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Rural mobile phone users could lose signal
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18-06-2012 10:13am#1http://www.irishexaminer.com/archives/2012/0618/ireland/rural-mobile-phone-users-could-lose-signal-197822.html
Thousands of mobile phone users in rural Ireland could be left searching for a signal due to policy decisions made by the telecom regulator ComReg.
A proposed auction of mobile facilities next month could result in a massive decline in coverage in rural areas.
An expert engineer from one of the big mobile providers, Ericsson, has warned that the failure by ComReg to push for a universal service obligation (USO) — which would require mobile phone operators to provide coverage for the whole country — will result in an inevitable decline in coverage for rural customers.
"The USO option, unless implemented quickly, fails to deal with the threat of coverage ‘erosion’ that Ericsson has highlighted and if such a trend takes hold, ComReg will be pretty powerless to do anything about it given that the licenses will have been issued with the low coverage obligations," the engineer’s submission said.
As it stands, the new licences to be issued by ComReg will only require mobile phone operators such as Vodafone, O2, Meteor, and 3 to provide a service to 70% of the population.
Broken down into geographical coverage, it could represent just 10% of Ireland’s land area — the heavily populated East coast.
However, ComReg is hoping competition for users will drive the operators to maintain their networks in rural areas.
Successive communications ministers accepted 100% coverage was impossible. Vodafone’s original licence required 85% coverage, O2 about 80%, and Meteor 53%.
A spokesperson for the regulator said: "ComReg considered that actual coverage levels are expected to exceed this 70% population obligation, given the competitive nature of the market and the limited risk of roll-back of coverage from the existing levels."
However, within ComReg’s own consultation documents, the commission admitted that if it doesn’t force mobile phone operators to provide rural coverage, consumers will suffer.
"The end result could be that the overall level of coverage provided by the market could be much reduced from current levels. This would potentially be very damaging for consumers who would no longer have the ubiquity of mobile coverage in rural areas that they are accustomed to," ComReg said in a consultation document.
A spokesperson for lobby group Ireland Offline said: "Investment decisions will be made in the UK (Vodafone) and Spain (O2) on the basis of coverage requirements set out by Comreg.
"If the operators are not required to cover rural areas this will lead to the inevitable decline in rural coverage as the operators will see no regulatory requirement to invest in rural areas and may abandon lesser- served areas."0
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But look at all the money ComReg are generating........./sarcasm off0
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PogMoThoin wrote: »But look at all the money ComReg are generating........./sarcasm off
It's the d4 attitude all over again, culchies don't need phone coverage as dancing cows don't need netflix and sure aren't they grand they can use string and tin-cans to communicate. Of course it's all their own fault anyway0 -
http://www.siliconrepublic.com/comms/item/27803-towards-4g-what-70pc-popul
A policy decision that could result in just 70pc of Ireland’s population being covered by the next generation of 4G LTE networks could cause people in rural areas to lose basic coverage over time, a lobby group has warned.
IrelandOffline has produced a map (below) that shows the areas that will be served with the next generation of spectrum. It warns that areas outside of these locations could eventually see older 2G and 3G equipment become obsolete and as a result basic coverage will be impacted.
According to Eamon Wallace of IrelandOffline the policy decision by ComReg equates to just 12pc and 6pc of geographic coverage depending on the metric chosen.
“Thousand of mobile phone users in rural Ireland could be left without coverage due to this policy decision."
He says that had a different process been chosen called shared Radio Access Network (RAN), operators would have shared infrastructure and be in a position to deliver reasonable mobile broadband services in rural locations.
“Sweden did the process right, they set up shared RAN for the more rural parts of the country, all the operators pooled and shared the infrastructure which delivered reasonable mobile broadband in remote areas.
http://irelandoffline.org/wp-content/2012/06/70pc-Map.png
“Other countries such as the UK have either reserved a spectrum block specifically for increases in Rural Coverage in their auction or as in the case of Germany in 2010 the Regulator went further and refused to allow 4G services to go active in lucrative urban areas until rural areas with patchy coverage had been covered first. This rural extension took two years once operators were forced to accelerate rural coverage to get at the high value customers," Wallace warned.
