DCM 2019 - Mentored Novices Thread

Lombardo123 · 10-05-2019 10:53pm

Hopefully a sign of things to come but didn't let plans get in the way of my runs this week.

Wedding tomorrow so a 14k last night and a little 5k recovery tonight.

Hoping to keep the momentum going while building the base mileage up.

This group already increasing accountability!

The Black Oil · 10-05-2019 11:00pm

frash wrote: »

Any suggestions for eating during the LSR?
Gels can help a bit on the longer runs but is there any 'energy bar' type things that people find useful?

Make your own energy balls. Dates, ground almonds, cinnamon, coca powder, etc. Plenty of recipes out there.

pd79 · 11-05-2019 8:33am

Huzzah! wrote: »

So, you're currently doing one midweek run of 5-10k and a weekend parkrun of 5?

The first week of HH1 is three by 5k plus a 10k. I think I would personally keep the LR at 10k for now and get used to having a third day of running before increasing again. It might also be worth introducing the third day incrementally, so maybe start with 3k and add to it each week. Then we can see about adding the fourth day.

Great thank you. Im currently doing two midweek 5k's and 10k lsr at weekend. So I'll keep LSR at 10k and introduce third run midweek. Thank you for the advice

Wombled · 11-05-2019 9:31am

Great looking through all your threads, super motivation. I had to have varicose veins laser procedure yesterday( had to have it done due to swelling and irritation around the ankle). Loads of walking for me in the meantime, back running in two weeks. So feeling really jealous of ye all now. Loving your reasons for doing DCM. Great example for children, if you put the hard work and training in anything is possible. Good luck everyone

Animella · 11-05-2019 9:40am

Welcome to everyone who has joined. Looking forward to sharing our progress over the next few months.

Just one worry I have to get off my chest before embarking on a plan- I have an irrational fear of running four days a week , or three days in a row!

I guess it’s because I have never done it and have survived so far running three days a week with cross training.
I KNOW that to improve I just need to run more often. I know it doesn’t have to be faster, or further, just more days a week.
Maybe I’m just lazy? But I am so scared of getting injured and ruining everything. I’m also afraid of totally zapping my energy levels.
How do I overcome this?

ReeReeG · 11-05-2019 10:32am

Animella wrote:

Just one worry I have to get off my chest before embarking on a plan- I have an irrational fear of running four days a week , or three days in a row!

I guess itâ€™s because I have never done it and have survived so far running three days a week with cross training. I KNOW that to improve I just need to run more often. I know it doesnâ€™t have to be faster, or further, just more days a week. Maybe Iâ€™m just lazy? But I am so scared of getting injured and ruining everything. Iâ€™m also afraid of totally zapping my energy levels. How do I overcome this?

That's a perfectly acceptable fear to have, but I can also assure you will overcome it no problem! I looked back at your first post, you're running 3 times a week right now so 2 midweek and 1 weekend, yes?

It's all about building it up sensibly. So could you start adding one more day midweek starting soon? It doesn't have to be anything crazy, even 15-20 mins at a really easy pace.

The plans build at levels that should prevent injuries, provided the easy runs are run at an actually easy pace.

py · 11-05-2019 10:33am

Would be interested to hear what people do after a run in terms of stretching/foam rolling.

Mr. Guappa · 11-05-2019 10:34am

Animella wrote: »

Welcome to everyone who has joined. Looking forward to sharing our progress over the next few months.

Just one worry I have to get off my chest before embarking on a plan- I have an irrational fear of running four days a week , or three days in a row!

I guess it’s because I have never done it and have survived so far running three days a week with cross training.
I KNOW that to improve I just need to run more often. I know it doesn’t have to be faster, or further, just more days a week.
Maybe I’m just lazy? But I am so scared of getting injured and ruining everything. I’m also afraid of totally zapping my energy levels.
How do I overcome this?

I had the exact same concerns this time last year - I was running 2-3 days a week and couldn't fathom my body withstanding more than that. The key is to slow it right down, and add additional days and mileage gradually.

I know you said previously your two existing midweek runs were 6-8km each. I'd drop them back to 5km for now, and add the third midweek day starting at maybe 3km, building that up to 5km over the course of a few weeks.

Keeping the paces slow will keep the energy levels from being drained. You should be able to comfortably hold a conversation at easy pace. Slow running will help build the endurance required for distannce running.

