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Now ye're talking - to a Nurse

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,678 ✭✭✭Signore Fancy Pants


    Whats harder to deal with, a boo boo or an owie?


  • Company Representative Posts: 71 Verified rep I'm a Nurse - AMA


    theteal wrote: »
    Just to add, if so, how did the role compare to the job in Ireland? Conditions? Levels of responsibility?

    Hi theteal,

    As I have answered above I have never went abroad. The only things I know are from friends and family who work abroad. I know that in the UK Irish trained nurses get up the ladder pretty quick due to qualifications and their own staffing issues there. I know that the level of responsibility in the UK is pretty much like it is here again due to short staffing and demands on the system there. In saying that, the UK has other staff to facilitate nurses such as nurses aids who do many tasks such as vital signs and cannulation.

    All those that went to the Middle East enjoy the amount of staff they have, have safe nurse to patient ratios (as does oz) and have many perks such as housing etc.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,572 ✭✭✭khaldrogo


    My wife is a nurse. She qualified as a general nurse and then went on to retrain as a midwife. While working as a midwife she was responsible for 12 mothers and 12 babies!!! This is crazy in my opinion.
    That said, she earned a decent wage and never complained that she should be getting paid more. She did, however, regularly complain about the lack of staff. She has since moved to private medicine and will never go back.

    Would you agree with me that the nurses striking at the moment would probably not be doing so if there was more staff? As in, the lack of staff is more of an issue than the money.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,572 ✭✭✭khaldrogo


    tretorn wrote:
    Also what do your Physio Therapists colleagues and your Dietician colleagues think about you looking to be paid the same as them.


    The nurses should certainly be paid more than a dietician ffs!!!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,572 ✭✭✭khaldrogo


    tretorn wrote:
    How much are carers paid, do they do the toiletting work and the changing of soiled sheets etc. Will the nurses look for them to get extra money too, what union are the Carers in.


    What qualifications do they have?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    khaldrogo wrote: »
    The nurses should certainly be paid more than a dietician ffs!!!!

    Why?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,572 ✭✭✭khaldrogo


    jlm29 wrote:
    Why?


    If you have to ask that then you have never had a 2 hr conversation with your wife physically and emotionally drained after she completed a 13 hr shift on a labour ward where a baby died.

    How many dead babies do dieticians deal with?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    Do you think that the enhanced career opportunities and the perks associated with nursing (I’m talking about the paid training, the pay for clinical practise while training, the fact that the paid college years contribute to pension years to name some) help to compensate for the reduced basic pay at graduation when compared to other ahps?

    And also, if the basic pay for nursing was increased in line with other ahps, but this perks removed, and allowances removed for unsociable hours etc, that this would be acceptable to the profession as a whole?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    khaldrogo wrote: »
    If you have to ask that then you have never had a 2 hr conversation with your wife physically and emotionally drained after she completed a 13 hr shift on a labour ward where a baby died.

    How many dead babies do dieticians deal with?

    I dont have a wife. They might not deal with dead babies, but they have a HUGE amount of responsibility clinically. There are many many who would or could die if their dietician were less competent. Dieticians analyse blood results, prescribe feed with the appropriate nutritional balance for critically ill, post op patients, ventilated patients, patients in renal failure. They have an enormous amount of knowledge which allows them to do this. They don’t just sit down in front of the fat people and tell them to cut out the fcuking mars bars


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,572 ✭✭✭khaldrogo


    As I said in a previous post, I don't necessarily think that the pay is that bad in general. I believe if the staff shortages were never there in the first place they wouldn't be striking.

    In terms of what I said about the dieticians pay; given what a nurse has to do and is responsible for during a shift compared to a dietician how could anyone not agree they should paid more? They should be paid more than a lot of professions tbh.


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  • Company Representative Posts: 71 Verified rep I'm a Nurse - AMA


    chicorytip wrote: »
    Hello. Do you think school leavers today regard Nursing as an attractive profession to enter and does it still have the same kind of status as a job that it had twenty or thirty years ago particularly among those from rural Ireland?
    Also, would you say that there are a sufficient number of nurses graduating each year to fill the available number of positions in the public health service?
    Finally, sorry for being so long winded, approximately how many of your colleagues are a) male and b) non - Irish?
    Thank you.

    I don't think it is still regarded in the same way as when I maybe went to college. It was seen then as a forever job and a qualification that could be used all over the world. I think trolley counts, increasing health care requirements and short staffing have unfortunately turned people off. I recently watched a blogger explain that she wanted to do Midwifery after school but she decided against it due to increasing patient numbers and short staffing which I found incredibly sad.