The forthcoming 4G auctions
ComReg said in March that provided there are no further objections to a current consultation should be the final step before a date for the auctions is set.
The spectrum auctions are critical because as well as paving the way for 4G technologies like LTE that are featured in the new iPad with speeds up to 73Mbps possible, former 2G bands can be used to provide 3G coverage to greater swathes of the population.
In total, 280 MHz of sub-2 GHz spectrum (ie, 140 MHz of paired spectrum) will be made available, more than doubling the currently licensed assignments in these particular bands.
ComReg said it will be a combinatorial clock auction, meaning it allows bidders to make packaged bids over multiple rounds of bidding within a prescribed timeframe.
But what can we do with the spectrum?
Wallace says the spectrum to be auctioned this summer includes the most valuable rural spectrum at around 800mhz, formerly in use for analogue television.
“It is valuable in rural areas because it reaches a longer distance and penetrates well into buildings where people may be found, a key weakness of the 2100mhz/2600Mhz spectrum in use for 3G devices.
A simple rule of thumb to measure the throughput of radio systems is the bits per Hertz measure.
“Currently (and for the foreseeable future) the value is between 3.5 to 5 bits per Hertz. This is part of the Shannon Limit and is a physical limit, even the mobile marketing departments can't break this limit, no matter how they like to spin mobile broadband successes.
“Investment decisions will be made in Madrid (O2) and Berkshire (Vodafone), the question will be asked "what are our coverage requirements?" The answer will be 70pc population only so the investment will only go to meeting that requirement. As the 2G and 3G gear becomes ever more obsolete will it ever be replaced if the coverage requirements are not there?
“The whole process was designed to maximize revenues rather than to provide coverage to consumers," Wallace warns.
Warnings of another broadband bottleneck
Wallace's views appear to be backed up by Ericsson's submission to the the ComReg consultation on the spectrum auctions. " ComReg is proposing a 70pc population coverage obligation. Ericsson strongly believes that such a target is wholly inappropriate for the following reasons: It fails to maximize the potential economic impact that the delivery of broadband in this spectrum could achieve.
"These bands are the only bands where high levels of coverage are economically viable. It makes no logical sense for coverage conditions to be lower in these bands relative to the higher bands, e.g. 3G services that have been licensed in the 2100 MHz band. In fact if anything it should be the other way around, with more stringent coverage obligations applying in the lower bands and more relaxed coverage obligations in the higher bands.
“There is a real danger that in the longer term operators may be forced to reduce their coverage from the current 99pc+ level we currently enjoy, down to a level at or close to 70pc of the population. This is because mobile operators in Ireland could well experience difficulty in securing access to scarce capex resources given that the financial returns to be made from such investment are significantly better in higher growth markets overseas.
“Such an outcome could lead to market failure and the resulting necessity to expand the National Broadband Scheme (NBS) from its current 10pc demographic to one as high as 30pc with consequent costs to the state.
“With regard to a minimum broadband throughput, given the right licensing conditions these bands are capable of supporting average end user-speeds of between 20Mbps and 95Mbps today. In Ericsson's opinion, it makes no sense to have a minimum average user throughput less than that required by the NBS," Ericsson's submission read.
John Kennedy0 -
Can everyone please email this article to Pat Rabbitte and their local representatives as this is very very serious.
I sent emails to Pat Rabbitte, Fergus O'Dowd, Enda Kenny and the 4 TDs in Galway East, not sure who monitors the email address the sent them to but hopefully someone will take notice before this turns into a total farce.
Edit
Got one reply of but not too hopeful.
