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Right-wing vs. Left-wing Clashes [MOD NOTE POST #1]

  • 12-08-2017 8:52pm
    #1
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,396 ✭✭✭


    MOD NOTE - READ BEFORE POSTING 22 AUGUST 2017

    Right, this thread has incurred over 100 moderator management actions and there have been over a dozen cards and bannings in the short 10 days that it has been open. That is completely unacceptable. This thread doesn't have any special rules, it is simply the politics charter that everyone posting here must read:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057553361

    There have been a whole pile of personal attacks, incivility, one liners, dubious links and link dumps. People are not complying with mod instructions which means the thread has gone off the rails on more than one occasion.

    Let's be clear, if you post on this thread you will be deemed to have read the charter in full and understand the need to have serious political debate and not make nonsense posts or jibes at other posters expense. Likewise, trolling, commenting on moderation or dragging the thread off topic with dubious links or repeated twitter/news dumping will not be tolerated.

    If you are unsure about posting links, you can get further clarification here.

    If you break those rules don't be upset if you get an immediate and lengthy ban from this forum.

    Otherwise, it is a very interesting and important topic and I'd like to thank the posters who have made significant contributions to the thread.

    ********




    Didn't see a thread on this and thought it probably deserved one. Maybe it should be in Politics, don't know. Maybe the mods can move it.

    Anyway. Over a planned removal of a Robert E. Lee monument from a public park it has come over the last couple of days to right wing and ultra right wing rallies and marches in Charlottesville, Virginia. There have been several reported clashes with groups of counter demonstrators. Now it's being reported that a truck or van deliberately crashed into a group of those counter demonstrators and then drove off. Apparently a state of emergency has been declared and additional police has been deployed.

    Trump even felt the need to tweet.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2017/08/12/us/charlottesville-white-nationalists-rally/index.html


«134567…40

Comments

  • #2
    GLaDOS
    Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 23,197 Mod ✭✭✭✭GLaDOS


    You sometimes get the impression the US is on the brink of civil war.

    Really seems to be a nation divided.

    Cake, and grief counseling, will be available at the conclusion of the test



  • #3
    Noveight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,813 ✭✭✭Noveight


    This picture titled White Nationalists wield torches seems a bit ominous...

    170812072520-02-charlottesville-white-supremacists-0811-restricted-exlarge-169.jpg


  • #4
    Samaris
    Registered Users Posts: 6,544 ✭✭✭Samaris


    Mod: As a political thread, I'm going to move it over to Politics. Bear in mind that it may not get reopened if it crosses over another thread already open.

    It will remain closed until a Politics mod can look at it.


  • #5
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,056 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Mod: I am reopening this. However, please ensure that you read the Politics charter before posting. Thanks.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • #6
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    Over the last yearr self appointed Antifa thugs have rioted in streets/attacked women & more-then people on the left react surprised when someone snaps, Lets ask the question if there wasn,t countless Antifa violence over the last year, would that driver of still snapped in Charlottesville ?


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  • #7
    Inquitus
    Registered Users Posts: 13,729 ✭✭✭✭Inquitus


    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    Over the last yearr self appointed Antifa thugs have rioted in streets/attacked women & more-then people on the left react surprised when someone snaps, Lets ask the question if there wasn,t countless Antifa violence over the last year, would that driver of still snapped in Charlottesville ?

    Yep, murdering some poor innocent, and injuring many others with a car, is a justifiable reaction to any opposition to White Supremacism, are you for real or what?


  • #8
    Samaris
    Registered Users Posts: 6,544 ✭✭✭Samaris


    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    Over the last yearr self appointed Antifa thugs have rioted in streets/attacked women & more-then people on the left react surprised when someone snaps, Lets ask the question if there wasn,t countless Antifa violence over the last year, would that driver of still snapped in Charlottesville ?

    Anybody capable of ramming a car into a crowd of people who were not threatening him in any way (being as he was in a car and they were walking peacefully down the street in their counter-protest), yes, probably would have done it anyway because to do that makes them a coward and a killer. Not to mention blind as a bat if he "thought" they were Antifa. Antifa being well-known for strolling down the road wearing bright colours and no masks. Mistake anyone could make, right? Someone is now dead and nineteen others are injured. And you would try to justify it?

    Ugh.


  • #9
    cd07
    Registered Users Posts: 466 ✭✭cd07


    Not a civil war....racial war! Ross Kemp did a good show on the issue recently. Klan lads look like complete hicks it's gas but then the opposition don't cover themselves in glory either...murica


  • #10
    super_furry
    Registered Users Posts: 27,319 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    It's not violent right wing clashes against the left wing, it's neo-nazi terrorists committing terrorist attacks and murdering people.


  • #11
    Manach
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,659 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manach


    Murica only - Not really. From Europe one side we have types like the Golden Dawn while on the other, Antifa. There is a great disenchantment with tradionional norms both in societal norms and faith in governing parties. The American ease of access to guns make it more likely that violence breaks out there first, but this contagion (where both extreme right and left draw inspiration and feedback from social media) can easily move to here.


