selling silage and hay round bales

adamhughes · 08-07-2018 11:01pm #1

off the field, (dont have room in shed) so what is a realistic price for good silage and hay bales right now

cute geoge · 08-07-2018 11:22pm

€30 delivered would be as much as i could afford to pay !!!
I find contractors can be expensive for hauling bales ,a 4/5 mile draw might cost up to €5/bale .There seems to be a big margin made by contractors in haulage although they will tell you there is nothing made drawing bales ,For instance I get silage bales drawn from a mile away and it costs me €3/bale to draw and stack with plenty room for turning in yard ,this is with a 14 bale load and it takes 50/55 minutes round trip to load,draw and stack

Bellview · 09-07-2018 12:25am

I Got 25 in field in mid June for very good quality silage. Hay making 30 in field near us. Spoke with a dealer last week who does some trading in hay and he is finding it hard to source hay.

_Brian · 09-07-2018 8:04am

cute geoge wrote: »

€30 delivered would be as much as i could afford to pay !!!
I find contractors can be expensive for hauling bales ,a 4/5 mile draw might cost up to €5/bale .There seems to be a big margin made by contractors in haulage although they will tell you there is nothing made drawing bales ,For instance I get silage bales drawn from a mile away and it costs me €3/bale to draw and stack with plenty room for turning in yard ,this is with a 14 bale load and it takes 50/55 minutes round trip to load,draw and stack

The contractor has to factor in lost opportunity when he’s drawing your bales he could be off earning better €/hr with his equipment.

Your describing €42/hr
If you take out €15/18 hr for labour it leaves very little for machinery, maintenance, diesel and of course profit.

Dakota Dan · 09-07-2018 9:26am

_Brian wrote: »

The contractor has to factor in lost opportunity when he’s drawing your bales he could be off earning better €/hr with his equipment.

Your describing €42/hr
If you take out €15/18 hr for labour it leaves very little for machinery, maintenance, diesel and of course profit.

Yeah and I could have been a doctor instead of a farmer, I wonder will the co op pay me an opportunity cost?

maidhc · 09-07-2018 9:57am

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Yeah and I could have been a doctor instead of a farmer, I wonder will the co op pay me an opportunity cost?

I sold all I had from the field at €25 a bale. Was offered €5 per bale to deliver locally. I refused, its not worth the hassle.

wrangler · 09-07-2018 9:59am

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Yeah and I could have been a doctor instead of a farmer, I wonder will the co op pay me an opportunity cost?

Even to trade in a tractor with 10000hrs is probably costing more than €42/hr never mind diesel etc

cute geoge · 09-07-2018 11:07am

_Brian wrote: »

The contractor has to factor in lost opportunity when he’s drawing your bales he could be off earning better €/hr with his equipment.

Your describing €42/hr
If you take out €15/18 hr for labour it leaves very little for machinery, maintenance, diesel and of course profit.

wrangler wrote: »

Even to trade in a tractor with 10000hrs is probably costing more than €42/hr never mind diesel etc

Well if a contractor can pay €15/18 hr for labour ,farming is some mugs game .A vet working in a practice will not even make that wage per hour!
A tractor with 10k hours would have potentially made €420,000 @ €42/hour minus tyres.service maintenance and labour .My milking parlour milking 40 cows@ 4 hours/day would to be working 8 years to clock 10,000 hours but i probably would be pushed to turnover much mower then €420k from milk in 8 years and then i start deducting my costs:mad:

Who2 · 09-07-2018 11:52am

cute geoge wrote: »

Well if a contractor can pay €15/18 hr for labour ,farming is some mugs game .A vet working in a practice will not even make that wage per hour!
A tractor with 10k hours would have potentially made €420,000 @ €42/hour minus tyres.service maintenance and labour .My milking parlour milking 40 cows@ 4 hours/day would to be working 8 years to clock 10,000 hours but i probably would be pushed to turnover much mower then €420k from milk in 8 years and then i start deducting my costs:mad:

A wage of 650 per week costs an employer around 1100. When all is factored in. Add in that a contractor will more than likely wait two to three months on average between good and bad payers and it’s not really worth the hassle.

lakill Farm · 09-07-2018 11:55am

_Brian wrote: »

The contractor has to factor in lost opportunity when he’s drawing your bales he could be off earning better €/hr with his equipment.