On behalf of Minister Rabbitte I acknowledge receipt of your correspondence. I’ll ensure it’s brought to his attention.0 -
Question down for written reply on this in the Dáil tomorrow from Galway West TD Seán Kyne*425. To ask the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources if he is concerned that the proposed 4G spectrum auction process which appears to cover 10% of the landmass and therefore only 70% of the population will place those citizens in rural areas at a disadvantage in terms of internet connectivity; and if he will make a statement on the matter. — Seán Kyne. [29698/12]0
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Written reply to Dáil question
425. Deputy Seán Kyne asked the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources if he is concerned that the proposed 4G spectrum auction process which appears to cover 10% of the landmass, and therefore only 70% of the population, will place those citizens in rural areas at a disadvantage in terms of internet connectivity; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29698/12]
Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources (Deputy Pat Rabbitte): The management of the radio spectrum is a statutory function of the Commission for Communications Regulation (ComReg) under the Communications Regulation Act 2002 as amended. In accordance with its statutory functions, ComReg consulted extensively on its proposals for the release of spectrum rights of use in 800 MHz, 900 MHz and 1800 MHz frequency bands.
ComReg received considerable interest in this consultation process which has resulted in the decision document for the award of a number of individual rights of use in the 800 MHz, 900 MHz and 1800 MHz radio spectrum bands (ComReg Document 12/25 and Decision 04/12 published on 16 March 2012). ComReg’s Information Memorandum for this award process details the processes and procedures ComReg is employing to implement its substantive decisions (ComReg Document 12/52 published on 25 May 2012).
The reasons, analysis and other material relied upon by ComReg in support of its decisions on the minimum coverage and roll-out requirements are set out in section 5.5 of Document 12/25. Amongst other things, ComReg considered that actual coverage levels are expected to exceed this 70% population obligation by a considerable margin, given the competitive nature of the market and the limited risk of roll-back of coverage from the existing levels. It should be noted that the four existing mobile operators have achieved coverage levels exceeding those set out in their respective licences. For example, for 3G services, Vodafone’s coverage covers 90% of the population, 5% more than its obligation. Hutchison 3G, better known as “3”, covers 96% of the population, 11% more than its obligation. O2 also covers 90.5% of the population, which is also more than its obligation
ComReg also notes that coverage continues to be an important competitive differentiator. Any deterioration in coverage by any one network would undermine that network’s attractiveness to its existing and potential customers. The importance of maintaining the existing levels of mobile telephony and mobile broadband coverage has been raised with ComReg by my officials. While the outcome of the forthcoming multi-band spectrum release process can not be anticipated I understand that ComReg are not anticipating any reduction in coverage as a result of the process. It is also important to note that ComReg’s coverage proposals are designed to facilitate the possible entry of new operators in a manner that would ensure that “cherry picking” of high-density urban areas would not occur.
http://debates.oireachtas.ie/dail/2012/06/19/00309.asp0 -
It is also important to note that ComReg’s coverage proposals are designed to facilitate the possible entry of new operators in a manner that would ensure that “cherry picking” of high-density urban areas would not occur.
what load of old twaddle...
If you make a regulation for 70% population coverage cherry picking is exactly what is going to happen0 -
Just in case anybody has any doubt as to what 70% population coverage looks like:
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Written reply to Dáil question
Just for the record.
ComReg did not provide any analysis. They relied on their own paid UK-based consultant who had less idea about Irish demographics than they did. There is no analysis.The reasons, analysis and other material relied upon by ComReg in support of its decisions on the minimum coverage and roll-out requirements are set out in section 5.5 of Document 12/25.Amongst other things, ComReg considered that actual coverage levels are expected to exceed this 70% population obligation by a considerable margin, given the competitive nature of the market and the limited risk of roll-back of coverage from the existing levels.
Once again, there was no analysis. They have played down the risk, ignored the risk, dissembled about the risk but they have not analysed or quantified the risk. They may as well have rolled a loaded dice or flipped a two-headed coin.It should be noted that the four existing mobile operators have achieved coverage levels exceeding those set out in their respective licences. For example, for 3G services, Vodafone’s coverage covers 90% of the population, 5% more than its obligation. Hutchison 3G, better known as “3”, covers 96% of the population, 11% more than its obligation. O2 also covers 90.5% of the population, which is also more than its obligation
Spot the odd one out - it seems Meteor is immune to competitive pressures. "3" has fewer base stations than any other provider and 389 of them (NBS) were subsidised and are therefore not the result of competition or competitive forces. Vodafone and O2's coverage has never been measured properly.ComReg also notes that coverage continues to be an important competitive differentiator.
