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Bóthar na dTreabh speed limit change to save commuters 54 seconds

  • 07-12-2018 12:27pm
    #1
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭


    Bóthar na dTreabh speed limit set to be increased to 80km/h

    https://connachttribune.ie/bothar-na-dtreabh-speed-limit-set-to-be-increased-to-80km-h-009/

    The section of BnT being talked about is between the Tuam Rd and the Kirwan RAB.

    Rounding the distance to 2km

    2km @ 50kmph = 2:24
    2km @ 60kmph = 2:00
    2km @ 80kmph = 1:30

    You are talking about gaining 54 seconds on a stretch of road where, at either end, you are usually forced to wait a min or two (best case) anyway due to the lights on one end and the RAB on the other.

    54 seconds


«1

Comments

  • #2
    98q76e12hrflnk
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,204 ✭✭✭98q76e12hrflnk


    Thank ****


  • #3
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    If they changed it to 200kmh I would save 2 minutes


  • #4
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    About time. Makes perfect sense. Most people travel at that speed on that stretch anyway


  • #5
    xckjoo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,344 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    Not a believer in faster = better but I don't mind this one. Don't think it's going to make much of a difference to the speeds cars go on the road anyway as most people already exceed the 50kmph limit.


  • #6
    what_traffic
    Registered Users Posts: 4,867 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    biko wrote: »
    If they changed it to 200kmh I would save 2 minutes

    If they changed it to Mach 1, you would be flying it.


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  • #7
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,230 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    biko wrote: »
    If they changed it to 200kmh I would save 2 minutes

    Should change all speed limits to lightspeed. We could all arrive before we left. Sure, we’d get loads done!


  • #8
    what_traffic
    Registered Users Posts: 4,867 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Bóthar na dTreabh speed limit set to be increased to 80km/h

    https://connachttribune.ie/bothar-na-dtreabh-speed-limit-set-to-be-increased-to-80km-h-009/

    The section of BnT being talked about is between the Tuam Rd and the Kirwan RAB.
    Why has it been 50kmph all this time?
    No central median?
    Or
    No Hard Shoulder?
    Or
    Footpath/Cycle Path?


  • #9
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,121 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    what_traffic wrote: »
    Why has it been 50kmph all this time?
    No central median?
    Or
    No Hard Shoulder?
    Or
    Footpath/Cycle Path?
    That is the general urban speed limit + no central median + an entrance to a housing estate at one end


  • #10
    xckjoo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,344 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    what_traffic wrote: »
    Why has it been 50kmph all this time?
    No central median?
    Or
    No Hard Shoulder?
    Or
    Footpath/Cycle Path?


    The 100m long road where I grew up has a speed limit of 80kmph. You'd be well pressed to get up that fast and back to zero before ending up in the field at the end :pac:


  • #11
    topcat77
    Registered Users Posts: 744 ✭✭✭topcat77


    There is a speed limit of 80km on upper ballymoneen road just after the entrance to Drisin. There still is Sli Gheal (194 units) , Maigh Burca (12 units) , Radharc na Fharraige (31 units), Fana Bui (41 units) and Ard cre (14 units) all exiting directly onto this road. Crazy planning!


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  • #12
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,121 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    topcat77 wrote: »
    There is a speed limit of 80km on upper ballymoneen road just after the entrance to Drisin. There still is Sli Gheal (194 units) , Maigh Burca (12 units) , Radharc na Fharraige (31 units), Fana Bui (41 units) and Ard cre (14 units) all exiting directly onto this road. Crazy planning!
    That road was listed as not being subject to the general urban speed limit in 1987 as they presumably weren't there at the time.

    S.I. No. 273/1987 - Road Traffic (Speed Limits) (County Borough of Galway and County of Galway) Regulations, 1987.


  • #13
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    How long has this taken, most sensible thing that’s been done on Galway roads in years I never paid any heed to the limit anyway bar the spot where you slow to check for guards. Only issue is I’d raise it to 100kmh.


  • #14
    what_traffic
    Registered Users Posts: 4,867 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    Deleted User wrote: »
    You are talking about gaining 54 seconds on a stretch of road where, at either end, you are usually forced to wait a min or two (best case) anyway due to the lights on one end and the RAB on the other.

    54 seconds

    Won't be a RAB for much longer so the logic is even harder to explain.
    https://connachttribune.ie/cpo%E2%80%88details-revealed-as-new-kirwan-junction-plan-proceeds-220/


  • #15
    Zzippy
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,166 Mod ✭✭✭✭Zzippy


    Raelynn Happy Couch wrote: »
    How long has this taken, most sensible thing that’s been done on Galway roads in years I never paid any heed to the limit anyway bar the spot where you slow to check for guards. Only issue is I’d raise it to 100kmh.



