Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12

Al Capwned · 15-04-2012 10:36am

When I first read that Fabio was being let out on loan, I couldn't understand it. But after thinking about it a bit, and reading a few posts from more knowledgeable posters in here and elsewhere, it may not be entirely a bad idea at all.

Evra has played the vast majority of games this season (and for the past few seasons), and Fergie obviously believes that he'll be first choice next season also. For Fabio to be warming the bench for that season would not help him to progress as a footballer. And the more I think about it, I think it makes sense to let him out on loan.

In the meantime, we do have cover for Evra in the form of Johnny Evans, if it comes to it, and if he can do a decent job if called on to do so at left back. Can't see this being a regular thing, though if Evra continues his current appearance record.

Evra will be 32 by the end of next season, and if Fabio has a full year at Premier League level under his belt by then, it may signal the natural progression for him to become our first choice left back at that point.

Will I Amnt · 15-04-2012 10:53am

Pro. F wrote: »

My problem is you posting excrement in this thread, citing wikipedia as a source when trying to establish the fee paid. Jimmy explained to you why that is utterly stupid, although it really shouldn't need explaining.

You may think it is a bit of fun and not important, but everybody else either has to waste their time reading your bullshìt or has to put you on ignore which makes threads confusing. It would be nice if you would take the slightest bit of intellectual responsibility for what you write and at least try to not act like a retard when you're posting in here. It would be the sound thing for you to do, just to show respect to everybody else who shares this thread and forum with you.

That's out of order Pro.F.
Everyone has the right to post what they want as long is it's not against the charter. Citing Wikipedia has about as much merit as linking to most tabloids or sites like football365 etc. in fairness.
I've seen so many variations of the cost of Nani and Anderson I don't know which to believe.

No need for some of those comments,you're point could have easily been made without them.

Giggsy11 · 15-04-2012 12:19pm

I dont see the point in sending Fabio out on loan. He was good enough to start against Barca in champions league finals, so he should be good enough to play at least few league games.

Playing Evra week in week out (As if there is some clause in his contract) wont do any good for Evra and Fabio too. Now with Fabio out we should sign back up LB when we have other areas to improve.

Pro. F · 15-04-2012 1:00pm

cambo2008 wrote: »

That's out of order Pro.F.
Everyone has the right to post what they want as long is it's not against the charter. Citing Wikipedia has about as much merit as linking to most tabloids or sites like football365 etc. in fairness.
I've seen so many variations of the cost of Nani and Anderson I don't know which to believe.

No need for some of those comments,you're point could have easily been made without them.

Bad and all as football365 and the tabloids are, at least their articles can't be altered by anonymous wums whenever the mood takes them. There is no doubt that mentioning the current Wikipedia claim on a debated transfer fee is completely idiotic and a waste of everybody's time.

The fact that something is not against the charter doesn't mean that it's ok. That is a nonsense argument. Posters acting with a bit of responsibility and actually trying to not post nonsense I think is a perfectly reasonable request, I don't know what you're on about.

killwill · 15-04-2012 1:09pm

Pro.F, when I first started posting in here many moons ago, you wete one of my favourite posters. What changed? You are quite negative for awhile now and dare I say picking on some people.

FutureGuy · 15-04-2012 1:13pm

Its brilliant to see SAF giving Evans the praise he deserves...

"There is no doubt he has been helped playing alongside the experience of Rio and he is now arguably the best defender in the country."

Will I Amnt · 15-04-2012 1:18pm

Pro. F wrote: »

The fact that something is not against the charter doesn't mean that it's ok. That is a nonsense argument. Posters acting with a bit of responsibility and actually trying to not post nonsense I think is a perfectly reasonable request, I don't know what you're on about.

The forum does not have to conform to your standards,there's people of all ages and differing levels of intelligence,from one extreme to the other.
Sometimes you just have to let things go instead of calling anyone that doesn't share your views a retard or drooler or whatever the buzz word is at the time.

Adolf Hipster · 15-04-2012 1:23pm

Wikipedia gets fixed very quickly and some pages are locked and can't be edited by randomers.

PhlegmyMoses · 15-04-2012 1:25pm

FutureGuy wrote: »

Its brilliant to see SAF giving Evans the praise he deserves...

"There is no doubt he has been helped playing alongside the experience of Rio and he is now arguably the best defender in the country."