All operators make claims. Advertising claims are a bust currency, ComReg know this.Any deterioration in coverage by any one network would undermine that network’s attractiveness to its existing and potential customers.
Customers will never know because they will continue to be fed advertising BS by the operators and ComReg.The importance of maintaining the existing levels of mobile telephony and mobile broadband coverage has been raised with ComReg by my officials.
One can only imagine what was said.While the outcome of the forthcoming multi-band spectrum release process can not be anticipated I understand that ComReg are not anticipating any reduction in coverage as a result of the process.
They simply do not know what will happen. The reason for giving regulators extensive powers is so we can have the coverage we want and need - with certainty. To then ignore those powers and instead carry out an experiment in free-market dogma, on the instruction of Colm McCarthy and the departments of Finance and Communications, is a hostile act directed at rural Ireland.
When a farm worker gets his arm ripped off by a tractor PTO-shaft in a remote area, and phones for help with his good one, he'll be gratified to know that ComReg were 'not anticipating' that the coverage, that could have saved his life, would disappear.It is also important to note that ComReg’s coverage proposals are designed to facilitate the possible entry of new operators in a manner that would ensure that “cherry picking” of high-density urban areas would not occur.
ComReg's coverage proposals will enable exactly the opposite and they have said so themselves.0 -
Looks like an automated replyGo raibh maith agat as teagmháil a dhéanamh le Roinn an Taoisigh.
Fuaireamar do theachtaireacht agus béimid ag déanamh athbhreithniú uirthi.
Thank you for contacting the Department of the Taoiseach.
Your message has been received and will be reviewed.
Regards,
Webmaster
Also just got this
The Taoiseach Enda Kenny T.D. thanks you for your recent e-mail.
The Taoiseach has noted the points you raised.
He has copied your correspondence to his colleague Pat Rabbitte T.D.,
Minister for Communications, Energy & Natural Resources for his
consideration.
The Taoiseach extends his very best wishes to you.
Yours sincerely,
Assistant Private Secretary
to the Taoiseach
Do TDs use their email?0 -
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Dail question on radio spectrum
The bit I thought interesting was
I would then argue that since comreg is 100% sure, including obligations in contract will not be placing any more burden on the operators. So why not? Why are they pushing back?ComReg is adamant that difficulties will not arise for a number of reasons. First, the infrastructure is in place and the masts have already been erected. There will be no roll-back on that. Second, the obligations on Vodafone, 3 and O2 in respect of 3G services were greatly exceeded. Third, mobile telephone companies are already competing to provide services and there is no question of a diminution of that competition.0 -
Comreg are deluded.
For years people don't meet obligations, or Comreg doesn't do sensible audits.
Masts in place MEANS NOTHING. LTE needs more backhaul. 800MHz needs new aerials. PAs, Duplex filters and LNAs etc. LTE needs new or extra gear generally. No-one can use their alleged LTE capable 3G gear either as they need it for 3G!0 -
Dail question on radio spectrum
The bit I thought interesting wasComReg is adamant that difficulties will not arise for a number of reasons. First, the infrastructure is in place and the masts have already been erected. There will be no roll-back on that. Second, the obligations on Vodafone, 3 and O2 in respect of 3G services were greatly exceeded. Third, mobile telephone companies are already competing to provide services and there is no question of a diminution of that competition.
I would then argue that since comreg is 100% sure, including obligations in contract will not be placing any more burden on the operators. So why not? Why are they pushing back?- Local Authority planning permissions for masts last for five years in general, so there is nothing permanent about them.
- The Long Run Average Incremental Cost (LRAIC) of a mast in a rural area is €29k per year. (€25k in Urban areas) so its an expensive business not helped by the gouging of local Authorities
- The obligations of Vodafone and O2 under their 3g licences amount to 27% and 37% of area respectively.
- 3 did not achieve its coverage by competition. It was subsidised.
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This new fangled intertube thing will never catch on
This is the typical Irish mentality it is one of the reason that I am considering leaving this country and never to return.
