How can I receive Soarsat and 28.2 east with one Dish

NewHillel · 12-01-2012 1:24am

I was referring to your comment 'Wait and support your regular Satellite / TV supplier who will have a wider range of material for Freesat etc.'

You are a founding member of the ISSA, a Trade Association for Aerial and Dish Installers. Your website is referenced on their homepage and you are preparing training material for them. That means that you have an interest - and that interest should be declared. In fact it should be part of the Code of Practice for the ISSA that all members publish their affiliation when making posts aimed at the general public, in a public forum. (It's not difficult to do, Tony at Satellite.ie has lead the way.)

watty wrote: »

My interest as you well know is to protect the consumer from wasting time and money. I sell nothing. I don't retail or wholesale. I don't work for any Satellite Reseller, ISP or Broadcast company. I'm currently not doing any contracts, consultancy or training for any of those either.

None of my websites advertise anything. (My main article on Irish DTT has about 34,900 unique reads and my main Saorsat/Ka-sat article has over 25,000 unique reads (the same IP is only ever counted once, no matter how many visits). No Advertising on them.

NewHillel wrote: »

Care to declare an interest?

watty wrote: »

Onwave are a VSAT reseller/installer. (Internet by Satellite).

Wait and support your regular Satellite / TV supplier who will have a wider range of material for Freesat etc.

Since RTE has not yet launched the service it's a bad idea to commit to ordering from ANYONE yet.

A walker set box is a bad choice for Freesat.

A 2 way Disesqc switch on its own doesn't allow PVR and is poor investment.

All poor advice Ciaran999, but your first post. I hope you are not working for Onwave.

NewHillel · 12-01-2012 1:30am

Ciaran999 wrote: »

Playing with the Walker STB - WP75 SAT-HD and discovered the elusive 7 day UK FTA satellite EPG.

Setup 1) Saorsat + FTA Sattlite on the one EPG. 7 day for saorsat but only now & next on FTA satellite and no channel order.

Setup 2) Saorsat on 1 EPG & FTA satellite on a separate EPG. Swap between them with one press on 'Mode' button. 7 day EPG for Saorsat, like Saorviews. 7 day for FTA satellite. Looks like some kind of Freesat ripoff, genre, etc.

Digital teletext working on FTA Satellite but not on Saorsat, which is odd as they both use the same mheg software/driver/stuff.

I understand it is unlikely TV3 or 3e will ever go on Saorsat as it covers NI. Too many programm rights issues with UTV. RTE has all kinds of legal Island of Ireland obligations and even at that may have to blank the odd programme on saorsat. TG4 will be grand as it already is transmitted from a site near Belfast, something to do with the good Friday agreement. Anyway UTV & ITV show most of the TV3/3e stuff.

Not perfect but great progress.

Its fantastic progress, getting ever closer to a one box solution.
I'm maxed out at the moment, but I'd love to try this on a Humax. to see how it would work.

Thanks for keeping us informed.

liamtech · 12-01-2012 3:09am

Ciaran999 wrote: »

Playing with the Walker STB - WP75 SAT-HD and discovered the elusive 7 day UK FTA satellite EPG.

Setup 1) Saorsat + FTA Sattlite on the one EPG. 7 day for saorsat but only now & next on FTA satellite and no channel order.

Setup 2) Saorsat on 1 EPG & FTA satellite on a separate EPG. Swap between them with one press on 'Mode' button. 7 day EPG for Saorsat, like Saorviews. 7 day for FTA satellite. Looks like some kind of Freesat ripoff, genre, etc.

Digital teletext working on FTA Satellite but not on Saorsat, which is odd as they both use the same mheg software/driver/stuff.

I understand it is unlikely TV3 or 3e will ever go on Saorsat as it covers NI. Too many programm rights issues with UTV. RTE has all kinds of legal Island of Ireland obligations and even at that may have to blank the odd programme on saorsat. TG4 will be grand as it already is transmitted from a site near Belfast, something to do with the good Friday agreement. Anyway UTV & ITV show most of the TV3/3e stuff.

Not perfect but great progress.

So what your saying is the walker satellite box (presume its the one that appeared on Powercity a while ago) CAN get a 7 day guide for astra 28.2 ie the UK channels:eek:... WELL! :eek:

THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING!:D Role on Saorsat!

Ciaran, can you post picture of the Walker in action... specifically the UK EPG, and MHEG5 functionality... a few other general pictures of the interface would be brilliant too.... Thanks in advance. Also does it have PVR functionality?

