Build at a standstill before it even starts!!

Bobbiblu · 09-12-2010 1:18pm #1

Hi All,

I haven’t posted on here in a while. I was expecting to be in the ‘live self builds’ thread ages ago but things haven’t worked out as I’d planned so I’m just interested to see if anyone else finds themself in the same situation.
Myself and my OH have been researching our build since the beginning of 2008, we received planning permission in April 2009 so that was the design of the building sorted. We then set about making all the important decisions in regards to what type of construction, heating system, windows, contrator or direct labour route, etc etc.
We visited a couple of sites belonging to the guys on here and got great advice and support and made all our decisions and even got all our trades on board and ready to go. Then and only then did we approach the bank and this is proving to be our downfall!!
We thought it was a no brainer for us to get a self build mortgage....without going into too much detail.
We have good credit histories, have not got any personal debt, already own the site are not employed in any area connected to construction plus we’re not looking for a very big mortgage (sub €175K) but we’ve been put through the hoop after hoop by the bank since June!!
Each time they tell us what information they want us to provide, we give them that exactly, they tell us they’ll get back to us within 14days and ‘it shouldn’t be a problem’ then, always in the afternoon of the 14th day we get an email saying “actually, can you give us a bit more information about such and such” (usually estimates for the build or something similar).
At this rate of non progression I’m not sure when we’re ever going to get started so I’m just wondering if there is

1. Anyone on here in a similar position?
2. Anyone who’s just come out of the other side successfully?
3. Anyone in (dare I say it, a bank) who has some inside information on what’s really happening in the banks these days?
4. And finally, to anyone embarking on the planning process can I suggest you work on your funding in tandem with your design and planning unless you’ve got it all sorted already ☺
Anyway, rant over! Just so frustrated at the moment!!

Poor Uncle Tom · 09-12-2010 2:32pm

I have some clients who are having problems with banks at the moment, one couple have been strung along for 8 months having to get all sorts of letters of commitment along the way.

Anecdotal evidence is telling us any of the banks do not have the funds right now to open new mortgages.

I know of one man who has a good bit of savings and called into his local branch to take out €10,000 of his own money for some extension work only to be told it would take at least 2 weeks for the bank to get it together for him.

sinnerboy · 09-12-2010 2:36pm

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

I know of one man who has a good bit of savings and called into his local branch to take out €10,000 of his own money for some extension work only to be told it would take at least 2 weeks for the bank to get it together for him.

:eek: Quick , lets all tell The Queen we're sorry .....

Technophobe · 09-12-2010 3:17pm

happened me when I went to take my last draw-down amount..everytime they came back looking for extra stuff, most of which they already had from earlier drawdowns/communications....

in the end, it came thru..so dont give up...:D

tred · 09-12-2010 3:20pm

Bobbiblu wrote: »

Hi All,

I haven’t posted on here in a while. I was expecting to be in the ‘live self builds’ thread ages ago but things haven’t worked out as I’d planned so I’m just interested to see if anyone else finds themself in the same situation.
Myself and my OH have been researching our build since the beginning of 2008, we received planning permission in April 2009 so that was the design of the building sorted. We then set about making all the important decisions in regards to what type of construction, heating system, windows, contrator or direct labour route, etc etc.
We visited a couple of sites belonging to the guys on here and got great advice and support and made all our decisions and even got all our trades on board and ready to go. Then and only then did we approach the bank and this is proving to be our downfall!!
We thought it was a no brainer for us to get a self build mortgage....without going into too much detail.
We have good credit histories, have not got any personal debt, already own the site are not employed in any area connected to construction plus we’re not looking for a very big mortgage (sub €175K) but we’ve been put through the hoop after hoop by the bank since June!!
Each time they tell us what information they want us to provide, we give them that exactly, they tell us they’ll get back to us within 14days and ‘it shouldn’t be a problem’ then, always in the afternoon of the 14th day we get an email saying “actually, can you give us a bit more information about such and such” (usually estimates for the build or something similar).
At this rate of non progression I’m not sure when we’re ever going to get started so I’m just wondering if there is

1. Anyone on here in a similar position?
2. Anyone who’s just come out of the other side successfully?
3. Anyone in (dare I say it, a bank) who has some inside information on what’s really happening in the banks these days?
4. And finally, to anyone embarking on the planning process can I suggest you work on your funding in tandem with your design and planning unless you’ve got it all sorted already ☺
Anyway, rant over! Just so frustrated at the moment!!

