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Comments

  • #62
    Guffy
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭Guffy


    gstack166 wrote: »
    Rappaport is über reliable though in fairness, from what I’ve followed on him anyways. Do we get much value in that 4th pick though if for example Giants do take Chubb or even trade down.

    Ah ya Rappaport gets some amount of legit info tbf.

    I don't know. If the Giants take a non QB at 2 then i think there would be plenty of trade value to be had


  • #63
    VillaMad
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭VillaMad


    So it's finally Draft night after what has been a long winter of waiting.

    Browns will have the first and fourth pick tonight.

    The QB will be the first pick and it has been regarded to be a fight between Sam Darnold and Josh Allen for the past month until suddenly I see Baker Mayfield may well be that pick but whatever happens all I hope is that they back the guy and give him time. You have to trust Dorsey and whoever else is in on it, to back themselves and go with who they believe is the best choice, having done all their scouting. With having Tyrod there, I'm not too worried as we should not have a Kizer situation facing us again next year.

    For the fourth pick, it should be Bradley Chubb as the Giants will most likely pick Barkley and try and pair him up with Myles Garrett, but I can see them trading down as the Bills have to come up to get a QB and you never know what else can happen in those few minutes. It's possible they could trade down and get someone like Mike McGlinchey to replace Joe Thomas instead.


  • #64
    VillaMad
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭VillaMad


    So it was Baker Mayfield after all and that's fine as they had the choice of all of them and they picked him as the best fit. Is he going to be a franchise QB for the next 10-15 years? Well we will see. He will have to go against the experts opinion due to his size and all the measurables but he was the most accurate QB.

    As for the fourth pick, it did deflate me at the time as Bradley Chubb was definitely the best available player on the list and I had visions of him on one side and Garrett on the other side, but they felt they needed more help at corner and with the likes of Brown and AJ Green in the division, they needed something and so Denzel Ward was the best on the board. It's possible they could have traded down and got Ward anyway, but we don't know and we never will. Ward was never really in the conversation for number 4 but he fills a need.

    For Rounds 2 & 3, a replacement for Joe Thomas will be the main need. Connor Williams is the favourite for that. For pick 35, they could go edge rusher with Landry or RB with Jones or Guice.


  • #65
    The_Honeybadger
    Registered Users Posts: 4,151 ✭✭✭The_Honeybadger


    Some surprising picks there, hope Mayfield works out for the Browns. Like yourself when the no. 4 pick was announced I was like WTF are they doing, but they do need a top corner and if he turns out to be that for the next decade it’s a good pick. They have enough picks so no need to risk trading back and hoping he is there if they really wanted him, which they clearly did.

    I think Dorsey deserves the benefit of the doubt, some of the business he did in FA was excellent and I look forward to seeing a much improved Browns team next year.


  • #66
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    I’m still scratching my head why the Browns didn’t pick Barkley at #1.  At the fourth pick they would still have the pick of at least 2 quality QB’s available to them (Mayfield, Darnold, Allen or Rosen).  Putting a top QB and the best RB we've seen in years on the field together would have helped them immensely.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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  • #67
    Guffy
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭Guffy


    notobtuse wrote: »
    I’m still scratching my head why the Browns didn’t pick Barkley at #1.  At the fourth pick they would still have the pick of at least 2 quality QB’s available to them (Mayfield, Darnold, Allen or Rosen).  Putting a top QB and the best RB we've seen in years on the field together would have helped them immensely.

    Absolute nonsense. I'm sorry but ive been having this debate since feb and not going into it again but if you dont understand it you need to read up on positional value and salaries.

    I'm a little surprised they took Chubb in the 2nd but am not dissapointed in it as i like the player. I would have beem proper pissed if they took Barkley


  • #68
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Guffy wrote: »
    notobtuse wrote: »
    I’m still scratching my head why the Browns didn’t pick Barkley at #1.  At the fourth pick they would still have the pick of at least 2 quality QB’s available to them (Mayfield, Darnold, Allen or Rosen).  Putting a top QB and the best RB we've seen in years on the field together would have helped them immensely.

    Absolute nonsense. I'm sorry but ive been having this debate since feb and not going into it again but if you dont understand it you need to read up on positional value and salaries.

