Raw food - German Shepherd Pup

BigDuffman · 29-09-2020 1:03pm #1

I'm the proud new owner of an 8 Week old Male German Shepherd (GSD) pup! I've been doing some reading online and chatting with other owners ref what to feed him. I've never had a pup or GSD before.

I'm cynical as a rule of new trends that don't have the full support of the professional / clinical community. But from what I've been reading some of the positive points of raw food seem to have merit.

My pup is 8/9 weeks old and weighs in at 5kgs I currently have him on gain elite big dog - puppy. The breeder had been giving him some raw mince with the Gain elite. So I have him on

Morning: 45g of Gain and 5g of mince
Mid morning: 25g of Gain
Afternoon: 25g of Gain
Evening 45g of Gain and 5g of mince.

He gets the odd bit of apple & peanut butter of scrap of veg through out the day too.

I'm not sure the best approach to increase his raw food intake. I'm not convinced that a fully "raw" diet is the way forward as anecdotally from a vet it can cause gastric torsion (?)

Has anyone had experience of combining food types?

Wizard! · 29-09-2020 1:18pm

BigDuffman wrote: »

I'm cynical as a rule of new trends that don't have the full support of the professional / clinical community. But from what I've been reading some of the positive points of raw food seem to have merit.

There is support and scientific proof, but most vets are resellers of garbage food, so they need to convince you to buy them.

I had a GSD with a severe diarrhea problem. The vet kept suggesting new types of food, but the problem persisted. He said he had an allergy on chicken and we ended up using beef/lamb, but still wasn't good enough.

When he suggested to buy an "anti-allergy" and very expensive food, I started being worried about his motives. I did my own research and ended up with BARF. I got a small amount just to try it, as the seller suggested, and since most of it was chicken, where the dog supposedly had allergy. He said to give him for 3 days, and if the problem persists to stop.

1st day: fed 12pm, 12:30 worst diarrhea ever, pure liquid
2nd day: fed 12pm, 6pm long walk, perfect poop

Since that day, he was amazingly energetic, his fair was glossy and clean,

and his teeth white and bright. And that with mostly chicken were he "was allergic"...

Here in Ireland I haven't found any BARF suppliers, but you can search some reliable Fb groups and learn to make your own, it is not hard, and it is much cheaper than the ready made. A GSD requires about 1.5-1.8kg meat per day, so you may want to cut costs.

Grains, are BAD for dogs, don't feed them any.

https://www.flexpetz.com/blog/facts-barf-homemade-diets/

Some information about the dangers of BARF for the owners:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3003575/

tk123 · 30-09-2020 9:10am

Wizard! wrote: »

Here in Ireland I haven't found any BARF suppliers, but you can search some reliable Fb groups and learn to make your own, it is not hard, and it is much cheaper than the ready made. A GSD requires about 1.5-1.8kg meat per day, so you may want to cut costs.

I'd assume you checked a few years ago when there was 2 suppliers? There's tons of suppliers now. My favourite is rawvolution.ie

OP I'm waiting for a pup atm and plan to do what I did last time. I'll be mainly feeding raw completes at first and will then mix with Rocco junior wet food from zooplus (Rocco is very popular with posters here) as the pup gets older and needs more food - both to bulk out the meat and save on costs. My girl was on over 1kg of food a day at one stage.
For increasing meat content I'd look at maybe swapping one of the dry meals out with a raw complete - that way what you're feeding is balanced. There are different opinions on whether raw and dry should be mixed but this is really down to your individual dog's digestion. My mam is in her 70s and used to be sent on a message to collect offal for her uncles dog as a child - raw feeding isn't a new trend/fad for everyone. There are also different options and levels of experience on raw feeding with vets - this is something to be mindful of. You should be working as a team with your vet not at loggerheads with them on what you're feeding. No matter what you feed your dog can still become sick and injured so you need a good relationship.

lashes34 · 30-09-2020 10:09am

I used raw for a Staffie years ago where she lost a third of her body weight and was seriously thin. It suited her perfectly, she regained the weight and was in great health.

