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10-08-2018, 11:17   #1
Mike Hoch
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The rural wilds of North Dublin- why not build?

The thread about the Tallaght Garda station one had a few posts about Dubs who were forced to the outlying counties and beyond by the cost of housing.

It got me wondering- why is north country Dublin so sparsely built on?

I know there are zoning laws and what have you, but why was the land never zoned and built on, particularly during the boom? Farming is a tough, largely subsidised business. I'd wager the vast majority of Dublin farmers would like nothing more to sell up for a fortune.

Just looking at a map, by my reckoning you could house 100,000 people, in what, 30,000 homes, in the rural lands between the Corduff/ Tyrellstown part of Blanch and the airport.

Another largely rural spot to the left of Swords and north of the airport could house perhaps 150,000.

North East of Swords looks to be maybe 3 or 4 times the size of the Blanchardstown area. A potential 400,000 people housed.

The population of Meath has nearly doubled, and grown by over 100,000, since 1996.

Kildare has also grown by over 100,000 in the same period.

Louth up by 40,000.

Westmeath 30,000.

Yet North County Dublin has, from my view of it, room for 750,000 people. More if we build more flats.

You can bet that the majority of Dubs resident in Meath and Kildare were born and brought up in North and West Dublin but found the prices too expensive. You can also bet the vast majority of people in these counties born elsewhere in the state were attracted to the Dublin area for work and would probably prefer to live within a shorter distance of the place. What is, and was, the sense of putting these people in estates in the hinterland that, while having good road and rail access, don't have a fraction of the bus service that those within the Dublin Bus service area do?
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10-08-2018, 11:20   #2
Samuel T. Cogley
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Theres a huge development planned around D5/D13/D17 - I forget exactly where.

It's only just about becoming 'viable' (read huge profit) to build in North Dublin.
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10-08-2018, 11:24   #3
Mike Hoch
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Originally Posted by Samuel T. Cogley View Post
Theres a huge development planned around D5/D13/D17 - I forget exactly where.

It's only just about becoming 'viable' (read huge profit) to build in North Dublin.
That's the thing as well. Even during the boom no new towns were really developed in the way Blanch, Clondalkin, Tallaght were in the 70's. Rather they just built new sections on to them- the likes of Ongar and Tyrellstown are essentially part of Blanch rather than suburbs in their own right.

In fact, the only two new towns they did try (Adamstown and Clongriffin) are today desolate half built kips (well, Clongriffin isn't too pretty, but I've heard the same of Adamstown)

Why was it less profitable to build there than say, Kildare?
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10-08-2018, 11:27   #4
Samuel T. Cogley
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Why was it less profitable to build there than say, Kildare?

I'd hazard a guess the land is a lot cheaper.
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10-08-2018, 11:37   #5
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Because some tree hugging nimby crank will lodge objection after objection rather than let people find a solution to the housing crisis.

The apple project in Galway stands as a shining example.
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10-08-2018, 11:38   #6
Donald Trump
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Yiz can fuck right off out of the North County ya townie bollixes. Enough of yiz there already. Time for a purge


I need it for me next golf course!
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10-08-2018, 11:39   #7
SEPT 23 1989
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A lot of it is farmed
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10-08-2018, 11:40   #8
Mike Hoch
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I'd hazard a guess the land is a lot cheaper.
But then so is the selling price.

How much profit would a developer be seeking to make per house in a development of three beds out of interest? Would they be happy with, say, 20,000 per house for a 200 home project?

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/...-45m-1.3536053

Calling it at 850 homes, each house plot would cost 52,941. Slightly less given much of the estate will be public roads, footpaths, amenities etc.

But, in terms of purchase price, it would be around 52,000 of your investment. Of course, plot costs for a development of terraced housing or flats is going to be less than this. As is land that is further away from the M50 and the city centre than Tyrellstown is.

Of course you'd want your head examined if you'r paying 370K plus for a house in Tyrellstown, with the reputation it's getting they homes should be worth half that, but each to their own.

Depends on the type of house being built obviously, but that housing co op in Ballymun built 3 bed terraces for minimum profit at 140K on land gifted by the council
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10-08-2018, 11:41   #9
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Water infrastructure. Seems to be all the rage these days.
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10-08-2018, 11:44   #10
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Water infrastructure. Seems to be all the rage these days.
There has been a 2 month "drought" in the rest of the country and a decades long problems with poor water infrastructure that has remained unsolved.

People still need housing. And they still refuse to address the issue of water infrastructure.
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10-08-2018, 11:45   #11
Mike Hoch
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Water infrastructure. Seems to be all the rage these days.
I guess my question is nearly more retrospective than anything. The bulk of the population growth in the counties surrounding Dublin would have been caused by Dubs and country folk who work in Dublin. The majority of whom would likely have preferred to live in Dublin, but moved either because they couldn't afford a house in what they regarded as a decent area, or they wanted a bigger house than what they could afford in Dublin. Instead of accommodating these hundreds of thousands of people within the county, estates were built in small villages in the bordering counties. Places well served by motorways and in some spots trains, but places that by and large lack a bus service as regular as Dublin Bus. The people, and the infrastructure, already exist- it just seems strange we decided to push the growth West and North West.

Last edited by Mike Hoch; 10-08-2018 at 11:48.
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10-08-2018, 11:45   #12
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"Fingal county provides around 55% of the country’s fresh produce, which includes soft fruits and berries, apples, lettuces, peppers, asparagus, potatoes, onions, and carrots."

https://www.irishexaminer.com/farmin...al-242443.html


So there would be places for people to live, but nothing left to eat.
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10-08-2018, 11:45   #13
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Yiz can **** right off out of the North County ya townie bollixes. Enough of yiz there already. Time for a purge

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I need it for me next golf course!

You are getting your pretend personalities mixed up again Don.
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10-08-2018, 11:51   #14
Mike Hoch
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"Fingal county provides around 55% of the country’s fresh produce, which includes soft fruits and berries, apples, lettuces, peppers, asparagus, potatoes, onions, and carrots."

https://www.irishexaminer.com/farmin...al-242443.html


So there would be places for people to live, but nothing left to eat.
I wasn't aware of that! I obviously knew about the berrys potatos etc but I never imagined a small corner of one of the states smallest counties fed half the market.

Even at that though, I doubt the majority of green space is being used for crops. Developments could surely be built around these fields. If there are only 600 active farmers in Fingal I'm sure that leaves plenty of growing space left over if building commenced up there.

Last edited by Mike Hoch; 10-08-2018 at 11:56.
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10-08-2018, 11:52   #15
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Thornton Hall, 30 million, there, I said it.
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