    I'm a little surprised they took Chubb in the 2nd but am not dissapointed in it as i like the player. I would have beem proper pissed if they took Barkley
    You have your opinion and that's fine.  Sorry, but to turn down a player that has the potential to give a team 2,000 combined running and catching yards, and still get a top rated QB, doesn't make sense to me.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #69
    Guffy
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭Guffy


    notobtuse wrote: »
    You have your opinion and that's fine.  Sorry, but to turn down a player that has the potential to give a team 2,000 combined running and catching yards, and still get a top rated QB, doesn't make sense to me.

    And who's going to pass him the ball? Your 3rd choice QB? I mean you do realise the success rate of qb's ya? Given that why would you leave the rest of the league choose what one you can have? Ward and mayfield have been my own personal preferences since march, delighted it fell that way. Ya it would have been nice to pick ward up a couple of spots later but if there is no one to trade back with feck it. Take your guy.

    Aside from that duke and crowell combined for 2,000 odd yards last year, on a horrible offense. Much happier having the QB we want and a lock down corner. The passing game (production and stopping it) is far more important and expensive to fix than the running game. Its the reason running backs, guards and mlb's are relatively poorly paid.


  • #70
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Guffy wrote: »
    notobtuse wrote: »
    You have your opinion and that's fine.  Sorry, but to turn down a player that has the potential to give a team 2,000 combined running and catching yards, and still get a top rated QB, doesn't make sense to me.

    And who's  going to pass him the ball? Your 3rd choice QB? I mean you do realise the success rate of qb's ya? Given that why would you leave the rest of the league choose what one you can have? Ward and mayfield have been my own personal preferences since march, delighted it fell that way. Ya it would have been nice to pick ward up a couple of spots later but if there is no one to trade back with feck it. Take your guy.

    Aside from that duke and crowell combined for 2,000 odd yards last year, on a horrible offense. Much happier having the QB we want and a lock down corner. The passing game (production and stopping it) is far more important and expensive to fix than the running game. Its the reason running backs, guards and mlb's are relatively poorly paid.
    You might be right.  The Browns are already a better team in 2018 than they were in previous years. But Mayfield, Darnold and Allen were all touted to be better than each other at times and one of them would have been available to the Browns at number 4.   Barkley and Chubb were can’t-miss prospects.  All four of the top rated QB’s have known flaws. They are all gambles.  I know the new rational seems to be you don’t waist the number one pick on a running back who might last 10 years in the league, but Barkley is exceptional.  And a quality RB is a QB’s best friend. If they took Barkley (the best player in the draft) first and then taken a risk on one of these four QBs later they would have been almost guaranteed of one home run pick. The risk-reward was much higher in taking Mayfield number one.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #71
    Silver-Tiger
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭Silver-Tiger


    Definitely the most excited i've been for a while.

    And nothing to do with Mayfield. He'll sit but wouldn't be surprised if he beat out Taylor.
    http://behindbaker.com/ These are great. He'll be great on hard knocks.

    Taylor, Landry , Hyde look like solid additions. Although Hyde might not be impressed if Chubb gets going. Duke is still my fav player on roster. The backfield looks great.

    There must be points scored with that offense. Gordon, Njoku, Coleman, Landry, That backfield and a solid Line.

    D looking good for next year too. Hopefully Garrett and Ogbah are healthy starting and Schobert has been great thus far.

    I'm not setting expectations too high for our new CB Denzel Ward. Partly because i'm still scarred by Justin Gilbert and mostly because rookie corners usually don't hot the ground running. Lattimore was exceptional for Saints last year. Haden had 6 picks in his rookie year but remember him getting torched constantly too.

    I think Hue needs 7-8 wins to keep his job. Don't think he'll get that. Still. Gonna be easy to root for the team this year i think.


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  • #72
    gstack166
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭gstack166


    Listening to the Browns radio station on Tunein this evening this evening while out running, interviewed a few players & ex-players live on it from the open training session.

    Seems like the players love Tyrod, no question the reckon that bar a complete disaster he will be the starter for the year.

    Bernie Kosar & Tim Couch are all in on the receivers & Couch especially sees a huge year for Corey Coleman coming. Jarvis has that point to prove mentality about him.