Have you tried another bank? Nib or ulster bank. Tell them youll move everything to them, on mortgage approval?

Bobbiblu · 09-12-2010 3:23pm

Thanks for the replies guys, I'm dismayed to hear it's as bad as you say Tom but at the same time I'm glad it's not just something I'm doing wrong that's causing the delay. I suppose we'll just have to keep plodding away, I'm sure we'll get there but it's the uncertainty of when that's really bugging me!

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Anecdotal evidence is telling us any of the banks do not have the funds right now to open new mortgages.

That's what I suspected....yet they still tell people they're in the market for mortgages!?!? could be a while yet so before we get going

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

I know of one man who has a good bit of savings and called into his local branch to take out €10,000 of his own money for some extension work only to be told it would take at least 2 weeks for the bank to get it together for him.

Holy sh1t!! that's far worse than I imagined :eek:

Bobbiblu · 09-12-2010 3:46pm

Technophobe wrote: »

happened me when I went to take my last draw-down amount..everytime they came back looking for extra stuff, most of which they already had from earlier drawdowns/communications....

in the end, it came thru..so dont give up...:D

Sorry to hear it was dragged out for you too Technophobe but delighted to hear that it worked out in the end - that gives me hope

tred wrote: »

Have you tried another bank? Nib or ulster bank. Tell them youll move everything to them, on mortgage approval?

Hi tred, thanks for your reply. Yes, we bank with AIB and after watching them fannying about for ages we decided to apply to Ulster Bank too and they're at the same craic but have some of the best interest rates so we'd definitely prefer our mortgage with them at this stage and the thing is neither bank have said no, the opposite in fact, they say everything looks great and like I said above they say it should be "no problem" but then at the 11th hour up pops the problem!?!? AArrrggghhh......and I thought deciding how to construct our house was the difficult part!....oh! how naive I was :rolleyes:

Haven't decided to try any others just yet, not sure I could contain my frustration at three or more very slow moving banks....besides if all banks are in the same boat I'm not sure there is any point in applying to anyone else just yet.

archtech · 09-12-2010 5:33pm

I've Bank of Ireland were lending for mortgages (up until quiet recently anyway) no sure what the storey is now.

I found AIB to be a pain the last time I went for a mortgage and that we before all the sh!te .

Poor Uncle Tom · 12-12-2010 6:02pm

Just saw this and heard that it has spilled over from commercial to private savings now, so much so that BOI were having 'technical difficulties' with their vault timelocks for a few days now. This has the potential to be scary.

soldsold · 12-12-2010 9:35pm

Hi Bobbiblu, sorry to hear you are having trouble getting approval, I have an NIB mortgage which also took a while to get approved so it's fairly slow in any case. I kept asking them if there was anything else they needed and what the schedule would be which prompted them to let me know about other paperwork they had left off the list they wanted.

Keep plugging away and as advised above maybe broaden the list to include another non Irish bank. Hopefully some of the 85 billion will be in your account soon

Lambsbread · 12-12-2010 9:41pm

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

I know of one man who has a good bit of savings and called into his local branch to take out €10,000 of his own money for some extension work only to be told it would take at least 2 weeks for the bank to get it together for him.

Was he trying to take the money out in cash? normally you have to give some notice when taking out more than €5000. Bank branches generally don't generally hold too much cash.

Poor Uncle Tom · 12-12-2010 10:50pm

Lambsbread wrote: »

Was he trying to take the money out in cash? normally you have to give some notice when taking out more than €5000. Bank branches generally don't generally hold too much cash.

