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New Maternity Hospital for Dublin 15

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    #2
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 23,854 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    I love the way these same razzmatazz capital plans are repackaged every two or three years and presented as new, when for the most part its just rolled over money on jobs that havent been delivered.

    How long have we been waiting for the National Childrens Hospital? Or the large Mater extension? I wouldnt hold your breath on this one folks, if you are pregnant now it could be your own kids qualified as midwives working in this "new" hospital by the time it opens.

    If Leo and Joan really wanted to see about buying votes in their constituency, they could start with crime and security.


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    #3
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    I love the way these same razzmatazz capital plans are repackaged every two or three years and presented as new, when for the most part its just rolled over money on jobs that havent been delivered.

    How long have we been waiting for the National Childrens Hospital? Or the large Mater extension? I wouldnt hold your breath on this one folks, if you are pregnant now it could be your own kids qualified as midwives working in this "new" hospital by the time it opens.

    If Leo and Joan really wanted to see about buying votes in their constituency, they could start with crime and security.

    Crime and security will be a big issue alright


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    #4
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,865 ✭✭✭✭January


    This was touted around when I was pregnant on my first child 7 years ago. Don't hold your breath. It's a relocation of the rotunda not a new hospital.


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    #5
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    January wrote: »
    This was touted around when I was pregnant on my first child 7 years ago. Don't hold your breath. It's a relocation of the rotunda not a new hospital.


    it is a new hospital physically for blanch


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    #6
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,865 ✭✭✭✭January


    handlemaster wrote: »
    it is a new hospital physically for blanch

    It's physically a new hospital but the rotunda will be closing when this is opened.


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    #7
    ongarboy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,201 ✭✭✭ongarboy


    I think it's still a good news story. Today's announcement confirms actual funding for go ahead rather than being mooted/shelved/mooted as a project up to now. It also means (hopefully) that expectant mothers and their newborns will now enjoy state of the art 21st century facilities rather than what was in place in the Victorian era 19th century building that is the Rotunda.

    Access is much better too just off the M50 rather then the traipse into a congested city centre which must be quite an endurance for mothers when their waters have broken!


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    #8
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    During their reign of tenure, everything from maternity, childrens hospital, has got worse. Public, Transport, car insurance, car tax, parking, waiting lists, health insurance, childcare, school costs, school places, traffic.

    Remember that when they call to the door.


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    #9
    eviltwin
    Registered Users Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    ongarboy wrote: »
    I think it's still a good news story. Today's announcement confirms actual funding for go ahead rather than being mooted/shelved/mooted as a project up to now. It also means (hopefully) that expectant mothers and their newborns will now enjoy state of the art 21st century facilities rather than what was in place in the Victorian era 19th century building that is the Rotunda.

    Access is much better too just off the M50 rather then the traipse into a congested city centre which must be quite an endurance for mothers when their waters have broken!

    It's a vote getter. It can be shelved at any stage.


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    #10
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    beauf wrote: »
    During their reign of tenure, everything from maternity, childrens hospital, has got worse. Public, Transport, car insurance, car tax, parking, waiting lists, health insurance, childcare, school costs, school places, traffic.

    Remember that when they call to the door.

    In fairness do you not remember what they inherited from the former government


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    #11
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,865 ✭✭✭✭January


    I'm not saying this new maternity hospital is a bad thing, I'm just saying they need both this new maternity hospital AND the Rotunda to keep up with overcrowding.


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    #12
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 23,854 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    ongarboy wrote: »
    I think it's still a good news story. Today's announcement confirms actual funding for go ahead rather than being mooted/shelved/mooted as a project up to now.

    Lordy no, it confirms nothing at all until is it sitting in the coffers of a Department and tenders are issuing.

    For instance, the broadband element of this plan actually represents a REDUCTION in investment from a previously announced stand-alone plan.

    Make no mistake, this is smoke, mirrors and election bullshytery.


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    #13
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    handlemaster wrote: »
    In fairness do you not remember what they inherited from the former government

    The country was broke, the bankers and developers were broke. Now they are slightly less broke and everyone else is a little more broke. The waiting lists are longer, the bills are higher, and the taxes are higher.