This is a HUGE development in my humble opinion... If that box is eventually certified Saorsat ready, then saorsat users may have hit the jackpot - those of us who are using saorview obviously havent...

:mad:

perhaps Digital aertel isnt being transmitted on saorsat yet . . . can anyone confirm or deny this?

Also ciaran does the multi-screen functions of the BBCi work as they are technically MHEG5? they didnt work on the Triax st-hd537

If walker can create a 7Day EPG satellite box, then all we need is for them to create a Combi Saorview/Satelite box with the same function and WE ARE SORTED!

watty · 12-01-2012 10:22am

The text / photo / menu part of BBCi is plain MHEG5. The video via Interactive uses extra non-MHEG5 proprietary EPG information.

watty · 12-01-2012 10:36am

NewHillel wrote: »

I was referring to your comment 'Wait and support your regular Satellite / TV supplier who will have a wider range of material for Freesat etc.'

You are a founding member of the ISSA, a Trade Association for Aerial and Dish Installers. Your website is referenced on their homepage and you are preparing training material for them.

I did prepare some training material. I do support the aims of ISAA, as anyone interested in Consumer protection should.

I've never made any secret of that.

But I'm not a Member. I have paid no fee, I have no membership number and I have never received even 1c in payments for any help given or expenses incurred.

Your objection to my statement is sheer nonsense.

There is no Saorsat Service yet
We know the regular Retailers and any installer will get supplies of the required LNBF, at least 20,000 have been produced for Irish Market.
There is no point in ordering an LBNF until RTE have definitively issued a Service Commencement date
I receive no benefit whatsoever from ISAA or anyone else connected with this. I'm giving sensible consumer advice.
I have been in correspondence in the past with Onwave. They appear to be a Company committed to doing the job properly. But they are a comparatively recent (compared to Digiweb) start up solely doing Satellite Terminals. They are now trying to get into installing Saorsat too. There is no valid reason to promote them for Domestic Ka-Sat LNBFs before RTE has announced a start date for service.

Apogee · 12-01-2012 12:36pm

Ciaran999 wrote: »

7 day EPG for Saorsat, like Saorviews. 7 day for FTA satellite. Looks like some kind of Freesat ripoff, genre, etc.

This is not an advertised feature of the Walker box. Can you please post a photo? How long does it take the box to populate the sat EPG?

zg3409 · 12-01-2012 5:55pm

Ciaran999 wrote: »

I'm not climbing onto the roof for a photo.

Ciaran999
I would be interested in knowing what dish size they provided for combined Saorsat/FreeSat. Any idea of make. Also how did they mount two LNBs, which type of bracket is used. And finally any chance of a photo? Even from a distance?

Thanks in advance...

watty · 12-01-2012 7:05pm

But how do you know it's the right size dish?

Onwave are only a VSAT reseller / Tooway Installer. Their Terminal dishes and gear will be whatever Tooway supplies. They have only very recently been installing TVRO and TV/VSAT combo.

This is nothing to do with Tooway. I'm only interested in official spec of EIRP for Saorsat carrier from Eutelsat or RTENL.

The carrier spec is different for Saorsat than the downlink for Tooway, for which the dish size is NOT constrained by LNB but the transmitter power.

Also in Donegal / Kerry the Eurobird beam (if you are using Sky box or 28E channels on Eurobird) is a lot weaker than in East Coast and than Astra 2D or 1N in the West.

The preliminary information I had was a 65cm dish for Saorsat on its own. A Dual satellite feed with 19 degrees separation needs a bigger dish. However I don't really believe the 65cm. It's at odds with my calculations.

The point is that we have no assurance at all that the dish Onwave are supplying with a dual 28.2E / 9E feed is actually based on firm information from Eutelsat and RTE NL. Of course maybe Onwave are in some kind of sole privileged position and have the requisite information, but RTE isn't allowed to promote "Single" companies (hence their Saorview Installer associations list has three names). Eutelsat can't tell people what RTENL has contracted without RTENL permission.

Even though the Satellite has a rated "maximum" EIRP per beam, a client saves money by using less than maximum power. We do not know what the FEC and actual carrier power will be for the live service. Without those figures and suitable margin for rain at 20GHz any dish size is anecdotal.

watty · 12-01-2012 7:08pm

Apogee wrote: »

This is not an advertised feature of the Walker box. Can you please post a photo? How long does it take the box to populate the sat EPG?