That I honestly don't know, it was something he told me as a by-the-way when we were chatting, but I do know what you mean. However, it would surprise me if this bank branch shouldn't have a hell of a lot more then that in cash in the branch at any given time, that is what safes are for and this branch is servicing a population of approximately 20,000 between the town it's in and surrounding areas.

Bobbiblu · 13-12-2010 5:59pm

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Just saw this and heard that it has spilled over from commercial to private savings now, so much so that BOI were having 'technical difficulties' with their vault timelocks for a few days now. This has the potential to be scary.

Had to look away for fright!?! :eek: thanks (I think?!?) Uncle Tom, for taking the time to post and frightening the bejaysus out of me

soldsold wrote: »

Hi Bobbiblu, sorry to hear you are having trouble getting approval, I have an NIB mortgage which also took a while to get approved so it's fairly slow in any case. I kept asking them if there was anything else they needed and what the schedule would be which prompted them to let me know about other paperwork they had left off the list they wanted.

Keep plugging away and as advised above maybe broaden the list to include another non Irish bank. Hopefully some of the 85 billion will be in your account soon

Hi soldsold, many thanks for the advice! I'll get on that....but will probably wait until after Christmas now and my new year's resolution will be not to take no for an answer!

Like you say it's just a matter of time...just it was being dragged on for sooooo long at this stage my enthusiasm for 2010 has ran dry....but I've asked Santa for a new batch so should be good for 2011

:D:D

Leadership · 15-12-2010 3:59pm

We had exactly the same issue with BOI, for months we got the run around but the day after the Government announced the first bail out with the commitment to lend again we contacted the bank and we had the written agreement. That was 18 or so months ago and we are in our new home and finally the stress of it all is worth it.

We kind of knew at the time it was stalling tactics but kept on plugging away anyway.

Liam01 · 15-12-2010 4:17pm

Got approval in P in October 2008 was told there would be no problem, It took from April 09 (got full planning) until Aug 2010 to get the first draw in my account,

Tried playing them all off oneanother to no avail, in the end up I told the bank i wasnt going to pay another penny off my site loan until they turned it into a morgage, - next week bank mamager called & gave me the good news..

Took a lot of messing though.

Bobbiblu · 15-12-2010 4:19pm

Thanks for that Leadership, I need all the reassurance I can get at this stage and it's great to hear you're at the end of the process and all is well....I'll just keep focused on this and start in earnest again in Jan - 2011 will be our year

Bobbiblu · 15-12-2010 4:25pm

Liam01 wrote: »

Got approval in P in October 2008 was told there would be no problem, It took from April 09 (got full planning) until Aug 2010 to get the first draw in my account,

Tried playing them all off oneanother to no avail, in the end up I told the bank i wasnt going to pay another penny off my site loan until they turned it into a morgage, - next week bank mamager called & gave me the good news..

Took a lot of messing though.

Wow! that's a lot of messing about alright....maybe I should work on my bad cop routine

thanks for posting Liam, it's great to hear from others who've made it out the other end of this messing about stage....here's to headaches related to the actual construction of our house!!

Liam01 · 15-12-2010 4:32pm

Build is going & went very well (Bar a slight window prob but that’s a different story) once the bank headache went away everything just seemed to slot into place, I must ad the local bank staff were busting their guts to get me approval, I think they were as delighted as I was when the nod came thru,

Persistence...

mr_edge_to_you · 01-01-2011 5:28pm

Hi Bobbiblu,

Would it be worth checking a mortgage broker?

in our case we went through a local broker and we got a level of service that no bank could compete with. There was a girl there with in depth self-build build knowledge and experience. On a number of occasions when the engineer was dragging his heels she took over and got him moving again. We had a direct number for her and we genuinely felt that we were dealing with someone who a sincere interest in our build. Anytime we had a concern or worry we could contact her directly. If we had to leave a voicemail it was returned in a matter of hours.

In saying that, the lender did make us jump through hoops. We had a major problem at the end because the auctioneer reviewed his original market value down (significantly) so we had to produce a few more bits of info to get the final stage payment. But again the broker was able to advise us all along and keep us calm and informed.