Really delighted with him this season. There is nothing better than when a youth product comes through and does well.

Owen_S · 15-04-2012 1:27pm

I think a loan to another PL club would be great for Fabio, if he gets a long run of games. His ability is wasted playing in the reserves. It might also lead to a few more appearances for Fryers next season.

I'm predicting a scrappy 1-0 today, at this stage we won't make up too much ground in terms of goal difference.

aperture_nuig · 15-04-2012 1:56pm

RE fabio on loan; I'd much rather see evra sold(he has been varying from average to awful this season IMO) and fabio promoted to first team regular. But, if SAF insists on keeping evra there, I think a loan is a good move for Fabio.

Edit: oh, and 2 - 0 today v villa.

Red Crow · 15-04-2012 2:01pm

I wouldn't sell Evra. I'd keep Evra and put Fabio in there when he's fit and loan out Fryers.

Give Fabio game time while keeping Evra as back-up.

killwill · 15-04-2012 2:02pm

Owen_S wrote: »

I think a loan to another PL club would be great for Fabio, if he gets a long run of games. His ability is wasted playing in the reserves. It might also lead to a few more appearances for Fryers next season.

I'm predicting a scrappy 1-0 today, at this stage we won't make up too much ground in terms of goal difference.

Is Fryers not going out on loan too?

Pro. F · 15-04-2012 2:02pm

cambo2008 wrote: »

The forum does not have to conform to your standards,there's people of all ages and differing levels of intelligence,from one extreme to the other.
Sometimes you just have to let things go instead of calling anyone that doesn't share your views a retard or drooler or whatever the buzz word is at the time.

You're point would be sensible if I was asking for something unreasonable. Asking for people to use the minimum of cop-on required to have a sensible conversation is not unreasonable.

killwill wrote: »

Pro.F, when I first started posting in here many moons ago, you wete one of my favourite posters. What changed? You are quite negative for awhile now and dare I say picking on some people.

The constant trolls and idiots who have blown through this thread at different times have made me realise that there is a limit to the amount of patience we should exercise. Some people can just fùck up a conversation when they want to or when they don't care. Like it or not there is a minimum amount of cop-on that is required for a discussion to carry on. I'm not saying that Samich doesn't have that, I'm certain he does, I'm saying that he's not exercising it.

Me saying that using Wikipedia as a source for a transfer fee is a waste of time is not unreasonable. People bringing what wiki says into that kind of conversation should be called on it. Samich has been posting for long enough to know how wiki works as a source. I think it's crazy that people are arguing about this. If Samich thought about it for a second he would admit that Wikipedia is a waste of time source, especially after reading Jimmy's response. I guarantee he understands that point.

Pro. F · 15-04-2012 2:06pm

Adolf Hipster wrote: »

Wikipedia gets fixed very quickly and some pages are locked and can't be edited by randomers.

Wikipedia is one of the shìttest sources possible for a transfer fee. I cannot believe you are trying to argue that.

PhlegmyMoses · 15-04-2012 2:14pm

It's about as solid as anywhere else really. It has to be backed up by a source like a newspaper's website, or a club press release. For example, a quick look at Anderson's wikipedia entry shows this:

The transfer fee Porto announced was €30 million,[19] which was equivalent to around £20.4 million as of May 2007.[17]

The source that this is referenced in is an official Porto club release in the form of a PDF. About as legit as you can get.

Samich · 15-04-2012 2:52pm

Pro. F wrote: »

My problem is you posting excrement in this thread, citing wikipedia as a source when trying to establish the fee paid. Jimmy explained to you why that is utterly stupid, although it really shouldn't need explaining.

You may think it is a bit of fun and not important, but everybody else either has to waste their time reading your bullshìt or has to put you on ignore which makes threads confusing. It would be nice if you would take the slightest bit of intellectual responsibility for what you write and at least try to not act like a retard when you're posting in here. It would be the sound thing for you to do, just to show respect to everybody else who shares this thread and forum with you.

Plenty of people use wikipedia on this site for your information.

Why does wikipedia even exist?

Would be nice to not be called a retard also. Also just because you think what I write is bull**** isn't what everyone thinks. It's a discussion board, people write what they think, not what they want you to hear.

Don't like what I post? Just hit the ignore button rather than posting why my posts are s*it!

