Running late for work, boarded train without ticket, fined

Drimnagh Road · 24-09-2013 8:51pm #1

This morning Athy Train station was chaotic.

CIE busses parked and lots of people milling around (National Ploughing Championships). By the time my lassie got out and into the station the train to Carlow was there so she ran to catch it...otherwise she would have missed it and next one is 11am but she starts work @ 9am.

What happened only Heir Jobsworth ticket inspector checks and refuses to allow her to purchase ticket on train and promptly hands her a €100 fine.

Surely on a day like today there should be some leeway given to the commuters who use the train everyday. S

She even had lots of tickets to show that she pays.....disgraceful.

Solicitors promptly visited this afternoon and looking forward to meeting them in court.

mikemac1 · 24-09-2013 8:53pm

The solicitor will cost more then the fine

Peppa Pig · 24-09-2013 9:10pm

So she got on the train without a ticket?
The inspector was just doing his job, hardly Gestapo-like behaviour.

If the solicitor allows this to go to court then he is acting like the gestapo.

Unfortunately, she is 100% in the wrong and could be digging a deeper hole by going to court. Best of luck anyway.

ArmaniJeanss · 24-09-2013 9:47pm

Is there not a reduced cost prepaid commuter ticket she could be getting seeing as she 'uses the train everyday'.
Saves money and queueing, and stops this problem occuring again.

Hilly Bill · 24-09-2013 10:11pm

Drimnagh Road wrote: »

This morning Athy Train station was chaotic.

CIE busses parked and lots of people milling around (National Ploughing Championships). By the time my lassie got out and into the station the train to Carlow was there so she ran to catch it...otherwise she would have missed it and next one is 11am but she starts work @ 9am.

What happened only Heir Jobsworth ticket inspector checks and refuses to allow her to purchase ticket on train and promptly hands her a €100 fine.

Surely on a day like today there should be some leeway given to the commuters who use the train everyday. S

She even had lots of tickets to show that she pays.....disgraceful.

Solicitors promptly visited this afternoon and looking forward to meeting them in court.

Should have got there earlier. Its a bit OTT calling the checker Gestapo just because he was rightly doing his job.
She got on the train without a ticket and was rightly issued with a fine . Showing previous tickets means nothing, its not like in Costa coffee when you get your sixth coffee free with a stamped card.
It will cost you more taking it to court especially when you haven't a case.

dave wilson · 24-09-2013 10:23pm

There are No Gestapo on the Waterford line or any line for that matter. However there are Revenue Protection Officers working.

road_high · 24-09-2013 10:25pm

Ploughing championships was well flagged in advance and people encouraged to use public transport...surely a "daily" user of the this train in the locality of said event would know this and be at the station a little earlier just in case. Not a leg to stand on I'm afraid. Handy money for the solicitor though...

RonanM123 · 24-09-2013 10:43pm

That morning train to Carlow is stopped in Athy for around 5 minutes at least so by no means is it IE fault.

Sounds to me you cut it to close to departure to turn up!

Drimnagh Road · 24-09-2013 11:08pm

dave wilson wrote: »

There are No Gestapo on the Waterford line or any line for that matter. However there are Revenue Protection Officers working.

I think its time we bring back the "conficts of interest" thread.

TINA1984 · 25-09-2013 12:03am

Drimnagh Road wrote: »

Solicitors promptly visited this afternoon and looking forward to meeting them in court.

Get over yourself ffs, pay the fine and suck it up :rolleyes:

monument · 25-09-2013 12:09am

Drimnagh Road wrote: »

I think its time we bring back the "conficts of interest" thread.

Two things:

[1] Tone it down: Handing out a fine to somebody who took the calculated risk of boarding a train without a ticket is nowhere close to Gestapo.

[2] Regardless of who you think words for what company you are not allowed to imply or say somebody conflicts of interest -- focus on the content of the post and not the poster.

Also: Thread title changed.

NoCrackHaving · 25-09-2013 1:09am

OP, I don't really see what case you have. If/when it gets to court under what grounds could you get the fine overturned? She did not have a ticket, end of for all legal purposes.

MGWR · 25-09-2013 3:44am

This is why trains should have conductors again. But it seems like the government just wants to get people for the unaffordable "standard fare" and encourage driving instead.

ifeelill · 25-09-2013 3:56am

I was full sure you could buy the ticket on the train.

Cool_CM · 25-09-2013 4:08am

MGWR wrote: »

This is why trains should have conductors again. But it seems like the government just wants to get people for the unaffordable "standard fare" and encourage driving instead.