If it's reading the actual Freesat EPG and not a licensed "Freesat HD" box they are not allowed to advertise it.

Cesium Clock · 12-01-2012 8:14pm

Hi all, will the walker box retune like a freesat box aswell as having the EPG?

zg3409 · 12-01-2012 8:25pm

watty wrote: »

But how do you know it's the right size dish?

I don't, exactly the same as I don't know what information they used to decide on the right size. Allowable rain fade is a matter of opinion, ask Sky. No harm in asking

Ciaran999 wrote: »

Saorsat Dish and LNB ...... similar size dish and similar size LNB (LNBF) as FTA satellite, freesat or Sky.

So a single KA LNB dish is only similar in size to a zone 2 sky dish. He does not give a size comparison for the dual LNB dish, (He seems to be installing two people, one person Saorsat only, the other combined Saorsat and Freesat)

watty wrote: »

Onwave are only a VSAT reseller / Tooway Installer. Their Terminal dishes and gear will be whatever Tooway supplies.

My understanding is to use a 40mm KA LNB then they are not supplying a tooway dish but rather a non tooway solid dish with dual LNB setup. I am just interested in finding out what they are using. I am using a 40cm dish but I wouldn't recommend it!

Hopefully ciaran999 can clarify

watty · 12-01-2012 9:33pm

I had surmised an 80cm for reliable dual feed 28 + 9 and 44cm for single dedicated Saorsat.

19 degrees spacing is nearly 10 degrees of main axis, so big gain loss.

We should know by the summer.

Ciaran999 · 13-01-2012 6:47pm

An interest is an interest and its not always about money, but anyway.

Rather than the form a circle approach, that can occur, I decided to make a few calls. LNB's are flying out the door at Onwave with individual orders and some satellite/aerial system installers ordering them by the dozen. Depending on volume Ka LNB circa €25, dish circa €25 and a Ku LNB + offset bracket + Diseqc switch circa €25. As mentioned previously the lot for under €80, €75.
Live in north north Donegal and have no problems with both on a 65cm dish.
Apparently, to get the thing off the ground, seeded, Eutelsat bought truck loads of TV type Ka LNB's as there are spot beams covering loads of countries, we are not alone. Onwave as the local agent/whatever are flogging them and will probably loose interest when the market starts to move by itself, it's not their game. Great to see some joined up thinking.
Dishes and boxes are obviously not viewed as a problem.

Apparently a TRIAX Saorview/Saorsat approved combi STB will be on the shelves sometime in Feb. Pick your own combination of services. Similar Walker combi STB on the shelves in late Feb/March. 7 day EPG Saoview and Saorsat, now and next FTA satellite. Will have to wait and see if this Walker box will do the Freesat emulation trick.

Even more progress, ha.

watty · 13-01-2012 9:59pm

In the Rain on all channels on 28.2E? I don't think so.
Even on Axis 65cm dish perfectly done is only just good enough for some 28E Transponders in North Donegal, in the rain.

I said months ago that at least 20,000 LNBs earmarked for Ireland. But "Truck loads" isn't enough (how do you know this for sure if you have no connection to Onwave?) if significant numbers who can get Saorview start buying before the people that can't get Saorview are sorted?

People said in Summer 2010 that there was no problem with this scheme.

I'd personally imagine Onwave do want to be permanently involved with TV installation as there is very limited market and little future for Satellite Internet, which can never ever be real broadband. When Ka-Sat was planned there was no evidence there would be LTE/4G rollouts and Fibre rollouts. Now there are. So Eutelsat after being uninterested in it for TV originally are really pushing Ka-Sat as Regional TV and Cinema distribution platform.

The ENTIRE Irish Satellite Internet capacity is only the same as one small DSL exchange or a UPC fibre cabinet and is typically 600ms to 800ms Latency, At best 30x worst than UPC and x12 to slow at best for any interactive Internet application.

n97 mini · 14-01-2012 10:16pm

pelisor2000 wrote: »

I really hope that's not the front of the house!

n97 mini · 14-01-2012 10:25pm

NewHillel wrote: »

I was referring to your comment 'Wait and support your regular Satellite / TV supplier who will have a wider range of material for Freesat etc.'

You are a founding member of the ISSA,

In fairness to Watty, while he can come across as an abrasive know-it-all, in 99.9% of cases he knows his stuff.

