Random Running Questions

partyguinness · 05-03-2021 11:28am

whatnext wrote: »

I’m the wrong side of mid 40s. In reasonable shape I think and wouldn’t be far off that. I’ve seen the quack about it because I was a bit concerned and they just said everyone is different. I had a cardiac assessment under stress (on a treadmill) and my heart can go from 50 resting to 200 and recover to below 100 in accordance with what ever they were expecting. I wasn’t interested in the science or explanations just wanted to know could I carry on as normal and the said yes, (with all the usual don’t sue me caveats. )

Bit like yourself I am wrong side of 40. Did you do a warm up beforehand? I am astonished at the jump from to over 180 by about 800m but everyone is different of course.

As a matter of interest, I have attacehd my last 5k TT from January but I hasten to add that was from a Garmin watch as I was waiting for a replacement chest strap. After a 10 minute progessive warm up I started from 109bpm and it steadily rose to 176 and you will see a jump to 195 just at the finish line (at that stage I was fairly fcuked). Now I would put a lot of that spike down to the watch moving around and take it with a large pinch of salt.

I did the exact same run in October and I started at 104bpm and steadily rose to peak at 165bpm (no crazy spikes) and that was with a chest strap.

Glad to see you have it checked out. Just as a side note, HR can be elevated if the body is fighting an infection even though you feel grand.

darrenheaphy · 05-03-2021 11:34am

Yeah there are all kinds of stressors that can contribute to a higher than average heart rate including previous exercise. It can also take time to settle into a run. It depends on your fitness levels but for example a morning run for me would have a higher rate for the first 10km even at a slow shuffle pae.

Another thing to be mindful of is that even with premium watches the HR sensor is limited and can confuse itself and 'lock' into a cadence pace instead, Garmin have a short article on that here: https://support.garmin.com/en-IE/?faq=rxsywTpox9AHVzOXFxni59

If you're new to running it could well be you're simply running too fast and need to slow down. A general rule is 80% of your runs should be easy with 10 to 15% mid-level/tempo and 5% hard (intervals, race pace etc).

Reg'stoy · 05-03-2021 1:11pm

whatnext wrote: »

I’m the wrong side of mid 40s. In reasonable shape I think and wouldn’t be far off that. I’ve seen the quack about it because I was a bit concerned and they just said everyone is different. I had a cardiac assessment under stress (on a treadmill) and my heart can go from 50 resting to 200 and recover to below 100 in accordance with what ever they were expecting. I wasn’t interested in the science or explanations just wanted to know could I carry on as normal and the said yes, (with all the usual don’t sue me caveats. )

Will turn 52 this month, which would, with the 220 minus age drop my max to 168, regularly hit over 180+ (have set 184 as my max for HR zones). I used to worry about my HR spiking at the beginning of my runs but from what I have read, seems to be due to lack of warm up, now I do try and walk at first and do a few hop and skips etc and run a slowish first K. I've noticed that it tends to follow the weather as in the cold, something to do with muscles needing blood so the heart pumps quicker to get it there. Once I'm warmed up (literally) as you can see it drops down to a 'proper' rate.

If you are worried wait till you get the stress test and maybe do a HR rate check by pace as it walking, fast walking etc and see how it jumps or not.

dobman88 · 05-03-2021 5:18pm

Didnt want to start a new thread on this but what do folk do when struggling for motivation. I'd been doing relatively fine until this week. Getting out for a run almost every day. Varying between slow 13k to a quicker 5k. Whatever I felt in the mood for.

This week, I didn't go out once. Just hit a wall and couldnt be bothered. Its not like my legs needed a break from over doing it, I'm careful in that if I feel anything I give it a days rest and stretch if needed.

Not sure what advice I'm looking for really, just a bit fed up I spose

Cartman78 · 05-03-2021 5:50pm

Don't worry, you're not alone....it's very hard to keep focused/motivated these days with no events to aim for.

Aside from that, maybe take a few days break away from it and mix things up when you get back into it.

I started doing regular 5K time trials late last year which kept me going...I was actually closing in on a lifetime PB until a kidney stone intervened a couple of weeks ago.

I've also recently introduced hill repeats to my repertoire, and do varying lengths of intervals as well to try to keep things relatively interesting.

