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Mobile phones and other electronic devices in school

2

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,182 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    If you are subbing in a school best thing to do when you go in is ask what is the policy on mobile phones and then follow that. My school has a ban on phones, if they are caught with them it's confiscated for three weeks. It works very well.


    What happens if a student tells you to 'F Off' It's my property" kind of thing. What if they refused to hand over and their parents back them 100%. They claim the last time it was handed over it was all scratched. And lo and behold yes there does seem to be damage to it. 'And you're lucky I'm not suing you'. How it got damaged is anyone's guess. Huge aggression. Students walk out of school rather than hand it up. And not a bother. A day off.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,746 ✭✭✭Drag00n79


    bobbyss wrote:
    What happens if a student tells you to 'F Off' It's my property" kind of thing. What if they refused to hand over and their parents back them 100%. They claim the last time it was handed over it was all scratched. And lo and behold yes there does seem to be damage to it. 'And you're lucky I'm not suing you'. How it got damaged is anyone's guess. Huge aggression. Students walk out of school rather than hand it up. And not a bother. A day off.


    And on top of that a school is on legal thin ice confiscating a phone.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    Drag00n79 wrote: »
    And on top of that a school is on legal thin ice confiscating a phone.

    In etch case it should refer back to the rules.
    It's no different than if a student took out a fidget spinner and started playing with it.... but it seems like some students can claim special privileges because it's their phone!

    I think we had the same attitude coming through in a recent enoug post where a student felt aggrieved his vaping device was confiscated!!!

    Students and parents sign up to abide by the rules. If they don't comply then they shouldn't have a legal leg to stand on. So i think it all goes back to how much the school are acting 'as one' in line with policy ...or making it up as they go along without amending policy.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,182 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    In etch case it should refer back to the rules.
    It's no different than if a student took out a fidget spinner and started playing with it.... but it seems like some students can claim special privileges because it's their phone!

    I think we had the same attitude coming through in a recent enoug post where a student felt aggrieved his vaping device was confiscated!!!

    Students and parents sign up to abide by the rules. If they don't comply then they shouldn't have a legal leg to stand on. So i think it all goes back to how much the school are acting 'as one' in line with policy ...or making it up as they go along without amending policy.

    There is a big difference between a fidget spinner and a three hundred euro mobile.
    A school may also be in a vulnerable place trying to enforce rules that a student (ie a child) has been asked to 'sign up' to. Is that in itself legal?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,700 ✭✭✭amacca


    bobbyss wrote: »
    What happens if a student tells you to 'F Off' It's my property" kind of thing. What if they refused to hand over and their parents back them 100%. They claim the last time it was handed over it was all scratched. And lo and behold yes there does seem to be damage to it. 'And you're lucky I'm not suing you'. How it got damaged is anyone's guess. Huge aggression. Students walk out of school rather than hand it up. And not a bother. A day off.

    Theres something wrong with a system where rules about mobile phones can't be enforced imo

    (I accept the fact that its reality but really its the tail wagging the dog here)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    bobbyss wrote: »
    There is a big difference between a fidget spinner and a three hundred euro mobile.

    Cost has no bearing. No more than if it were a €300 bong.
    bobbyss wrote: »
    A school may also be in a vulnerable place trying to enforce rules that a student (ie a child) has been asked to 'sign up' to. Is that in itself legal?

    I said parents and students.
    Further to that, loco parentis gives the school the right to act in the best interests of the child, and other effected students.

    They can keep it in their pocket and turn it off.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 382 ✭✭Giveaway


    Its called a signal jammer and its illegal to use as it could prevent someone calling the emergency services...
    its about the size of a phone with a small antenna attached you can buy them off aliexpress and the likes

    A faraday cage is not a jammer. Been around for centuries. An airplane fuselage would be an example. Nobody inside is fried by a lightning strike. Build around a classroom and can use landline or step out into corridor to make emergency call


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 382 ✭✭Giveaway


    bobbyss wrote: »
    What happens if a student tells you to 'F Off' It's my property" kind of thing. What if they refused to hand over and their parents back them 100%. They claim the last time it was handed over it was all scratched. And lo and behold yes there does seem to be damage to it. 'And you're lucky I'm not suing you'. How it got damaged is anyone's guess. Huge aggression. Students walk out of school rather than hand it up. And not a bother. A day off.
    Then the school disciplinary process kicks in. I would exclude him from class until phone handed over


