wrote:
    They should make it available for Radio Astronomy for Transition year students to encourage science.

    Funnily enough, the Radio Telescope for Ireland project specifies a 32M dish, just like the Elfordstown one. Whether it would have a sufficient elevation/azimuth range or not is another story.
    http://www.arti.ie/tech_specs.php

    BTW there was a program this evening on RTÉ about Collins Steeplejacks with some archival footage of the installation of the radome at Mt Gabriel and the subsequent formation of Collins Essco in the manufacture/installation of radomes.
    http://www.l-3com.com/essco/about/plantlocations.html


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,819 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    RE: The Donnybrook mast would they not need planning permission to demolish it ??
    AFAIK, to demolish something does not need planning permisison unless it is either (a) residential or (b) listed.
    Of course it has been suggested that RTE flog off the entire Donnybrook complex to property developers and move operations to someplace land is cheaper (next door to TG4 perhaps :D )
    Can you imagine the taxi bill then? :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,242 ✭✭✭Ulsterman 1690


    Victor wrote:
    AFAIK, to demolish something does not need planning permisison

    Admitidely im not an expert but was under the impression that any large (i.e. bigger than a garden shed) structure needed planning permission for demolition if its been there more than a certain number of years unless it could be shown to be in a dangerous condition
    unless it is .....residential

    Well surely its only "residential" if someone lives there and one generally tends to avoid demolishing structures with people inside (although there are exceptions :eek: )


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 89 ✭✭Scottish paddy


    I would hardly think it needs planning permission to dismantle it, as it doesn’t exactly add to the scenic beauty of Donnybrook!:rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭Zaphod


    Zaphod wrote:
    BTW there was a program this evening on RTÉ about Collins Steeplejacks with some archival footage of the installation of the radome at Mt Gabriel

    Not Mt Gabriel but Woodcock Hill:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭Zaphod


    Anyone in the vicinity of Kilmainham might keep an eye out for this:

    1181301968494.jpg


    Webb telescope should be able to observe edge of universe

    Dick Ahlstrom, Science Editor

    A full-scale model of a space telescope which, when in orbit, should be able to see the edge of the universe, has touched down in Dublin.

    The 80ft (24.38m) model came to earth at the Royal Hospital, Kilmainham, where it will remain on public display for two months.

    The real James Webb space telescope (JWST) will not be launched until 2013, but when it does go into orbit it will carry a little bit of Ireland. Scientists from the Dublin Institute for Advanced Studies are part of a 10-country European consortium building Miri, one of the experiments to be carried on the telescope.

    "We are immensely proud to be involved in this exciting new project," the institute's Prof Tom Ray said yesterday. The model was brought over from the Smithsonian Institution in Washington to mark a meeting of participants in the telescope project at the Royal Hospital this week. The initiative is funded jointly by the US National Aeronautics and Space Administration (Nasa) and the European and Canadian space agencies.

    The meeting will involve 300 international scientists and space technology companies, who will discuss progress on the telescope.

    Dr John Mather, JWST chief project scientist and 2006 Nobel Prize winner, was also at the Royal Hospital. He will deliver two public lectures during the week, including one at Trinity College this evening organised by The Irish Times, the Royal Irish Academy and Depfa Bank. He will also give a public lecture on Thursday June 14th, organised by the institute which also plays host for this week's meeting at the Royal Hospital.

    Prof Ray was instrumental in bringing the JWST review meeting to Dublin. "It is important for Ireland because it emphasises that there is Irish involvement in a major international project," he said. "It shows our expertise is equal to the best of them."

    The giant 80ft by 40ft by 40ft model is impressive. However, the real space instrument will be an engineering marvel when built and launched.

    The Webb telescope will be many times more sensitive than the soon to be retired Hubble space telescope, which orbits several hundred miles overhead and will be located a million miles into space.

    This is necessary because the highly-sensitive instruments will have to be kept at a temperature of minus 270 degrees in order to operate properly.

    One of the telescope's key roles will be in discovering new planets and improving our understanding of how stars form, Prof Ray said.

    Newly formed planets tend to be very hot and Miri (Mid-Infrared Instrument) will be able to see the heat given off by new planets and infant stars.
    © 2007 The Irish Times


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 828 ✭✭✭BarryM


    Antenna wrote:
    Some photos of Mt Gabriel on the web.
    gabriel1.jpg
    gabriel2.jpg
    gabriel5.jpg

    one of the 2 Radomes has an RTE TV relay around its wall. 2 sets of UHF panels facing different areas (one set is H polarisation, the other Vertical), the receive aerials for Mullaghanish also visible

    The whole set-up on Gabriel has been expanded quite a lot recently. I can see it out the window, from here on Sherkin Island.

    It was originally an IAA installation (and still is theirs) which has a link back to the Shannon IAA station. The two dishes point out to a point about 15W where Irish/Eurocontrol airspace begins. Shannon handles all traffic from 15W; south to about 45N and north to about 56N. The whole area is called Shanwick, part of it was controlled from Prestwick.

    Recently (last 5 years or so) RTE installed a UHF tv transmitter there; various mobile operators have installed relays and a number of local broadband suppliers have relays there too, for wireless BB. This message routes through one of them!!

    The irony, to my mind, is that IAA presumbaly paid eircom or one of its predecessors, for the fibre optic link to Shannon and now eircom sublets bits of it to RTE, mobile operators and wireless BB suppliers......

    Bye, Barry


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭Zaphod


    2825411399_a020a4062d_o.gif

    From here.


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