    Well, I'm shocked. Shocked I tell you! I never saw this coming from you... :pac:


  • #16
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Zzippy wrote: »
    Well, I'm shocked. Shocked I tell you! I never saw this coming from you... :pac:

    I think my record on the road is 180kmh very late one night :D :pac:


  • #17
    Bredabe
    Registered Users Posts: 4,001 ✭✭✭Bredabe


    Where is this road?


  • #18
    flazio
    Registered Users Posts: 12,799 ✭✭✭✭flazio


    Bredabe wrote: »
    Where is this road?

    Between the Tuam Road junction and the Headford road roundabout.


  • #19
    dastardly00
    Registered Users Posts: 13,304 ✭✭✭✭dastardly00


    Raelynn Happy Couch wrote: »
    I think my record on the road is 180kmh very late one night :D :pac:

    Are you hoping to get a pat on the back from posters or a Helen Lovejoy 'won't somebody please think of the children' type reaction... Or what's the point of your post? :confused:


  • #20
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,666 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    what_traffic wrote: »
    Won't be a RAB for much longer so the logic is even harder to explain.
    https://connachttribune.ie/cpo%E2%80%88details-revealed-as-new-kirwan-junction-plan-proceeds-220/

    The logic is pretty clear: the road is clearly safe for a speed greater than 50km/h in good weather conditions. And so almost every motorised vehicle travels at faster than the current limit. If anything, travelling at the limit would actually cause more of a safety issue that travelling a little faster - say up to about 70km/h.

    By raising the limit, the guards have a clear incentive to target the drivers whose behaviour is actually dangerous (yes Nox, I mean you!), rather than getting to choose from any number who are not really behaving dangerously.

    Too-low limits also reduce respect for the law overall: if it's only sensible to speed here, then there's less of a taboo about doing it elsewhere too.


  • #21
    Ruhanna
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭Ruhanna


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Bóthar na dTreabh speed limit set to be increased to 80km/h

    https://connachttribune.ie/bothar-na-dtreabh-speed-limit-set-to-be-increased-to-80km-h-009/

    The section of BnT being talked about is between the Tuam Rd and the Kirwan RAB.

    Rounding the distance to 2km

    2km @ 50kmph = 2:24
    2km @ 60kmph = 2:00
    2km @ 80kmph = 1:30

    You are talking about gaining 54 seconds on a stretch of road where, at either end, you are usually forced to wait a min or two (best case) anyway due to the lights on one end and the RAB on the other.

    54 seconds


    More evidence that the Council is lying through its teeth about transport planning and traffic management in Galway.

    If the N6 Bothar na dTreabh is congested, as they claim, then strict speed control is required, in order to manage junctions more safely and effectively.

    Of course they have never attempted to control speed on the N6.

    If the N6 is not congested as claimed, which the lack of speeding controls suggests, then their claim that the expansion of road space is the only solution to traffic congestion is clearly false.

    Deleted User wrote: »
    About time. Makes perfect sense. Most people travel at that speed on that stretch anyway

    Utterly wrong.

    Exceeding the speed limit is not sensible. Changing a rule just because lots of people break it is not a rational way to implement public policy.


    And here's an example of why changing the rule to suit people breaking the rule is indefensible. Self-confessed speed merchant (not to mention using a mobile phone in traffic) boasts of exceeding the 50 km/h speed limit by a huge margin:
    Raelynn Happy Couch wrote: »
    How long has this taken, most sensible thing that’s been done on Galway roads in years I never paid any heed to the limit anyway bar the spot where you slow to check for guards. Only issue is I’d raise it to 100kmh.
    Raelynn Happy Couch wrote: »
    I think my record on the road is 180kmh very late one night :D :pac:


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  • #22
    Ruhanna
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭Ruhanna


    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    The logic is pretty clear: the road is clearly safe for a speed greater than 50km/h in good weather conditions. And so almost every motorised vehicle travels at faster than the current limit. If anything, travelling at the limit would actually cause more of a safety issue that travelling a little faster - say up to about 70km/h.

    By raising the limit, the guards have a clear incentive to target the drivers whose behaviour is actually dangerous (yes Nox, I mean you!), rather than getting to choose from any number who are not really behaving dangerously.

    Too-low limits also reduce respect for the law overall: if it's only sensible to speed here, then there's less of a taboo about doing it elsewhere too.


    Lots of anecdata and assumptions there.

    There have been serious crashes, a few of them fatal, on the N6 Bothar na dTreabh. The design is pretty much the same along its entire length.