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Giveaway wrote: »
    Then the school disciplinary process kicks in. I would exclude him from class until phone handed over

    That's great. If you didn't have a spare phone 9j your bag.
    You could get one and hand it up and keep your own.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 382 ✭✭Giveaway


    That's great. If you didn't have a spare phone 9j your bag.
    You could get one and hand it up and keep your own.
    Troubkesome teen storming out and hanging out at home is the parents responsibility


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  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Giveaway wrote: »
    Troubkesome teen storming out and hanging out at home is the parents responsibility

    Saying they are troublesome is a bit over dramatic.
    Just because you use a phone in school and won't hand it over to a teacher doesn't really make you a troublesome teen in my experience.
    All you've to do is get another phone and hand it up and your back in school. Your not really excluding them if they get back in when the phone is handed up.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,268 ✭✭✭twowheelsonly


    Its called a signal jammer and its illegal to use as it could prevent someone calling the emergency services...
    its about the size of a phone with a small antenna attached you can buy them off aliexpress and the likes

    The law is funny on these things as you can use them with a licence as long as they don't interfere with other licensees (e.g. Mobile phone service providers..). Therefore to use them needs the consent of the affected services.
    I can vaguely recall that a cinema was ordered to remove one under threat of prosecution.

    The big question of course is how often do students need to call the emergency services ? I'd take a guess at never in this country.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,632 ✭✭✭SligoBrewer


    That's great. If you didn't have a spare phone 9j your bag.
    You could get one and hand it up and keep your own.

    The days of spare phones are gone with activation on servers, added cost of phones and having accounts tied to one device only. This isn't 2006 anymore when we could text in our pockets without looking at the screen.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭ Amirah Spoiled Tourist


    What about this 5G rollout over the coming years, will it be a 'health experiment' of sorts?

    With new millimeter wavelengths, it requires thousands of new 'small cell' towers (possibly using upgraded streetlights).


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    The days of spare phones are gone with activation on servers, added cost of phones and having accounts tied to one device only. This isn't 2006 anymore when we could text in our pockets without looking at the screen.

    We had touch phones in the later half of secondary school.
    Plenty got away with texting.
    Cheap touch phones are available in Tesco. I know people who still do it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,371 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, does that apply to students 18 yrs old? Surely that's illegal?

    Why would it be illegal? It's part of the school policy that parents and students have signed up to. Phones are banned in the school. If they are caught with a phone, it's a 3 week ban. Then they get it back.

    Actually about 2 years ago a parent went and reported the confiscated phone as theft at the local garda station. The guards called up, heard what happened and said grand and left.

    We rarely see a phone now. We're not so naive as to assume that students don't have phones with them, but they would never take one out in class, the penalty is too severe (and is enforced) if they are caught.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    We rarely see a phone now. We're not so naive as to assume that students don't have phones with them, but they would never take one out in class, the penalty is too severe (and is enforced) if they are caught.

    I have to say your very naive of you think they never take them out.
    Our policy was was stricter than yere's and it was enforced but most people chanced it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,371 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    bobbyss wrote: »
    What happens if a student tells you to 'F Off' It's my property" kind of thing. What if they refused to hand over and their parents back them 100%. They claim the last time it was handed over it was all scratched. And lo and behold yes there does seem to be damage to it. 'And you're lucky I'm not suing you'. How it got damaged is anyone's guess. Huge aggression. Students walk out of school rather than hand it up. And not a bother. A day off.


    Well I'll ask them again. If it continues they'll be marched down to the principal's office and parents called in. Funny enough once that is the other option the phone is handed over fairly quickly.
    Drag00n79 wrote: »
    And on top of that a school is on legal thin ice confiscating a phone.

    It's in our school policy. We don't plan on keeping it, it will be returned after three weeks. Same as any other object that can be confiscated.
    In etch case it should refer back to the rules.
    It's no different than if a student took out a fidget spinner and started playing with it.... but it seems like some students can claim special privileges because it's their phone!

    I think we had the same attitude coming through in a recent enoug post where a student felt aggrieved his vaping device was confiscated!!!

    Students and parents sign up to abide by the rules. If they don't comply then they shouldn't have a legal leg to stand on. So i think it all goes back to how much the school are acting 'as one' in line with policy ...or making it up as they go along without amending policy.