    Jabril Peppers backed Laundry’s comments about making the playoffs, says there’s a genuine belief in the camp they will do it & Hue & Dorsey are saying it’s the aim for the season which is surprising to hear Hue say that considering the pressure he is going to be under.

    I’d take 6-10 in the morning if it was given but depending what happens with Flacco & Jackson in Baltimore they should give it a good go to finish runners up in the division, to finish behind the Bengals this year in my opinion would be a firing offence in itself for Hue Jackson!


  • #73
    VillaMad
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭VillaMad


    gstack166 wrote: »
    Listening to the Browns radio station on Tunein this evening this evening while out running, interviewed a few players & ex-players live on it from the open training session.

    Seems like the players love Tyrod, no question the reckon that bar a complete disaster he will be the starter for the year.

    Bernie Kosar & Tim Couch are all in on the receivers & Couch especially sees a huge year for Corey Coleman coming. Jarvis has that point to prove mentality about him.

    Jabril Peppers backed Laundry’s comments about making the playoffs, says there’s a genuine belief in the camp they will do it & Hue & Dorsey are saying it’s the aim for the season which is surprising to hear Hue say that considering the pressure he is going to be under.

    I’d take 6-10 in the morning if it was given but depending what happens with Flacco & Jackson in Baltimore they should give it a good go to finish runners up in the division, to finish behind the Bengals this year in my opinion would be a firing offence in itself for Hue Jackson!

    I wouldn't predict anything anymore with these Browns as even to get any win would be a big thing for this coach and roster. Baltimore and Cincinnati have certainly had stronger sides but even to get a win against both sides would be a major plus for me.

    I suppose with all pre-season training camps, there is always going to be optimism and hope for the year ahead and hopefully the new batch can escape the scars of the past.

    Two concerns however for me. Josh Gordon looks like he will miss another part of the season. Some rumours that it could be, just to avoid Hard Knocks, but whatever the reason it is a blow although not wholly surprising considering his past. Landry is a proven and should help but I do worry about Coleman who just hasn't lived up to his draft pick.

    My other concern is replacing Joe Thomas where Shon Coleman has struggled in the role. Austin Corbett was it was initially thought, drafted high in the second round to take on this role but the coaching staff see him as versatile on the OL which makes it a baffling draft pick for me.

    Finally I hope Tyrod Taylor keeps the job for the year and we don't see Baker Mayfield much this season, if at all. Too often, the Browns have thrown in a rookie at QB who has floundered as the gulf between college and the pro game is steep and I hope Baker is given time to develop. The fear is that if the Browns struggle early on that the chants for Mayfield to come on will get louder and louder. I believe that Mayfield will be very good for this side in the future but I hope that he isn't thrown in at the deep end.


  • #74
    gstack166
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭gstack166


    Corey Coleman traded to the Bills for undisclosed draft picks.

    He was drafted first round in 2016 in the draft we passed on Wentz. That draft is looking a complete disaster now.

    On another note, I presume that leaves the room on the roster they want to persue Dez Bryant? We’ll see.


  • #75
    The_Honeybadger
    Registered Users Posts: 4,151 ✭✭✭The_Honeybadger


    I read on social media that not one of theirs first round picks from 07-16 is left on their roster after this trade. Mad if true.


  • #76
    gstack166
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭gstack166


    mickeyk wrote: »
    I read on social media that not one of theirs first round picks from 07-16 is left on their roster after this trade. Mad if true.

    Could be wrong now but I don’t think it’s as far back as 07, I think it’s from 2011 to 16, either way that’s bad enough too.

    I have a feeling Dorsey knows what he is doing though, even with Corey gone who I rated, injuries cost him Baker/Tyrod still have enough of weapons to be throwing to. I’d be worried if Dez comes in to be honest. I just think their seems to be a good spirit in the camp now & he could desrupt that. Time will tell if we sign him.


  • #77
    Guffy
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭Guffy


    I hope this is because higgens and callaway are tearing up camp with Gordan coming back and nothing to do woth Dez.


  • #78
    gstack166
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭gstack166


    Guffy wrote: »
    I hope this is because higgens and callaway are tearing up camp with Gordan coming back and nothing to do woth Dez.

    I imagine & hope Gordon is straight in as soon as the Hard Knock cameras are out of there.


