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Sinn Fein - just where is the money coming from?

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,281 ✭✭✭CrankyHaus


    When did rules prohibiting political funding from abroad come in?
    If SF built up enough of a nest egg and property portfolio in ROI before that then it's little surprise that the party would be well off. Especially if it doesn't have to rent premises.

    SF had a considerable international fund raising enterprise for decades, not to mention the lucrative criminal activities of the IRA.

    If the money came from illegal activities subsequent to the GRA then it's obviously a scandal but until there's any evidence of that I don't really see it as a big deal.

    The main concern with political party funding is the influence this may give funders over politicians, corruption basically. This is a concern with say the FF Galway Races tent or Paddy the Plasterer giving Bertie bags of cash. I'm not aware of any billionaires or millionaires getting favours from SF in exchange for money.


  • Registered Users Posts: 66,323 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Serious question for you.
    is there any thread about Sinn Fein that you do not post on?
    For a fella(I assume) who says he is a floating voter and not a party member you appear to be infatuated with them.

    Serious answer:

    If you are talking about ME on the thread, that in itself is a sign of 'infatuation' or 'obsession'.

    Stalking is considered a sociopathic illness. Just sayin. ;)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,148 ✭✭✭Salary Negotiator


    What use are you?

    Could you not have written another long winded reply (excuse) explaining why Leo and the agencies of the state cannot intervene, and that we should just accept the allegation without question, like certain posters are fond of writing? :)

    Sorry to disappoint, all I have is local rumours and conjectures.


  • Registered Users Posts: 66,323 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    There's a good chance a lot of their properties are held in 'trust' and would have recieved quite a bit of grant aid.

    The building they own here (as far as I know they own it) was acquired as a 'Failté' building and was used to rehabilitate prisoners released after the GFA. That programme would have been heavily funded by P&R money.

    There seems to be several community based services in there now..also funded in terms of paying rents, running costs. Creche's, Support Groups etc etc.


    *The locals call the creche 'Long Creche' :)


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Serious answer:

    If you are talking about ME on the thread, that in itself is a sign of 'infatuation' or 'obsession'.

    Stalking is considered a sociopathic illness. Just sayin. ;)

    And that right there is deflecting from the question you were asked.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 66,323 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Cupatae wrote: »
    And that right there is deflecting from the question you were asked.

    Absolutely ^^^ ...you might have noticed...THE THREAD IS NOT ABOUT FRANCIEBRADY!


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    What are the 200 employees doing and why didn’t some of them run for the Dail considering they let folks like your one in Clare and your man in Tipperary run for them?

    200 people - that’s more full time employees than the Conservative or Labour parties in Britain.

    Something not right here. Hope the Irish Times keep digging - like the media should.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,215 ✭✭✭✭Suckit


    It's okay to let a thread go quiet for a while, it doesn't necessarily mean it's dying.


    What are the 200 employees doing and why didn’t some of them run for the Dail considering they let folks like your one in Clare and your man in Tipperary run for them?

    200 people - that’s more full time employees than the Conservative or Labour parties in Britain.

    Something not right here. Hope the Irish Times keep digging - like the media should.
    Why would they need to run when both of those mentioned got in?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,204 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    Quite frankly I would be surprised if they were not the richest party in the country. SF have been fund raising in various guises for decades both nationally throughout the island of Ireland and internationally- which gives them a huge well to dip into unlike the other parties. SF are also the oldest party in the country or at least just behind Labour.

    The only surprise here is that people seem surprised or at least trying to generate faux outrage.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,467 ✭✭✭Floppybits


    Just in the interest of fairness will the IT be doing a piece on funding for all political parties in the Republic of Ireland or will it just be Sinn Fein? FF and FG are not squeaky clean as their supporters may think, we had Bertie getting cash from Paddy the Plasterer, Martin with the builders money resting in his account, we wont mention Liam Lawlor or the Planning tribunals or Ivor Callely, then on FG who didn't pay tax on certain payments, good auld Michael Lowry and then there is the involvement of DOB and his "Favourable" treatment by FG and that is also not mention the blind eye that was turned for 2 year on Dara Murphy and his expense claims.