    Yep, phones are no different from hoopy earrings, facial piercings and multicoloured jackets or whatever else schools usually ban.
    bobbyss wrote: »
    There is a big difference between a fidget spinner and a three hundred euro mobile.
    A school may also be in a vulnerable place trying to enforce rules that a student (ie a child) has been asked to 'sign up' to. Is that in itself legal?

    Nope. A school's policy is their terms and conditions. Should we not have any rules at all??? You sign up to all sorts of terms and conditions everywhere else in life. Why should schools be different? Children don't sign up to rules on their own, their parents are also signing up to them. Parents are agreeing to not let their child bring a phone to school. They have access to the office phone if they need to ring home, and a message can be left at the office for a child if a parent needs to contact them. We don't have a problem with it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,371 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    I have to say your very naive of you think they never take them out.
    Our policy was was stricter than yere's and it was enforced but most people chanced it.

    OK, let me rephrase so. It's extremely rare that a student will take out a mobile phone in class where there is a high chance of getting caught and getting it confiscated.

    In the last three years since we've had this rule in the school I've confiscated 2 phones, both from students who were caught in class with them, both in the first year we brought in the rule. Our students sit and chat to each other on the corridors at break time/lunch time instead of staring at phones like zombies. That can only be a good thing.

    Of course students have their phones with them. We are not stupid. But you cannot follow a student into a toilet cubicle to check if they are on their phone. We also don't have parents ringing the school demanding phones back. They know the rule is enforced and are on board with it as it's in the best interests of the students.


  • Registered Users Posts: 48,129 ✭✭✭✭km79


    Blaizes wrote: »
    Thank you Rainbow Trout I will do that.It's just hard to know from school to school.My own kids primary school is very strict and notes come home regularly reminding us that the children must not bring in mobile phones or devices but it seems to me that in some schools that it seems to be a grey area and I don't know if I am within my right to take the phones and leave on teacher desk till the end of class.Then as I have said if some children have e books on devices etc. It's just not easy to manage.

    No child in primary school NEEDS a mobile phone
    I don't understand parents some time .
    I know there is peer pressure etc but parents need to be parents!
    My oldest is doing his LC now. He got his first phone at Xmas of 1st year. A basic phone.
    He got his first proper smart phone after his JC which was a hand me down from me when I upgraded.
    My other lad is in 2nd class now . He will not be getting one until secondary school again.
    I don't accept the argument children need them at that age for after sports matches /training etc
    We managed before we can manage now .

    We also have a strict policy and it is enforced.
    If parents dont like the policy they have a choice of 2 other schools in the area......


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  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    OK, let me rephrase so. It's extremely rare that a student will take out a mobile phone in class where there is a high chance of getting caught and getting it confiscated.

    In the last three years since we've had this rule in the school I've confiscated 2 phones, both from students who were caught in class with them, both in the first year we brought in the rule. Our students sit and chat to each other on the corridors at break time/lunch time instead of staring at phones like zombies. That can only be a good thing.

    Of course students have their phones with them. We are not stupid. But you cannot follow a student into a toilet cubicle to check if they are on their phone. We also don't have parents ringing the school demanding phones back. They know the rule is enforced and are on board with it as it's in the best interests of the students.

    Personally I don't think you see students using phones in class and you dont catch them them. I found teachers slow to catch people out.
    This is coming from a student who saw many students using phones in schools. You had to be careful tough. It was only the dozy kids that got caught out.
    Our school had a zero tolerance policy. Phones banned from school grounds between 9 AM. and 3.45 PM. So there were no phone use in corridors/etc and we talked.
    We just played games/texted/etc during class.
    We're not going to agree about this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,371 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    Personally I don't think you see students using phones in class and you dont catch them them. I found teachers slow to catch people out.
    This is coming from a student who saw many students using phones in schools. You had to be careful tough. It was only the dozy kids that got caught out.
    Our school had a zero tolerance policy. Phones banned from school grounds between 9 AM. and 3.45 PM. So there were no phone use in corridors/etc and we talked.
    We just played games/texted/etc during class.
    We're not going to agree about this.

    We're not going to agree about this because you assume I'm blind. I have eyes in the back of my head. Students don't take phones out in my class because they know it's not worth the hassle. You don't have to see the phone to know a student is using it, a student looking at their lap with one hand under the desk is enough to know what they are doing.