It is absolutely disgusting that our government and politicians after everything that has happened in this country would are still playing fire with our economic future.0 -
Can everyone please email this article to Pat Rabbitte and their local representatives as this is very very serious.
I sent emails to Pat Rabbitte, Fergus O'Dowd, Enda Kenny and the 4 TDs in Galway East, not sure who monitors the email address the sent them to but hopefully someone will take notice before this turns into a total farce.
Edit
Got one reply of but not too hopeful.
On behalf of Minister Rabbitte I acknowledge receipt of your correspondence. I’ll ensure it’s brought to his attention.
Hi funnyname
I am considering sending a group email that will include these politicians you have listed but also to include opposition such as Sinn Fein and Fianna Fail.
I will also be including the media in this email. The main reason I am sending a group email of this nature is that the receivers will see that other people have been contacted as well.
I hope that this will at least bring one person on the list to act in some manner. I am also going to include media such as radio shows and tv.
If you are sending a group email ensure that the receivers are fully aware of what is at stake here. This could potentially cost the Irish economy hundreds of billions of euros that can be generated by a smart economy. If this 70% population coverage goes ahead there will be many rural businesses that will not have access to advanced communications systems.
Also try to convey that this topic is one of the most important issue that Ireland is facing it will be even bigger than the banking scandal if this is not addressed. There is much more at stake here than people are aware of. Future automation and augmented reality technologies will require these high bandwidth capable systems as will the smart grid.0 -
football_lover wrote: »Hi funnyname
I am considering sending a group email that will include these politicians you have listed but also to include opposition such as Sinn Fein and Fianna Fail.
That's already been done and only one politician showed any interest, the rest couldn't be bothered with the economic future of the country. I suppose as long as they get their expenses they are happy...and get to play on the TV0 -
That's already been done and only one politician showed any interest, the rest couldn't be bothered with the economic future of the country. I suppose as long as they get their expenses they are happy...and get to play on the TV
Have you sent group email mails were it would be sent to several people and not just one.
The Idea of this would be to make people aware that it has been received by different people. I used to this tactic in the corporate world and found that responses and reaction are much quicker as people can see that other people have received this the mail as well.
What we need to do is make the general population aware of this as well as making people in media aware.
I do not think people understand what is at stake here we are risking the competitiveness of Ireland as a smart economy this could cost us hundreds of billions in lost exports to the Irish economy.
The SMART economy will require a fast high bandwidth wireless communications system for embedded electronics.0 -
football_lover wrote: »
The SMART economy will require a fast high bandwidth wireless communications system for embedded electronics.
Well not to play down the importance of 4G I honestly think that with an inept regulator who has designed the 4G system in Ireland to be strangled at birth, the importance of fixed line broadband is the only way we have of getting decent service throughout the country. If we could roll out electricity to every shebeen and shack in the country we can easily roll out fibre to the very same shacks. The cost would be much less than the cost of a 4G service. We've already subsidised a 3G roll out, that money would have been far better spent on providing more fibre.
Having said all that a decent 4G service is important...
4G is a road warriors thing, after all that was the design goal, it may be well designed in other countries but not here. It is not, in general, a replacement for proper broadband.
I've tried connecting up remote PLCs on 3G but it was an unmitigated disaster. 4G does address some of the issues uncovered but not all of them.0 -
Well not to play down the importance of 4G I honestly think that with an inept regulator who has designed the 4G system in Ireland to be strangled at birth, the importance of fixed line broadband is the only way we have of getting decent service throughout the country. If we could roll out electricity to every shebeen and shack in the country we can easily roll out fibre to the very same shacks. The cost would be much less than the cost of a 4G service. We've already subsidised a 3G roll out, that money would have been far better spent on providing more fibre.
Having said all that a decent 4G service is important...
4G is a road warriors thing, after all that was the design goal, it may be well designed in other countries but not here. It is not, in general, a replacement for proper broadband.
I've tried connecting up remote PLCs on 3G but it was an unmitigated disaster. 4G does address some of the issues uncovered but not all of them.
