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09-06-2017, 12:32   #1
Nelbert
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Alarm options?

Hi guys,

I know it's been discussed before but has anyone successfully integrated alarm and automation?

I've a Vera edge and a fair few z wave enabled devices.

I have no problem switching to zig bee or something else but the ultimate goal for me is a unified front (if I got a zigbee alarm I'd use Domoticz as a front for both it and Vera z-wave for example).

The ultimate goal is that any window and door sensors are BOTH automation and security enabled. I don't want 2 separate sensors on the 3-4 doors I'd be putting them on.

Is there alarm systems available with registered installers that are either z-wave or IP addressable (easily and securely!) or a fallback I know there is some that you can hook up voltage sensors to sense arm / disarm etc. My fear (i.e. what I want to avoid) with IP or voltage sensor is that detecting the status of individual door / window sensors wouldn't be possible.

I know this has been discussed before but hoping a new thread with new / current status might be good.
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09-06-2017, 13:31   #2
wexfordman2
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Originally Posted by Nelbert View Post
Hi guys,

I know it's been discussed before but has anyone successfully integrated alarm and automation?

I've a Vera edge and a fair few z wave enabled devices.

I have no problem switching to zig bee or something else but the ultimate goal for me is a unified front (if I got a zigbee alarm I'd use Domoticz as a front for both it and Vera z-wave for example).

The ultimate goal is that any window and door sensors are BOTH automation and security enabled. I don't want 2 separate sensors on the 3-4 doors I'd be putting them on.

Is there alarm systems available with registered installers that are either z-wave or IP addressable (easily and securely!) or a fallback I know there is some that you can hook up voltage sensors to sense arm / disarm etc. My fear (i.e. what I want to avoid) with IP or voltage sensor is that detecting the status of individual door / window sensors wouldn't be possible.

I know this has been discussed before but hoping a new thread with new / current status might be good.

Hi,

I've had the comfort alarm system by cytech for.the last 17 years (upgraded it about ten years ago, but apart from that same system). It's a fully fledged automation controller and alarm system with an Android or iPhone app that lets you control the alarm, automation devices and view cameras etc.

It has interfaces to zwave, cbus, knx, X10, velbus and lots more different interfaces.


Regards

Eamon
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09-06-2017, 13:56   #3
Nelbert
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Hi,

I've had the comfort alarm system by cytech for.the last 17 years (upgraded it about ten years ago, but apart from that same system). It's a fully fledged automation controller and alarm system with an Android or iPhone app that lets you control the alarm, automation devices and view cameras etc.

It has interfaces to zwave, cbus, knx, X10, velbus and lots more different interfaces.


Regards

Eamon
Did you install yourself? Could you pm me your installer if not?
Essentially I'd love to have something like that just sitting on the existing z wave network and be able to make use of z wave door sensors etc.
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09-06-2017, 14:39   #4
wexfordman2
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Did you install yourself? Could you pm me your installer if not?
Essentially I'd love to have something like that just sitting on the existing z wave network and be able to make use of z wave door sensors etc.

I fitted it myself, there are installers about in Ireland though, take a look at the website for links www.cytech.biz

One thing I would say about it, from an automation perspective you do want to be able to access and tweak the programming of it yourself. And I would say the same for any controller. When the controller is your alarm system also, sometimes an installer may be reluctant to give you access to the system at that level, so check that out if you are going the installer route.
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09-06-2017, 14:51   #5
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It has interfaces to zwave, cbus, knx, X10, velbus and lots more different interfaces.
Having looked at many systems I regret not getting this one.

It's far better than the others I've seen
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09-06-2017, 16:18   #6
Nelbert
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I fitted it myself, there are installers about in Ireland though, take a look at the website for links www.cytech.biz

One thing I would say about it, from an automation perspective you do want to be able to access and tweak the programming of it yourself. And I would say the same for any controller. When the controller is your alarm system also, sometimes an installer may be reluctant to give you access to the system at that level, so check that out if you are going the installer route.
I don't mind having 2 controllers one for automation and one for alarm. It's doubling up on sensors etc that I don't want. So even if it was locked down as an alarm controller only I'd be fine with that, I'd have my other controller as the primary one for automation aspects...... if that makes sense.

Is your house insurance impacted by it being self install?
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09-06-2017, 20:43   #7
wexfordman2
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I don't mind having 2 controllers one for automation and one for alarm. It's doubling up on sensors etc that I don't want. So even if it was locked down as an alarm controller only I'd be fine with that, I'd have my other controller as the primary one for automation aspects...... if that makes sense.

Is your house insurance impacted by it being self install?
Hi, I don't claim an alarm discount, or I got a lower discount as it's a self install.
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09-06-2017, 22:29   #8
Nelbert
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Is it a complex install considering I'd be going with the alarm panel, siren, keypad and z wave add on?

Had a quick glance and most of the complex stuff seems more geared towards wired zones where as my sensors etc would just be z wave?

I've done cable pulls and outdoor sockets and lights etc but an alarm would be a new one on the DIY resume. Just wouldn't like to make a mess of it or worse fry the board/s
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10-06-2017, 07:09   #9
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Hi, I don't claim an alarm discount, or I got a lower discount as it's a self install.

That's the general advice on the home security forum too. It's not worth it
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10-06-2017, 09:20   #10
wexfordman2
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Originally Posted by Nelbert View Post
Is it a complex install considering I'd be going with the alarm panel, siren, keypad and z wave add on?

Had a quick glance and most of the complex stuff seems more geared towards wired zones where as my sensors etc would just be z wave?

I've done cable pulls and outdoor sockets and lights etc but an alarm would be a new one on the DIY resume. Just wouldn't like to make a mess of it or worse fry the board/s
Split the install into two boys

The wiring, which tbh is not difficult, it's just pirs (2 or 3 pairs per our) and door contacts.