    You also don't understand that the culture in some schools is different to others. Rules might have been strict in your school but students didn't pass any heed. It's different in other schools.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    We're not going to agree about this because you assume I'm blind. I have eyes in the back of my head. Students don't take phones out in my class because they know it's not worth the hassle. You don't have to see the phone to know a student is using it, a student looking at their lap with one hand under the desk is enough to know what they are doing.

    You also don't understand that the culture in some schools is different to others. Rules might have been strict in your school but students didn't pass any heed. It's different in other schools.

    I know everything you just said regarding about looking down/keeping your hands up/etc.
    You've just to be careful not to get caught.
    I used leave my phone on my desk and put my copy over it. A lot did it.
    I've seen teachers with the same attitude as yours and they believed that nobody used phones in there class. They hadn't a clue u my experience.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,371 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    I know everything you just said regarding about looking down/keeping your hands up/etc.
    You've just to be careful not to get caught.
    I used leave my phone on my desk and put my copy over it. A lot did it.
    I've seen teachers with the same attitude as yours and they believed that nobody used phones in there class. They hadn't a clue u my experience.

    You wouldn't have a hope of doing that in my class. I'd spot a gap under a copy and have the phone gone before you'd realise it. I do a lot of mileage around the room in 40 minutes. And a lot more teachers would too. You've probably not considered that maybe the teachers in your school just couldn't be bothered enforcing the rule and chose not to see the phones.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    You wouldn't have a hope of doing that in my class. I'd spot a gap under a copy and have the phone gone before you'd realise it. I do a lot of mileage around the room in 40 minutes. And a lot more teachers would too. You've probably not considered that maybe the teachers in your school just couldn't be bothered enforcing the rule and chose not to see the phones.

    Of course I thought about that. They did care and took phones off people but only of those stupid enough to get caught.
    Personally I know teachers similar to you with the same attitude and ye haven't a clue in my experience.
    You've your mind made up and I've mine.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,119 ✭✭✭mtoutlemonde


    I know everything you just said regarding about looking down/keeping your hands up/etc.
    You've just to be careful not to get caught.
    I used leave my phone on my desk and put my copy over it. A lot did it.
    I've seen teachers with the same attitude as yours and they believed that nobody used phones in there class. They hadn't a clue u my experience.

    You must really think teachers are stupid. It has been pointed out that not all schools had a relaxed policy like yours ... I say relaxed because the teachers didn't follow policy. It's very easy to see a student who has their mind somewhere else during class and a phone under a copy wouldn't go on for too long. I have been in enough schools and have seen enough policies and I don't allow mobile phones because it just isn't safe nowadays because that one day when your patience is very thin ... you end up on social media. Now there was one school where phones were allowed during breaks between classes and allowing the students to use their phones (which I had no control over) during a double class was the longest three/four minutes of my working week but as a substitute, I had to allow it. I love the idea that rainbowtrout pointed out that the students actually have to speak to each other instead of looking at screens.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,119 ✭✭✭mtoutlemonde


    Of course I thought about that. They did care and took phones off people but only of those stupid enough to get caught.
    Personally I know teachers similar to you with the same attitude and ye haven't a clue in my experience.
    You've your mind made up and I've mine.

    Yes but that's from a students perspective. I also move around the room and usually teach from the middle if possible so I can see what every student is doing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    You must really think teachers are stupid. It has been pointed out that not all schools had a relaxed policy like yours ... I say relaxed because the teachers didn't follow policy. It's very easy to see a student who has their mind somewhere else during class and a phone under a copy wouldn't go on for too long. I have been in enough schools and have seen enough policies and I don't allow mobile phones because it just isn't safe nowadays because that one day when your patience is very thin ... you end up on social media. Now there was one school where phones were allowed during breaks between classes and allowing the students to use their phones (which I had no control over) during a double class was the longest three/four minutes of my working week but as a substitut, I had to allow it. I love the idea that rainbowtrout pointed out that the students actually have to speak to each other instead of looking at screens.

    We spoke at lunch time as well.
    I've made it clear that my school hadn't a relaxed policy but a lot of teachers were naive and didn't see things. And came out with the same stuff as
    rainbowtrout.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,022 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Yes but that's from a students perspective. I also move around the room and usually teach from the middle if possible so I can see what every student is doing.

    My teachers did this also!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,119 ✭✭✭mtoutlemonde


    My teachers did this also!

    Again teachers were not following school policy. I don't know when or where you went to school but things have tightened up considerably.


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