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23-10-2009, 20:06   #1
darter
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News and views on Greystones harbour and marina [SEE MODERATOR WARNING POST 1187]

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After reviving many PM's regarding this thread and having a discussion with my fellow moderator we have decided to reopen this thread under strict conditions. As all previous warnings that myself and mango salsa issued have been ignored i have outlined below some points that will help this thread flow.

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I'd like to start a thread that collects news and views on Greystones harbour and marina. Given the demonstrated eager propensity of the large-handed moderators to close anything down quickly if it strays from the topic of the OP, I ask that all of you who want to discuss anything other than "News and views on Greystones harbour and marina" do it in a separate thread. That way perhaps we can avoid the thread being closed whilst there are still very active participants providing useful information to the community...

I will initiate the thread by saying that although I was against the development that was on principle - the principle being that this is the first time that public beach land in Ireland has been given over to a developer, and that it should not have been counternanced without the State becoming involved - as in the "real" politicians rather than our municipal ones. Now that it is happening, I have "moved on", and welcome its completion as I do think it will add significantly to Greystones.

Please add your news (state the facts and reference the sources) and views (fact-less), but please keep to the topic of the thread.

darter

Last edited by LEIN; 21-07-2011 at 18:41.
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23-10-2009, 22:04   #2
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I am looking forward to a new modern harbour compared to what it is replacing.
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23-10-2009, 22:21   #3
cuddlycavies
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Cant help thinking that with it's residential and business components will come accountability and reponsibility. I look forward to it's completion. In fairness, disturbance has been minimal in the town and surrounds.
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23-10-2009, 23:01   #4
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Work on the development started early in 2008 so it is now about 22 months in progress. Based on the planned progress in this promotional video the project is substantially behind schedule.

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24-10-2009, 12:26   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darter View Post
I'd like to start a thread that collects news and views on Greystones harbour and marina. Given the demonstrated eager propensity of the large-handed moderators to close anything down quickly if it strays from the topic of the OP, I ask that all of you who want to discuss anything other than "News and views on Greystones harbour and marina" do it in a separate thread. That way perhaps we can avoid the thread being closed whilst there are still very active participants providing useful information to the community...

I will initiate the thread by saying that although I was against the development that was on principle - the principle being that this is the first time that public beach land in Ireland has been given over to a developer, and that it should not have been counternanced without the State becoming involved - as in the "real" politicians rather than our municipal ones. Now that it is happening, I have "moved on", and welcome its completion as I do think it will add significantly to Greystones.

Please add your news (state the facts and reference the sources) and views (fact-less), but please keep to the topic of the thread.

darter
If you have a problem with the moderation of this forum or any forum take it to pm. Consider that a warning.
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25-10-2009, 06:55   #6
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Walked down to the harbour yesterday. I was happy to see work still taking place on the weekend...

It's also good to see the sailing club able to use the slipway and launch their boats and have fun even in moderate seas. It was a challenge, but one they all clearly enjoyed. It's important that the moderate seas don't stop our enjoyment of the facilities given us, and that we can launch boats out and see how they fair and see what others think of our sailing.

Now, the question for the day is - is the financing there to finish the project completely, with town square, marina, club houses, shops and apartments? Or was the budget structured such that the sales of the apartments during the construction was a necessary part of cash-flow? I suspect the latter...

I note that the new apartments on Kimberley Road next to the school are on the rental market by the developer even before completion - obviously the developer won't get his asking price now so is putting them out as rentals hoping that the absurd Celtic Tiger prices return within a short time frame. Would this though be a model for apartments that might be built at the harbour? I guess the answer depends on how deep the pockets are of Sispar.

darter

p.s. I note that the greystonesmarina forum (www.greystonesmarina.com) has died a death. Pity.
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25-10-2009, 12:29   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darter View Post
I'd like to start a thread that collects news and views on Greystones harbour and marina. Given the demonstrated eager propensity of the large-handed moderators to close anything down quickly if it strays from the topic of the OP,


darter
In fairness to the moderators some of the other threads got very emotive and-on occasions-abusive. I think your idea is a good one and it is important that we keep emotion out of it as much as possible. That way people can be kept up to date with what is happenig/likely to happen.
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25-10-2009, 12:38   #8
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The piece below is the opinion of a local politican but it is based on meetings with the developer and I think the information on the removal of the hoarding is positive.