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  • #12
    A Little Pony
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,875 ✭✭✭A Little Pony


    GLaDOS wrote: »
    You sometimes get the impression the US is on the brink of civil war.

    Really seems to be a nation divided.
    The South should be it's own country anyway. It has nothing in common politically or socially with the Northern states.


  • #13
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    Samaris wrote: »
    Anybody capable of ramming a car into a crowd of people who were not threatening him in any way (being as he was in a car and they were walking peacefully down the street in their counter-protest), yes, probably would have done it anyway because to do that makes them a coward and a killer. Not to mention blind as a bat if he "thought" they were Antifa. Antifa being well-known for strolling down the road wearing bright colours and no masks. Mistake anyone could make, right? Someone is now dead and nineteen others are injured. And you would try to justify it?

    Ugh.

    Over the last year the Milo event in Berkley a few months ago got cancelled due to left wing violence and women attacked + maced in the face followed on Ann Coulter being cancelled due to threats of violence + other incidents of Trump supporters trying to hold peaceful rallies only to be violently attacked by militant left wing protesters , followed by threats of violence towards people attending today,s rally, take it all into account constant violence along with constant threats of violence it was evident someone was gonna snap sooner or later , am I trying to justify it ? fcuk no to quote an phrase " violence breeds violence " for those who oppose & disagree with Trump supporters if they wanna counter protest them peacefully non violently no problem with that, but the minute they violently oppose people they disagree with is when they are creating the breeding ground for further violence + counter violence .


  • #14
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    Inquitus wrote: »
    Yep, murdering some poor innocent, and injuring many others with a car, is a justifiable reaction to any opposition to White Supremacism, are you for real or what?

    Over the last year the Milo event in Berkley a few months ago got cancelled due to left wing violence and women attacked + maced in the face followed on Ann Coulter being cancelled due to threats of violence + other incidents of Trump supporters trying to hold peaceful rallies only to be violently attacked by militant left wing protesters , followed by threats of violence towards people attending today,s rally, take it all into account constant violence along with constant threats of violence it was evident someone was gonna snap sooner or later , am I trying to justify it ? fcuk no to quote an phrase " violence breeds violence " for those who oppose & disagree with Trump supporters if they wanna counter protest them peacefully non violently no problem with that, but the minute they violently oppose people they disagree with is when they are creating the breeding ground for further violence + counter violence .


  • #15
    Inquitus
    Registered Users Posts: 13,729 ✭✭✭✭Inquitus


    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    Over the last year the Milo event in Berkley a few months ago got cancelled due to left wing violence and women attacked + maced in the face followed on Ann Coulter being cancelled due to threats of violence + other incidents of Trump supporters trying to hold peaceful rallies only to be violently attacked by militant left wing protesters , followed by threats of violence towards people attending today,s rally, take it all into account constant violence along with constant threats of violence it was evident someone was gonna snap sooner or later , am I trying to justify it ? fcuk no to quote an phrase " violence breeds violence " for those who oppose & disagree with Trump supporters if they wanna counter protest them peacefully non violently no problem with that, but the minute they violently oppose people they disagree with is when they are creating the breeding ground for further violence + counter violence .

    I would disagree, Nazism and White Supremacism does not deserve a platform, and protesting to deny it one is both reasonable and to be expected in a decent society.


  • #16
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    Inquitus wrote: »
    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    Over the last year the Milo event in Berkley a few months ago got cancelled due to left wing violence and women attacked + maced in the face followed on Ann Coulter being cancelled due to threats of violence + other incidents of Trump supporters trying to hold peaceful rallies only to be violently attacked by militant left wing protesters , followed by threats of violence towards people attending today,s rally, take it all into account constant violence along with constant threats of violence it was evident someone was gonna snap sooner or later , am I trying to justify it ? fcuk no to quote an phrase " violence breeds violence " for those who oppose & disagree with Trump supporters if they wanna counter protest them peacefully non violently no problem with that, but the minute they violently oppose people they disagree with is when they are creating the breeding ground for further violence + counter violence .

    I would disagree, Nazism and White Supremacism does not deserve a platform, and protesting to deny it one is both reasonable and to be expected in a decent society.
    The two people I referred to in that post were Milo + Ann Coulter who had their speaking engagements at Berkley cancelled due to violence, are you seriously saying those two are " nazis " ? same goes for Trump supporters if they want to hold a rally are all Trump supporters also " nazis " ? there is key difference in protest as in peaceful protest versus violent opposition to someone you disagree with , but since you brought up that you support no platform type policy do you also think Communism should also be equally be no platformed ? given far more were killed under Communist regimes then nazi regimes .


