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The Alabama senate has voted to ban abortion after six weeks

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    #62
    KSU
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭KSU


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    And this is just the start of what seems inevitable that this will go to the US Supreme Court.

    While there is talk of this off the back of the Alabama law they are not the first to sign such a trigger law in recent years (Alabama are now the 8th) These span back the last 8 years.


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    #63
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    emmaro wrote: »
    Horrible what Alabama has voted for. They care more about a bunch of cells than the children dying in their schools every week from guns.
    Is this from eating guns, or inhaling them?


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    #64
    upandcumming
    Registered Users Posts: 2,709 ✭✭✭upandcumming


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    I don't really understand the American right's obsession with trying to keep women from having abortions. It's definitely not concern for the children. It's appalling that a group of men can exert this level of control over what women do with their bodies. Utterly disgusting.

    Sorry what group of men?

    The men that voted for for law? The same fellas that were elected to the Senate by citizens of the stae?

    This type of rubbish does little to help anyone's cause and certainly not the pro-choice cause.


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    #65
    Mr. CooL ICE
    Registered Users Posts: 17,497 ✭✭✭✭Mr. CooL ICE


    Outlaw Pete wrote: »
    Amazing, in the run-up to the referendum users (such as myself) were permanently banned from posting in the repeal thread if the made even the slightest disparaging remarks about those with pro-choice views and yet here you have a clear insult aimed at the OP and anyone that dares agree with him, thanked by AH mods.

    But yet they'll tell you they don't moderate in a biased way. Ha!

    Mod: "the slightest disparaging remarks" is an grossly inaccurate and dishonest description of what got you threadbanned from that thread.

    You're around long enough to know not to discuss moderation on thread. Let this post of yours be the last of it or it won't be threads you'll be banned from.


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    #66
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,153 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    upandcumming wrote: »
    Sorry what group of men?

    The men that voted for for law? The same fellas that were elected to the Senate by citizens of the stae?

    This type of rubbish does little to help anyone's cause and certainly not the pro-choice cause.

    Elected? Please. A broke 2-party system means you're stretching that word a fair bit.

    My point stands. A group of conservative white men voting to deny women bodily autonomy whose concern for the unborn child ends at childbirth.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #67
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Imagine not allowing it in the case of rape or FFA.

    The celebrating of people in this thread is sickening too. I hope you never, ever have a daughter who needs you and your help when she finds herself in a crisis pregnancy.


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    #68
    KSU
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭KSU


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    Elected? Please. A broke 2-party system means you're stretching that word a fair bit.

    But democratic majority in the Senate was consecutive for 136 years until 2010 in Alabama so yes people actively went against the grain of the state and the status quo.


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    #69
    KSU
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭KSU


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Imagine not allowing it in the case of rape or FFA.

    While I am not condoning it should be noted that the number of people in this thread who have raised this point is not indicative of the actual statistics in the US which stand at less than 1% of all abortions carried out each year.


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    #70
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    KSU wrote: »
    While I am not condoning it should be noted that the number of people in this thread who have raised this point is not indicative of the actual statistics in the US which stand at less than 1% of all abortions carried out each year.

    And?


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    #71
    SoundsRight
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 408 ✭✭SoundsRight


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Imagine not allowing it in the case of rape or FFA.

    The celebrating of people in this thread is sickening too. I hope you never, ever have a daughter who needs you and your help when she finds herself in a crisis pregnancy.

    You know, you can help a woman and not pressure her into having an abortion. The hope is that a return to traditional family values will see less women finding themselves having an unplanned pregnancy.


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    #72
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    B0jangles wrote: »
    Hasn't been repeatedly established that making abortion illegal doesn't reduce the number of abortions, it just turns them into backstreet abortions?

    Yeah, but lets be honest, they dont really give a **** about women.

    Making people you dont know and will never meet follow their rules gets them all revved up.


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    #73
    Ineedaname
    Closed Accounts Posts: 369 ✭✭Ineedaname


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Imagine not allowing it in the case of rape or FFA.

    It gets worse. Alabama is one of the few states that allows rapists to sue for custody of their children.


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    #74
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »
    Why so many people here care so much about the women of Alabama I'll never figure out.

    Tell me about it. Theyll be claiming they are actual people next and looking for them to be the equal of men. This needs to be stopped.


    Why are so many here concerned with the foetus' of Alabama?


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    #75
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Guy:Incognito wrote:
    Yeah, but lets be honest, they dont really give a **** about women.

    Such an easy and bull**** thing to say. I've far from made my mind up about this but **** like this is dishonest


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    #76
    KSU
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭KSU


    Faugheen wrote: »
    And?

    My point is that this argument is the go to with pro choice despite the fact that it accounts for such a small number. Pro life tend to focus on catch all law because once you start bringing in exceptions it is where the law gets eroded into nothingness (which is part of the reason they don't want to address Roe vs Wade)

    Counter argument that is sometimes made is that rape outside of marriage often are pro choice for anonymity and less chance of conviction and being caught through DNA. With it is not emotionally sensitive to the victim it is one that is made from a deterrent standpoint by some.


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    #77
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    SoundsRight wrote: »
    The news from across the pond is very heartening. Alabama, Georgia, Missouri....fantastic stuff. Good, proud states leading the way. People are realising that a human life actually means something.
    .

    Maybe they'll get slavery back too and they can have the good ol days again.


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    #78
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Guy:Incognito wrote:
    Maybe they'll get slavery back too and they can have the good ol days again.

    That is genuinely sick. Comparing someone who disagrees with abortion to be in any way related to a slave owner?

    Can you hear yourself?