    The critical factor in fatal and serious crashes is speed. There is absolutely no evidence that driving at the speed limit on a 50 km/h road is more dangerous than exceeding the speed limit.

    There's no evidence to support the "respect for the law overall" argument either. What's lacking is enforcement. When drivers fear that they are going to receive fines, penalty points, higher insurance premiums and a possible driving ban, they suddenly feel "respect" for the speed limit, and they won't do it again.

    There are very good reasons for having a 50 km/h speed limit on that road. One key reason is the relationship between junction capacity and traffic speed.

    Galway City Council is claiming, in its sales pitch for a new ring road, that Volume To Capacity Ratios at key junctions on the N6 are over the critical level of 0.85 (85%) or even as high as 115%. Yet Transport Infrastructure Ireland says that "flow to capacity ratio (RFC) of not greater than 75% is generally required when considering carriageways with design speeds of greater than 60 km/h".

    Galway City Council, and indeed the TII, can't have it both ways. They cannot claim that current traffic volumes and junction capacity issues are so great that a new ring road has been urgently required for the past quarter century, and yet junctions on the same route are so free-flowing that an 80 km/h speed limit is justified. Both can't be true, so one of them is a fib. Which one is it?


  • #23
    flazio
    Registered Users Posts: 12,799 ✭✭✭✭flazio


    Well, what I suggest in addition to the increased speed limit is some form of partition between the inbound and outbound lanes, be that a line of reflective poles, or a wire fence or even a wall (Tuam bypass for example) , and armco barriers to separate the footpath cycle lane beside the road from the now officially faster traffic. There are other ways to keep other road users safer then just keeping their speed down. (though I do approve that method when appropriate.


  • #24
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,666 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Ruhanna wrote: »
    Galway City Council, and indeed the TII, can't have it both ways. They cannot claim that current traffic volumes and junction capacity issues are so great that a new ring road has been urgently required for the past quarter century, and yet junctions on the same route are so free-flowing that an 80 km/h speed limit is justified. Both can't be true, so one of them is a fib. Which one is it?

    Ahh, time.

    Sometimes a road can be like X.

    At other times, it can be like Y.

    That means it's both X and Y, even if they're mutually exclusive.


  • #25
    Worn Out
    Registered Users Posts: 150 ✭✭Worn Out


    Mark my words there’s going to be a very SERIOUS accident on this road soon. The manner of the speeding and particularly the undertaking of vehicles is very dangerous. I see it every single day and it’s horrifing. It’s a very dangerous stretch of road. All to save a few seconds and get held up at the lights or roundabout. If the speed limit is increased to 80km cars will start doing 100/120 and that’s going to get messy.


  • #26
    Whereisgalway
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,470 ✭✭✭Whereisgalway


    They should have peak n off peak speed limits for roads like this one.


  • #27
    Ruhanna
    Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭Ruhanna


    flazio wrote: »
    Well, what I suggest in addition to the increased speed limit is some form of partition between the inbound and outbound lanes, be that a line of reflective poles, or a wire fence or even a wall (Tuam bypass for example) , and armco barriers to separate the footpath cycle lane beside the road from the now officially faster traffic. There are other ways to keep other road users safer then just keeping their speed down. (though I do approve that method when appropriate.

    There are reasons other than safety to keep the speed limit on the N6 Bothar na dTreabh to a strictly controlled 50 kph.

    Those reasons include, but are probably not limited to: junction capacity, CO2 emissions and the need for a bus service along the route.


    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    Ahh, time.

    Sometimes a road can be like X.

    At other times, it can be like Y.

    That means it's both X and Y, even if they're mutually exclusive.

    A good argument for leaving the speed limit at 50 km/h then.


    Whereisgalway wrote: »
    They should have peak n off peak speed limits for roads like this one.


    A more sustainable and equitable solution would be to leave the speed limit at 50 km/h on the entire length of the N6 ring road/Bothar na dTreabh and control it rigorously with average speed cameras (maybe 60 km/h if there was zero tolerance enforcement). One lane each way could be reallocated to public transport, also strictly controlled to stop encroachment by car drivers (as happens every minute of the day on Seamus Quirke Road). Additional measures such as removing all the roundabouts, configuring all the signalised junctions to prioritise buses, bikes and pedestrians, and providing a continuous segregated bike path the whole way to Ballybrit/Parkmore would all combine to make the road safer for everyone and would increase junction capacity.


    Worn Out wrote: »
    Mark my words there’s going to be a very SERIOUS accident on this road soon. The manner of the speeding and particularly the undertaking of vehicles is very dangerous. I see it every single day and it’s horrifing. It’s a very dangerous stretch of road. All to save a few seconds and get held up at the lights or roundabout. If the speed limit is increased to 80km cars will start doing 100/120 and that’s going to get messy.