Paul Tergat · 15-04-2012 2:56pm

Samich wrote: »

Plenty of people use wikipedia on this site for your information.

Why does wikipedia even exist?

Would be nice to not be called a retard also. Also just because you think what I write is bull**** isn't what everyone thinks. It's a discussion board, people write what they think, not what they want you to hear.

Don't like what I post? Just hit the ignore button rather than posting why my posts are s*it!

while its not a massive problem and can largely be ignored using wiki as a source is pretty stupid

aperture_nuig · 15-04-2012 3:02pm

Just find what source wikipedia referenced and use that! simples!

Samich · 15-04-2012 3:05pm

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Its 46 Million Euros. When we signed exchange was much better for Euros.

Anderson was signed for 30 Million Euros which was equivalent to 20 Million pounds back in May 2007.

English papers reported we payed combined fee of 30 Million pounds for Anderson and Nani which is equal to 46 Million Euros.

IMO its a good deal.

Edit: There are few reports which says we signed Nani for 25 Million Euros which was 17 Million back then. If we consider that then we have paid 55 Million euros for the pair.

Samich wrote: »

Wiki says 46 million pounds for Nani & Anderson.

I like Anderson a lot, when he comes on as a sub he offers a lot of energy and that. From the start he isn't as effective, probably lacks a bit of explosive power off the mark.

Well well, for one I thought the first poster might have made a mistake with the euros sign, because we're in euros.

Secondly I didn't say "The fee was £46m!", I said "Wiki says"

I never said wiki was perfect, although if you go onto man utd's wiki page and say their capacity is 1 more than it actually is, go back later and it will be back to what it was.

Lots of people on the forum would use wiki for info.

Most likely ye've been told by lecturers not to trust wiki or use it as a reference.

aperture_nuig · 15-04-2012 3:16pm

So, berba is on the bench for today's game, would love to see him on. I wonder though, is he on the bench because we're a little short up front, or because saf wants to put him in the shop window?

Son Of A Vidic · 15-04-2012 3:16pm

VW 1 wrote: »

Hit and miss? We've lost 3 league games this season, hardly hit and miss tbf. The performances may not look that pretty but when we are on to win the league with a potentially record number of points, overall season form can't be called hit or miss ffs.

Lies, damn lies and then statistics eh? Don't let record a points haul paper over the core issue. Now I can only speak for myself, but this season has delivered more shockingly bad performances than I care to remember. Our European form has been dire and amongst the worst I have ever seen. And any team that comes to Old Trafford and has a go at us, seems to seriously rattle the team.

I think I can safely say these are not typical United qualities under the SAF era. So regardless of the title being won or not, SAF has a lot of work to do. Because if Scholes hadn't of returned to this team, then I have no doubt United would probable be lying further down the table. His class and true legend status is accepted the world over.

But a reason I was annoyed by his return, was despite all his great years of service, we still needed the old masters magic on the pitch. When in reality, United should already have his successor in place. The points haul since his return has been amazing. But take Scholes away and just see how many points we wouldn't have right now.

Our season stats would look a whole lot different without him. A record points haul means nothing to me and sometimes you just have to look deeper that that to see the reality. Becasuse if we take Scholes out of the team with his quality and genius. Then United are close to winning nothing.

Paul Tergat · 15-04-2012 3:17pm

aperture_nuig wrote: »

So, berba is on the bench for today's game, would love to see him on. I wonder though, is he on the bench because we're a little short up front, or because saf wants to put him in the shop window?

jump into the match thread mate!

aperture_nuig · 15-04-2012 4:53pm

Paul Tergat wrote: »

jump into the match thread mate!

Heh, I usually try not to, its normally nigh on impossible to have a decent conversation in them.

Paul Tergat · 15-04-2012 4:58pm

aperture_nuig wrote: »

Heh, I usually try not to, its normally nigh on impossible to have a decent conversation in them.

Proven right so far

Paul Tergat · 15-04-2012 5:57pm

Back on track. Job done.

5 points, 4 games.

DB21 · 15-04-2012 5:59pm

5 points, 4 games left. Not going to get too optimistic, but provided we match City's result next week, we need 2 points from 3 games.

Paul Tergat · 15-04-2012 6:03pm

DB21 wrote: »

5 points, 4 games left. Not going to get too optimistic, but provided we match City's result next week, we need 2 points from 3 games.

Providing one of the points is against City right?