    I don't feel that enough are qualifying, however, I feel sorry for students coming into nursing now. They are not getting the same attention as I would have gotten. It is too busy in many areas to properly teach.... However, students I have had the pleasure of working with seem to be thriving and are amazing maybe because they are being given more responsibility than I would have been given. They of course work under supervision but I feel when I first had my own students I was able to spend so much more time with them than in recent years.
    Do you think it was a good idea to do an AMA at this time when considerations of nurses are heavily influenced by the ongoing strike?

    Was that a motivation in doing the AMA?

    Hi Tell me how.

    I had a few reasons. My main aim would be to show people the real side of who a nurse is.
    I overheard 2 parents the other day saying they never realised how much a nurse actually did and then told us on their way out the door that they had the wrong idea of nurses from recent media and that they fully supported us after watching us work which again reminded me that some people do not know what a nurse does.
    Also, i made the mistake of reading certain comments on another thread here which were totally false and frankly upsetting. I would prefer to maybe answer some questions and give MY reality and maybe let even one person see that what is being put out on the media about cruel nurses is not true.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,572 ✭✭✭khaldrogo


    I'm going to leave my input there now as I don't want to derail the thread.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 616 ✭✭✭Crock Rock


    tretorn wrote: »
    Are you being paid while you are on strike.

    I


    I'd also like to know the answer to this. Well? Are you?


  • Registered Users Posts: 916 ✭✭✭1hnr79jr65


    Myself and my 10 year old nephew both go to hospital regularly for LTI and i can say hand on heart the nurses are by far the hardest workers there and also the most helpful. They got a lot on their plate to deal with but do best when they can. Once saw a nurse go to an office to cry cos i believe it was due to being so overwhelmed and that is sad they don't get support they require. So kudos to you and your colleagues.

    As for my questions i have a couple to ask,

    1. Do you get any payment support for training and is there any recovery if you left country?
    2. Do you believe its fair for those who get subsidized training paid for by tax money only to leave country and not invest themselves?
    3. If yes to payment support, would you forgo this payment in favor of much stronger pay, terms and conditions ?
    4. What is the general view in relation to abortion legislation from a nursing perspective, is there much disagreement/animosity at the passing of it or are nurses generally more supportive of this legislation being passed? (especially curious to your own thoughts now you work with children, would the legislation change how you view this particular field?)


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,540 ✭✭✭Martina1991


    Nurses get certain allowances, paid post grad qualifications, overtime payment, can work up time off by working nights and have attractive pension benefits.

    If all nurses and management got the 12% pay increase across the board, do you think its fair that nurses would be on similar salaries to physios, OTs etc and still get all the benefits above?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    Why do you think you deserve 2008 figures when 2008 figures were bloated and unsustainable?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    Can you admit that that young irish people have a tendency to travel abroad anyways no matter what the profession is. There are not many nurses in their late 30s or 40's out in Oz. These young Irish people want to experience the world, they do not want to stay in Ireland all their life and the givemeareasontocomehome hashtag is just pandering for attention and praise.

    There's shortages in every sector in ireland at the moment, there's irish tradespeople, engineers, scientists in Canada, Dubai etc and I don't see them with hashtags looking for an ego boost.




  • Which is more important to you, getting the pay increase or improved working conditions such as lower nurse to patient ratios?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,357 ✭✭✭hawkelady


    Crock Rock wrote: »
    I'd also like to know the answer to this. Well? Are you?

    They are not !! Why would you think they get paid while on strike ffs.
    They’ll get paid the union day rate which is approx €50


  • Registered Users Posts: 41 AudiAvant


    Which is more important to you, getting the pay increase or improved working conditions such as lower nurse to patient ratios?

    I imagine both
    You need money to have a life on too
    It's becoming impossible to live in Dublin and most places in Ireland
    It's only the parents of Ireland that are stopping the homeless figures spiraling


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  • Company Representative Posts: 71 Verified rep I'm a Nurse - AMA


    Is it true most nurses are really living in poverty. I follow a nurse on instagram and she's constantly posting with her colleagues pics of nights out/holidays etc.

    How can nurses expect restoration of pay without everyone else in the public sector getting theirs aswell. Do nurses really think the country can afford it.

