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13-08-2018, 23:19   #1
Victor
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The front of buses

Why is there a large black area at the front of buses, surrounding the destination 'scroll'?

Surely it would improve visibility of the bus to have a brighter colour there? Alternatively, you could go for a bigger scroll, but that might cost a fair bit.





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13-08-2018, 23:38   #2
Stephen15
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I would think the LED stands out better on a black background rather than a blue or another colour background. I think was tried when the first dot matrix RVs were delivered but then it was changed to a black background.
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14-08-2018, 00:17   #3
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Preference in order is 3, 1, 2.
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14-08-2018, 01:02   #4
Victor
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I would think the LED stands out better on a black background rather than a blue or another colour background. I think was tried when the first dot matrix RVs were delivered but then it was changed to a black background.
Perhaps. But having a reflective black background isn't great.

Having buses yellow is good for visibility, but having most of the front black or glass isn't great.

I wonder how well the orange contrasts with the blue.
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14-08-2018, 01:31   #5
Stephen15
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Perhaps. But having a reflective black background isn't great.

Having buses yellow is good for visibility, but having most of the front black or glass isn't great.

I wonder how well the orange contrasts with the blue.
The old scrolls were easier to see than the current LEDs look at how clear the scrolls are in London however scrolls have the big disadvantage of being inflexible so they can't be changed look at how clear London bus destination displays are.

Mind you the LEDs do stand out at night. It would be good if they introduce something like Paris has here in Dublin.
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14-08-2018, 09:15   #6
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With the different designs of buses it makes sense for one size to be used. Dublin Bus mostly have a fleet of Wright Gemini’s with a similar front, but up until recently there were over 600 ALX400s in service with a totally different design. There are also over 100 Enviro 400/500 vehicles in use with a different front again. The same LED unit is in use across all types of vehicles and makes swapping them out easy if a bus is withdrawn or the unit is damaged.
I’m guessing ordering one type of display across the whole fleet is cheaper than ordering per bus (these units are not cheap), and it keeps a consistent look for passengers.
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14-08-2018, 12:12   #7
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I don't think it's black, it's dark blue , part of the light and dark blue livery scheme.
A bit like Preist's Socks I guess.
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14-08-2018, 19:53   #8
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Quote:
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The old scrolls were easier to see than the current LEDs look at how clear the scrolls are in London however scrolls have the big disadvantage of being inflexible so they can't be changed look at how clear London bus destination displays are.

Mind you the LEDs do stand out at night. It would be good if they introduce something like Paris has here in Dublin.
The new BCI Tri-Axle which entered service this week in London has a VERY clear hi-definition LED display....

https://i.imgur.com/uVqgUVt.png

This is a very innovative and interesting machine,and one which the NTA should have sought to trial in Dublin.
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14-08-2018, 22:11   #9
Losty Dublin
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The new BCI Tri-Axle which entered service this week in London has a VERY clear hi-definition LED display....

https://i.imgur.com/uVqgUVt.png

This is a very innovative and interesting machine,and one which the NTA should have sought to trial in Dublin.
VT's are getting on a bit and will be in need of replacement sooner or later. Perhaps, perhaps, perhaps
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15-08-2018, 00:10   #10
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IIRC there are regulations on font, font-size, font and background colour etc under the EU disability regulations for the partially sighted.

Its caused UK rail companies big problems. There was once a small fleet of trains (SWT 485 before rebuild) unable to return to service because the PIS showed letters/numbers that were a few cm too small.
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15-08-2018, 09:06   #11
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a few cm? just how big do they have to be!

Hardly surprising they had trouble fitting a display on to ex tube cars.
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15-08-2018, 21:09   #12
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a few cm? just how big do they have to be!

Hardly surprising they had trouble fitting a display on to ex tube cars.
I can't remember but a good example is some of the older trains on ScotRail. The LED/LCD destination on the front used to have two lines of text. For example,

Edinburgh
Waverley

The letters were too small however, so now the only way of using the correct size font is to use huge letters on a scrolling screen. Which is useless on a train coming into a station as all you can see is gh Wav before it passes you!
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15-08-2018, 22:18   #13
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Its caused UK rail companies big problems. There was once a small fleet of trains (SWT 485 before rebuild) unable to return to service because the PIS showed letters/numbers that were a few cm too small.
Class 485's never had LED displays I'm aware, they're way too old for that.

Not sure why them being too small would stop them being returned to service, they could just turn the displays off, since a large amount of stock in the UK still has no LED or PIS systems.
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15-08-2018, 22:44   #14
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Class 485's never had LED displays I'm aware, they're way too old for that.

Not sure why them being too small would stop them being returned to service, they could just turn the displays off, since a large amount of stock in the UK still has no LED or PIS systems.
Old? 1998 built is new enough in railway terms. Older stuff will be gone in 2020. They have no choice if its not fully accessible.

From Wikipedia, regarding the 458's " In July 2006, the Department for Transport refused to grant an further exemption from the Rail Vehicle Accessibility Regulations, resulting in modifications to the passenger information system being made, with new wider LEDs fitted within the existing housing"

I have to say that as someone with perfect 20/20 vision, the destination display on the front of Dublin Buses is unreadable from more than 100yrds under most lighting/weather conditions.
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15-08-2018, 22:50   #15
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I'm pretty sure that you mean a different train, since Class 485s were built in 1923-31 according to Wikipedia.

Sure, those trains with PIS systems will have to be adapted, but as far as I'm aware there is no requirement for any train without PIS systems to be fitted with one post 2020.

There is going to be a fair few loco hauled stock that will survive past 2020 with modifications as well as a few more types of older diesel units that will hold on past then with modifications, but the pacers will be gone!

The trend for LED's these days is white high definition displays, which are easier to read.
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