  • #79
    VillaMad
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭VillaMad


    Only a 7th rounder for Coleman which suggests to me that they would have cut him at the end of pre-season.

    For a guy to be on a rookie-contract, it is baffling to get trade him unless the coaches and Dorsey feel that he is just isn't actually any good. Injuries have cost him an extended run in the side and I get the feeling that the fans would have turned on him ala Kenny Britt if he dropped a simple catch at the start of the season.


  • #80
    Ohmeha
    Registered Users Posts: 1,888 ✭✭✭Ohmeha


    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000945622/article/antonio-callaway-cited-for-marijuana-possession

    Just imagine if the Browns were on Hard Knocks this year...


  • #81
    VillaMad
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭VillaMad


    Ohmeha wrote: »
    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000945622/article/antonio-callaway-cited-for-marijuana-possession

    Just imagine if the Browns were on Hard Knocks this year...

    Well everyone knew about him being a bit shady ahead of the draft, so it isn't a huge surprise. Hard Knocks apparently also spent some of the day with Coleman when he gets traded which might be interesting as well.


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  • #82
    gstack166
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭gstack166


    Anyone see Episode 1 Friday night?

    Even though I believe Landry doesn’t make that speech if he doesn’t know the cameras are on him I feel he is the perfect personality for the roster. He brings a mentality that’s been missing for a long long time to Cleveland.

    He has every right to say what he did in my opinion too, I think he has played 16 games in every season he’s been a pro, for a receiver who get crushed that’s pretty impressive.

    I found it a bit awkward of the scenes with Dorsey & Jackson together though, I think it’s pretty clear that Jackson realises he’s out at some point this year & is just hoping he can leave with his head held high with a few wins.

    I’m getting excited for the season now, a competitive roster in a division that’s pretty weak excluding the Steelers!

    I strongly fancy ya to finish second, mainly because I feel possibly 5 but definitely 6 wins would be enough for that to happen in my opinion.


  • #83
    The_Honeybadger
    Registered Users Posts: 4,151 ✭✭✭The_Honeybadger


    gstack166 wrote: »
    Anyone see Episode 1 Friday night?

    Even though I believe Landry doesn’t make that speech if he doesn’t know the cameras are on him I feel he is the perfect personality for the roster. He brings a mentality that’s been missing for a long long time to Cleveland.

    He has every right to say what he did in my opinion too, I think he has played 16 games in every season he’s been a pro, for a receiver who get crushed that’s pretty impressive.

    I found it a bit awkward of the scenes with Dorsey & Jackson together though, I think it’s pretty clear that Jackson realises he’s out at some point this year & is just hoping he can leave with his head held high with a few wins.

    I’m getting excited for the season now, a competitive roster in a division that’s pretty weak excluding the Steelers!

    I strongly fancy ya to finish second, mainly because I feel possibly 5 but definitely 6 wins would be enough for that to happen in my opinion.

    Watched it last night. Jackson is coming across like a bit of a clown, if they have a bad start he’ll be under severe pressure. Felt bad for him that he lost his brother and mum in quick succession. I can’t imagine trying to deal with that in such a high pressure job.

    Landry looks absolutely driven to win, he is exactly what they need in that locker room. Tyrod came across well too I thought.

    I really hope they have a good season. 6-7 wins is probably best case scenario? That would be a monumental improvement on last year


  • #84
    Silver-Tiger
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭Silver-Tiger


    Happy that Flash is back. As much drama as he is, i'm happier with him back rather than Dez.

    Jackson looks Awful(as expected) on Hard Knocks.

    What's his leash do you think?

    I think if they start 0-3 he's in trouble. 0-4 and he's deffo gone. Same for 1-4.

    Haley prob get the gig for a season.


  • #85
    gstack166
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭gstack166


    Silver-Tiger wrote: »
    Happy that Flash is back. As much drama as he is, i'm happier with him back rather than Dez.

    Jackson looks Awful(as expected) on Hard Knocks.

    What's his leash do you think?

    I think if they start 0-3 he's in trouble. 0-4 and he's deffo gone. Same for 1-4.

    Haley prob get the gig for a season.

    I think Jackson comes across as a very decent man. Well liked but just lacks that show of leadership. Not a man you’d run through a wall for.