Your describing €42/hr
If you take out €15/18 hr for labour it leaves very little for machinery, maintenance, diesel and of course profit.

take off the 13.5% vat

travel time to pick up area

travel time from drop off area

Limestone Cowboy · 09-07-2018 12:07pm

cute geoge wrote: »

Well if a contractor can pay €15/18 hr for labour ,farming is some mugs game .A vet working in a practice will not even make that wage per hour!
A tractor with 10k hours would have potentially made €420,000 @ €42/hour minus tyres.service maintenance and labour .My milking parlour milking 40 cows@ 4 hours/day would to be working 8 years to clock 10,000 hours but i probably would be pushed to turnover much mower then €420k from milk in 8 years and then i start deducting my costs:mad:

Could easily spend 10e an hour on diesel before any other expenses. You'd want every bit of 40e an hour and probably more. Do have a lot of lads asking me to do spraying, spread fert and topping for them and I'm not going doing it anymore, nobody wants to pay for it. Drew 80 bales 10 miles for a fella last winter aswell and I didn't get a cent out of it, topped and sprayed 10 acres and brought 2 runs of cattle to the Mart last summer for another and nothing either. I wouldn't like to be making a living out of it anyway, couldn't be working for any worse than a farmer.

Bass Reeves · 09-07-2018 12:08pm

Know a few lads around me that will not send out a tractor at less than 50/hour. Vat is 6euro out of that. While contractors can get cheap labour relatively for silage young lads gewtting 100-120/day all full time drivers are on at least 12/hour and some are on 15/hour as there is plenty of work around. You can add 25-30% for employer PRSI, holiday pay etc. Another issue is that fulltime drivers will expect OT rates for Saturday and sunday and hours after an 8 hour day. Not sure what public liability and diesel is costing. My baler man had one of his tractors have a problem lately and it cost 4K with the tractors out of action for 10 days, he carried out a service and some other jobs and that added another 1200 euro and he did the labour himself :eek:.

Not that I would be hand them out money too freely but there costs are horrific. In 15-20 years most contractors have gone from owning equipment to leasing. Most big contractors have something else to fall back on or to have work during the quite period during the winter.

cute geoge · 09-07-2018 12:59pm

Limestone Cowboy wrote: »

Could easily spend 10e an hour on diesel before any other expenses. You'd want every bit of 40e an hour and probably more. Do have a lot of lads asking me to do spraying, spread fert and topping for them and I'm not going doing it anymore, nobody wants to pay for it. Drew 80 bales 10 miles for a fella last winter aswell and I didn't get a cent out of it, topped and sprayed 10 acres and brought 2 runs of cattle to the Mart last summer for another and nothing either. I wouldn't like to be making a living out of it anyway, couldn't be working for any worse than a farmer.

I would say you better give up the contracting because you look like a soft touch being a busy fool not collecting your money
I would love to know what tractor would use €10 diesel /hour .Last time i filled diesel was €0.78 so you are talking about a tractor burning 13 litres/hour pulling 10/12 tonne for 1 mile and loading/unloading for most of that time.I would say 6 litres/hour would be more like it
My point is i find haulage done by a contractor is expensive compared to bailing which is a specialised job,raking is another money spinner for a contractor .I get charged €10/acre for this and see little benefit to me unless i have tedded out the grass .It is a great benefit to the contractor though because it speeds up the bailing time for him!!!!

Bass Reeves · 09-07-2018 2:23pm

cute geoge wrote: »

I would say you better give up the contracting because you look like a soft touch being a busy fool not collecting your money
I would love to know what tractor would use €10 diesel /hour .Last time i filled diesel was €0.78 so you are talking about a tractor burning 13 litres/hour pulling 10/12 tonne for 1 mile and loading/unloading for most of that time.I would say 6 litres/hour would be more like it
My point is i find haulage done by a contractor is expensive compared to bailing which is a specialised job,raking is another money spinner for a contractor .I get charged €10/acre for this and see little benefit to me unless i have tedded out the grass .It is a great benefit to the contractor though because it speeds up the bailing time for him!!!!

Around us no contractor charges seprately for raking as they do it to speed up baling. Baling is a flat 8/bale and most now mow for 2/bale, When you consider crops are now down to 8-9/acre if well wilted mowing is sub 16-18/acre. Yes haulage/stacking is expensive when compared to some jobs carried out by a contractor. But the reason for that there are few enough at it and none will flat price it because of too many varibles. As well most have had to buy new trailers over the last few years to keep them road legal

On the other hand baling at 30 bales/hour has a turns over of 240/hour or over 180/hour when you take raking and net into account into account. On the down side you have at least a 100K unit in operation. In my case I think buying silage and hay is uneconomical if you have to pay for haulage. Distance up to 10 miles is immaterial as most of the time is lost loading and stacking. I looked at silage about 7 miles away in early June but assuming loads of 19 bales loaded drawn and stacked would be 75 minimum and nearer 100/load or about 5/bale. Trucks carring hay and straw to the west of Ireland from the South east charge about 10/bale. Lads have moved away from hauling round bales to square bales to reduce cost