    I will speak for myself and the colleagues on my current ward to answer this. We work a 5 day week with no premiums or overtime and I can honestly say that we are all broke. Most of us are in debt of some sort such as an overdraft or credit card. Most of us are renting despite almost all of us being in late 20s, early 30s and older. 2 of the girls appear to have a great social life but they both live at home so perhaps that helps. Most of us now live outside of Dublin also.
    Why do you believe you deserve more money now when your Union signed up to the current wage agreement?

    If the government give you more money, you'll have all the other Unions crying me too! So why do you believe you deserve more money than all your public service colleagues? Why not look for increased staffing levels which will lighten your load?

    I was at talks with my union around that time and the massive majority nurses in the room wanted to strike then. The same issues were being discussed at that stage. As far as I was concerned at that time there were promises made with regards to recruitment and retention which have not happened. Hospitals I have worked in went abroad to recruit and people abroad are not attracted enough to what is offered here. So as far as I am concerned we did look for increased staffing. We have looked for safer nurse to patient ratios. This is not a new battle. I think we deserve as much money as other healthcare professionals that have also spent 4 years in college!

    Duffryman wrote: »
    Assuming that there's only so much money to go round, and that we can't magic up some more of it to give nurses a pay rise, has the INMO or anybody else ever done a detailed proposal as to where money could be found to fund a pay raise?

    If so, what exact cuts or budget freezes would it entail in the other areas that would be affected?

    I don't know how to answer this to be honest.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,131 ✭✭✭KaneToad


    Do you think it is short sighted of your union leadership to insist that the ONLY way to improve recruitment & retention is to pay more? (As an objective observer I would find it difficult to accept this stance.)


  • Company Representative Posts: 71 Verified rep I'm a Nurse - AMA


    beertons wrote: »
    Where do you see yourself in 5 years?

    I would love to either be working in palliative care. Dream job would be teaching/lecturing but I can't see that happening within the next 5 years.
    AMKC wrote: »
    Hello. Do you think the HSE is inefficient?

    What do you think can be done to help keep nurses trained here from going abroad?

    Do you think the location of the new children's hospital is a good place for it or do you think a greenfield site might have been better?

    I do think there are things that could be done better that would assist in the efficiency of the HSE. Using the same systems and programmes so that information could be shared easily. The recruitment process in the HSE is also long and drawn out.

    In 2 college courses I had, I had to pay back a year and work my usual full time hours whilst doing those courses.... maybe there should be a repayment of time introduced to hold on to newly qualified nurses for a year?! May be an unpopular opinion with some newly qualified nurses but its only my opinion :o

    I think a greenfield site would have been better...
    How awful is the HSE and should it be done away with?

    I feel its disjointed. I think it could be improved instead of doing away with it and starting afresh again :o


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,941 ✭✭✭✭Purple Mountain



    Nurses in Ireland are also doing jobs that are done by extra health professionals in many countries. Nurses in Ireland carry out many tasks that are only done by doctors/allied health professionals in many other countries such as the UK, America and Australia.



    ;)

    Would you be able to expand a bit more on this please?

    To thine own self be true



  • Registered Users Posts: 59 ✭✭gOst


    In the past I was indifferent to the plight of nurses.
    I would have shared many of the ignorant hot takes I've read on boards up until my sister actually became a nurse.

    I really don't think people realise the emotional and physical demands of the job.
    She has had people cough blood into her face, among other bodily fluids thrown at her.
    She's injured herself from trying to stop disoriented patients pull IVs from themselves or not having enough assistance/hoists to move obese patients.

    The emotional stuff is the real kicker.
    She once had an 80 odd year old women with terminal cancer ask her to hold her hand as she had no family and was scared of dying.
    She sat there for an hour with her after working a 12 hour shift.
    Of course she didn't have to do that but the request alone would have f&*ked with my head for weeks.

    You probably do become desensitized to it to some extent but the continuous emotional stress must be exhausting. Then add in the night shifts to mess with your body clock. She's told me numerous times she's ping ponged on her bus route home because she's fallen asleep.

    You simply can't compare working conditions to that on a ward.

    Sorry for the rant :o. Now for the question.

    Increased salary aside, do you think the HSE could offer something else which would make any improvement to a nurses working conditions?
    Shorter shifts? Longer hand over periods to help catch up on paperwork within your actual shift hours?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 751 ✭✭✭Perifect


    I just want to offer my support to you and all nurses. As you can see from this thread, begrudgery is alive and well. Ignore this kind of person who wants to drag you down. What was funny was them scoffing at you taking so long to reply, little realising that you were hard at work while they have been posting on the internet all day! :D

    Would you recommend young people to join the nursing profession and if you could go back in time, would you change career choice?