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    #14
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,864 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    beauf wrote: »
    The country was broke, the bankers and developers were broke. Now they are slightly less broke and everyone else is a little more broke. The waiting lists are longer, the bills are higher, and the taxes are higher.

    Only because the previous government hadn't got around to even close to the full level of cuts they would have had to do. If you think that them (or the other lot for that matter) would have done a better job you, for starters, don't understand the importance of international perception. FF were considered incompetent internationally as well as at home and its the former that matters. Past performance is another issue - its historically been an FG/Labour coalition that's had to pull Ireland out of recessions.

    Also, if you're that much "more broke" with reduced income tax, reduced USC, higher SRCOP etc and actually fairly low tax increases you likely live in a mansion, smoke a lot and buy an awful lot. Tax increases on consumers basically consist of the LPT, VAT, alcohol duty returning to its pre-crisis level (it was cut as an incentive to spend during the crash, remember), DIRT and a hefty set of hikes on smokes.


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    #15
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    beauf wrote: »
    During their reign of tenure, everything from maternity, childrens hospital, has got worse. Public, Transport, car insurance, car tax, parking, waiting lists, health insurance, childcare, school costs, school places, traffic.

    Remember that when they call to the door.

    You left out the weather. Some of those things were out of the government's hands.

    As for car tax, mine has never been cheaper. Don't know how you can blame insurance on them either. Our health insurance has become more competitive.

    And a country in recession does not mean everyone becomes broke.


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    #16
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    L1011 wrote: »
    Only because the previous government hadn't got around to even close to the full level of cuts they would have had to do. If you think that them (or the other lot for that matter) would have done a better job you, for starters, don't understand the importance of international perception. FF were considered incompetent internationally as well as at home and its the former that matters. Past performance is another issue - its historically been an FG/Labour coalition that's had to pull Ireland out of recessions.

    Also, if you're that much "more broke" with reduced income tax, reduced USC, higher SRCOP etc and actually fairly low tax increases you likely live in a mansion, smoke a lot and buy an awful lot. Tax increases on consumers basically consist of the LPT, VAT, alcohol duty returning to its pre-crisis level (it was cut as an incentive to spend during the crash, remember), DIRT and a hefty set of hikes on smokes.

    I've no interest in having a debate about which is "worser".

    Just that in real terms during this Govt tenure (or the previous govt) very little if anything has been done, in either making it easier to access children & maternity hospitals, or the experience in them. So keep that in perspective of this announcement.

    I don't see what smoking, alcohol, mansions or where I live, has any relevance.


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    #17
    athtrasna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,420 ✭✭✭✭athtrasna


    Why do some people just want to find an excuse to slag off the government instead of celebrating what this means for our area?

    We knew the hospital was going to move out here, the expert advisory group recommended it months ago. This really is in the best interests of pregnant women and women undergoing treatment/investigations of a gynae nature. The Rotunda is old, overcrowded and in the middle of a not so great part of the city centre with next to no parking. Confirmation today that funds will be available for the move is massive and positive news!

    As someone who lives in Waterville I also see this as a chance to escape negative equity being on the horizon and as someone with local business contacts I'm delighted at what this means for the area.

    It truly is positive for so many. It also keeps our case for getting the national children's hospital out here. I still don't believe it ever will or should be built at St. James' hospital.


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    #18
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    beauf wrote: »
    l
    Just that in real terms during this Govt tenure (or the previous govt) very little if anything has been done, in either making it easier to access children & maternity hospitals, or the experience in them. So keep that in perspective of this announcement.

    I don't see what smoking, alcohol, mansions or where I live, has any relevance.

    Haven't the plans been submitted for the new childrens hospital to An Bord Pleanala? I don't agree with its location but that's a different debate.


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    #19
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    ThisRegard wrote: »
    You left out the weather. Some of those things were out of the government's hands.

    As for car tax, mine has never been cheaper. Don't know how you can blame insurance on them either. Our health insurance has become more competitive.

    And a country in recession does not mean everyone becomes broke.