I opted a few years ago to buy a receiver box against his advice, and today that box is in landfill somewhere.

watty · 15-01-2012 12:32am

But I *am* an abrasive know it all.

No-one likes a "clever dick"
...
Everyone really hates a "clever dick" that's mostly right

Actually I was thinking of changing my name to Cassandra, not to explore my feminine side, but because no-one believes me till it's too late. Beware Geeks bearing gifts.

Actually sometimes I'm wrong (more often if it's not Electronics/Comms related), but I usually do admit it.

A lot of the "Abrasiveness" is total frustration at lack of any proactive support of the consumer laws. We do actually have some good regulation and law to protect consumer. But Government in the past has supported "big business" and even opposed advice of their own expert Committees to rip off the consumer and the Nation.

NewHillel · 15-01-2012 9:32pm

n97 mini wrote: »

In fairness to Watty, while he can come across as an abrasive know-it-all, in 99.9% of cases he knows his stuff.

I opted a few years ago to buy a receiver box against his advice, and today that box is in landfill somewhere.

I don't doubt for a moment he knows his technology, or his good intentions.

Ciaran999 · 16-01-2012 11:23am

So it’s ok to question peoples honesty because they don’t worship at the watty alter. Not very professional. I would suggest less PC time and more interaction with people and installations to see what actually works in the real world could be beneficial. If Onwave were a member of ISAA would a certain individual (with no interest in ISAA – NOT) have such an issue with the fact that they were, simply, first to marked with a domestic product.
Heard about Onwave and the Walker box in a pub after a funeral in Glenties, between Christmas and the new-year (a guy called Dave up from Dublin for a few days to his holiday home). Bought the kit, put it up, it works.
Obviously getting information like this is not possible and there must be some kind of divine intervention at my house as it works.

I wonder why people with good information, and there has to be lots out there, would not get involved in this information platform. Join, put up some good information and then be repeatedly insulted.
In the land of the blind the one eyed man may be king. But he is still half blind.

watty · 16-01-2012 11:49am

What is the point of being "first" when there is no service?

Perhaps other people are responsibly waiting for the Service to be
1) Confirmed as Definitely launching
2) Actual real Launch date.

There can't be "good" information till the service is really confirmed with

A Launch date for Service
Confirmed EIRP of Saorview carrier. It can be lower than tests and lower than maximum to save costs and make out-of-area reception impossible (due to East Scotland & Calais French Spot)
Resulting Recommended dish sizes for Saorsat alone and dual feed, for PROPER rain margin, from RTENL, not a VSAT reseller.
Specification of the Service. There isn't one, so while we have known since 17th July 2010 that "Saorsat" would likely need Ka-LNB, dish pointing at 9E and a DVB-S2 HD box with MHEG5, the only real "extras" since are that unofficially RTENL are happy with coverage.

Ciaran99, the ONLY extra information you have added is that Onwave are selling the LNBs already. Which isn't very responsible for a service which isn't launched, not confirmed and for which the Broadcaster has not published the Spec. Onwave can't legally know what RTENL and Eutelsat have discussed, or share that if they do know prior to RTENL making announcements.

We knew a year ago that over 20,000 LNBFs ordered for Ireland, for release to Retail and the trade, when the Service is confirmed and due to commence. Search the posts, it's all there.

Also www.saortv.info and www.techtir.ie
The only thing you appear to be "bringing to the party" is premature selling by Onwave of the LNBF.

I've had confirmation of SAME LNB before your Onwave post. But the suppliers do not want any publicity till the service date is confirmed.

You are entitled to post. I'm entitled to point out just what I did. Which is all factual.

If you have a problem the ONLY reason could be if you want Onwave to prematurely sell LNBFs.

Ciaran999 · 16-01-2012 12:34pm

I rest my case.

Apogee · 16-01-2012 2:58pm

watty wrote: »

Ciaran99, the ONLY extra information you have added is that Onwave are selling the LNBs already.

He also informed us of the manufacturer (Inverto), the technical specs (twin output, polarity switching) in addition to posting a photo and approximate price. In truth, he had provided more new information in a few posts than most other contributors combined.

watty wrote: »

I've had confirmation of SAME LNB before your Onwave post.

That's great for you but damn all use to the rest of us.

watty wrote: »

We knew a year ago that over 20,000 LNBFs ordered for Ireland, for release to Retail and the trade, when the Service is confirmed and due to commence.

We did? Since when?