ScummyMan · 15-04-2012 6:06pm

Few thoughts on today:

I thought Evra was quality today, granted he didn't have huge amounts of defending to do, but he did his job well.

Scholes is simply outstanding. It was a masterclass bringing him back by SAF.

Its also scary how much Evans has improved this season. I honestly didn't think he had a future at the club last year, but he's proved me wrong with game after game of fantastic performances.

Rooney was poor today, still got two goals though which is the sign of a good striker I suppose.

Overall job done, good win. We were a bit wasteful with chances, but Villa were so poor it didn't matter. I'd be very worried for them after that performance.

Nailz · 15-04-2012 6:08pm

DB21 wrote: »

5 points, 4 games left. Not going to get too optimistic, but provided we match City's result next week, we need 2 points from 3 games.

I want 12 points from 4 games.

Kylo Ren · 15-04-2012 6:08pm

Nailz wrote: »

I want 12 points from 4 games.

I want 13!

DB21 · 15-04-2012 6:08pm

Paul Tergat wrote: »

Providing one of the points is against City right?

Yeah. So 4 points from our next 2, and we just need 1 from the last 2.

smokedeels · 15-04-2012 6:09pm

Rooney might have been our worst player today.... and he got two goals, ha.

adox · 15-04-2012 6:11pm

DB21 wrote: »

Yeah. So 4 points from our next 2, and we just need 1 from the last 2.

No we don't. Could still lose it on goal difference in that scenario and in fact most likely would.

MANUTD99 · 15-04-2012 6:12pm

Rafael was outstanding today, he defended excellent, his tackling was good, he headed some great balls out of danger, he linked up well with Valencia in attack and even got a few half decent crosses into the box.

His place at RB should be cemented at this stage

Paul Tergat · 15-04-2012 6:13pm

Paul Tergat wrote: »

Providing one of the points is against City right?

DB21 wrote: »

Yeah. So 4 points from our next 2, and we just need 1 from the last 2.

adox wrote: »

No we don't. Could still lose it on goal difference in that scenario and in fact most likely would.

.

Kylo Ren · 15-04-2012 6:19pm

Have to agree with Sir Alex there. I don't want to get bitten in the bum.

DB21 · 15-04-2012 6:37pm

Okay, we win next week, we're 5 points clear in the worst case scenario going into the City game. And there's my error -_-

So, we draw at City, still 5 clear. In which case we need only 2 points from the final 2 games.

So 6 points needed, at least one has to be at City.

Giggsy11 · 15-04-2012 6:43pm

Carrick had very good game today, was surprised to see him beating players with nice dribbles and also in tight spaces he made passed ball well. Should make those forward runs often as he is really good at it.

killwill · 15-04-2012 6:44pm

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Carrick had very good game today, was surprised to see him beating players with nice dribbles and also in tight spaces he made passed ball well. Should make those forward runs often as he is really good at it.

Yup, do you remember his run for his goal against QPR earlier in the season?
Class

Giggsy11 · 15-04-2012 6:53pm

killwill wrote: »

Yup, do you remember his run for his goal against QPR earlier in the season?
Class

Yeah and there are few videos of his West Ham days where he was playing as almost AM. Saw that in 2002-03 season review I think, he was good at it.

JerryHandbag · 15-04-2012 7:04pm

Nice to see Berbatov get a run today, didnt think we'd see him in a Utd shirt again.

Pro. F · 15-04-2012 7:31pm

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Carrick had very good game today, was surprised to see him beating players with nice dribbles and also in tight spaces he made passed ball well. Should make those forward runs often as he is really good at it.

You're making way too much out of that. You have to take the quality of the opposition into account and how little effort they put in defending. Villa were abject at closing down players today and never put anybody under pressure.

On a slightly different note, it really looks like the posters who were saying that Fergie chose the wrong game to rest players against Wigan were right. Scholes really wasn't needed today. Although maybe Fergie felt there was no option because he thought Scholes couldn't play two games close together, no matter how much he was going to be needed mid-week.

Pro. F · 15-04-2012 7:34pm

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

It's about as solid as anywhere else really. It has to be backed up by a source like a newspaper's website, or a club press release. For example, a quick look at Anderson's wikipedia entry shows this:

The source that this is referenced in is an official Porto club release in the form of a PDF. About as legit as you can get.

You have got to be fùcking kidding me.