    Yours being cheaper is fantastic news. Unfortunately it has no context.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057014964
    http://www.cartell.ie/2012/12/budget-2013-significant-motor-tax-increases/

    If our health insurance has got cheaper why have so many bailed out of it, and they have to force people back into it.
    The number of people paying for health insurance has risen for the first time in five years, with 36 per cent of people now holding health insurance plans, according to the 2015 Pfizer Health Index.
    The reported rise in health insurance sales coincides with the 74,000 private policies sold in April as people rushed to avoid the age-related penalties introduced under the new Lifetime Community Rating (LCR) on May 1st, 2015.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/health-insurance-customers-rise-after-launch-of-rating-regime-1.2260047


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    #20
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    My car tax being cheaper does have context, you said "we're" paying more. I, nor my wife, aren't.

    And again for my own policy, and my wife and kids with a separate company, our plans have got better due to playing insurers off each other, and even off their own plans.

    Some people are fixated on doom and gloom.


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    #21
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    ThisRegard wrote: »
    Haven't the plans been submitted for the new childrens hospital to An Bord Pleanala? I don't agree with its location but that's a different debate.

    I was suggesting, that's not a lot of help at 8.30am tomorrow, trying to get parking around Temple St.


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    #22
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    beauf wrote: »
    I was suggesting, that's not a lot of help at 8.30am tomorrow, trying to get parking around Temple St.

    They're a government, not magicians. You want to bulldoze the flats around it to build a carpark?

    I've been in the unfortunate situation of getting parking for the hospital on more than one occasion.


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    #23
    Uncle Ben
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,843 ✭✭✭Uncle Ben


    This scam has more to do with vote 1&2 for govt parties and we'll build everything, just for you and just here.

    When you do vote 1&2 for govt parties they'll say sorry, we did say all this will be built after the next election.


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    #24
    Zaph
    Registered Users, Subscribers Posts: 47,282 ✭✭✭✭Zaph


    If someone can make a tangible link between car tax and a new maternity hospital for me I'll allow the discussion, otherwise back on-topic please folks. Thanks.


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    #25
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    Zaph wrote: »
    If someone can make a tangible link between car tax and a new maternity hospital for me I'll allow the discussion, otherwise back on-topic please folks. Thanks.

    It's being used as a stick to beat the government by saying we're all paying more motor tax on one hand, which we all aren't, but on the other the maternity hospital plan is purely a vote getter to balance this out . (I'm not naive enough to believe it isn't a big part, but it was mooted a long time ago)


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    #26
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    ThisRegard wrote: »
    They're a government, not magicians. You want to bulldoze the flats around it to build a carpark?...

    Ironically they sold off a lot of the old Connolly hospital to developers.

    Now we pay for parking. Considering something like 90% of people drive to hospital, parking would seem to be important. More so if they expand the hospital.

    Bit of shame they sold all that land then.


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    #27
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    I was making a broader point about the lack of improvement to the cost of obtaining healthcare (which includes getting to it) and the experience of it when you are there. For me its not political issue. So campaigning on it by anyone, is shameful, considering the shambles they've let behind each other.


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    #28
    Rosser
    Registered Users Posts: 591 ✭✭✭Rosser


    beauf wrote: »
    Ironically they sold off a lot of the old Connolly hospital to developers.

    Now we pay for parking. Considering something like 90% of people drive to hospital, parking would seem to be important. More so if they expand the hospital.

    Bit of shame they sold all that land then.

    'They' - it's not a permanent Government, 'they' as in the present one did not sell it off but 'they' as in an earlier FF led one did but to be fair also used a fair bit for the sports campus which is a good legacy.

    Anyway great news for the area and won't be remotely surprised if James' doesn't get planning for the national children's hospital and the whole thing ends up in Blanch.


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    #29
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    By they I meant the hospital.

    I thought it was sold off to fund the building of the new hospital. There was something about it took so long to build the cost had risen so more funding was needed. Can't remember the details.


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    #30
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    When are they putting in the planning permission etc ? What year will they start ?


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    #31
    Pat Dunne
    Registered Users Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭Pat Dunne


    beauf wrote: »
    Ironically they sold off a lot of the old Connolly hospital to developers.

    Bit of shame they sold all that land then.
    To put your comments in context, the Fianna Fail / Green / PD governments under the stewartship of Bertie Ahearn and Brian Cowan where responsible for the selling off the land at Connolly Hospital.
    Also to remind you, Dublin West was represented at Ministerial level by Brian Lenihan, in both governments, from 2002 to 2007 and 2007 to 2011 inclusive.


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