The main problem is that they are still using a system whereby sometimes there are conductors and sometimes there aren't. It purely depends on what line you use and who you are dealing with.

On the Sligo train if you hop on at one of the midway stations where there is no machine or the office is closed there is generally a conductor/ticket inspector who will sell you the ticket on the train.

In other situations such as getting the early train from Cork, there are certain tickets that you need to buy from the cashier as the destination is not available on the machine. Though the desks should be manned, sometimes they aren't and I have been in situations where I have been told to hop on the train and the Revenue Protection guy will 'sort me out'. I hate boarding trains without tickets based on the information that 'it'll be grand' when the guy who told me to do so will be at the station after the train leaves and the chances are that the guy who I was told would sort me out wasn't informed and I have to pay a fine instead. In this instance it was grand as I went to find the guy before the train left and was issued my ticket after he was able to verify that that the guy at the turnstile did actually say that I could buy it from him (the cashiers were technically supposed to be there so there should have been no reason why I would have been on the train without the ticket).

On other quieter Dublin to Cork services I have seen Revenue Protection men issue a ticket and say 'don't do it again love' to the attractive girl in one carriage and issue a fine to somebody in the next.

This highlights my main problem with Irish Rail: there is absolutely no consistency and they create grey areas themselves by their own actions. The answer you get depends solely on the person you are speaking to at a certain time that 5 minutes later may be contradicted by another member of staff. Either have conductors and allow people to buy tickets on the train or don't and have proper machines operating at all stations. But whatever you do, at least be fücking consistent about it!

corktina · 25-09-2013 8:50am

i thought "Revenue Protection
Men" couldn't issue tickets

the groutch · 25-09-2013 9:44am

MGWR wrote: »

This is why trains should have conductors again. But it seems like the government just wants to get people for the unaffordable "standard fare" and encourage driving instead.

they're not some sort of transport Boogeyman, they're not out to get anyone, but just wanting the transport system to run as smooth as possible within their constraints, one of which is not having the financial resources for a conductor on every train (unless you're happy to foot the bill for that with yet more fare increases)

LXFlyer · 25-09-2013 9:50am

There are two categories of staff here - a ticket checker and the Revenue Protection Unit (RPU).

The former can issue tickets, the latter do not, but issue standard fares. The former tend to work on routes where there are stations without ticket facilities while the latter operate across the network.

The basic rule is if there is a facility to purchase a ticket at the station you are boarding the train at, you must use it. Otherwise you can pay the checker or at the destination.

In the OP the facility was there, she didn't use it, and she got fined by a member of the RPU, who frankly was doing his job and shouldn't be castigated in the manner he was.

In post #15 I suspect a checker was sent on the train due to the station ticket office being unmanned.

Grolschevik · 25-09-2013 12:21pm

Cool_CM wrote: »

On other quieter Dublin to Cork services I have seen Revenue Protection men issue a ticket and say 'don't do it again love' to the attractive girl in one carriage and issue a fine to somebody in the next.

You followed him from carriage to carriage?!

Cool_CM · 25-09-2013 12:57pm

Grolschevik wrote: »

You followed him from carriage to carriage?!

Was one of the three carriage ones and I was going to the bathroom.

26-09-2013 5:50am

Just to relate my own experience a few years back.....

After a while without taking the train (rolling stock changed from the old GE hauled carriages to the new DMUs), I decided to get one so I could bring a bike home on the return leg. Get to the station as the train is there, rush through the office to catch as the door closes. Look around for the inspector, no one to be found. Eventually find out from drinks cart lady no getting ticket on the train anymore. Get off in Athlone & explain hurriedly to staff guy checking tickets my situation. He says better off sorting that in Dublin, then "you'd better get back on that train mate." Get back on train, inspector at seat. Offer money, get told "you can't buy tickets on train anymore" get fine notice. Buy single in Dublin for return journey. Sent letter explaining with single ticket, got told I'm not liable for the ticket, as I bought one in Dublin, but the fine still stands. Paid it.

Nice Botty · 26-09-2013 5:57am

Drimnagh Road wrote: »

This morning Athy Train station was chaotic.

CIE busses parked and lots of people milling around (National Ploughing Championships). By the time my lassie got out and into the station the train to Carlow was there so she ran to catch it...otherwise she would have missed it and next one is 11am but she starts work @ 9am.

What happened only Heir Jobsworth ticket inspector checks and refuses to allow her to purchase ticket on train and promptly hands her a €100 fine.

Surely on a day like today there should be some leeway given to the commuters who use the train everyday. S

She even had lots of tickets to show that she pays.....disgraceful.