I fed mainly chicken drumsticks, duck necks. Added a little veg and offal.

Tangleytuftles · 01-10-2020 9:44pm

My disaster dog(who has allergies and has always been funny with dry food) is loving premade raw. Degomeat and approved raw are both good foods he does excellent on. I also give him about 50 grams of dry food a few days a week(I get the lidls 60% meat grain free stuff which isn't the greatest but its the only dry food in the last 3 months that hasn't given him the runs) because my dog refuses to eat enough raw to get his daily calories from that alone. He's meant to be eating about 500 grams a day of raw but he's been bored lately so he's only been eating about 70% of that so I add in enough dry to make up the calories. He's such a weirdo.

Justin Credible Darts · 11-10-2020 4:56am

I have a German shepherd and insist you do not ever give him raw meat.

firstly they are pedigree dogs and pedigrees are more prone to illnesses than a mongrel / mixed breed/ etc

I feed mine gluten free, wheat free, dry.
Once but no more than twice a week would I add a pouch to his food, as my shepherd is huge and got him under the 8 stone mark now although thin, is very tall and long so when he farts, the whole house stinks, and boy do they fart, and loud.
They can have very sensitive stomachs.

I always kept border Collies and they being a more prolific breed were hardier breed, but shepherds can be very temperamental.
The gluten free, wheat free food is more expensive, but it will save you on vet bills, I am speaking from experience

Wizard! · 11-10-2020 9:00am

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

The gluten free, wheat free food is more expensive, but it will save you on vet bills, I am speaking from experience

And my experience says the exact opposite... :rolleyes:

DBB · 11-10-2020 12:11pm

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

I have a German shepherd and insist you do not ever give him raw meat.

firstly they are pedigree dogs and pedigrees are more prone to illnesses than a mongrel / mixed breed/ etc

Is there a documented link between feeding raw meat to a pedigree dog, and illness?
I'm curious as to why you'd insist one does not ever give raw meat to a GSD... I have 2 of them, also huge dogs, and had another before them both. They were and are fed raw. I have tried a variety of really high quality dry foods over the years, but have never achieved the balance of solid poops, lack of flatulence, and good health with the GSDs as I consistently have with the raw diet.
My vet heartily recommends a wet or raw diet too.
So, where does that leave us? Should I not be feeding raw food to the GSDs?

tk123 · 11-10-2020 1:14pm

My vet nearly choked one time when I mentioned that somebody had used the cross breeds are healthier line on me lol.

Justin Credible Darts · 11-10-2020 4:05pm

Wizard! wrote: »

And my experience says the exact opposite... :rolleyes:

well good for you.

Glad you found something that helped your dog.

As one member mentioned the worst culprit for my dog was the chicken, he loved it, but it would not agree with him, after a long time and plenty vet bills I found the gluten free, wheat free, was the only one that suited mine.

the raw did not suit mine.

tk123 · 11-10-2020 5:20pm

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

the raw did not suit mine.

Different things suit different dogs. Insisting others don’t feed what doesn’t suit your individual dog is a bit over the top(!)

Justin Credible Darts · 11-10-2020 5:23pm

tk123 wrote: »

Different things suit different dogs. Insisting others don’t feed what doesn’t suit your individual dog is a bit over the top(!)

maybe in hindsight, but was going by what my vet suggested.

Took almost 2 years before we got the balance right.

Even this year I got a different flavour sack of food, same company and brand, and it did not suit him.

Never had a dog like him for sensitivity in the stomach

Wizard! · 11-10-2020 8:30pm

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

maybe in hindsight, but was going by what my vet suggested.
Took almost 2 years before we got the balance right.
Even this year I got a different flavour sack of food, same company and brand, and it did not suit him.
Never had a dog like him for sensitivity in the stomach

1. A Vet's opinion is not a scientific study. Is based on every individual and current circumstances
2. If you have a dog with certain sensitivity, what makes you think that his treatment/food applies to all others?

My vet said my GSD was sensitive to chicken, and he was proved 100% wrong...