  • #17
    testaccount123
    Registered Users Posts: 1,023 ✭✭✭testaccount123


    Neo Nazis and Islamists, all reactionary right wing scum. **** them and the ideologies that spawn then


  • #18
    super_furry
    Registered Users Posts: 27,319 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    Why are you talking about people having speaking engagements cancelled? An Alt-Right Neo-Nazi just commuted a terrorist attack and murdered someone.


  • #19
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    ...it was evident someone was gonna snap sooner or later , am I trying to justify it ? fcuk no...

    Your denial rings hollow, frankly. Driving a car into people isn't "snapping", it's an act of terrorist violence whether it's an islamist terrorist doing it or a fascist terrorist doing it.


  • #20
    super_furry
    Registered Users Posts: 27,319 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    Driving a car into a crowd is only terrorism if the people driving are brown.

    Snapping? My arse.


  • #21
    testaccount123
    Registered Users Posts: 1,023 ✭✭✭testaccount123


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    Your denial rings hollow, frankly. Driving a car into people isn't "snapping", it's an act of terrorist violence whether it's an islamist terrorist doing it or a fascist terrorist doing it.

    Two sides of the same coin


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  • #22
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    super_furry wrote: »
    Why are you talking about people having speaking engagements cancelled? An Alt-Right Neo-Nazi just commuted a terrorist attack and murdered someone.
    Because nothing happens in a vacuum, if there hadn,t of been endless political violence by militant left wingers over the last year its highly doubtful that some lone nut would of felt the need to do what he did today " violence breeds violence " .


  • #23
    BillyBobBS
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,568 ✭✭✭BillyBobBS


    Violent left and right wing extremists it looks like. These people are all scum.


  • #24
    red ears
    Closed Accounts Posts: 945 ✭✭✭red ears


    GLaDOS wrote: »
    You sometimes get the impression the US is on the brink of civil war.

    Really seems to be a nation divided.

    But diversity is our strength?

    We are learning a hard lesson that tribalism can't just be wished away. We are seeing similar strife in Indonesia between the Chinese and the natives. What is happening in america is only going to get worse.


  • #25
    wes
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Three dead and dozens wounded as white supremacists clash with anti-fascist campaigners in Virginia


    More dead now :(.

    We are seeing more and more white supremacist terror these days, and its astonishing that that so many refuse to call it what it is "terrorism".

    These guys were openly engaging in Nazi salutes and they showed with helmets, sticks and shields, and had 0 intent of peaceful protest.


  • #26
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    Because nothing happens in a vacuum, if there hadn,t of been endless political violence by militant left wingers over the last year its highly doubtful that some lone nut would of felt the need to do what he did today " violence breeds violence " .

    Still sounding like justification where I'm sitting.

    "If those uppity left-wingers would of kept their pinko liberal mouths shut, god-fearin' Christians wouldn't feel the need to murder them."


  • #27
    testaccount123
    Registered Users Posts: 1,023 ✭✭✭testaccount123


    Aaaaand we're straight into excusing and rationalizing the violence. Makes a change from listening to the lefties do it i guess


  • #28
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    When people ask why am I bringing up events over the last year ? these tweets phrase it in a better way then I do .
    https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/896421076984397824
    https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/896424713890615296
    https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/838207152292417536


  • #29
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    Because nothing happens in a vacuum, if there hadn,t of been endless political violence by militant left wingers over the last year its highly doubtful that some lone nut would of felt the need to do what he did today " violence breeds violence " .

    Still sounding like justification where I'm sitting.

    "If those uppity left-wingers would of kept their pinko liberal mouths shut, god-fearin' Christians wouldn't feel the need to murder them."
    Im not talking about people keeping their mouths shuts, having a counter argument to someone + peacefully protesting against someone are one thing, political violence + riots + violently attacking people you disagree with while wearing masks will only do one thing which is create counter violence, " violence breeds violence " .


  • #30
    red ears
    Closed Accounts Posts: 945 ✭✭✭red ears


    wes wrote: »
    Three dead and dozens wounded as white supremacists clash with anti-fascist campaigners in Virginia


    More dead now :(.

    We are seeing more and more white supremacist terror these days, and its astonishing that that so many refuse to call it what it is "terrorism".

    These guys were openly engaging in Nazi salutes and they showed with helmets, sticks and shields, and had 0 intent of peaceful protest.

    I don't believe they did go with the intention of violence, they went for a rally and to have a few speakers. But they were also ready to defend themselves from the inevitable Antifa attacks. This is exactly what transpired. Had the white nationalists been allowed to have their rally and have their speakers there would have been no violence. There didn't need to be any attention given to them.


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  • #31
    red ears
    Closed Accounts Posts: 945 ✭✭✭red ears


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    "If those uppity left-wingers would of kept their pinko liberal mouths shut, god-fearin' Christians wouldn't feel the need to murder them."

    Are you aware of how antifa have been behaving in America since Trump was elected. They are a violent bunch of thugs.


This discussion has been closed.
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