Animella · 11-05-2019 11:40am

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

I had the exact same concerns this time last year - I was running 2-3 days a week and couldn't fathom my body withstanding more than that. The key is to slow it right down, and add additional days and mileage gradually.

I know you said previously your two existing midweek runs were 6-8km each. I'd drop them back to 5km for now, and add the third midweek day starting at maybe 3km, building that up to 5km over the course of a few weeks.

Keeping the paces slow will keep the energy levels from being drained. You should be able to comfortably hold a conversation at easy pace. Slow running will help build the endurance required for distannce running.

Thanks, Mr. Guappa, I’ll try that.

No problem with running slowly at conversational pace, that’s my forte! I’ll add a short extra run.

Treviso · 11-05-2019 6:45pm

Animella wrote: »

Welcome to everyone who has joined. Looking forward to sharing our progress over the next few months.

Just one worry I have to get off my chest before embarking on a plan- I have an irrational fear of running four days a week , or three days in a row!

I guess it’s because I have never done it and have survived so far running three days a week with cross training.
I KNOW that to improve I just need to run more often. I know it doesn’t have to be faster, or further, just more days a week.
Maybe I’m just lazy? But I am so scared of getting injured and ruining everything. I’m also afraid of totally zapping my energy levels.
How do I overcome this?

If it's possible, try to incorporate a run, or more runs, on grass as it's easier on the legs impact wise. I do a lot of my easier runs on grass (and some longer ones too depending on how my legs feel).

Just remember with running on grass, your pace will be slower so allow of that i.e. 9.30min mile would be 9.45-10min mile

kyomi · 11-05-2019 9:30pm

Hi all. I very tentatively signed up for DCM this year - if I get to the start line it'll be my first ever marathon.

Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)
Yes. 5K 21:50, 10K 47:02, half marathon 1:49:xx (the half marathon was several years ago - I think if I did one now I'd be looking at 2:00:00).

Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training? No.

How much training do you currently do?
Was doing 20 miles p/w up to a couple of months ago, have managed to take it up to 30 miles p/w for the last month or two. Usually four days a week but sometimes I drop it to three if I'm busy. Speed session Tuesday, easy run Thursday, parkrun Saturday, long run (10-13 miles) Sunday.

What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?
I know for my first marathon I should just worry about finishing, so that's what I'm going to do. Really, I'd love to get under four hours, but I'm going to try very hard to just aim to finish.

How many days a week can you train? And what plan do you intend to follow?
I'm hoping to add a fifth day per week as marathon training goes on - an extra run to/from work or at lunchtime. I've made my own plan which involves increasing the distance of my midweek run (max 11 miles) and the Sunday long run (max 20 miles), plus a four week taper up to marathon day. (My husband gave me Lore of Running by Tim Noakes for Christmas and it's been my training bible!)

What is your biggest worry/fear/doubt (if you have any!) in signing up?
So many! Mainly that despite having been a runner for nine years I just won't be able for it. In practical terms, I sometimes get dead legs while running and it's such a horrible feeling, I'm sure I would despair if this happened on a long run or on the day itself. I'm also nervous about incorporating food into my runs as I've never done this before.

Why are you running this marathon?
I love supporting my clubmates in the marathon every year, it's such a fantastic day and the supporters are great. Every year I watch them running with envy and wish it was me out there. This year I just decided to go for it.

Animella · 12-05-2019 9:17am

ReeReeG wrote: »

That's a perfectly acceptable fear to have, but I can also assure you will overcome it no problem! I looked back at your first post, you're running 3 times a week right now so 2 midweek and 1 weekend, yes?

It's all about building it up sensibly. So could you start adding one more day midweek starting soon? It doesn't have to be anything crazy, even 15-20 mins at a really easy pace.

The plans build at levels that should prevent injuries, provided the easy runs are run at an actually easy pace.

Thanks ReeRee G,
Yes, I run usually three times a week. It shouldn’t be such a big deal to add one more, I guess I’m stuck in my ways and a worrier!
I suppose it’s a matter of getting into a new routine. I run on my two mornings off work so I should just lay out my gear and go for a short run after work another evening.
Thanks for all the advice.
I’ve a half marathon next weekend so will add the fourth run after that.
Thanks again

pd79 · 12-05-2019 9:21am

Animella wrote: »

Welcome to everyone who has joined. Looking forward to sharing our progress over the next few months.

Just one worry I have to get off my chest before embarking on a plan- I have an irrational fear of running four days a week , or three days in a row!