    The speeding is already dangerous. An increase in the speed limit will only have the effect of encouraging the lunatics.

    There have been numerous crashes at different locations along the N6 ring road/Bothar na dTreabh over the years. Some have resulted in deaths, others in serious injury. The relatively minor ones, such as when a driver demolishes a guardrail or a traffic light, seem to go unreported in the local media.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=107772595&postcount=713

    https://connachttribune.ie/two-killed-in-horror-car-smash-on-bridge/

    https://connachttribune.ie/hit-and-run-driver-jailed-for-fleeing-accident/

    https://www.rte.ie/news/2016/1126/834580-galway-traffic-delays/


  • #28
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Ruhanna wrote: »
    There are reasons other than safety to keep the speed limit on the N6 Bothar na dTreabh to a strictly controlled 50 kph.

    Those reasons include, but are probably not limited to: junction capacity, CO2 emissions and the need for a bus service along the route.





    A good argument for leaving the speed limit at 50 km/h then.






    A more sustainable and equitable solution would be to leave the speed limit at 50 km/h on the entire length of the N6 ring road/Bothar na dTreabh and control it rigorously with average speed cameras (maybe 60 km/h if there was zero tolerance enforcement). One lane each way could be reallocated to public transport, also strictly controlled to stop encroachment by car drivers (as happens every minute of the day on Seamus Quirke Road). Additional measures such as removing all the roundabouts, configuring all the signalised junctions to prioritise buses, bikes and pedestrians, and providing a continuous segregated bike path the whole way to Ballybrit/Parkmore would all combine to make the road safer for everyone and would increase junction capacity.





    The speeding is already dangerous. An increase in the speed limit will only have the effect of encouraging the lunatics.

    There have been numerous crashes at different locations along the N6 ring road/Bothar na dTreabh over the years. Some have resulted in deaths, others in serious injury. The relatively minor ones, such as when a driver demolishes a guardrail or a traffic light, seem to go unreported in the local media.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=107772595&postcount=713

    https://connachttribune.ie/two-killed-in-horror-car-smash-on-bridge/

    https://connachttribune.ie/hit-and-run-driver-jailed-for-fleeing-accident/

    https://www.rte.ie/news/2016/1126/834580-galway-traffic-delays/

    God help us if you had any power over roads in Galway, you would make some mess of them.

    I’d say that you could count on your fingers how many people agreed with the 50kmh limit in this road, it was widely known as one of the most ridicolous speed limits ever set in the country so the fact you agree with it doesn’t say much for your opinion (all of which I massively disagree with as would the vast vast majority of people)...

    The sensible thing would be to increase the limit to 100kmh and while they are at it they could tackle an other idiotic limit - the Q bridge which should be increased to 80kmh immediately, as 50kmh is a joke and hence totally ignored. The blaming speed for crashes mantra really needs to stop too speed had nothing to do with any of them crashes you linked even so you aren’t even supporting your own argument.


  • #29
    xckjoo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,344 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    Ruhanna wrote: »
    There are reasons other than safety to keep the speed limit on the N6 Bothar na dTreabh to a strictly controlled 50 kph.

    Those reasons include, but are probably not limited to: junction capacity, CO2 emissions and the need for a bus service along the route.
    <snip>


    I'm with you in general about the speed thing. People don't realise it's about flow and not max speed. Driving faster just gets you to the next bottleneck faster.

    I think they'd have to do a restructuring of the road on Bothar na dTreabh. People won't stick to the 50kmph naturally and it gives them ammo to argue that speed limits can be ignored. Bus lanes and proper cycle lanes would be a good idea but that would involve forward thinking.


  • #30
    xckjoo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,344 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    Raelynn Happy Couch wrote: »
    I think my record on the road is 180kmh very late one night :D :pac:


    You must be the coolest guy in the school yard


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  • #31
    joeKel73
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,689 ✭✭✭joeKel73


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Rounding the distance to 2km

    2km @ 50kmph = 2:24
    2km @ 60kmph = 2:00
    2km @ 80kmph = 1:30

    You are talking about gaining 54 seconds on a stretch of road where, at either end, you are usually forced to wait a min or two (best case) anyway due to the lights on one end and the RAB on the other.

    54 seconds

    The problem with that road is the 50km/hr speed limit is rarely enforced and widely ignored. If you do stick to the limit, you'll currently have a steady flow of cars passing you over the 2km and you'll be much further back the queue at the next junction. The resulting total delay is much longer than 54 seconds.


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