I am not disagreeing with you on importance of fixed line systems. But wireless systems would be cheaper than fixed line systems to introduce. In the long term we could build a better fixed line system but in the next 5 year 4G is the most realistic from a distribution point of view.
There is things that 4G can do from a purely physical point of view than fixed systems cannot do.
Setting up mobile data points cannot really be set up with fixed line systems. Having automated agriculture is going to need a massively distributed wireless system as are many other systems.
Augmented technologies are going to need wireless systems as opposed to fixed wire systems.
We could do a electricity based roll out like the ESB done but that will be at the expense of Wireless systems. We are addressing this issue as a nation from a top down approach. We are allowing a spectrum bandwidth structure to be dictated by special interest groups this and whole issue stinks of corruption (Maybe I am just bitter due to pass experiences of this country).
This spectrum auction is akin to our transport system or water ways it is that important to the life of this economy.
Other Successful countries have taken the complete opposite approach from Ireland why are we the only country that is doing this kind of thing. We seem to do everything the Irish way. And look what our economy is like today this issue will be even bigger as other countries will leave us behind. Everything we do in this country is going to kill SME's.0 -
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another plan to drive the country folks to move to the towns and cities, along with closing Gardai stations, post offices, all this septic tank nonsense0
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football_lover wrote: »I am not disagreeing with you on importance of fixed line systems. But wireless systems would be cheaper than fixed line systems to introduce. In the long term we could build a better fixed line system but in the next 5 year 4G is the most realistic from a distribution point of view.
The claimed performance of mobile systems is driven by marketing departments rather than real world engineering metrics.
So don't put your faith in those claimed performance figures.
IrelandOffline did a long document a few years back which compared HSPA and Fixed wireless systems and examined some of the 4G myths. I wonder if it is still available.There is things that 4G can do from a purely physical point of view than fixed systems cannot do.
Indeed that is very true...We are allowing a spectrum bandwidth structure to be dictated by special interest groups this and whole issue stinks of corruption (Maybe I am just bitter due to pass experiences of this country).
If by special interests you mean a greedy regulator then yes:)0 -
The claimed performance of mobile systems is driven by marketing departments rather than real world engineering metrics.
So don't put your faith in those claimed performance figures.
IrelandOffline did a long document a few years back which compared HSPA and Fixed wireless systems and examined some of the 4G myths. I wonder if it is still available.
Indeed that is very true...
If by special interests you mean a greedy regulator then yes:)
4G has the potential bandwidth of gbps as opposed to 3g mbps this is a matter of engineering as opposed to marketing. The providers do over inflate their capabilities.
4G is the next step in the digital evolution of communications it will allow for a greater distribution of wireless communications.
The issue is more than just the peak capabilities it also has the issue of distribution that the 70% population issue will create. Having a 5mbps bandwidth that is consistent is better than no coverage at all.
I my self am facing the dilemma with this 4G issue of having no coverage at all my 3G coverage is a joke. LTE has technical capabilities beyond 3G that could rectify the distribution issue. If 4G is only 70% coverage I will more than likely have to move out of Ireland as allot of my friends have already done. How many more people in my situation are going to leave. It only take one person with an idea out of the thousands to build a successful exporter.
I have seen the capability of distribution of 4G communications and the massive potential that it present to business both large and small. Germany is light years ahead of us they have adapted a much better strategy for 4G than we have.
If we do not make our government and politicians and academics wake up to this issue we are in for a 20 year economic up hill battle that will be locked in by communication agreements.
By special interests I do mean greedy regulators and a greedy governments that is hell bent on squeezing every drop of money it can make. I am also talking about network providers that can get away with cheaper built networks so as to maximizes short term profits. people talk about state assets being used to finance debts this will be the biggest of them all.
Communications is our biggest asset and has the potential to grow our GDP from about 160 billion (current) to 500 billion. Technologies such as 4G will enable industries such as personalized clothing via xbox kinnect styled scanning and high bandwidth communications will grow whole new industries that Irish rural SME's will miss out on.0 -
football_lover wrote: »4G has the potential bandwidth of gbps as opposed to 3g mbps this is a matter of engineering as opposed to marketing. The providers do over inflate their capabilities.
