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Enda's And Richard's Support

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    #32
    fayer
    Registered Users Posts: 913 ✭✭✭fayer


    The walls are closing in...

    From RTE
    Charlie Flanagan to vote against Enda Kenny

    Fine Gael's Justice Spokesman Charlie Flanagan has indicated that he will vote against Enda Kenny in tomorrow's confidence vote.

    It is understood Deputy Flanagan informed Mr Kenny of this decision this afternoon.

    Deputy Flanagan told RTÉ News he would not make any public comment on his decision and expressed the hope that the party could move forward in a united way after tomorrow's meeting.

    T.W.H Byron Beat me to it.....


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    #33
    Eliot Rosewater
    Registered Users Posts: 3,745 ✭✭✭Eliot Rosewater


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Perhaps something in that direction. Even if Bruton takes over FG as it is, would this mean a swing toward more liberal policies? In the long term all the auld ones will eventually be gone!! After watching the PDs programme last night I don't fancy the emergence of a new liberal party. Perhaps the best tactic would be to try to lobby for change within FG, as you've said before.


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    #34
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Eliot Rosewater wrote: »
    It's interesting to see all the MEPs supporting Kenny. Is this because they're a bit immune from Irish politics, and are voting only with stability in mind, as opposed to TDs, who probably have serious concerns with the fate of their own Dail positions under Kenny's "weak" leadership?
    See'ing them on the news yesterday with Máiread McGuinnes nodding like a banshee,it's more of this misguided loyalty syndrome...

    There is a reason why people vote in droves for the opposition even if it is a weak one at co council level and at MEP level.
    It's to deliver the punishment message to the sitting government.

    HOWEVER - that only transfers to the main opposition party in Dáil elections when their leader is seen as a credible Taoiseach and kenny isn't.
    So it ends up going to the four winds instead and FG lose out on the most important gain-Dáil seats.

    The longer it is taking for kenny and his cohorts not to see the writing on the wall or wake up to peoples perceptions of him by resigning now before tomorrow,the worse it is.


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    #35
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    fayer wrote: »
    The walls are closing in...
    ...Or afore mentioned "undercurrent" starting to emerge and show/say how they really feel.

    Enda might be indeed walking on quicksand and he can't see it.


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    #36
    gandalf
    Registered Users Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    Well thats the writing on the wall for Enda with the majority of the Shadow Front Bench on RB's side. I have a feeling he will be announcing his standing down from the leader position later on tonight.


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    #37
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    Fine Gael's Justice Spokesman Charlie Flanagan has indicated that he will vote against Enda Kenny in tomorrow's confidence vote...
    ...He is the eleventh member of the 19-member front bench nominated by Mr Kenny who has publicly said he has lost confidence in the leadership.
    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0616/finegael.html

    11 out of 19 is not a good indication of things going well for Enda at all.


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    #38
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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    #39
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    gandalf wrote: »
    Well thats the writing on the wall for Enda with the majority of the Shadow Front Bench on RB's side. I have a feeling he will be announcing his standing down from the leader position later on tonight.
    I'd say he'll go all the way to the vote despite the folly.
    He wants to see how close it is,even though thats just stupid.
    The pragnatic thing to do for the good of the party would be to step down.
    He's taking it personally now as are some of his cabaal.

    They should be held up as traitors and the self interested buffoons that they are.


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    #40
    Laminations
    Registered Users Posts: 4,693 ✭✭✭Laminations


    Enda Kenny expresses confidence ahead of tomorrow’s Motion

    Please Enda dont drag it to a vote


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    #41
    gandalf
    Registered Users Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    Word leaking out that he has resigned.


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    #42
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    gandalf wrote: »
    Word leaking out that he has resigned.
    Well his handlers sent a text message to matt cooper saying Things are going so well for enda now that he won't have time to be on the show today,hes busy maximising tomorrows vote by talking to people.

    I kid you not-that was on the last word just now...


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    #43
    gandalf
    Registered Users Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Well his handlers sent a text message to matt cooper saying Things are going so well for enda now that he won't have time to be on the show today,hes busy maximising tomorrows vote by talking to people.

    I kid you not-that was on the last word just now...


    There must be a lot of buckets of sand at FG's headquarters cause a lot of them appear to have their heads firmly buried in them !!


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    #44
    Eliot Rosewater
    Registered Users Posts: 3,745 ✭✭✭Eliot Rosewater


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Well, the Progressive Democrats was carved out of other parties. I don't see the kind of dissatisfaction within political circles nowadays that was present back then. I can't imagine any group of current TDs jumping ship to set up a new shop.

    I'm not sure if a brand new party without any of the current stock would be a success, either. I may be totally wrong, of course, and my analysis is probably affected by my tendency to take a negative approach to Irish politics!

    Do you envisage it?


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    #45
    thebman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,012 ✭✭✭✭thebman


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Yeah I haven't seen it mentioned yet but the PD's actually put forward an economic policy and proposals for a budget that were rejected by FF just before we started down this property bubble road.

    I would like to know what was in them TBH. It kind of shows the policies that got us into this mess are almost entirely FF's.


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    #46
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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    #47
    Sulmac
    Registered Users Posts: 1,021 ✭✭✭Sulmac


    It'd be great to see FG endorse more socially liberal policies under Bruton, it has to be said. As someone mentioned before, Kenny is too centrist and afraid to "rock the boat" on many issues.

    The meeting gets under way at 11:30 tomorrow, according to RTÉ News.