There's an excellent thread on here called "The Best 10K Workouts" which might be worth a look for you as well.

darrenheaphy · 05-03-2021 5:57pm

Dobman - it's seems like such a cliche but I set myself a weekly and monthly volume, use Strava to track progress towards that. Like Cartman78 I add some variety too - intervals on Monday, hill repeats later in the week, morning for low intensity runs and afternoons for short fast runs. With the lockdown it's hard to add route variety but it can be so much more interesting to find some nice alternative routes. I always try to find circular routes, rather than there and back again, way less tedious! Failing all that - sometimes I find a great book on Audible, if the book is good enough you'll want to get out and run just to listen to it!

partyguinness · 05-03-2021 6:05pm

dobman88 wrote: »

Didnt want to start a new thread on this but what do folk do when struggling for motivation. I'd been doing relatively fine until this week. Getting out for a run almost every day. Varying between slow 13k to a quicker 5k. Whatever I felt in the mood for.

This week, I didn't go out once. Just hit a wall and couldnt be bothered. Its not like my legs needed a break from over doing it, I'm careful in that if I feel anything I give it a days rest and stretch if needed.

Not sure what advice I'm looking for really, just a bit fed up I spose

You could try going for a few gentle bicylce rides just to mix it up a bit and to take your mind off running and at least you are doing something.

dobman88 · 05-03-2021 6:48pm

Cheers lads/ladies, all suggestions and advice appreciated, yeah I've found a couple of nice routes around me that do a loop, it's much better than a there and back I agree. Have tried to mix it up but just feel like it's all a bit for nothing at the moment. We got into a football final before then games were stopped last year and met the manager during the week who said it may not even be played so that kind of added to me asking myself why bother. Yes, first world problems very much, I admit. But it was keeping me going.

I dunno, just venting I guess.

darrenheaphy · 05-03-2021 7:12pm

dobman88 wrote: »

Cheers lads/ladies, all suggestions and advice appreciated, yeah I've found a couple of nice routes around me that do a loop, it's much better than a there and back I agree. Have tried to mix it up but just feel like it's all a bit for nothing at the moment. We got into a football final before then games were stopped last year and met the manager during the week who said it may not even be played so that kind of added to me asking myself why bother. Yes, first world problems very much, I admit. But it was keeping me going.

I dunno, just venting I guess.

Why not sign up to a goal that's bigger than you can do today. For example a marathon or the 80K Eco Trail or the Kerry Way Ultra Nite (~80K). Pick something bigger than you can do or nearly do, something that excites you, and that'll help have a north star to aim towards

keane2097 · 05-03-2021 9:50pm

dobman88 wrote: »

Cheers lads/ladies, all suggestions and advice appreciated, yeah I've found a couple of nice routes around me that do a loop, it's much better than a there and back I agree. Have tried to mix it up but just feel like it's all a bit for nothing at the moment. We got into a football final before then games were stopped last year and met the manager during the week who said it may not even be played so that kind of added to me asking myself why bother. Yes, first world problems very much, I admit. But it was keeping me going.

I dunno, just venting I guess.

I'm doing a training plan on the garmin for a half marathon which is giving me a bit of structure, a goal but a bit of flexibility too. There are other ones for different distances, could you start a plan aiming to do a certain time for 5k or 10k?

skyblue46 · 05-03-2021 10:54pm

Reg'stoy wrote: »

Will turn 52 this month, which would, with the 220 minus age drop my max to 168, regularly hit over 180+ (have set 184 as my max for HR zones). I used to worry about my HR spiking at the beginning of my runs but from what I have read, seems to be due to lack of warm up, now I do try and walk at first and do a few hop and skips etc and run a slowish first K. I've noticed that it tends to follow the weather as in the cold, something to do with muscles needing blood so the heart pumps quicker to get it there. Once I'm warmed up (literally) as you can see it drops down to a 'proper' rate.

If you are worried wait till you get the stress test and maybe do a HR rate check by pace as it walking, fast walking etc and see how it jumps or not.

That first 15 mins is it locking onto cadence in all probability, nothing to do with blood rushing to cold muscles. I have been a victim of it a few times.

Reg'stoy · 06-03-2021 11:22am

skyblue46 wrote: »

That first 15 mins is it locking onto cadence in all probability, nothing to do with blood rushing to cold muscles. I have been a victim of it a few times.

This is my cadence reading from that run, I always imagined that cadence was very subjective to the individual. Do you shorten your stride or reducing cadence at the beginning of your runs? and did it sort out your heart rate spikes?