NewHillel · 17-01-2012 8:42pm

Apogee wrote: »

He also informed us of the manufacturer (Inverto), the technical specs (twin output, polarity switching) in addition to posting a photo and approximate price. In truth, he had provided more new information in a few posts than most other contributors combined.

I have no vested interest in the aerial installation trade.
(I originally posted here because of my professional background and a genuine interest in this area, going back over 30 years.)
Here's how I see it...

Ciaran99 provided excellent information, which furthered our knowledge in this area. The real issue, excuse me for being cynical, appears to be that Onwave are supplying the market before some others are ready. I suspect that the plan was to have a big marketing blitz with a certain organisation being first to market with this equipment. Or, at the very least, having trained all their installers. We would then see another 'Rogue Installer' thread, along the lines of 'The Rogue Installer is not trained to install Saorsat'...

Maybe I'm wrong, but to my eyes, there is a clear attempt to stifle independent voices, and potential, non-trade, supply chains. This applies not only to this thread, but to alternative sources of receiver. Hence the ongoing attacks on non-Saorview and non-Freesat equipment. In many cases these are perfectly adequate solutions, that can be purchased and installed at low cost. /Rant.

I would have no hesitation buying the Onwave equipment, had I the time, and inclination, to install same. With 20,000 of the LNBF's ordered for Ireland, there's very little chance of anyone being caught out. Very worst case would be a new dish.

Apogee · 17-01-2012 8:59pm

NewHillel wrote: »

I suspect that the plan was to have a big marketing blitz with a certain organisation being first to market with this equipment. Or, at the very least, having trained all their installers.

I've seen nothing which supports this.

NewHillel · 18-01-2012 12:16am

We know that training is planned, it is reasonable that it would cover Saorsat.
(Particularly given the stated knowledge about LNBs.)
There is the concern that "the domestic LNBs are not meant to be on sale yet."
There is the anti-Onwave rhetoric.
There's the "Wait and support your regular Satellite / TV supplier".

Maybe the marketing blitz is a little bit over the top...

Apogee wrote: »

I've seen nothing which supports this.

Originally Posted by NewHillel
I suspect that the plan was to have a big marketing blitz with a certain organisation being first to market with this equipment. Or, at the very least, having trained all their installers

Premier · 19-01-2012 4:11pm

Apparently a TRIAX Saorview/Saorsat approved combi STB will be on the shelves sometime in Feb. Pick your own combination of services. Similar Walker combi STB on the shelves in late Feb/March. 7 day EPG Saoview and Saorsat, now and next FTA satellite. Will have to wait and see if this Walker box will do the Freesat emulation trick.

Even more progress, ha.[/QUOTE]

I heard this info as well, From supplier was also informed that triax could also be supplying the lnb's with the receivers maybe as a pack saorsat receiver incl lnb?

Cesium Clock · 19-01-2012 10:07pm

NewHillel wrote: »

I have no vested interest in the aerial installation trade.
(I originally posted here because of my professional background and a genuine interest in this area, going back over 30 years.)
Here's how I see it...

Ciaran99 provided excellent information, which furthered our knowledge in this area. The real issue, excuse me for being cynical, appears to be that Onwave are supplying the market before some others are ready. I suspect that the plan was to have a big marketing blitz with a certain organisation being first to market with this equipment. Or, at the very least, having trained all their installers. We would then see another 'Rogue Installer' thread, along the lines of 'The Rogue Installer is not trained to install Saorsat'...

Maybe I'm wrong, but to my eyes, there is a clear attempt to stifle independent voices, and potential, non-trade, supply chains. This applies not only to this thread, but to alternative sources of receiver. Hence the ongoing attacks on non-Saorview and non-Freesat equipment. In many cases these are perfectly adequate solutions, that can be purchased and installed at low cost. /Rant.

I would have no hesitation buying the Onwave equipment, had I the time, and inclination, to install same. With 20,000 of the LNBF's ordered for Ireland, there's very little chance of anyone being caught out. Very worst case would be a new dish.

From Queries for Saorview [was Saorview has joined Boards.ie] post 197

"Testing of the satellite is ongoing. At this point our tests to date look very positive. Until our testing is complete, it would be misleading to give definitive details. Should our remaining tests prove successful we will make all relevant details available well in advance of analogue switch off.