4G will be slightly better than 3G with less coverage and it will be great............as long as people don't use it as a fixed broadband substitute0 -
PogMoThoin wrote: »4G will be slightly better than 3G with less coverage and it will be great............as long as people don't use it as a fixed broadband substitute
4G is many times greater than 3G technically but coverage in Ireland will destroy it completely as a communication medium.0 -
football_lover wrote: »4G has the potential bandwidth of gbps as opposed to 3g mbps this is a matter of engineering as opposed to marketing.
Sorry but that is total nonsense and is driven by marketing not reality. Spectral efficiency will allow you to calculate the probable bandwidth for one user and one user only near the centre of the cell, the normal efficiency is about 3.5/5 bits per hertz and with 5Mhz cells you can see just how limited 4G will be in Ireland. There was talk of 20Mhz channels which would deliver more bandwidth.
They may even still be there I forget...but it's still easy to calculate the probable speed one user will get.
Also if you have no 3G signal now you will never have 4G service either again not the way Comreg have designed the auctions, remember it's 70% population coverage not 70% geographic coverage so your only hope is a fibre rollout.
Yes with unlimited bandwidth and only one user in the cell LTE will deliver reasonably high speeds.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectral_efficiency
Here's another good explanation :http://gigaom.com/2010/03/05/whats-slowing-down-verizons-lte-speeds/
Now I'm not saying that LTE is not important and what you want to do IS definitely worthwhile go ahead and IoffL will probably support you in your endeavor, email them and ask0 -
Sorry but that is total nonsense and is driven by marketing not reality. Spectral efficiency will allow you to calculate the probable bandwidth for one user and one user only near the centre of the cell, the normal efficiency is about 3.5/5 bits per hertz and with 5Mhz cells you can see just how limited 4G will be in Ireland. There was talk of 20Mhz channels which would deliver more bandwidth.
They may even still be there I forget...but it's still easy to calculate the probable speed one user will get.
Also if you have no 3G signal now you will never have 4G service either again not the way Comreg have designed the auctions, remember it's 70% population coverage not 70% geographic coverage so your only hope is a fibre rollout.
Yes with unlimited bandwidth and only one user in the cell LTE will deliver reasonably high speeds.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectral_efficiency
Now I'm not saying that LTE is not important and what you want to do IS definitely worthwhile go ahead and IoffL will probably support you in your endeavor, email them and ask
I agree with you that I will not get a a good 4G service based upon the 70 population coverage as this will cover urban areas. I zero hope of fixed line system as just to cover my area will require many millions of investment to cover a few hundred people that are well spread out. I have seen LTE in other countries and it more feasible than fixed line systems for remote areas.
This is not a technical point of the capabilities of 4G.
If you want debate the points of 4G communications systems on a scientific level I am willing to do this. If we want to be precise we can discuss LTE and not use the term 4G which has not objective definition and is a only really a general term.
It will be a few days before I can respond to you as I do not have access to any broadband and will now be entering the digital dark zone.0 -
football_lover wrote: »
If you want debate the points of 4G communications systems on a scientific level I am willing to do this. If we want to be precise we can discuss LTE and not use the term 4G which has not objective definition and is a only really a general term.
It will be a few days before I can respond to you as I do not have access to any broadband and will now be entering the digital dark zone.
Sorry to hear you are going to the twilight zone...
There's not much to debate, LTE will not deliver Gbs, even in your dreams.
Max throughput in 20Mhz channels is clear, for one user it'll be about 30Mhz, then when many users are sharing your speeds will drop away and approach zero. So much for the wonders of LTE:)
Everything else,all the wonderful speed promises, are fantasy dreamed up in marketing departments:)0 -
I got this reply from Ciaran CannonI am aware of the ongoing debate/discussion around digital coverage across rural Ireland. I am raising these matters with Minister Rabbitte and will revert to you when I receive a response.
Best wishes,
Ciaran Cannon TD
Minister for Training and Skills
None of the other TDs in my constituency got back to me.0 -
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