I'm (personally) not too worried about the spike (it doesn't happen every run) and the remains of the run seem to be in a good place, plus the previous day I had PB'ed my 5k (23-13) and 10k (47-11) times during another 12k run. I'm doing the Ray Darcy challenge and so once a week I do an interval, 1k repeats or a quick run to mix things up, which seems to be working as in the last 10days I PB'ed my 5k,10k,15k and 10mile times and will try to do the same on my long run tomorrow when I'll run a 1/2 distance. Apologies for my conceitedness on the PB's but all too often it's tough to get the motivation (common for a lot these days) but for the last while I've been really enjoying my running.

walshb · 06-03-2021 3:43pm

Watching the 3000 today and seeing Travers run 8 mins 6 and Tobin 7 mins 47....

7 mins 47 is a really great time, albeit not elite...

Question: Our 3000 meters outdoor record is Mark Carroll's 1999 7 mins 30.

This is truly a brilliant time. Is it our best Irish record for men?

jamule · 06-03-2021 4:15pm

walshb wrote: »

Watching the 3000 today and seeing Travers run 8 mins 6 and Tobin 7 mins 47....

7 mins 47 is a really great time, albeit not elite...

Question: Our 3000 meters outdoor record is Mark Carroll's 1999 7 mins 30.

This is truly a brilliant time. Is it our best Irish record for men?

Coughlans indoor mile, still 4th fastest ever

walshb · 06-03-2021 4:25pm

jamule wrote: »

Coughlans indoor mile, still 4th fastest ever

5th fastest time, 4th fastest athlete.

Savage time

Carroll's outdoor probably greatest. Eamon's for indoor.

Pherekydes · 06-03-2021 6:17pm

Barr's 400 hurdles perhaps?

walshb · 06-03-2021 6:34pm

Pherekydes wrote: »

Barr's 400 hurdles perhaps?

Very far down the all time list...in the 300s

Carrol top 80 ever times!

Pherekydes · 06-03-2021 7:02pm

The best way to compare performance in different events is with the scoring tables. Coghlan's indoor mile is worth 1265, Carroll's 3000 is worth 1237 and Barr's is worth 1233.

skyblue46 · 06-03-2021 8:04pm

Reg'stoy wrote: »

This is my cadence reading from that run, I always imagined that cadence was very subjective to the individual. Do you shorten your stride or reducing cadence at the beginning of your runs? and did it sort out your heart rate spikes?

I'm (personally) not too worried about the spike (it doesn't happen every run) and the remains of the run seem to be in a good place, plus the previous day I had PB'ed my 5k (23-13) and 10k (47-11) times during another 12k run. I'm doing the Ray Darcy challenge and so once a week I do an interval, 1k repeats or a quick run to mix things up, which seems to be working as in the last 10days I PB'ed my 5k,10k,15k and 10mile times and will try to do the same on my long run tomorrow when I'll run a 1/2 distance. Apologies for my conceitedness on the PB's but all too often it's tough to get the motivation (common for a lot these days) but for the last while I've been really enjoying my running.

No need to change anything. Its just that the HR monitor fails to pick up on your HR and is actually counting your cadence. It usually corrects itself fairly quickly on a run.

dobman88 · 08-03-2021 11:47am

keane2097 wrote: »

I'm doing a training plan on the garmin for a half marathon which is giving me a bit of structure, a goal but a bit of flexibility too. There are other ones for different distances, could you start a plan aiming to do a certain time for 5k or 10k?

Thanks for all the help and advice. I had a look at training plans over the weekend and decided to give the half a go. There is an event on Valentia Island in September I think that I will work towards and I did the sister event 10k in the Gap of Dunloe in Kerry last year. The 20k version of that looked deadly too tbf.

My furthest run so far is just shy of 18k, I did that in last years lockdown and was beat after it so never attempted anything over 15k since.

As brilliant as an 80k ultra sounds, I'm 16 stone and played GAA all my life so not built for an 80k but respect to anyone doing that. Just not for me.

keane2097 · 08-03-2021 4:04pm

dobman88 wrote: »

Thanks for all the help and advice. I had a look at training plans over the weekend and decided to give the half a go. There is an event on Valentia Island in September I think that I will work towards and I did the sister event 10k in the Gap of Dunloe in Kerry last year. The 20k version of that looked deadly too tbf.

My furthest run so far is just shy of 18k, I did that in last years lockdown and was beat after it so never attempted anything over 15k since.

As brilliant as an 80k ultra sounds, I'm 16 stone and played GAA all my life so not built for an 80k but respect to anyone doing that. Just not for me.

Good idea, I'll see you there so.

shotgunmcos · 08-03-2021 9:07pm

Quick one I've been pondering.

Do those of you with indivual coaches focus on a give distance that is their kind of speciality like short, mid, long distance, or is it general running coaching tailored to your goals.