    The best example of this I’ve seen anyways is Bill Parcells, all the ‘Football Lifes’ & other shows & docs ive seen about him or the Giants, he comes across very likeable too but you wouldn’t want to cross him & when he shouts you listen. Hue doesn’t have that aura about him.

    Oddly enough, the more I see of Haley the more I think you could be right about him getting the gig!


  • #86
    VillaMad
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭VillaMad


    The Browns’ 53-man roster has been finalised:

    Offense (25)

    Quarterbacks (3): Tyrod Taylor, Baker Mayfield, Drew Stanton; running backs (3): Carlos Hyde, Duke Johnson, Nick Chubb; wide receivers (6): Jarvis Landry, Antonio Callaway, Rashard Higgins, Damion Ratley, Derrick Willies, Josh Gordon; tight ends (4): David Njoku, Darren Fells, Orson Charles, Seth DeValve; offensive linemen (9): Joel Bitonio, Austin Corbett, JC Tretter, Kevin Zeitler, Chris Hubbard, Desmond Harrison, Earl Watford, Austin Reiter, Greg Robinson

    Defense (25)

    Defensive linemen (9): Myles Garrett, Emmanuel Ogbah, Chris Smith, Carl Nassib, Chad Thomas, Larry Ogunjobi, Jamie Meder, Trevon Coley, Devaroe Lawrence; linebackers (6): Christian Kirksey, Jamie Collins, Joe Schobert, Genard Avery, James Burgess, Jermaine Grace; defensive backs (10): Denzel Ward, Terrance Mitchell, T.J. Carrie, E.J. Gaines, Denzel Rice, Jeremiah McKinnon, Jabrill Peppers, Damarious Randall, Briean Boddy-Calhoun, Derrick Kindred

    Specialists (3)

    K Zane Gonzalez, P Britton Colquitt, LS Charley Hughlett

    - The Browns acquired DL Devaroe Lawrence from the Saints in exchange for a 2019 seventh-round pick.

    - The Browns waived 18 players: LB B.J. Bello, DL Caleb Brantley, TE Devon Cajuste, RB Matthew Dayes, OL Christian DiLauro, OL Spencer Drango, DL Daniel Ekuale, DL Zaycoven Henderson, RB Dontrell Hilliard, WR Blake Jackson, DB Mike Jordan, DB Montrel Meander, DL Nate Orchard, DB Tigie Sankoh, WR Da’Mari Scott, LB Brady Sheldon, DB Simeon Thomas, P Justin Vogel.

    So the Hard Knocks duo of Cajuste and Orchard don't make it which is a shame. Shon Coleman was traded to the 49'ers yesterday. Matthew Dayes is also unlucky as I thought he has done well. Perhaps he could go into the practice squad.


  • #87
    Silver-Tiger
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭Silver-Tiger


    Nassib gone also to make way for acquisitions.

    Regardless of Hard Knocks, i'm surprised. He looked great before breaking his hands. This must be lingering over him. I'd say he will find a home.


  • #88
    Silver-Tiger
    Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭Silver-Tiger


    Silver-Tiger wrote: »
    Nassib gone also to make way for acquisitions.

    Regardless of Hard Knocks, i'm surprised. He looked great before breaking his hands. This must be lingering over him. I'd say he will find a home.

    Buccs take him


  • #89
    gstack166
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭gstack166


    Force 6 turnovers, two in the span of one minute and don’t win? That’s almost unbelievable. Except, somehow, it’s totally believable.

    Baker is the only one happy today!


  • #90
    VillaMad
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭VillaMad


    gstack166 wrote: »
    Force 6 turnovers, two in the span of one minute and don’t win? That’s almost unbelievable. Except, somehow, it’s totally believable.

    Baker is the only one happy today!

    Hard to analyze that game. It was just crazy. I'm worn out!


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  • #91
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users Posts: 18,921 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    gstack166 wrote: »
    Force 6 turnovers, two in the span of one minute and don’t win? That’s almost unbelievable. Except, somehow, it’s totally believable.

    Baker is the only one happy today!

    #believeland

    ---

    Ridiculous game. It was the missus' first game since she came out as a Brown's fan.

    The range of emotions were hilarious.


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