The keypads use cat5.

The complexity in the wiring is planning it and making sure you get everything where you need it. I have door sensors on some of my internal doors to activate lights etc.

The programming then is the next phase which will take you a while to get the hang of by is fairly logical.

I would suggest downloading the manual, and even the comfigurator program to see how the programming is done. Explore the forums alos,

I have a guide I wore up to an upgrade I did on my system so I will link that if you want alos.

Off you are handy with wiring, and logical then you could do it yourself.

My background is telcoms, so it was second nature to me almost.
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10-06-2017, 12:01   #11
Nelbert
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Originally Posted by wexfordman2 View Post
Split the install into two boys

The wiring, which tbh is not difficult, it's just pirs (2 or 3 pairs per our) and door contacts.

The keypads use cat5.

The complexity in the wiring is planning it and making sure you get everything where you need it. I have door sensors on some of my internal doors to activate lights etc.

The programming then is the next phase which will take you a while to get the hang of by is fairly logical.

I would suggest downloading the manual, and even the comfigurator program to see how the programming is done. Explore the forums alos,

I have a guide I wore up to an upgrade I did on my system so I will link that if you want alos.

Off you are handy with wiring, and logical then you could do it yourself.

My background is telcoms, so it was second nature to me almost.

Cheers I was actually thinking of using all z wave PIRs and door contacts rather than any wires....

I assume the keypad are just you bog standard looking numeric plus a few extra button type?
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10-06-2017, 15:00   #12
FrankGrimes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wexfordman2 View Post
Split the install into two boys

The wiring, which tbh is not difficult, it's just pirs (2 or 3 pairs per our) and door contacts.

The keypads use cat5.

The complexity in the wiring is planning it and making sure you get everything where you need it. I have door sensors on some of my internal doors to activate lights etc.

The programming then is the next phase which will take you a while to get the hang of by is fairly logical.

I would suggest downloading the manual, and even the comfigurator program to see how the programming is done. Explore the forums alos,

I have a guide I wore up to an upgrade I did on my system so I will link that if you want alos.

Off you are handy with wiring, and logical then you could do it yourself.

My background is telcoms, so it was second nature to me almost.
Are you using separate home automation hub for the lights or does the security hub also do that? Link to cytech didn't work on my phone, which product was it? Already feeling that running cables to power all the motion sensors I want for HA (dont want to have to change batteries all the time) will be a lot so 2nd set for security seems a bit much. Still struggling to accept that security systems that relay events/ integrate with HA hubs like Smartthings are so limited in thisbdayband age.

Actually, that reminds me, have been finding the Smartthings forum to be the most informative site I've come across with very resourceful members so maybe someone on there will have some code or solution to join up the two systems, worth a look.
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10-06-2017, 16:53   #13
wexfordman2
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Cheers I was actually thinking of using all z wave PIRs and door contacts rather than any wires....

I assume the keypad are just you bog standard looking numeric plus a few extra button type?
To my.mind, if you are wiring from scratch why put in wireless devices when you could go wired ?

Apart from usual issues with wireless sensors such as receptionn,better life, reliability, compare the cost of a zero wave pir or door sensor to a standard wired one.

Specific to comfort though, the z wave sensors I don't think can be used as an alarm trigger, I might be wrong on this but worth checking up.


They keypads can vary in look, you can even get touch screen and intercom ones.


But, I would strongly suggest go wired for your sensors.
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10-06-2017, 17:05   #14
wexfordman2
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Are you using separate home automation hub for the lights or does the security hub also do that? Link to cytech didn't work on my phone, which product was it? Already feeling that running cables to power all the motion sensors I want for HA (dont want to have to change batteries all the time) will be a lot so 2nd set for security seems a bit much. Still struggling to accept that security systems that relay events/ integrate with HA hubs like Smartthings are so limited in thisbdayband age.

Actually, that reminds me, have been finding the Smartthings forum to be the most informative site I've come across with very resourceful members so maybe someone on there will have some code or solution to join up the two systems, worth a look.
Hi Frank, yep the security system is also the automation hub.

Some general things I have it doing, and note that because it's an integrated alarm system and controller, you can get it to behave differently based on the status of the alarm system (away, night mode, home mode)

1) All lghts are smart controlled, using velbus devices, but this could easily be done with other protocols that comfort supports.
2) events can be triggered from any door or motion sensor, and based on or restricted to dusk, Dawn, security mode etc, security arming, disarming etc.

3) so, certain rooms I have the lighting based on motion detection after dusk. When you walk into a room, or open a door, the lights are activated for a set period. I have not his set in the bathrooms, kitchen, master bedroom, and corridor.

4) when leaving home, once the system is armed it will turn off any or all devices that I have it controlling. In my instance, all lights.

5) arriving home, if it's dark, once the front Doo is opened, it turns on internal hall lights and kitchen lights.

6) by the bedside an arm button sets the house to night mode, turns off all lights, and prevents them being auto triggered by motion, or in some cases makes other lights now that igger based on motion detection.

7) used to control my heating bit I have migrated this to nest.

8) app allows full control of the system locly or remotely, including all connected devices.


On the smart things, there are two things to note. Comfort does not talk directly to the ST hub, but if your devices are z wave then it should be able to talk dir xtly to the devices.

There is a rasperry pie smart things emulator which will talk to comfort, so that is actually an interface from comfort directly to smart things.

I will post some links in a few minutes
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10-06-2017, 17:09   #15
wexfordman2
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http://www.cytech.biz


http://www.comfortforums.com

www.velbus.eu



And a link to a guide I did on my own system when I upgraded my system from using X10 for controlling lights to using velbus.


https://drive.google.com/a/glenegare...w?usp=drivesdk
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