Solicitors promptly visited this afternoon and looking forward to meeting them in court.

A valuable lesson for the the lazy lassie. Get there in good time. Enjoy your court date where you will also learn a valuable and costly lesson

BenShermin · 26-09-2013 8:10am

Nice Botty wrote: »

A valuable lesson for the the lazy lassie. Get there in good time. Enjoy your court date where you will also learn a valuable and costly lesson

Lovely condescending post there.

What lesson exactly will the OPs friend learn?

Is it that next time she should wear a track suit and board the train with a six pack of pish for beer and some skins. Fare evaders on the DART seem to get no hassle from the RPU folks when they do this.

Perhaps the lesson is for the OPs friend to give a fake name and address to the RPU. Plenty of fare evaders do that.

Might they teach her on how to obtain and use a fake DFSA free travel pass, that will help her avoid a fine next time!

Or maybe (most likely) she'll learn that Irish Rail don't see her as a valued customer and that she should now switch to the car or bus instead for her commute?

Nice Botty · 26-09-2013 8:15am

BenShermin wrote: »

Lovely condescending post there.

What lesson exactly will the OPs friend learn?

Is it that next time she should wear a track suit and board the train with a six pack of pish for beer and some skins. Fare evaders on the DART seem to get no hassle from the RPU folks when they do this.

Perhaps the lesson is for the OPs friend to give a fake name and address to the RPU. Plenty of fare evaders do that.

Might they teach her on how to obtain and use a fake DFSA free travel pass, that will help her avoid a fine next time!

Or maybe (most likely) she'll learn that Irish Rail don't see her as a valued customer and that she should now switch to the car or bus instead for her commute?

No. Learn that it pays to plan your trip to take account of events such as the National Ploughing Championship and impact on traffic. Learn to have enough time for the ESSENTIAL ticket buying that forms part of public travel. Learn to buy a ticket or else be fined.

n97 mini · 26-09-2013 9:23am

lxflyer wrote: »

There are two categories of staff here - a ticket checker and the Revenue Protection Unit (RPU).

The former can issue tickets, the latter do not, but issue standard fares.

There's nothing preventing someone from the RPU also selling tickets, it's just that the decision has been made that they issue fines, not tickets.

LXFlyer · 26-09-2013 9:28am

n97 mini wrote: »

There's nothing preventing someone from the RPU also selling tickets, it's just that the decision has been made that they issue fines, not tickets.

Selling tickets is not their function - their function is revenue protection and they are clearly identifiable from their badge as such.

I was clarifying that - as post #15 was suggesting they did sell tickets - and that is not the case.

foggy_lad · 26-09-2013 9:29am

n97 mini wrote: »

There's nothing preventing someone from the RPU also selling tickets, it's just that the decision has been made that they issue fines, not tickets.

That is why they're called the Revenue Procurement Unit. It would be very easy to keep a lot of customers happy and using the train by just alowing these ticket checkers to sell tickets on voard.

noodler · 26-09-2013 9:40am

What on earth is the legal argument you or a solicitor could possibly make to get out of this?

I think we all know OP that you will think better than to go down that route.

mitosis · 26-09-2013 9:41am

n97 mini wrote: »

Yes, I was pointing out there is nothing to stop them from selling tickets other than a decision has been taken by someone.

It's not that they can't, it's that the won't sell tickets.

All the signage says "Do not board without a valid ticket"

Why should there be a get-out wherein tickets are for sale on the train? If you can buy your ticket on the train, why would you buy prior to boarding? You never know, you might get lucky and not have to buy a ticket at all if the inspector doesn't get to you!

To the OP it seems harsh to be penalised, but the simple truth is there is no fault attached to IR, all would have been well if the passenger planned correctly.

Rachiee · 26-09-2013 9:55am

Sorry OP im with the majority on this one. I can understand her skipping fare so as not to miss the train. But at the end of the day she still skipped fare why should she be allowed not pay just because she usually pays and was running late. Solicitor ? Thats just silly she didnt pay the fare and got fined for fare evasion simple as.

n97 mini · 26-09-2013 11:03am

lxflyer wrote: »

And the point of all of this semantics is?

It appears to me that IE has taken a confrontational approach, and seem to prefer issuing fines to issuing tickets, in the event that a customer has no ticket, regardless of the reason.

I'm not aware of any other company that takes such a confrontational approach.

I travel on trains in Britain and NI quite a bit. I regularly meet ticket inspectors/sellers but I have yet to meet a Revenue Protection Officer.

Running late for work, boarded train without ticket, fined

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