Justin Credible Darts · 11-10-2020 8:33pm

Wizard! wrote: »

1. A Vet's opinion is not a scientific study. Is based on every individual and current circumstances
2. If you have a dog with certain sensitivity, what makes you think that his treatment/food applies to all others?

My vet said my GSD was sensitive to chicken, and he was proved 100% wrong...

My fella loves chicken but I cannot give him more than a bit, as it gives him the runs.

As I said earlier i was quoting my vet, and as you say vets can be wrong.

Graces7 · 12-10-2020 2:47am

re the word "insist" in the ops first post? I read it at first as meaning that he/she insisted WE do not feed raw. But then read MY DOG. …. He is saying do not feed MY DOG raw?

Of course dogs and cats are individuals. There is no one rule. Our job as owners is to feed what is best for each pet.

I was made very aware of that with one of my last rescues. Previously there had never been a cat in forty years with any issues about feeding. But this little one is clearly a large part Oriental. ( the tell tale " breeders nightmare " as one poster on another forum put it, of six neat white spots on her jet black fur. Including her " medallion" …... and her voice!

when she came she was rail thin. Putting fingers astride her hips they all but met. She simply will not eat what the others had been given and in the multi car rescue ? So I tried various things; raw chicken is grand, thank you, and one brand of kibble.
But only one.

They get food sensitivities and intolerances just as we do. Al part of our commitment as owners

The others eat anything they are given.
.

Hooked · 12-10-2020 5:06pm

BigDuffman wrote: »

I'm the proud new owner of an 8 Week old Male German Shepherd (GSD) pup! I've been doing some reading online and chatting with other owners ref what to feed him. I've never had a pup or GSD before.

Has anyone had experience of combining food types?

I've 2 Siberian Huskies...

One will be 10 next April. The other is 7 at Christmas. They've only been to a vet for the snip. Healthy as horses!!!
And I firmly believe that it's down to tremendous breeding and a very healthy diet!

Was a bit late to the raw diet with the older one and had the younger on it from about 6 months... I'd be reluctant to feed it earlier - that's just me. I wanted him to be at least that old before I started introducing RAW.

Personally - I don't feed a mix in the same meal. I've read that they digest at different rates.

So, for most of their lives - we feed kibble in the morning meal. Supplemented with salmon oil, natural yoghurt or a raw egg... We find Markus Muhle Naturnah a great feed for the money. You'll find it on zooplus. Rating/review here: https://www.allaboutdogfood.co.uk/dog-food-reviews/0341/markus-muehle-natural-dog-food

For the raw - we make up batches each week. And freeze.

Raw mince, fish, chicken, fresh veg (par boiled), rice, herbs, eggs, fish oil, etc... A chicken wing, thigh or fish head as a substitute for the above "batches". And a large brisket bone once every 6-8 weeks to keep their teeth and gums healthy.

Dr. Conor Brady is worth a follow on Facebook (Dogs First).

My opinion - Introduce the raw as a separate meal. Starting with the basics.. chicken. Then build from there. NEVER feed cooked bones!!!

Enjoy your puppy! You've no idea how fast these 10 years have gone!!!!

Justin Credible Darts · 12-10-2020 5:08pm

yep, rice is another under rated food i have given my fella too,

Hooked · 12-10-2020 5:11pm

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

yep, rice is another under rated food i have given my fella too,

Agreed!!!

Just avoid the "easy cook" or brown rice IF you're treating diarrhea after fasting.
The rice water is great to get them back on track after fasting...

Justin Credible Darts · 12-10-2020 5:27pm

Problem with my fella is he acts like he was never fed.

No matter what I have , he wants, think its more of him wanting to interact, he loves tomato, lettuce, turnip, raw carrot.
If I have it he wants it.

Obviously there are plenty foods he simply cannot have. I knew a greyhound breeder that use to feed his dogs tomatoes , seemingly they break down the lactic acid on joints, which can be a problem for some dogs if they are walked too much when they are young, so I often give my fella some cherry tomatoes, loves his egg as well.

Raw food - German Shepherd Pup

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