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    #48
    Wide Road
    Closed Accounts Posts: 412 ✭✭Wide Road


    Rather than answer to parties that don't exist anymore,I decided to remain calm. READ the text.it's Enda v Richard. it's simple. Two fg td's, fighting it out for one thing, POWER. One reason and one only, POWER. don't believe anything else. John Bruton Endas brother refused to talk to DL before a general election, yet formed a govt with no mandate shortly afterwards with who, go one guess, DL. Why, one word POWER. If you doubt me, check out his brother Richard.


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    #49
    nkay1985
    Registered Users Posts: 6,975 ✭✭✭nkay1985


    I think the writing is on the wall for Enda, whether he wins the vote today or not. He couldn't possibly carry on as leader of FG after this. The vast majority of the bright, young front-benchers have sided with Bruton. These are the people that have drawn voters back to FG - Varadkar etc. If I was a FG member and it was a choice between having Kenny as leader or having all these people on my front bench I know which I'd be choosing.

    I've made my feelings on Enda and the FG leadership problem very well-known, most recently here, here and here. I really we come out of this with Bruton leading FG and that they manage to heal the wounds quickly for the good of all of us! If that happens and there aren't some major policies that I disagree with then FG will be getting a high preference from me.


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    #50
    femur61
    Registered Users Posts: 1,588 ✭✭✭femur61


    Enda should listen to the public not a few farmers in his party. I'm from rural Ireland and he makes me cringe sometimes especially when he was on The Late Late show.


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    #51
    PeterIanStaker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,072 ✭✭✭PeterIanStaker


    According to Fianna Fail TV , I mean RTE, both sides claiming a majority.

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0617/finegael.html

    70 people are eligible to vote, wonder will there be any undecided or are they very polarised?


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    #52
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    femur61 wrote: »
    Enda should listen to the public not a few farmers in his party. I'm from rural Ireland and he makes me cringe sometimes especially when he was on The Late Late show.
    Agreed.Except Mick Darcy who was very good on morning Ireland in support of Bruton this morning is a farmer and from a very rural part of north wexford.

    The question today should be do you want someone competent at the helm or someone like kenny who had to be prompted by a minder/handler sitting beside him,when answering questions on the banking reports on the news at one last week....

    The fact that some fg gombeens are blindly loyally following kenny just shows how out of touch they are and what a gombeen they want running the country.
    The public see through that now which is why Kenny should resign now in the realization that his skills extended to lovey dovey country meetings amongst the faithfull but a credible competent Taoiseach he could never make as the skills for that job he doesn't have.

    Bruton does!


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    #53
    Polynomial
    Registered Users Posts: 31 ✭Polynomial


    Deleted User wrote: »
    a credible competent Taoiseach he could never make as the skills for that job he doesn't have.

    Bruton does!

    "...Bruton does"
    They said exactly the same about Noonan


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    #54
    Sleepy
    Registered Users Posts: 24,176 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    I still think people are overly harsh on Kenny. He's a good organiser, good face to face (even people I know who are staunch supporters of other parties say this when they meet him), had the sense to surround himself with talent rather than those who were loyal to him (i.e. the polar opposite of the current cabinet) and brought Fine Gael from being a party I (incorrectly) considered a mouthpiece for a vested interest group to a party proposing sensible economic measures to deal with our current economic situation, first steps towards a better electoral system and generally seemed like a more capable set of hands to have on the levers of power than his counterpart in Government.

    His failing is that he's not slick, not good in front of a camera / microphone and rather than just be himself and be honest about that, he tried to improve himself in this area on a very public stage. The fact that the Irish electorate holds this against him is more our failing than his, imho.

    All that said, I think he should be stepping aside. Even if he defeats the coup, he can never hope to bring the party to a majority in the Dail when so many of the electorate won't vote FG with him at the helm. As I've already said, I see this as our failing rather than his, but if he wants what's best for Ireland (and in my view and presumably his, a majority FG government is the best thing realistically on offer in the next election) he should step down and offer his talents in re-uniting the party to it's next leader.


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    #55
    enda1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭enda1


    Here's a mad idea...

    FG split, with Bruton taking along a good number of people, maybe 30/40%
    Harney joins them and they become a major force in Irish politics.

    What're the chances I wonder?


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    #56
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,978 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    This could be very messy at best the margin for victory will be about 6-8 and could be well be far less. The best that can be hoped for is Kenny defeat then a re-energising election campaign that puts some lead in Fine Gaels pencil for the Autumn.


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    #57
    Judgement Day
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    enda1 wrote: »
    Here's a mad idea...

    FG split, with Bruton taking along a good number of people, maybe 30/40%
    Harney joins them and they become a major force in Irish politics.

    What're the chances I wonder?

    Better still they all disappear into oblivion. :D


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    #58
    Raiser
    Registered Users Posts: 4,929 ✭✭✭Raiser


    Fine Gael spent year after year booing and feigning disgust at their Political Foes, waiting patiently, biding their time for an opportunity to strike.

    - When it came they were not found wanting of action, action borne out of lust for power, greed and the desire for self-promotion as they threw themselves in a frenzied mob at each others throats.


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    #59
    Mikefitzs
    Registered Users Posts: 316 ✭✭Mikefitzs


    enda1 wrote: »
    Here's a mad idea...

    FG split, with Bruton taking along a good number of people, maybe 30/40%
    Harney joins them and they become a major force in Irish politics.

    What're the chances I wonder?

    How in the name of all that is sacred would Mary Harney be beneficail to any political party in Ireland after all that she has NOT done with our healt care system.
    If she joined Bruton Gael no sane person should give them a vote.

    Just a passenger



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    #60
    Eliot Rosewater
    Registered Users Posts: 3,745 ✭✭✭Eliot Rosewater


    Does anyone know what time the vote is on?


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    #61
    Byron85
    Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭Byron85


    Eliot Rosewater wrote: »
    Does anyone know what time the vote is on?

    Around 11.30 I think.


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