I guess it’s because I have never done it and have survived so far running three days a week with cross training
I KNOW that to improve I just need to run more often. I know it doesn’t have to be faster, or further, just more days a week.
Maybe I’m just lazy? But I am so scared of getting injured and ruining everything. I’m also afraid of totally zapping my energy levels.
How do I overcome this?

I'm so glad you said that, because I feel same ! Feels strange to run three days in a row, going to try it this week I hope +

Bananaleaf · 12-05-2019 10:21am

py wrote: »

Would be interested to hear what people do after a run in terms of stretching/foam rolling.

I found my foam roller too awkward to use so I bought a 'tiger tail' roller which I love. Still awkward at times, for calf especially, but overall much easier to use.

I read a book about preparing for marathon running and this is the plan I put together, based on what info I picked up from it:

I do dynamic stretches before running a fast session (stretches which involve moving legs, hip opening, swinging the legs etc)

On a long run I don't stretch before and I just run the first mile extra slow as a warm up.

After runs I will do static stretching (stretching out the leg and holding in the stretch) or a combination of some different things they had in the book like:

Feet flat on the ground and raising and lowering your toes multiple times until you start to feel it in your shin
Heel dips
Lie down flat on your back and raise one bent leg (right angle bend) then make circles clockwise and anti clockwise with the foot. Then flex foot forward and back for a minute. Change leg.

I don't know if this is all okay or if it's too much or too little. So maybe before you copy any of this, could one of the mentors say if this is right or wrong

Thanks so much

Animella · 12-05-2019 12:54pm

pd79 wrote: »

I'm so glad you said that, because I feel same ! Feels strange to run three days in a row, going to try it this week I hope +

Oh good, I’m glad too I’m not the only one!
Best of luck with your three days in a row.

Huzzah! · 12-05-2019 12:57pm

Animella wrote: »

Oh good, I’m glad too I’m not the only one!
Best of luck with your three days in a row.

Just keep it super easy and it should be no problem to you. I find the more days a week I run, the more routine it becomes, which makes it easier in a way.

Soulsun · 12-05-2019 1:28pm

Hi folks
Any advice how to increase my LSR from 10km

skyblue46 · 12-05-2019 4:39pm

Soulsun wrote: »

Hi folks
Any advice how to increase my LSR from 10km

Maybe I'm missing something but run 11km next week. If you are running at a pace that means 10km is all you can run then run slower. Run at a pace about 90 secs per mile slower than your planned marathon pace.

Huzzah! · 12-05-2019 6:21pm

kyomi wrote: »

Hi all. I very tentatively signed up for DCM this year - if I get to the start line it'll be my first ever marathon.

Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)
Yes. 5K 21:50, 10K 47:02, half marathon 1:49:xx (the half marathon was several years ago - I think if I did one now I'd be looking at 2:00:00).

Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training? No.

How much training do you currently do?
Was doing 20 miles p/w up to a couple of months ago, have managed to take it up to 30 miles p/w for the last month or two. Usually four days a week but sometimes I drop it to three if I'm busy. Speed session Tuesday, easy run Thursday, parkrun Saturday, long run (10-13 miles) Sunday.

What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?
I know for my first marathon I should just worry about finishing, so that's what I'm going to do. Really, I'd love to get under four hours, but I'm going to try very hard to just aim to finish.

How many days a week can you train? And what plan do you intend to follow?
I'm hoping to add a fifth day per week as marathon training goes on - an extra run to/from work or at lunchtime. I've made my own plan which involves increasing the distance of my midweek run (max 11 miles) and the Sunday long run (max 20 miles), plus a four week taper up to marathon day. (My husband gave me Lore of Running by Tim Noakes for Christmas and it's been my training bible!)

What is your biggest worry/fear/doubt (if you have any!) in signing up?
So many! Mainly that despite having been a runner for nine years I just won't be able for it. In practical terms, I sometimes get dead legs while running and it's such a horrible feeling, I'm sure I would despair if this happened on a long run or on the day itself. I'm also nervous about incorporating food into my runs as I've never done this before.

Why are you running this marathon?
I love supporting my clubmates in the marathon every year, it's such a fantastic day and the supporters are great. Every year I watch them running with envy and wish it was me out there. This year I just decided to go for it.