  • Company Representative Posts: 71 Verified rep I'm a Nurse - AMA


    Calhoun wrote: »
    Do you think that the money issue has consumed the current action going on? What the nurses want is much more important than just a wage but that is being lost by the demand for a salary increase .

    Would it be best if we introduce a mandatory term of service for those going into nursing which can be bought out at any time? That way we could address the amount of nurses goong abroad and servicing other countries off the back of our tax payer.

    Yes I do. I feel that people are not seeing the bigger picture and I don't blame them. What is being put out in the media is money focused and everything is being shown in a bad light from what I can see. Nurses want pay parity with our colleagues who do the same length degree as us and we also use skills they use. Nurses want more staff and one way to attract more and keep them may be more money but the realistic side is they have tried to recruit and retain which is not happening which has led to this in my opinion. There is also the fact that nurses have increased responsibility and more demands. We work an extra day for free every 4-6 weeks as per the current agreement. It is so upsetting to see a poor public opinion because people simple don't understand where we are coming from.

    And yes I think a mandatory term of service might be a good idea and should be looked into further. Even if it was a delayed term for a certain time which could be followed up I think it is an area that should be investigated. There are courses where you do have a mandatory term of service to pay back and it does keep people there for the year which is great.
    Do you think the questions here are rabidly right wing and anti worker in comparison to your experiences on the picket line and dealing with the public in general?

    Good luck with the strike

    Yeah some questions are difficult to answer. However, I will speak a little of my experiences on the picket line.... which is a more positive note.

    So I have done 3 days on the picket line so far.... and no... I will not be getting paid for any days I strike!

    Some of the experiences i have had on those 3 days have moved me and many of my co-workers to tears. One thing in particular was a child asking her mum what we were doing and her mum stopping and explaining what we were doing. They went to the shop and the little girl walked up with a box of heroes. That to me was overly generous but so lovely. People from the area making food to drop over, companies arriving with tea and coffee, people dropping off pastries and doughnuts. Support from other amazing frontline workers. Doctors going off and buying hats/gloves/coffees and picketing with us. The amount of beeps of cars and people just saying well done or keep going as they passed. It has been an eye opener in a way. When I worked with adults it was rare to receive a thank you some days.... it is different obviously with children and their parents but the support has really kept our chins up.


    You certainly can't be accused of being a chatterbox anyway nurse!

    I am sorry.... contrary to popular belief nurses are sometimes too busy to be on their phones/internet in work :P:pac:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 342 ✭✭VeryTerry


    Pussyhands wrote: »
    Can you admit that that young irish people have a tendency to travel abroad anyways no matter what the profession is. There are not many nurses in their late 30s or 40's out in Oz. These young Irish people want to experience the world, they do not want to stay in Ireland all their life and the givemeareasontocomehome hashtag is just pandering for attention and praise.

    This is a load of bollox from someone that has clearly never been forced out. It's all well and good going on a working holiday visa or a J1 but me and a lot of my friends have never been able to return from "experiencing the world".

    It's not a new thing either. Half my family are English and American because my aunt's and uncles left in the 70's and 80's.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    Considering that ANPs earn up to €70k, DONs can earn in excess of €80k, and other managerial roles in nursing are also quite well paid, do you think that a blanket 12%pay rise across all grades would be fair?


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  • Company Representative Posts: 71 Verified rep I'm a Nurse - AMA


    J Mysterio wrote: »
    Do you like Coppers? Can I find a nurse there?

    Hate Coppers.... loved it until I passed what was obviously a wannabe gynaecologist/Donald Trump (way before he was president!) :pac::pac:
    Do you think if the Government brought in a policy making nurses complete 3 years post college in Irish hospitals or fees would be recouped would help the staffing situation and make hospitals safer for patients?

    I think it would help but I even think a year would be enough considering you only get paid for your internship.... the other 3 years you work for free. I think if you expected nurses to work for 3 years you would have unhappy nurses feeling trapped. I think even a year would help.
    amcalester wrote: »
    Is the response time here typical of the HSE?

    :pac::D I mean.... it was only 6 hours til i first got on :pac:
    ELM327 wrote: »
    This thread is also covered by the remit of the strike unfortunately

    Yes but no picket line tonight thankfully! :P:pac:


This discussion has been closed.
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