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Phoenix Park Tunnel

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    #32
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,485 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Rud wrote: »
    so basically what your saying is it is ok to hop down onto any track in the country as long as it's quiet and not much chance of getting hit by a train?

    no, I just said you can do it, not that its ok to do it :rolleyes:


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    #33
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    There's an anti Metro North/Interconnector letter in the Irish Times today. He says the Phoenix Park tunnel could be used rather than a new tunnel for the interconnector. What are the reasons again that make him wrong?


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    #34
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,018 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Furet wrote: »
    There's an anti Metro North/Interconnector letter in the Irish Times today. He says the Phoenix Park tunnel could be used rather than a new tunnel for the interconnector. What are the reasons again that make him wrong?
    It's not really a case of the PPT being an alternative for the IC. They would both do fundamentally different things.

    The problem with the IC is that it still isn't clear to most people that it is much more than just a tunnel to connect Heuston to Connolly (which it won't do anyway of course!).

    the IC will allow trains to travel directly under the area of the city where most commuters want to go (the South central business district). The PPT would do little for these people.

    The PPT would however allow all sorts of other possibilities and from right now could be used to get trains from Kildare etc. to the Docklands station (with some basic trackwork). This was the stated aim of IE but it has never materialised.


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    #35
    DWCommuter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,032 ✭✭✭DWCommuter


    Furet wrote: »
    There's an anti Metro North/Interconnector letter in the Irish Times today. He says the Phoenix Park tunnel could be used rather than a new tunnel for the interconnector. What are the reasons again that make him wrong?

    It wasn't me!:D


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    #36
    OurLadyofKnock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 558 ✭✭✭OurLadyofKnock


    Furet wrote: »
    There's an anti Metro North/Interconnector letter in the Irish Times today. He says the Phoenix Park tunnel could be used rather than a new tunnel for the interconnector. What are the reasons again that make him wrong?


    They all both serve different purposes - but are all useful.

    It is great to see people still writing letters about this issue and bring the matter up as Irish Rail do everything they can to stop people from knowing there is even a tunnel under the Phoenix Park.

    Letters like this to the papers, even ill informed ones, are very important for the future protection of the tunnel as such actions ensure that the Phoenix Park Rail Tunnel remains the monster The Lynch Mob cannot kill.

    The day the IRRS organise a "Farewell Special" from Docklands to Islandbridge is the day I will kidnap and chain Irish Rail management to the tracks at the site of the old cement depot at Cabra West and light a cigarette and just stand back and sing:

    "I hear that train a coming...it's coming round the bend..."


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    #37
    KC61
    Registered Users Posts: 4,316 ✭✭✭KC61


    Furet wrote: »
    There's an anti Metro North/Interconnector letter in the Irish Times today. He says the Phoenix Park tunnel could be used rather than a new tunnel for the interconnector. What are the reasons again that make him wrong?

    What the interconnector delivers is two completely independent DART services (Maynooth/Greystones and Northern Line/Hazelhatch) and the elimination of the numerous conflicts north of Connolly and relieves pressure on the loop line bridge. None of that is delivered by using the Phoenix Park tunnel instead.

    The problem with using the Phoenix Park Tunnel is that it funnels everything off the Kildare line onto the same tracks as trains from Maynooth at Glasnevin Junction and then everything has to cross northbound and southbound tracks to get into Connolly thereby using extra slots.

    Arguably it could be used to route trains from Kildare to Docklands, but this would require a diamond crossover at Glasnevin Junction. This would however mean longer journeys to say the south city centre at Grafton Street than the existing bus transfer at Heuston.


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    #38
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    Okay. So who among you is going to write a letter to Madam and rebut the piece in today's paper?


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    #39
    Judgement Day
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    The offending letter in full - I agree with its sentiments but my main objection to DART underground is that CIE/IE are behind it. They cannot be trusted with this sort of project, especially as by the time it is completed they will have killed the entire inter-city network and then what will the inter-connector connect? A Western DART line to the existing DART lines - WOW!!


    http://www.irishtimes.com/letters/index.html#1224276042062

    Monday, August 2, 2010

    Madam, – I concur with Frank McDonald’s views (Opinion, July 28th) on the proposed Metro North and Dart underground and would like to add some points. The recent extension to the Luas light rail line at Cherrywood (Home News, May 6th) is very good value for money costing €300 million, working out at €40 million per kilometre for the 7.5km track. What is not good value is the €6 billion about to be spent on the Metro. The present Cherrywood to St Stephen’s Green Luas line should be extended to go via the city centre to Dublin Airport.