    Jesus christ


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    #79
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users Posts: 8,094 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    SoundsRight wrote: »
    You know, you can help a woman and not pressure her into having an abortion. The hope is that a return to traditional family values will see less women finding themselves having an unplanned pregnancy.

    What do traditional family values have to do with anything? Do you mean the time when women were expected to be baby machines? Yeah sounds great. Wouldn't be surprised to see these backwards states legalise marital rape again the way they are going.

    Women have always found themselves having unplanned pregnancies and always will. Allowing women to choose whether to continue with pregnancy or not is not pressuring her into abortion. Most women still go on to have the child given the option.

    And if alabama really cared about human life then why do they have the death penalty?


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    #80
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    Patty Hearst wrote: »
    60% of Abortions in Alabama were obtained by African American Women. Interesting stat

    A group who have a significantly lower median income than the white population of Alabama.
    I wonder if they feel they cant afford large families....

    But sure **** it, 6 starving people and 0 abortions is better than 4 who can get by.


    Maybe all the middle aged white folk will adopt the extra black babies? No need to overtly say you want a house boy that way and you look all charitable helping the lower classes.


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    #81
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Guy:Incognito wrote:
    Maybe all the middle aged white folk will adopt the extra black babies? No need to overtly say you want a house boy that way and you look all charitable helping the lower classes.

    You are a racist


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    #82
    KSU
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭KSU


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    And if alabama really cared about human life then why do they have the death penalty?

    You do realise the only crime which warrants the death penalty is .......... Murder go figure


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    #83
    Taiga
    Registered Users Posts: 350 ✭✭Taiga


    Deleted User wrote: »
    That is genuinely sick. Comparing someone who disagrees with abortion to be in any way related to a slave owner?

    Can you hear yourself?

    Jesus christ

    Not much difference is there? Not if you're a woman who has been raped, or even (gasp!) a woman who doesn't want to be pregnant. You are being forced to stay pregnant against your will. These women were once embryo's too remember. Why does the compassion end once they're born?


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    #84
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    SoundsRight wrote: »
    You know, you can help a woman and not pressure her into having an abortion. The hope is that a return to traditional family values will see less women finding themselves having an unplanned pregnancy.

    Nobody is pressuring women into having abortion.

    It's about choice. If you don't want an abortion, don't have one.


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    #85
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users Posts: 8,094 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    KSU wrote: »
    You do realise the only crime which warrants the death penalty is .......... Murder go figure

    Yes, and? Life is sacred except when it's state sponsored murder? Then it's ok. Even better if they can execute women who have abortions. That will teach them to see themselves as anything other than brood mares. Under his eye.


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    #86
    Aeropress
    Site Banned Posts: 1 ✭Aeropress


    The reason these threads go around in circles forever is because both sides fail to address to underlying difference in opinion, they both debate and argue on the surface level.

    The true cause of the impasse is a failure to accept that morality is subjective, you can't tell someone that their morals is wrong, you can however tell them that their morals are inconsistent.

    For example if someone believes that ending the life of the unborn is immoral because life is sacred while also supporting the death penalty then they are inconsistent in their morals unless they can explain further nuances to their morals.

    Likewise, those on the pro choice side fail to accept that it is perfectly reasonable and valid to believe that it is immoral to kill the unborn, therefore abortion should be illegal. They often just can't accept a difference of opinion on morals and resort to name calling.


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    #87
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    KSU wrote: »
    My point is that this argument is the go to with pro choice despite the fact that it accounts for such a small number. Pro life tend to focus on catch all law because once you start bringing in exceptions it is where the law gets eroded into nothingness (which is part of the reason they don't want to address Roe vs Wade)

    Counter argument that is sometimes made is that rape outside of marriage often are pro choice for anonymity and less chance of conviction and being caught through DNA. With it is not emotionally sensitive to the victim it is one that is made from a deterrent standpoint by some.

    So these women should be forced to go through with a pregnancy after a traumatic experience such as rape?

    Unless you are disagreeing with the above, everything you've said is irrelevant to what I said.


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    #88
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Such an easy and bull**** thing to say. I've far from made my mind up about this but **** like this is dishonest

    Its not at all. If you cared about women youd let them make their own decisions in life based on their own circumstances.

    Deciding you know whats best for people you dont and wont ever know (and plenty you will) is ****ed up .

    Laws need to be made for the good of society. Thats a given, Some things dont require the input of anyone else . This is certainly one of those things.


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    #89
    Taiga
    Registered Users Posts: 350 ✭✭Taiga


    Riiigghhttt...


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    #90
    rossie1977
    Registered Users Posts: 11,341 ✭✭✭✭rossie1977


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    I don't really understand the American right's obsession with trying to keep women from having abortions. It's definitely not concern for the children. It's appalling that a group of men can exert this level of control over what women do with their bodies. Utterly disgusting.

    Social conservatives view women as third class citizens basically. We see how women are treated in even more conservative countries like Saudi Arabia..that's basically the goal of us social conservatives, to control what women do.

    A progressive society where women are free-thinking would be a deathnail for us conservatism.


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    #91
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Taiga wrote:
    Not much difference is there? Not if you're a woman who has been raped, or even (gasp!) a woman who doesn't want to be pregnant. You are being forced to stay pregnant against your will. These women were once embryo's too remember. Why does the compassion end once they're born?

    The majority of women who chose abortion all across the world are not rape victims. We shouldn't legislate just for the hard cases I'm undecided on the issue. I understand both sides but when horrible comments like conflating abortion with slavery appear, I'm damned if I won't call it out. It's horrific and disingenuous.


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