    So by all means investigate SF and their money but make sure the same is done for every single party in the state. I'd say there would be a nerves in those parties if that was to happen.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 20,329 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    In 2018 a number of their elected representatives gave the donation limit of €2,500 to the party. As happened in other parties as well. The only difference is that the TD's from FG etc don't go round claiming that they are living on the average wage. If the SF reps are handing over more than €2,500 there must be some creative accounting going on to get round the SIPO limit.

    https://www.sipo.ie/reports-and-publications/annual-disclosures/Report-donations-political-parties-2018.pdf


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,204 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    Floppybits wrote: »
    Just in the interest of fairness will the IT be doing a piece on funding for all political parties in the Republic of Ireland or will it just be Sinn Fein? FF and FG are not squeaky clean as their supporters may think, we had Bertie getting cash from Paddy the Plasterer, Martin with the builders money resting in his account, we wont mention Liam Lawlor or the Planning tribunals or Ivor Callely, then on FG who didn't pay tax on certain payments, good auld Michael Lowry and then there is the involvement of DOB and his "Favourable" treatment by FG and that is also not mention the blind eye that was turned for 2 year on Dara Murphy and his expense claims.

    So by all means investigate SF and their money but make sure the same is done for every single party in the state. I'd say there would be a nerves in those parties if that was to happen.


    Yeah the hilarity of Bertie Ahern as the Minister for Finance not having a bank account and expecting us to believe it.

    While we are at it, let the GAA throw open their books and also especially local GAA clubs and county boards. That would be a laugh. All those fat brown envelopes handed over to players and coaches but maybe they just let local business do the dirty work instead. The whole "expenses" charade.

    Investigate by all means but there is no high and mighty organisation in this country able to throw the first stone.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,467 ✭✭✭Floppybits


    Yeah the hilarity of Bertie Ahern as the Minister for Finance not having a bank account and expecting us to believe it.

    While we are at it, let the GAA throw open their books and also especially local GAA clubs and county boards. That would be a laugh. All those fat brown envelopes handed over to players and coaches but maybe they just let local business do the dirty work instead. The whole "expenses" charade.

    Investigate by all means but there is no high and mighty organisation in this country able to throw the first stone.

    Can you imagine the skeletons that would be unearthed if that happened. Jaysus there would be blood on the streets.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,643 ✭✭✭storker


    News reaches us this morning that SF is by a country mile the richest political party in the country. It owns 50 properties around the country, and, rather extraordinarily, employees 200 people.

    This is shocking and really should be looked into further, because if true, it means that despite everything we keep hearing to the contrary, SF are better at managing finances than FF and FG! :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,228 ✭✭✭Acosta


    Yeah the hilarity of Bertie Ahern as the Minister for Finance not having a bank account and expecting us to believe it.

    .

    If the IT are hinting at some alleged Shinner financial corruption it's worth remembering that after the Bertie debacle FF were once again returned to government by the electorate a few month's later.


  • Registered Users Posts: 43,017 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Are all the 200 employees capped at the average industrial wage?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,779 ✭✭✭CFlat


    I worked as a tour guide in the Midlands in the early 80s. I had a group of Americas one day and we were passing Custume Barracks in Athlone. I pointed out that it was the head quarters of the western command of the Irish army. One American pipped up and said, "oh is that where the IRA are stationed?".

    My theory is the SF/IRA have been lying to guilable Americans for decades telling them they were the legitimate army of the republic so they would put their hands deep into their pockets. After all what decent human being would give money to support a terrorist organisation?

    Unfortunately I do agree with some posters here though. The more that comes out about SF, the more support they appear to garner. It's nearly Trumpesque at this stage now.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭mynamejeff


    Quite frankly I would be surprised if they were not the richest party in the country. SF have been fund raising in various guises for decades both nationally throughout the island of Ireland and internationally- which gives them a huge well to dip into unlike the other parties. SF are also the oldest party in the country or at least just behind Labour.