Greystones Labour party Councillor Tom Fortune has expressed concerns over the delays in completing the community facilities associated with the Marina development at Greystones. “It has become clear at recent community liaison meetings with the developer that the completion of these facilities is contingent on the construction of the apartments that were intended to provide the finance for this whole project” he stated. “However there is little or no prospect of these apartments being constructed in the short or medium term” he continued “and so we must conclude that there is equally little hope for the community facilities-which were seen as a key benefit of this development by its promoters- unless the housing market picks up significantly”

On a more positive note, Councillor Fortune announced some good news regarding the hoarding that has blocked off views of the sea from the harbour area for almost two years. “I expressed my concern about the presence of this hoarding to the developers and in response they have confirmed that they hope to remove a substantial portion of it next summer” said Councillor Fortune.
“Because of its excessive scale, this project was always going to be very susceptible to housing market conditions” concluded Fortune. “Unfortunately the worst possible outcome has come to pass. It is now important is that all public representatives recognise the reality of the situation and work to protect the public interest in the new scenario facing us. Fortunately the developer is showing a willingness to work with us in this regard.”
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26-10-2009, 07:35   #9
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Do we know what exactly is going to be left when the developers pull out ? My understanding is that they're finishing the sea walls :- does that mean we end up with piers, at least ?
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26-10-2009, 10:18   #10
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As I understand it the intention is to finish the sea walls and no more. (For the time being at any rate)
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26-10-2009, 10:23   #11
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As I understand it the intention is to finish the sea walls and no more. (For the time being at any rate)
I was afraid of that.

SISK seem to be trying to get out of this with some dignity..Fiachra2, you're a local councillor, correct ? Do you have any insight,what can we realistically ask SISK to do ?
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26-10-2009, 18:37   #12
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I was afraid of that.

SISK seem to be trying to get out of this with some dignity..Fiachra2, you're a local councillor, correct ? Do you have any insight,what can we realistically ask SISK to do ?
The PPP contract between Wicklow County Council and SISPAR is secret for commercial reasons. Only the Council can tell us what safeguards they have in place to ensure that the harbour area will be left in a usable position if the project is mothballed indefinitely. Hopefully the highly paid experts in WCC struck a good deal had allowed for this eventuality in the PPP contract
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26-10-2009, 19:46   #13
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The PPP contract between Wicklow County Council and SISPAR is secret for commercial reasons. Only the Council can tell us what safeguards they have in place to ensure that the harbour area will be left in a usable position if the project is mothballed indefinitely. Hopefully the highly paid experts in WCC struck a good deal had allowed for this eventuality in the PPP contract
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26-10-2009, 19:47   #14
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I am looking forward to a new modern harbour compared to what it is replacing.
Remember when the water used to come in there?
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27-10-2009, 06:53   #15
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.

SISK seem to be trying to get out of this with some dignity..Fiachra2, you're a local councillor, correct ? Do you have any insight,what can we realistically ask SISK to do ?
No I am not a councillor anymore but am still very involved.

Your question is difficult to answer. There is a bond in place for €10M in the event of non completion of the project. However in can presumably only be excercised if the project is not completed. It may be of no use if the project is postponed. Based on the limited information available the developer has until at least 2014 to complete the project and possibly beyond that time. So it is likely that the developer could close down the site with the promise of returning in the next few years and in that event the bond could not be used to clear up the place. In any case WCC wouldn't clear it up if they thought there was any chance of the developer coming back.

My own view is that we are better off appealing to SISPAR's better nature and their interest in not leaving a complete mess as their legacy to Greystones. However I have no idea what they will be prepared to do. Based on what they have said to date-see Tom Fortune quote above-it looks like much of the hoarding will be removed and we will have acess to some-if not all of the harbour.
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