Regards,

SAORVIEW Brian. "

10 thanks for the above post including 'New Hillel'

NewHillel · 25-01-2012 11:13pm

watty wrote: »

Onwave are a VSAT reseller/installer. (Internet by Satellite).

Wait and support your regular Satellite / TV supplier who will have a wider range of material for Freesat etc.

I see that the ISAA have just put a Saorsat video up.
I guess it's all right for consumers to start thinking about Saorsat, now? :cool:

watty · 26-01-2012 1:22am

RTE should be making an announcement in a few weeks. I'd wait and see what they say. However the service is going ahead.

There is as yet no service. RTE will be announcing the service start date soon. This is a major step forward from them being "coy" about it there was going to be a service at all. You'd want a Dual feed with 28E and the UK version of TV3 though.

zg3409 · 09-02-2012 2:43am

Back to topic...

I have been looking at the options for combined Saorsat and Freesat on the one dish. My main problem/interest is mounting two LNBs on the one dish.

One of the issues I believe will be the strength of the arm if extended from focal point out 20 degrees and say an octo freesat LNB is fitted.

I know the size of dish recommended for Saorsat is not confirmed but I am assuming it is going to be the prime focus of an 80cm dish. The gain of an 80cm dish is approx 37.1dB at 11.7Ghz (Triax TD78).

I would encourage people to WAIT before purchasing dishes until we know for certain.

I have been considering what size dish is needed for Freesat at it seems to be 60cm prime focus for most of Ireland (except for extreme south west) as far as I understand.

So making the above assumptions I did the sums on mounting a bracket on an 80cm dish 20 degrees off centre, for Freesat. My Maths says it's not a good enough signal.

I also considered larger dishes, multifocus dishes (like the Wavefrontier, "Triax unique", Maximum e85 Multifocus Dish).

I considered strength of the mounting/arm/bracket along with dish gain at focal, -20 degrees, and both saorsat and freesat mounted 10 degrees each side of focal point.

My aim:
37.1dB gain for 9 East Saorsat (at 11.7Ghz)
35.8dB gain for 28.2 Freesat

Strong mounting etc, size, cost

I based most of my sums on this document
http://www.catec.ro/catalog/Triax%20TD%20Unique.pdf

and standard dish gains:
54cm 34.2
64cm 35.8
78cm 37.1
88cm 38.8
110cm 40.2

It suggests when 20 degrees off prime focus an 80cm dish is down by -4.5dB, so the Freesat will see a dish of equivalent of 37.1 - 4.5 = 32.6dB = smaller than 54cm dish which is no good.

We could start to mount the Saorsat LNB off focus on an 80cm dish but so far we don't know if this is too weak.

So say we go for a 88cm dish and put Ka in prime and Freesat offset -20. Freesat gets 38.8 -4.5 (approx) = 34.3 = 54cm (slightly too small)

So say we go for a 88cm dish and put Ka in offset to one side by 10 degrees and Freesat offset 10. Freesat gets 38.8 -1 (approx) = 37.8 = 80cm (strong) Saorsat also gets an equivalent of 80cm dish. So it looks as if an ordinary 88cm dish with both LNBs half offset is good enough for most places.

Now having read the triax TD multibar installation manual
"Please note that the total weight of the Multiblock with LNBs must not exceed 1.1 kgs." It seems as if this is not ideal for lots, and lots of LNBs and might be fiddly to set up. It also adds about 20 euro to the total price of dish +bracket.

Next up is the triax unique. This claims a equivalent dish size of 88cm over a 30 degree arc. The mounting seems a lot stronger and each LNB can be moved independantly which is important for more than two LNB setups. However this dish is much larger than an 88cm dish being 100 x 111 cm. It is also relatively expensive and not in stock most places.

The Maximum e85 Multifocus Dish was for sale from one supplier at under 100 euro retail. It's looks a bit weaker than the "triax unique" but it is specially designed for multi LNB unlike say the TD88. It gives the equivant of an 80cm across a 30 degree arc (works up to 50)so it will work fine. Its size is 75 x 90 cm so around the same as a TD88. It also has the option of 3° / 4,3° spaced LNB holder for close sats.

I'm going to dismiss the Wavefrontier due to size, looks and cost. It is more a hobbiest dish, for very closely spaced satellites. It will work though.

I don't know how any of these dishes are for strength/corrosion resistance.

In summary, wait for the moment, but if a 80cm prime focus dish is recommended for Saorsat then my sums say an 88cm is needed for combined Saorsat and Freesat.

Comments please