    The only surprise here is that people seem surprised or at least trying to generate faux outrage.

    SF like to propagate that lie to steal some history from other older parties but in reality the party of MLM Ellis etc were created as an offshoot of and offshoot of the actual parties who fought the war of independence and civil wars .

    they are n older than 1970 or so formed as a result of orders from a IRA army council meeting the previous year

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinn_Féin#1923–1970


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,650 ✭✭✭✭maccored


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    SF like to propagate that lie to steal some history from other older parties but in reality the party of MLM Ellis etc were created as an offshoot of and offshoot of the actual parties who fought the war of independence and civil wars .

    they are n older than 1970 or so formed as a result of orders from a IRA army council meeting the previous year

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinn_Féin#1923–1970

    when have SF ever claimed to be the oldest political party in ireland then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,204 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    CFlat wrote: »
    .

    My theory is the SF/IRA have been lying to guilable Americans for decades telling them they were the legitimate army of the republic so they would put their hands deep into their pockets. After all what decent human being would give money to support a terrorist organisation?


    Safe to say that you have never hung around Irish centers in the US and then dismissing all Americans who may have donated as 'guilable (sic)' makes you look a bit foolish and ill informed.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,204 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    mynamejeff wrote: »
    SF like to propagate that lie to steal some history from other older parties but in reality the party of MLM Ellis etc were created as an offshoot of and offshoot of the actual parties who fought the war of independence and civil wars .

    they are n older than 1970 or so formed as a result of orders from a IRA army council meeting the previous year

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinn_Féin#1923–1970


    Splits, splits and more splits is not really relevant. There has been a Sinn Fein party in continuous existence since 1905.


    The funds and resources in place in 1970 had to have gone somewhere and continued.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,918 ✭✭✭Conall Cernach


    Bear in mind that many of these properties will be shops selling republican type memorabilia which all need to be staffed then there can't be much surprise that they have 200 employees. Also of note should be that Republican Sinn Féin, a group with one elected councillor and a membership that would be lucky to top 100, also owns two properties paid for via donations from supporters and private members draws etc.

    If it was examined I would not be surprised to find that the usual establishment parties do not own the properties they use because they are paying vast rents to party members and supporters.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    2500 sheets is the most a political party can accept in a calendar year from a single donor. And that has to be registered and reported to the Standards in Public Office.

    Even if they were paying their 200 employees the minimum wage it would cost 4.2 million a year (excluding PRSI etc).

    So they’d have to be getting 1700 donations of 2500 a year to support the wage bill alone. That doesn’t account for the 50 properties either. You don’t have to declare donations up to 100 quid so maybe SF just received 43000 €100 donations.

    Where’s the money coming from? Something very odd about all this. Hmmm......


  • Registered Users Posts: 934 ✭✭✭Fred Cryton


    Why has the media nothing to say about the fact that Mary Lou owns a second home in France?

    Wouldn't do her "Woman of the people" act any favours now would it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 834 ✭✭✭Heart Break Kid


    Are all the 200 employees capped at the average industrial wage?

    Thats not something they enforce anymore. Most of their TDs claim their full salary.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,204 ✭✭✭partyguinness



    Where’s the money coming from? Something very odd about all this. Hmmm......


    Ah come on Johnny you are better than this.


    Anyway it's not like they bought 50 properties in one go. I am sure they have been built up over several decades. Sure think of all the 'safe houses' needed back in the 70s and 80s.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,215 ✭✭✭✭Suckit


    It has to be said, the FG meltdown since this election is hilarious.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,329 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    Suckit wrote: »
    It has to be said, the FG meltdown since this election is hilarious.

    It doesn't have to be said so often.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    Suckit wrote: »
    It has to be said, the FG meltdown since this election is hilarious.

    This has nothing to do with FG. It’s asking where SF gets the money to own 50 properties and employ 200 people. Very valid questions to ask. They promised new politics. This smells very old.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,215 ✭✭✭✭Suckit


    It doesn't have to be said so often.


    shrug2.gifI didn't start the thread reminding everyone.


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