Limestone Cowboy · 09-07-2018 3:38pm

cute geoge wrote: »

I would say you better give up the contracting because you look like a soft touch being a busy fool not collecting your money
I would love to know what tractor would use €10 diesel /hour .Last time i filled diesel was €0.78 so you are talking about a tractor burning 13 litres/hour pulling 10/12 tonne for 1 mile and loading/unloading for most of that time.I would say 6 litres/hour would be more like it
My point is i find haulage done by a contractor is expensive compared to bailing which is a specialised job,raking is another money spinner for a contractor .I get charged €10/acre for this and see little benefit to me unless i have tedded out the grass .It is a great benefit to the contractor though because it speeds up the bailing time for him!!!!

A soft touch is right, never had any notion of going contracting. Just getting caught with neighbours asking me to do things and that's the thanks you get. Lesson learned.

paddysdream · 09-07-2018 7:41pm

cute geoge wrote: »

I would say you better give up the contracting because you look like a soft touch being a busy fool not collecting your money
I would love to know what tractor would use €10 diesel /hour .Last time i filled diesel was €0.78 so you are talking about a tractor burning 13 litres/hour pulling 10/12 tonne for 1 mile and loading/unloading for most of that time.I would say 6 litres/hour would be more like it
My point is i find haulage done by a contractor is expensive compared to bailing which is a specialised job,raking is another money spinner for a contractor .I get charged €10/acre for this and see little benefit to me unless i have tedded out the grass .It is a great benefit to the contractor though because it speeds up the bailing time for him!!!!

Charge anything from 35 an hour to 40 an hour for drawing/stacking hay/straw/silage.Depends on how much roadwork involved plus host of other factors including the client,whether its a once off or regular work etc etc.
Anything involving lots of road equals more diesel.Thats for a tractor and bale trailer bringing 22 silage or 30 straw/hay at a go.

No idea what any tractor here uses per hour but do know that 200hp Fendt was using 39.9 litres an hour square baling straw last Saturday.Thats without chopping it which would surely push it past 40 litres an hour easily.Sat up beside him whilst waiting for a load and thats what the readout was telling him.

anthony500_1 · 09-07-2018 10:11pm

paddysdream wrote:

No idea what any tractor here uses per hour but do know that 200hp Fendt was using 39.9 litres an hour square baling straw last Saturday.Thats without chopping it which would surely push it past 40 litres an hour easily.Sat up beside him whilst waiting for a load and thats what the readout was telling him.

I hope they were 8x4x4 bales.............

paddysdream · 09-07-2018 10:40pm

anthony500_1 wrote: »

I hope they were 8x4x4 bales.............

8x4x3 Winter barley straw ie middle size of the 3 big square bale sizes

White Clover · 09-07-2018 10:43pm

paddysdream wrote: »

8x4x3 Winter barley straw ie middle size of the 3 big square bale sizes

Off topic here, but, how did the grub go during the silage paddy?!

older by the day · 09-07-2018 10:56pm

cute geoge wrote: »

I would say you better give up the contracting because you look like a soft touch being a busy fool not collecting your money
I would love to know what tractor would use €10 diesel /hour .Last time i filled diesel was €0.78 so you are talking about a tractor burning 13 litres/hour pulling 10/12 tonne for 1 mile and loading/unloading for most of that time.I would say 6 litres/hour would be more like it
My point is i find haulage done by a contractor is expensive compared to bailing which is a specialised job,raking is another money spinner for a contractor .I get charged €10/acre for this and see little benefit to me unless i have tedded out the grass .It is a great benefit to the contractor though because it speeds up the bailing time for him!!!!

I draw bales for a neighbour, 5 or 6 hours at a time he comes out with 50 Euro and thinks he's great, I don't ever refuse him. Anyways that was grand when I had a small Ford tractor, but the big tractors now a days 50 Euro wouldn't cover the tyre wear. I changed the back end oil lately 4 drums 320 Euro 3 metal inline filters 130. I wouldn't be to jealous of contractors, a cracked mirror 100 Euro.

visatorro · 09-07-2018 11:51pm

paddysdream wrote:

No idea what any tractor here uses per hour but do know that 200hp Fendt was using 39.9 litres an hour square baling straw last Saturday.Thats without chopping it which would surely push it past 40 litres an hour easily.Sat up beside him whilst waiting for a load and thats what the readout was telling him.