    Using a mixture of ground level and elevated tracking as used in all Luas projects, this enterprise would deliver greater economic and social value than the proposed €6 billion Metro North, which involves the destruction of St Stephen’s Green, the vast construction of unnecessary underground stations, and tunnel works which will endanger the structures of many old Dublin buildings.

    The light rail model of Luas transportation in Dublin (everybody would be able to take the A train to the airport) is cost effective and would deliver a light rail line at a fraction of the cost of the Metro North. Another example of Government project money wastage is the proposed €2 billion underground Dart going from Heuston Station to the Docklands which Iarnród Éireann is in the process of building. There is no reason for this new line as there is already a useable and well-built railway line which runs from Heuston Station via a tunnel at the Phoenix Park; the line then traverses a semi-circle around the northside and terminates at Connolly station. Iarnród Éireann has made no attempt to incorporate this great railway asset into its commuter network. – Yours, etc,

    DAMIAN O’REGAN,
    Sion Hill,
    Blackrock,
    Co Dublin.


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    #40
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,018 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Judgement Day wrote: »

    DAMIAN O’REGAN,
    Sion Hill,
    Blackrock,
    Co Dublin.
    Luckily for dear Damian, he lives spitting distance from the DORT so he likely doesn't need metro north or the interconnector.


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    #41
    Judgement Day
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    murphaph wrote: »
    Luckily for dear Damian, he lives spitting distance from the DORT so he likely doesn't need metro north or the interconnector.

    Unless he wants to go to Hazlehatch, the soon to be terminus of rail services west of Dublin? :rolleyes:


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    #42
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    I'm a photographer but also a mild enthusiast. I'm well aware of the dangers in the tunnel and what to do if a train does approach. I've spent over twenty years around tracks, trains, tunnels and yards so I'm pretty safe even though I may be trespassing. I have a few more pictures from that set here


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    #43
    davebuck
    Registered Users Posts: 243 ✭✭davebuck


    murphaph wrote: »
    Luckily for dear Damian, he lives spitting distance from the DORT so he likely doesn't need metro north or the interconnector.

    I agrees totally Dear old Damien is being spoiled by the dart,F*** the rest of the city that's not on the existing dart line.

    What a Prat!!!!


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    #44
    DWCommuter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,032 ✭✭✭DWCommuter


    Effects wrote: »
    I'm a photographer but also a mild enthusiast. I'm well aware of the dangers in the tunnel and what to do if a train does approach. I've spent over twenty years around tracks, trains, tunnels and yards so I'm pretty safe even though I may be trespassing. I have a few more pictures from that set here

    Fantastic photos of a rarely seen location and at least you admit that you are trespassing.


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    #45
    corktina
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    Effects wrote: »
    I'm a photographer but also a mild enthusiast. I'm well aware of the dangers in the tunnel and what to do if a train does approach. I've spent over twenty years around tracks, trains, tunnels and yards so I'm pretty safe even though I may be trespassing. I have a few more pictures from that set here

    the trouble with trespassing is YOU might know what you are doing but someone else seeing you and assuming they can do the same, may not know what they are doing. A lot of discussion on this issue in the UK railway press.Its a no-no nowadays.


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    #46
    westtip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭westtip


    davebuck wrote: »
    I agrees totally Dear old Damien is being spoiled by the dart,F*** the rest of the city that's not on the existing dart line.

    What a Prat!!!!

    Its totally unfair to criticise someone for making a point, just because he lives near the dart. He expressed a view and a valid one that the PPT exists and could be used - even if it was just a shuttle service between connolly or docks area and Heuston on a 15 minute interval - It would add value to the overall travel product on offer in dublin - and it should at least be tried. Criticising someone for these reasons - he lives neat the dart he expressed a view he's a pratt is not dissimilar to prejudice, and is all too prevelant in our parish pump mentality. so please don't criticise his opinion because of his postcode, by all means argue against his views if you wish but don't judge on colour creed or address.


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    #47
    SeanW
    Registered Users Posts: 8,786 ✭✭✭SeanW


    westtip wrote: »
    Its totally unfair to criticise someone for making a point, just because he lives near the dart. He expressed a view and a valid one that the PPT exists and could be used - even if it was just a shuttle service between connolly or docks area and Heuston on a 15 minute interval
    I agree the PPT could and should be used and the 15 minute shuttle idea sounds good.

    But this writer has a much simpler idea - "let them eat cake." Luas isn't really a solution to anything important, remember it takes nearly an hour to get from Tallaght to Connolly. You could go to Mullingar in nearly the same time. Clearly Metro and DART are required for the Airport, Swords, Dublin West etc.