Welcome, kyomi. You've some nice PBs there and a really nice base. I like your goal for the marathon itself, too. We all have many fears heading into marathon training, whether it's the first or umpteenth time we've done it, so you're not alone. All we can do is control the controllables and train as well as we can for the day itself.

My main knowledge of Professor Noakes is from Marathon Talk, so I must get that book and have a read. If you like, you can post your plan and we can have one of the more experienced Boardsies take a look?

Huzzah! · 12-05-2019 6:24pm

Bananaleaf wrote: »

I found my foam roller too awkward to use so I bought a 'tiger tail' roller which I love. Still awkward at times, for calf especially, but overall much easier to use.

I read a book about preparing for marathon running and this is the plan I put together, based on what info I picked up from it:

I do dynamic stretches before running a fast session (stretches which involve moving legs, hip opening, swinging the legs etc)

On a long run I don't stretch before and I just run the first mile extra slow as a warm up.

After runs I will do static stretching (stretching out the leg and holding in the stretch) or a combination of some different things they had in the book like:

Feet flat on the ground and raising and lowering your toes multiple times until you start to feel it in your shin
Heel dips
Lie down flat on your back and raise one bent leg (right angle bend) then make circles clockwise and anti clockwise with the foot. Then flex foot forward and back for a minute. Change leg.

I don't know if this is all okay or if it's too much or too little. So maybe before you copy any of this, could one of the mentors say if this is right or wrong

Thanks so much

Looks good to me, anyway! I could certainly learn a thing or two from it

I try to prioritise foam rolling, personally.

Soulsun · 12-05-2019 7:30pm

skyblue46 wrote: »

Maybe I'm missing something but run 11km next week. If you are running at a pace that means 10km is all you can run then run slower. Run at a pace about 90 secs per mile slower than your planned marathon pace.

So run slower to get the distance?

py · 12-05-2019 7:35pm

Soulsun wrote: »

So run slower to get the distance?

Yup, slow down your pace. Your best 5Km pace is not going to be the same as your best 10Km pace and so on. You just need to adjust your pacing so that your legs can last the distance. There's also the extra adjustment you may need to make to ensure you don't burn your legs out so follow what was mentioned in the OP, run slow and then run even slower. Best of luck with it.

Soulsun · 12-05-2019 7:42pm

py wrote: »

Yup, slow down your pace. Your best 5Km pace is not going to be the same as your best 10Km pace and so on. You just need to adjust your pacing so that your legs can last the distance. There's also the extra adjustment you may need to make to ensure you don't burn your legs out so follow what was mentioned in the OP, run slow and then run even slower. Best of luck with it.

Cheers py
RUN SLOW, THEN EVER SLOWER IS MY NEW MOTO.

Some times it's hard to go SLOW when your in the zone

py · 12-05-2019 7:46pm

Soulsun wrote: »

Cheers py
RUN SLOW, THEN EVER SLOWER IS MY NEW MOTO.

Some times it's hard to go SLOW when your in the zone

Yup completely agree, think you need to consider the long term goal. The past week was the first time I've run on 3 consecutive days and pace was about 6:30/Km. Legs weren't fresh but they didn't ache.

Another thing, if you listen to music then it might be an idea to choose a slower beat or switch to podcasts where quick/upbeat tunes won't have you running too fast.

Soulsun · 12-05-2019 7:49pm

py wrote: »

Yup completely agree, think you need to consider the long term goal. The past week was the first time I've run on 3 consecutive days and pace was about 6:30/Km. Legs weren't fresh but they didn't ache.

Another thing, if you listen to music then it might be an idea to choose a slower beat or switch to podcasts where quick/upbeat tunes won't have you running too fast.

Long term goal is 26.2 miles....
Ha on the music..had the prodigy beating today.... will consider less tempo tunes next time
Thnk for advice

skyblue46 · 12-05-2019 7:58pm

Soulsun wrote: »

So run slower to get the distance?

Exactly...the bulk of your marathon training should be at a pace that would embarrass you if your friends see you running. As I said it should be slower than your marathon pace by some way and probably 3 minutes per mile slower than you can race a 5k. Your mentors will get back to this but they have given the link to a training paces calculator. Running slow on the long and easy runs is the single most important thing you can do to reach your goals. It's infinitely more important than gels, energy bars, or anything else.

Bananaleaf · 12-05-2019 8:08pm

I've decided to go with the boards plan.