Like how does a coach respond to someone who just want to PR all distances? What was your thinking getting a coach? Specific target or generally improve? I know there are coaches here too so happy for either side of the relationship to comment.

One of the reasons I ask is that back when I did triathlon I had 2 different coaches. One for shorter distance racing and a different one when I focused on long distance.

Thanks

healy1835 · 08-03-2021 9:59pm

shotgunmcos wrote: »

Quick one I've been pondering.

Do those of you with indivual coaches focus on a give distance that is their kind of speciality like short, mid, long distance, or is it general running coaching tailored to your goals.

Like how does a coach respond to someone who just want to PR all distances? What was your thinking getting a coach? Specific target or generally improve? I know there are coaches here too so happy for either side of the relationship to comment.

One of the reasons I ask is that back when I did triathlon I had 2 different coaches. One for shorter distance racing and a different one when I focused on long distance.

Thanks

Well in my case, I started running to train for DCM and my mate/coach gave me my training. I hadn't really been running beforehand so I didn't overthink things.

He'd be experienced from 1500m up to the Marathon so I wouldn't have any worries in that regard. Whilst I've pretty much moved from marathon block to marathon block, racing shorter distances is always encouraged and these races are usually key components and touch points of all the blocks.

I love trying to improve across all the various distances, but the Marathon is King and my training always has that in mind

Swashbuckler · 08-03-2021 10:41pm

shotgunmcos wrote: »

Quick one I've been pondering.

Do those of you with indivual coaches focus on a give distance that is their kind of speciality like short, mid, long distance, or is it general running coaching tailored to your goals.

Like how does a coach respond to someone who just want to PR all distances? What was your thinking getting a coach? Specific target or generally improve? I know there are coaches here too so happy for either side of the relationship to comment.

One of the reasons I ask is that back when I did triathlon I had 2 different coaches. One for shorter distance racing and a different one when I focused on long distance.

Thanks

It's a good question.

For me the reason I reached out to KSU was a prompt from a poster on here. I had been asking several questiona and the suggestion of coaching was mentioned. Once I accepted that all levels of runner get coaches I figured why not reach out. One conversation later and I had a coach.

In terms of goals etc, in my case I was clear. 10k is my distance I'd like to peak at with a view to eventually moving up to marathon. Given my long term mentality the training really focuses around long term consistency, day in day out, week after week year after year. Nothing spectacular. Running solid training regularly and balancing life within that.

I do think short distance gains can come from long distance training though. Look at healy!

darrenheaphy · 09-03-2021 2:44pm

Totally agree on coach - I've found a more tailored plan has been transformative, this particular guy (James Sullivan from Carrick-on-Suir) has been fantastic on technique and finding a balanced weekly volume of 100km+ a week, prior to lockdown was getting approx 40km a week. In short my plan is a general mix of low intensity volume, intervals, hill repeats and a fast (or hard mountain run) on Saturday.

robinph · 09-03-2021 3:02pm

Had my first jab today, but based on a totally unscientific survey of other runners locally I think I'll be taking a couple of days off from running now. Lots of people generally getting some mild symptoms which doesn't bother me in the slightest, but have heard a couple of runners who felt all superhuman after their vaccination and carried on training... Then the mild symptoms seemed to be a bit worse and drag on for longer.

Probably a load of nonsense and totally unrelated, but I'll use it as an excuse to eat some junk food and sit on the sofa this evening instead. Not that I need much of an excuse for that.

Omega28 · 09-03-2021 11:15pm

How many kms a week would you guys be putting in? I'm relatively new to running and just trying to gauge where I should be at.

OOnegative · 09-03-2021 11:21pm

Omega28 wrote: »

How many kms a week would you guys be putting in? I'm relatively new to running and just trying to gauge where I should be at.

How many kms a week you running now?

Ceepo · 09-03-2021 11:23pm

Omega28 wrote: »

How many kms a week would you guys be putting in? I'm relatively new to running and just trying to gauge where I should be at.

The more relevant question is, how many kms can you do, without impacting of other life and work balance.

ariana` · 10-03-2021 10:29am

Omega28 wrote: »

How many kms a week would you guys be putting in? I'm relatively new to running and just trying to gauge where I should be at.

Most of us built up gradually over time... You will either burn out or get injured if you try to do to much to soon. A rule of thumb is to increase by no more than 10% per week and not every week! So every 3rd or 4th week step back a bit to let the training be absorbed.

Might be worth trying to find a plan to follow to help you build in a sustainable way. Consistency over time really is key - patience is your friend.

And as Ceepo quite rightly says it's about what you can manage within your own circumstances - work/life balance.

Random Running Questions

Comments