That source, which is not for the figure Samich mentioned, might happen to be legit. That doesn't mean all claims on Wikipedia are reliable or referenced properly. Plenty of references go nowhere when you click through them or go to nonsense sources. And the articles are able to be edited for wuming purposes at any time. So no, it is not ''about as solid as anywhere else really''. That is a fùcking stupid claim. If you are offended by me saying that I really don't care. I have no interest in handling your argument with delicacy if you are going to try to argue nonsense like that.

Samich should have used the reference material to back up his claim, not Wikipedia itself. It is normal forum discussion behavior. It was just pure laziness to do otherwise.

Samich wrote: »

Plenty of people use wikipedia on this site for your information.

Why does wikipedia even exist?

Wikipedia is a fantastic resource for learning about things and as a source of references. I use it every single day myself. What it is not is in any way definitive with details which can be relied on without in a discussion without checking references. When people are discussing a transfer fee using Wikipedia directly as a source to back up a claim is a waste of time. What you should do is check out the references yourself and use them instead. It saves everybody else having to do it. This is commonly accepted behaviour.

Samich wrote: »

Would be nice to not be called a retard also. Also just because you think what I write is bull**** isn't what everyone thinks. It's a discussion board, people write what they think, not what they want you to hear.

Don't like what I post? Just hit the ignore button rather than posting why my posts are s*it!

I guarantee you anybody with half a clue agrees that using Wikipedia as a source in a discussion on a transfer fee is bullshìt.

I've already explained to you that using the ignore function makes threads confusing, so no I won't be doing that.

Samich wrote: »

Well well, for one I thought the first poster might have made a mistake with the euros sign, because we're in euros.

So?

Samich wrote: »

Secondly I didn't say "The fee was £46m!", I said "Wiki says"

I never claimed otherwise. Obviously there is no doubt you were getting your information directly from Wikipedia. That's the whole point.

Samich wrote: »

I never said wiki was perfect, although if you go onto man utd's wiki page and say their capacity is 1 more than it actually is, go back later and it will be back to what it was.

That still does not mean it is reliable for details without checking the sources. Not checking and showing the source yourself is just being lazy.

Samich wrote: »

Most likely ye've been told by lecturers not to trust wiki or use it as a reference.

You don't need to go to university to work out that wiki is useless as a direct source in the type of situation we are talking about.

3hn2givr7mx1sc · 15-04-2012 7:45pm

Goodbye until June lads and ladies, going to see if I can get my access removed until after the Leaving Cert to help me focus a bit more!

Hopefully it'll be 20 titles by the time I come back! :P

Paul Tergat · 15-04-2012 7:47pm

baz2009 wrote: »

Goodbye until June lads and ladies, going to see if I can get my access removed until after the Leaving Cert to help me focus a bit more!

Hopefully it'll be 20 titles by the time I come back! :P

Good luck lad!

Fuhrer · 15-04-2012 7:47pm

baz2009 wrote: »

Goodbye until June lads and ladies, going to see if I can get my access removed until after the Leaving Cert to help me focus a bit more!

Hopefully it'll be 20 titles by the time I come back! :P

What is this ****?

Football is far more important than your Leaving Cert

Pro. F · 15-04-2012 7:51pm

baz2009 wrote: »

Goodbye until June lads and ladies, going to see if I can get my access removed until after the Leaving Cert to help me focus a bit more!

Hopefully it'll be 20 titles by the time I come back! :P

Best of luck man. It'll be over soon and then you never ever have to deal with that shìte again.

Fuhrer · 15-04-2012 7:53pm

MANUTD99 wrote: »

Rafael was outstanding today, he defended excellent, his tackling was good, he headed some great balls out of danger, he linked up well with Valencia in attack and even got a few half decent crosses into the box.

His place at RB should be cemented at this stage

Aye, very composed today. Staying on his feet and trying to get it back rather than launching himself in like a maniac

3hn2givr7mx1sc · 15-04-2012 7:56pm

Paul Tergat wrote: »

Good luck lad!

Pro. F wrote: »

Best of luck man. It'll be over soon and then you never ever have to deal with that shìte again.

Cheers fellers!

Fuhrer wrote: »

What is this ****?

Football is far more important than your Leaving Cert

I'm just pissed that I'm gonna be missing the United v City match thread, tbh.:pac:

Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12

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