I was wondering if I could ask the following questions:

I will be doing a HM in Achill (hilly!) on 07 July. Can I switch weeks 2&3 and make the HM my long run? (Not planning on racing this one as I believe it's a killer)

I will be doing the South Dublin 10k and the DCM half. But instead of the Frank Duffy 10 I'm going to do the Kilcock 10mile the Sunday beforehand (18th Aug) Again, is it okay to switch weeks 8and 9?

Thanks

The Muppet · 12-05-2019 8:14pm

I just came across this this evening so popping in to wish everyone well with the training and main event. Enjoy

DBB · 12-05-2019 8:45pm

Eeek! I can barely believe I get to legitimately post in this thread, after a few years of reading mentored novices threads with envy, wishing I had the nerve all those novices had to commit myself to training for a marathon

.
So, it is with a heady mixture of terror and delight that I've decided that 2019 is the year that I just bloody well do it... I got a little wave of adrenaline when I saw that this thread is now with us, because it makes it all more real!

So, here we go...
Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)

Yes, I have been an on-off runner for maybe 15+ years now, getting myself fit enough to run the women's mini marathon for charity each year since 2003ish? I would have done a few races in the lead-up to it, but too long ago now to be particularly relevant. My fastest 10km was 54:55 in... I dunno... 2010ish? Fastest 5km 24:xx, which was also a good number of years ago.

Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training? (No problem if you do)

No

How much training do you currently do ? Distances, how many days a week, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.

Since November-ish, I've built up to 4 runs per week.
Mondays: 7-8km, followed by a 30 min strength and conditioning session
Tuesdays: 5-6km
Thursdays: 7-8km, followed by another 30 min S&C session
Saturdays: LSR day, anywhere between 13-15km so far.
I'd also do at least one good, long, lively walk with the dogs during the week, and shorter walks with them every day.

All 4 runs are easy and slow. I am lucky in that I have a relation who's an elite endurance athlete who's been guiding me since February: I'm currently running to heart rate (max 140bpm), which I've found to be a great leveler in allowing me to gauge how I'm getting on over time.
It is also a bit frustrating, because I often want to run faster, but I've been quite disciplined with the assurance that good things will happen by keeping it ssssllloowwwww, and I'm starting to see times improving and feeling like I could readily run further after each run.
Critically, because running slowly makes long distance seem very manageable and relatively painless (so far), it has really helped me to get my head around the idea of running for 26.2 miles, which is what has been blocking any ideas of taking on a marathon I might have had over the years!

What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?

Ooohhh... I just dream of finishing! If I was to have my arm twisted to come up with a time, 4hrs 30mins would be absolutely brilliant:o

How many days a week can you train? And what plan do you intend to follow?

I can comfortably enough continue running 4 days per week. I have been more-or-less following the Hal Higdon half-marathon plan to take me up to the Clontarf HM on July 7th, at which point I had planned to morph onto the HH marathon plan.
Does that sound like a plan?

What is your biggest worry/fear/doubt (if you have any!) in signing up?

Like others have said, my biggest worry is getting to the start line without any big dramas! I still have little mental struggles with the fact that my shortest training runs now are almost as long as my longest run ever! However, those doubts recede a bit with every LSR: during the most recent LSRs, I've run further than I've ever run in my life, and I'm feeling good afterwards

Why are you running this marathon?

For the challenge, because I just never believed I could! I also love chocolate, cake and cookies, but I don't love not being able to fit into my clothes, so this training is helping me be more disciplined with my diet, as well as burning calories!

Thank you to Mr. Guappa, Huzzah!, and ReeReeG for taking us on! Looking forward to getting to know you all, and my fellow novices, as the next few months pass!

Bananaleaf · 12-05-2019 8:57pm

DBB I am also currently running to HR and I fully agree with everything you have said about it. It can be incredibly frustrating at times, but having said that I was running without any PBs for a yr and a half before trying it and I have PBd in the 2 races I have done this year since starting it. I started in March and I remember thinking at the time that I was being clever starting so early. Now I wish I'd started HR training even earlier.

One downside for me is that at 10min kms I can't find a soul willing to go with me on long runs. I'm already worrying about how this will pan out for me. Will I just have to go it alone or will I eventually get up to their 7min km slow pace?

When I started HR I was doing 11min kms and now I can hover around 9.5min kms or even 8min 50sec when I'm feeling good, so I do trust it anyway.

It was a boardsie from the Random Running Questions who introduced me to it in fact.

DCM 2019 - Mentored Novices Thread

Comments