Chopping big square bales would kill a tractor. Need closer to 300hp or more maybe.
Lad here charges fiver a bale, whether it's a mile or ten miles. That was before diesel got dearer though!

farming93 · 10-07-2018 7:18am

Sorry for hijacking this topic, but he much should I charge per acre for hay still standing ? Without ripping anyone off but still enough that I'm making a few pound myself ?

RightTurnClyde · 10-07-2018 7:26am

Round straw bales making €30 around here. Buyers want to lodge money in sellers acound before it's even cut. Bananas stuff.

Bass Reeves · 10-07-2018 8:56am

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Round straw bales making €30 around here. Buyers want to lodge money in sellers acound before it's even cut. Bananas stuff.

Talking to another farmer last night. He was after buying 75 bales of hay at 32/ bale. He was going to have to get it delivered at say 3-4/bale. it was going to cost 35+ in the yard. It was late June hay so feed value a bit better than straw. He bought it so he could buy cattle. With ration looking like being 300+ this winter he is at nothing.

I made the point to him to hold off buying as stores will be under pressure in the autumn. His answer was good catle always make good money.

adam14 · 10-07-2018 10:18am

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Talking to another farmer last night. He was after buying 75 bales of hay at 32/ bale. He was going to have to get it delivered at say 3-4/bale. it was going to cost 35+ in the yard. It was late June hay so feed value a bit better than straw. He bought it so he could buy cattle. With ration looking like being 300+ this winter he is at nothing.

I made the point to him to hold off buying as stores will be under pressure in the autumn. His answer was good catle always make good money.

A lot of lads are at nothing and will be at nothing. There's going to be a lot of lads fall by the wayside and but it will take a while for all these contributing factors to hit the bottom line. The economics of buying hay or straw at the prevailing prices is not there. Even the economics of contracting is not there. Machinery prices and associated running costs are going up and farmers can not afford to pay higher contracting prices. Something has to give.

wrangler · 10-07-2018 10:32am

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Round straw bales making €30 around here. Buyers want to lodge money in sellers acound before it's even cut. Bananas stuff.

There's no sector more entitled to proper prices than tillage farmers, They have been screwed for the last five to ten years......straw prices needs to double for them this year or we'll be importing straw next year

TooOldBoots · 10-07-2018 10:37am

farming93 wrote: »

Sorry for hijacking this topic, but he much should I charge per acre for hay still standing ? Without ripping anyone off but still enough that I'm making a few pound myself ?

Considering that crops are back, you'd be estimating about 6 round bales/acre @ 25 each gives a value of €150. The hay standing would come in at a third of the value so unfortunately about €50/acre is all you could expect

Bass Reeves · 10-07-2018 11:51am

wrangler wrote: »

There's no sector more entitled to proper prices than tillage farmers, They have been screwed for the last five to ten years......straw prices needs to double for them this year or we'll be importing straw next year

But it is uneconomic to buy straw at those prices. Tillage in Ireland has become a high cost game with lads gambling. It was intersting over the last few years on this forum lads advocating the value of straw bedded sheds for cows and adult cattle. We now see the folly of this. Tillage farmer jsut like the rest of us have being competing with world prices.

My old friend John Heney has an interesting common sence article again in the FI. Darragh McCollough has an article on Kerry Co-op share spin out. Bother are interesting to read. There has been an artifical demand for straw for the last few years. It was being used in finishing systems to achieve high ration intake in cattle, lads were opting away from slats to beeded sheds, as well as normal demand for calving and cattle bedding. The equine industry demand is massive as well. But then there is a lot of uneconomic tillage being carried out.

Bass Reeves · 10-07-2018 11:56am

TooOldBoots wrote: »

Considering that crops are back, you'd be estimating about 6 round bales/acre @ 25 each gives a value of €150. The hay standing would come in at a third of the value so unfortunately about €50/acre is all you could expect

Very little hay moving at 25/bale most at 30/bale. Add in that this type of hay can be used as replacement for straw as well in finishing cattle. Saw a lad ask 20/bale for a standing crop lately. If it is only being cut now it will be 8 bales/acre IMO. If it is goodish meadow with little enough weed, 15/bale minimum or 100-120/acre. I would not pay that for it but that is where the market is.

davidk1394 · 11-07-2018 9:52am

Sold hay for €35/bale last week out of the field but it was top notch stuff

Reggie. · 11-07-2018 10:12am

davidk1394 wrote: »

Sold hay for €35/bale last week out of the field but it was top notch stuff

Sure every seller says that

selling silage and hay round bales

Comments