We went from approval in principle to 1st stage drawdown (foundations) in 5 months.

Bobbiblu · 20-11-2011 12:38pm

I know this is a very old thread but just thought for completeness I should finish the story. Basically mr_edge was bang on when he said

mr_edge_to_you wrote: »

Hi Bobbiblu,

Would it be worth checking a mortgage broker?

We found a really good guy through a friend and he's been excellent. He worked in a bank before becoming a broker so he knew exactly what the story was! He knew precisely which banks to approach and had approval in principal within about two weeks!! I wish we'd realised this at the very beginning!! but we got there in the end. There was still a fair bit of paperwork to sort out before we got the actual loan offer but we just provided them with what they wanted and it all ran pretty smoothly after that. So for what it's worth, I'd definitely recommend obtaining the services of a mortgage broker to deal with the banks on your behalf these days if you're applying for a self build mortgage.

Poor Uncle Tom · 20-11-2011 1:15pm

Glad it worked out for you Bobbiblu.

Any other advice looking back?

mr_edge_to_you · 20-11-2011 5:55pm

thanks for the feedback bobbiblu. delighted my advice was useful.

i think the importance of being able to pick up the phone and ring someone you know and who knows your situation is very important. i don't think you get that level of personal interaction with a bank.

best of luck with the rest of the process.

Bobbiblu · 22-11-2011 12:32pm

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Glad it worked out for you Bobbiblu.

Any other advice looking back?

Don't use as many smilies????:o

Seriously, though the only advice I can give is don't think the battle with the bank is necessarily complete once you have the letter of offer in your hand! For example, the terms of our offer stated the first drawdown had to be completed within three months of the date of offer and we had to do at least €30K's worth of work before the first drawdown, which we had done and more, so our engineer put in for €45K and the bank issued us with €15K!!! they're basically making sure we're not relying on our own funds to finish the build by ensuring we spend our own funds at the beginning....but it does make balancing my own books a bit tricky as no one gives credit these days, and we have to spend a lot more cash to get to the next stage payment before we can be reimbursed!! And it wasn't something I was expecting nor was it something the broker had anticipated but to be fair to him, he says things change within the banks weekly!!

Bobbiblu · 22-11-2011 12:34pm

mr_edge_to_you wrote: »

best of luck with the rest of the process.

Many thanks mr_edge

brendan_donegal · 23-11-2011 9:49am

Yes, I got a mortgage approved recently for my self build and the condition on mine was I spent €40k first. So I have, I got the architect to put in the cert and say that we have spent 40k and we expected to get €32k back so we could continue on with the build. Now the bank are saying we need to certify that €80k worth of work has been done before they will give us any money. So they are basically saying we have to spend another €40k we don't have. How is this system supposed to work?
The only way I can see is get trades in and get materials on account and not pay them until we have spent another €40k and get our draw down.
My fear is the bank will come up with some excuse and we will be left with huge bills and people not very happy with us. Why should we put ourselves in this position? How are the banks gettings away with this cr@p, we own them for f&*k sake......AAAArrrggggghhhhhh

archtech · 23-11-2011 11:03am

brendan_donegal wrote: »

Yes, I got a mortgage approved recently for my self build and the condition on mine was I spent €40k first. So I have, I got the architect to put in the cert and say that we have spent 40k and we expected to get €32k back so we could continue on with the build. Now the bank are saying we need to certify that €80k worth of work has been done before they will give us any money. So they are basically saying we have to spend another €40k we don't have. How is this system supposed to work?
The only way I can see is get trades in and get materials on account and not pay them until we have spent another €40k and get our draw down.
My fear is the bank will come up with some excuse and we will be left with huge bills and people not very happy with us. Why should we put ourselves in this position? How are the banks gettings away with this cr@p, we own them for f&*k sake......AAAArrrggggghhhhhh

In spending your 40K you can take into account things like development contributions fees etc as money spent, if you have, assuming that you had advised the bank of them in your total build cost. your architect should note that on his valuation to the bank.

Build at a standstill before it even starts!!

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