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HSE stoops to an new low.

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  • 17-12-2012 11:19am
    #1
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭


    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/cancer-patients-are-asked-to-pay-up-front-for-chemo-3327217.html

    It is hard to believe that people are being asked to pay up front to recieve life saving chemotherapy!
    These outpatients are being asked to pay up front for chemotherapy treatment at €75 a go.
    "This is happening in Dublin and outside Dublin in other hospitals.

    "They are being asked to pay immediately. This appears to be an HSE directive sent out to all hospitals. It's not just one or two hospitals."

    How low can the Health Service Executive stoop?


«13456

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    #2
    snubbleste
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 31,117 ✭✭✭✭snubbleste


    What's the issue :confused: Completely misleading title.
    This is normal.
    If you are not covered by either medical card or health insurance, you have to pay some of the cost and the rest is subsidised by the State.


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    #3
    crusher000
    Registered Users Posts: 649 ✭✭✭crusher000


    issue will increase as more and more people can't afford private health insurance


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    #4
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    snubbleste wrote: »
    What's the issue :confused: Completely misleading title.
    This is normal.
    If you are not covered by either medical card or health insurance, you have to pay some of the cost and the rest is subsidised by the State.

    The issue is demanding payment up front, it amounts to pay us now or die!
    It was previously the case that you were billed AFTER the treatment, with so many people now in deep financial trouble it is unjustifiable that they are to be charged per treatment in advance!


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    #5
    Mr Benevolent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    €75 for a chemotherapy session sounds like a bargain tbh.


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    #6
    crusher000
    Registered Users Posts: 649 ✭✭✭crusher000


    Confab wrote: »
    €75 for a chemotherapy session sounds like a bargain tbh.
    You complete a**e


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    #7
    Sergeant
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,362 ✭✭✭Sergeant


    WileyCoyote wrote: »
    The issue is demanding payment up front, it amounts to pay us now or die!
    It was previously the case that you were billed AFTER the treatment, with so many people now in deep financial trouble it is unjustifiable that they are to be charged per treatment in advance!

    What is the huge difference between paying for it in advance, as opposed to be being billed for it afterwards? You still have to pay it.


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    #8
    snubbleste
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 31,117 ✭✭✭✭snubbleste


    WileyCoyote wrote: »
    The issue is demanding payment up front, it amounts to pay us now or die!
    It was previously the case that you were billed AFTER the treatment, with so many people now in deep financial trouble it is unjustifiable that they are to be charged per treatment in advance!
    It is completely justifiable. The client is fully aware that this is the way the system operates.
    The HSE is also in financil trouble, why should they be paying more to chase up debtors?


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    #9
    Frank Black
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,296 ✭✭✭Frank Black


    WileyCoyote wrote: »
    The issue is demanding payment up front, it amounts to pay us now or die!
    It was previously the case that you were billed AFTER the treatment, with so many people now in deep financial trouble it is unjustifiable that they are to be charged per treatment in advance!


    Do you not think this is the reason they are doing it?


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    #10
    mountai
    Registered Users Posts: 953 ✭✭✭mountai


    Sergeant wrote: »
    What is the huge difference between paying for it in advance, as opposed to be being billed for it afterwards? You still have to pay it.

    What is PRSI for then.


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    #11
    Rabies
    Registered Users Posts: 15,258 ✭✭✭✭Rabies


    Sergeant wrote: »
    What is the huge difference between paying for it in advance, as opposed to be being billed for it afterwards? You still have to pay it.

    Many people run away from bills. Was still common place before the recession. Now many people feel like they have a right to ignore bills, that is the worrying bit.


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    #12
    Mr Benevolent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    crusher000 wrote: »
    You complete a**e

    I wasn't joking. Chemo drugs are very expensive. They could charge people the full whack if they want. Why should people get free treatment if they don't have a medical card or private health insurance?


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    #13
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    Sergeant wrote: »
    What is the huge difference between paying for it in advance, as opposed to be being billed for it afterwards? You still have to pay it.
    The difference is that if you have a chemo appointment tomorrow and you don't have €75 you dont get the life saving treatment:mad:


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    #14
    Frank Black
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,296 ✭✭✭Frank Black


    mountai wrote: »
    What is PRSI for then.

    The difference between the actual cost of the treatment and the €75 the patient is charged presumably.


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    #15
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    Confab wrote: »
    I wasn't joking. Chemo drugs are very expensive. They could charge people the full whack if they want. Why should people get free treatment if they don't have a medical card or private health insurance?

    Because they may likely die without it?


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    #16
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    black francis wrote: »
    Do you not think this is the reason they are doing it?
    You think a pay now or die attitude is reasonable, fair, or even acceptable?


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    #17
    norrie rugger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,656 ✭✭✭norrie rugger


    Sergeant wrote: »
    What is the huge difference between paying for it in advance, as opposed to be being billed for it afterwards? You still have to pay it.

    Probably to do with while you are on Chemo you are out of work and have no income.
    Once/if you recover, you will have an income stream again and can start to pay down.


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    #18
    crusher000
    Registered Users Posts: 649 ✭✭✭crusher000


    So those that can pay will be saved and those that have no money will be turned away to die ?

    Health Service is the name, don't expect it for free but peoples health should take priority over all economic debt etc.


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    #19
    matrim
    Registered Users Posts: 7,517 ✭✭✭matrim


    The HSE can't win with this one.