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    #48
    KC61
    Registered Users Posts: 4,316 ✭✭✭KC61


    I think that it is more the case that the letter writer just does not understand the real purpose of the Interconnector.


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    #49
    Judgement Day
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    KC61 wrote: »
    I think that it is more the case that the letter writer just does not understand the real purpose of the Interconnector.

    Which is?


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    #50
    Stonewolf
    Registered Users Posts: 1,132 ✭✭✭Stonewolf


    KC61 wrote: »
    I think that it is more the case that the letter writer just does not understand the real purpose of the Interconnector.

    ... and perhaps works somewhere on the Northside and therefore sees it as a threat due to the required change at Pearse.


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    #51
    KC61
    Registered Users Posts: 4,316 ✭✭✭KC61


    Judgement Day wrote: »
    Which is?

    As I said above:

    1) Two completely independent DART services (Maynooth/Greystones and Northern Line/Hazelhatch) connecting at Pearse; and

    2) The elimination of the numerous conflicts north of Connolly between Maynooth line and northern line services; and

    3) Relieves pressure on the loop line bridge.

    None of the above is delivered by using the Phoenix Park tunnel instead.


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    #52
    OurLadyofKnock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 558 ✭✭✭OurLadyofKnock


    I built a trolley for a video camera to move on rails that can fold up and be used to make moving images on closed or little known lines of various gauge with a sliding central bar for gauge changes as part of a film project. I have already done some footage on closed lines around the country and even the tramyard at Dalkey and bits of remaining 18" gauge track along the quays in Dublin and Saint James' Gate. Eventually I will have a one hour film of timelapses moving along various ghost or enigmatic rail lines.

    I am going to walk it through the PPT tunnel to get a timelapse. Can't wait now. That image has really inspired me.


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    #53
    highnc
    Registered Users Posts: 723 ✭✭✭highnc


    OurLadyofKnock wrote: »

    I am going to walk it through the PPT tunnel to get a timelapse. Can't wait now. That image has really inspired me.

    how well will your video trolley contraption stand up against a freight train or loco transfer...very bad and wreckless idea.


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    #54
    westtip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭westtip


    Nostradamus?


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    #55
    OurLadyofKnock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 558 ✭✭✭OurLadyofKnock


    highnc wrote: »
    how well will your video trolley contraption stand up against a freight train or loco transfer...very bad and wreckless idea.

    Nah. I will get off the track if a train is on it. Then get back on it again as it'll be 3 days before the next one.

    Forgive me for not getting my life insurance policy updated. It's hardly TGV surfing.


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    #56
    OurLadyofKnock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 558 ✭✭✭OurLadyofKnock


    westtip wrote: »
    Nostradamus?

    Even he could not predict when the next train through the PPT is due.


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    #57
    flyingsnail
    Registered Users Posts: 2,752 ✭✭✭flyingsnail


    OurLadyofKnock wrote: »
    Forgive me for not getting my life insurance policy updated. It's hardly TGV surfing.

    But it is illegal.


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    #58
    Transportuser09
    Registered Users Posts: 581 ✭✭✭Transportuser09


    OurLadyofKnock wrote: »
    I am going to walk it through the PPT tunnel to get a timelapse. Can't wait now. That image has really inspired me.

    Given that the PPT is used by transfer and pernament way trains which run at random and unadvertised times that would be a pretty stupid thing to do...unless you're contending for a Darwin award of course.


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    #59
    Transportuser09
    Registered Users Posts: 581 ✭✭✭Transportuser09


    OurLadyofKnock wrote: »
    Even he could not predict when the next train through the PPT is due.

    Making it all the more dangerous to go into...it's far from disused.


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    #60
    Transportuser09
    Registered Users Posts: 581 ✭✭✭Transportuser09


    corktina wrote: »
    the trouble with trespassing is YOU might know what you are doing but someone else seeing you and assuming they can do the same, may not know what they are doing. A lot of discussion on this issue in the UK railway press.Its a no-no nowadays.

    Exactly. Someone seeing that post might think the place was safe to go into. The fact that people keep saying it's not used makes the situation worse, it's not used by passenger trains but IS by other trains and at the end of the day if you get hit by a train it doesn't matter if it is passenger or not. There are no doubt also risks associated with walking on the pw itself, slip trip and fall and all that... What if someone fell (oily sleepers, uneven ballast, etc...) banged their head and unconsciously lay there for hours, unknown to anyone. The consequences don't bear thinking about.


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    #61
    OurLadyofKnock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 558 ✭✭✭OurLadyofKnock


    I have ears. I will hear the train coming.


This discussion has been closed.
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