    If they ask to pay upfront then it's a reaction similar to the OP, where people say "HSE are such money grabbing bastards, stopping people from getting threatment because they won't pay €75"

    If they don't ask for upfront payment and a bill is sent out. People don't pay the bill and the HSE have to get in some form of debt collector, "HSE are money grabbing bastards, I'm in chemo and they are stressing me out sending me bills"


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    #20
    Frank Black
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,296 ✭✭✭Frank Black


    WileyCoyote wrote: »
    You think a pay now or die attitude is reasonable, fair, or even acceptable?


    Yes, that's exactly what I believe - :rolleyes:


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    #21
    miss_shadow
    Registered Users Posts: 1,446 ✭✭✭miss_shadow


    I work in a cancer hospice. I'd hate to tell you that some of the pain relief they offer is based on how old you are and your chance of survival because of the cost of the treatment.


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    #22
    miss_shadow
    Registered Users Posts: 1,446 ✭✭✭miss_shadow


    I work in a cancer hospice. I'd hate to tell you that some of the pain relief they offer is based on how old you are and your chance of survival because of the cost of the treatment.


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    #23
    bleg
    Registered Users Posts: 5,848 ✭✭✭bleg


    miss_shadow wrote: »
    I work in a cancer hospice. I'd hate to tell you that some of the pain relief they offer is based on how old you are and your chance of survival because of the cost of the treatment.

    Basic pharmacoeconomics.


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    #24
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    matrim wrote: »
    The HSE can't win with this one.

    If they ask to pay upfront then it's a reaction similar to the OP, where people say "HSE are such money grabbing bastards, stopping people from getting threatment because they won't pay €75"

    If they don't ask for upfront payment and a bill is sent out. People don't pay the bill and the HSE have to get in some form of debt collector, "HSE are money grabbing bastards, I'm in chemo and they are stressing me out sending me bills"

    Bills were previously issued after treatment, I don't ever remember complaints.
    I mean this isn't for something minor it's for Chemo ffs!
    it is certainly concerning the Irish Cancer Society
    http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/irish-cancer-society-worried-by-chemotherapy-prices-578104.html


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    #25
    ShiverinEskimo
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 18,115 ✭✭✭✭ShiverinEskimo


    Confab wrote: »
    I wasn't joking. Chemo drugs are very expensive. They could charge people the full whack if they want. Why should people get free treatment if they don't have a medical card or private health insurance?

    Such an ignorant, obnoxious attitude even by AH standards. Only the extremely rich could afford to pay cash for Chemo. My Dad's runs at about 110 grand for the full course. That's just for the Chemo - not the other 22 drugs per day he takes to combat the side-effects of the drugs to treat the side-effects of the drugs to treat the side-effects of the chemo.

    Only the extreme minority of people receiving Chemo could afford to pay the full whack so in reality what your proposing is "The health service could just let these people die a slow, horrifyingly painful death if they want".

    It's always the healthy, employed people with disposable income that harp on about health welfare. I hope your situation never deteriorates in the same manner as those currently reliant on Chemo.


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    #26
    Einhard
    Registered Users Posts: 6,920 ✭✭✭Einhard


    WileyCoyote wrote: »
    You think a pay now or die attitude is reasonable, fair, or even acceptable?

    I seriously doubt that people would be allowed to die because they couldn't afford the €75. Just another excuse for some to wallow in indignant outrage. By the looks of things, it's the default position of a fair proportion of people here. We're becoming a nation of Victor Meldrews.


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    #27
    bleg
    Registered Users Posts: 5,848 ✭✭✭bleg


    Einhard wrote: »
    I seriously doubt that people would be allowed to die because they couldn't afford the €75. Just another excuse for some to wallow in indignant outrage. By the looks of things, it's the default position of a fair proportion of people here. We're becoming a nation of Victor Meldrews.

    I don't believe it.


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    #28
    super_furry
    Registered Users Posts: 27,322 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    WileyCoyote wrote: »
    The difference is that if you have a chemo appointment tomorrow and you don't have €75 you dont get the life saving treatment:mad:

    Has anyone been turned away?


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    #29
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    Einhard wrote: »
    I seriously doubt that people would be allowed to die because they couldn't afford the €75. Just another excuse for some to wallow in indignant outrage. By the looks of things, it's the default position of a fair proportion of people here. We're becoming a nation of Victor Meldrews.

    I don't believe it! :D

    But seriously it is causing causing concern according to the Irish Cancer Society.


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    #30
    Sergeant
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,362 ✭✭✭Sergeant


    Einhard wrote: »
    I seriously doubt that people would be allowed to die because they couldn't afford the €75. Just another excuse for some to wallow in indignant outrage. By the looks of things, it's the default position of a fair proportion of people here. We're becoming a nation of Victor Meldrews.

    Joeduffyitus.


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    #31
    Mr Benevolent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    ShiverinEskimo wrote: »
    Only the extremely rich could afford to pay cash for Chemo. My Dad's runs at about 110 grand for the full course. That's just for the Chemo - not the other 22 drugs per day he takes to combat the side-effects of the drugs to treat the side-effects of the drugs to treat the side-effects of the chemo.

    Only the extreme minority of people receiving Chemo could afford to pay the full whack so in reality what your proposing is "The health service could just let these people die a slow, horrifyingly painful death if they want".

    What? Where did I ever say any of that? All I said was that people should not expect any sort of treatment to be free. You've completely blown my post out of proportion. If your dad has PHI, a medical card or can afford the heavily subsidised €75 per treatment then he doesn't need to worry about the €110k, and the Drugs Payment Scheme, his medical card or PHI will look after most of the drugs expenses.

    The point - medical treatment will never be free, the €75 is a standard charge and was being charged well before the Indo started whining.


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