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New R&A Rules from 1/1/19

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 15,781 ✭✭✭✭Seve OB


    noting sweeter than in a match and you feel your opponent should really hit a provo

    they don't..... lost ball, do they walk back? maybe or maybe not, but great chance to win the hole either way.

    but maybe you are not in great shape... off the fairway, little trouble. now the fecker can just drop a ball in the middle of the fairway and play 4 into the green??????

    no, i'm not a fan of that


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,794 ✭✭✭Golfgraffix


    HighLine wrote: »
    Another good introduction is relief from an embedded ball through the green (the entire course except hazards and teebox&green of hole being played). It always annoyed me watching the professionals getting relief from a plugged ball through the green but us amateurs are expected to hack it out (or take an unplayable) when our ball plugs in semi/rough.

    The 40 seconds per shot is far too long. Count that out in your head and pretend you're standing over a ball. It should be at least half that time.

    Ditto I have been plugged in a revetted face twice this year, not really fair having to take a penalty even it was back on short grass.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,091 ✭✭✭backspin.


    Russman wrote: »
    I don't like not having to inform anyone that you're going to pick up your ball to identify it - that's a little bit too far for me tbh.

    I agree, i think this one has the potential to be abused by some people in order to improve their lie in the semi-rough or rough.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,091 ✭✭✭backspin.


    These rules are a month away now. Our club hasn't even mentioned them.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭HighLine


    backspin. wrote: »
    These rules are a month away now. Our club hasn't even mentioned them.

    I've been putting them out on my club's social media and there has been very little interaction... likes,shares etc.

    I recently made a video tutorial for winter rules at my club and I'm considering doing the same with the main rule changes for 2019.

    It's hard to get the message across to members. There are a high percentage of players who don't know the current rules nevermind look at the new rules for 2019 in advance.

    So for the Winter Rules this year we 1) sent a written version out to members via email, 2) displayed them in the clubhouse, PRO Shop, locker rooms and noticeboards 3) put a video tutorial on all social media as well as the written version and 4) put on the club's website.

    I played with a guy today who didn't have a clue. Didn't know what nearest point of relief was and didn't know that he needed to mark his ball before lifting. He has been playing for years. Over the last few weeks, there has been plenty of similar situations with players not having a clue of the Winter Rules. It's frustrating and just goes to show that so many players just couldn't be arsed to try and learn the basic rules.


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,560 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1




  • Registered Users Posts: 403 ✭✭Poker Face


    USGA-StrokeAndDistance-R4-18-0307.jpg

    Got a question on the above. Take the image on the left. Say the Ball goes out of bounds alot shorter than in that image, say before it it says Out of bounds, what happens with B as if you go to the edge of the fairway you are going nearer the hole.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭HighLine


    Poker Face wrote: »
    Got a question on the above. Take the image on the left. Say the Ball goes out of bounds alot shorter than in that image, say before it it says Out of bounds, what happens with B as if you go to the edge of the fairway you are going nearer the hole.

    Good question and it's not specifically addressed in the rule but they state the limitations as

    "Limits on Location of Relief Area:
    Must be in the general area, and
    Must not be nearer the hole than the ball reference point."

    So then you would not be able to drop on the fairway. I'm guessing it might be covered in the decisions. I'm also guessing not many clubs will adopt this local rule anyway... but that's only my own speculation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 403 ✭✭Poker Face


    HighLine wrote: »
    Good question and it's not specifically addressed in the rule but they state the limitations as

    "Limits on Location of Relief Area:
    Must be in the general area, and
    Must not be nearer the hole than the ball reference point."

    So then you would not be able to drop on the fairway. I'm guessing it might be covered in the decisions. I'm also guessing not many clubs will adopt this local rule anyway... but that's only my own speculation.

    Yeah I agree but I know fellas who would say they could!!! Needs a bit more clarification. Can you drop within 2 club lenghts of where it went OB not near the hole and be playing 4? On my example if its close to the tee then you are probably better playing 3 off the tee anyway.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,560 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    So you can put your tee shot way OOB/lost and drop onto the fairway and play your fourth...


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,794 ✭✭✭Golfgraffix


    slave1 wrote: »
    So you can put your tee shot way OOB/lost and drop onto the fairway and play your fourth...

    Yep


  • Registered Users Posts: 57 ✭✭Dotzie


    The new ob rule is a local rule only if your club adopts the new ruling then you'll have the fairway drop but current ob rules will still apply if they don't adopt the new ob ruling.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,560 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Well I’m all for fast golf, I’ll propose it to our society, anything to keep things moving


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭HighLine


    slave1 wrote: »
    Well I’m all for fast golf, I’ll propose it to our society, anything to keep things moving

    Or... players could just play a provisional ball and keep things moving. I've said before in another thread but the relief procedures for this local rule are not straightforward. Determining where to drop will take time. And then on a blind driving hole... big hitting Johnny is sure his ball went OB/lost 100 yards infront of where it actually was.

    Thankfully I'm fairly sure my club won't be adopting this local rule.


  • Registered Users Posts: 396 ✭✭Skyfloater


    I can't see how people who hit a big hook or slice are going to be able to determine point A at all.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,794 ✭✭✭Golfgraffix


    As a local rule can it be applied to certain holes or dies it have to be the entire course ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭Webbs


    Is there an option to keep the lost ball new local rule but not the out of bounds?

    There are many instances where players dont hit a provo as they are sure the ball is hit in an area where the ball will be found, but for whatever reason, (plugged, under a leaf etc) it is lost. This really affects pace of play if that player has too go back to tee and hit again. I'm not a fan of the OOB new rule as its clear a ball is OOB so reload but a lost ball is a different scenario


  • Registered Users Posts: 719 ✭✭✭Hoof Hearted2


    Webbs wrote: »
    Is there an option to keep the lost ball new local rule but not the out of bounds?

    There are many instances where players dont hit a provo as they are sure the ball is hit in an area where the ball will be found, but for whatever reason, (plugged, under a leaf etc) it is lost. This really affects pace of play if that player has too go back to tee and hit again. I'm not a fan of the OOB new rule as its clear a ball is OOB so reload but a lost ball is a different scenario

    The beauty of this rule is that both scenarios are covered by it, so no need to over complicate the issue, and I suspect come Jan 1st 2019, there is going to be some craic on courses countrywide.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 879 ✭✭✭Montgolfier


    I don't see any club in Ireland adopting this rule as we take club competitions seriously. I'd say it more for golf resorts and non regular golfers


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,343 ✭✭✭ChippingSodbury


    I don't see any club in Ireland adopting this rule as we take club competitions seriously. I'd say it more for golf resorts and non regular golfers

    I have it from a reliable source that if the Local Rule is adopted for a Competition, it will not be a counting Competition under CONGU rules (i.e. CONGU won't accept the rule)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,781 ✭✭✭✭Seve OB


    I have it from a reliable source that if the Local Rule is adopted for a Competition, it will not be a counting Competition under CONGU rules (i.e. CONGU won't accept the rule)

    I hope that's true.

    I don't mind if it is adopted for informal competitions and for the likes of societies I think it should actually be encouraged. But for regular member comps, hmm Pfffttt as Ted and Dougle would have said, down with this sort of thing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,839 ✭✭✭Russman


    I don't see any club in Ireland adopting this rule as we take club competitions seriously. I'd say it more for golf resorts and non regular golfers

    I sort of agree with your sentiment, but at the same time, rules change and we have to adjust our thinking, this might be one of those cases. What we think a rule "should" be doesn't really matter. Its more our long held belief than anything.
    Things that are penalties this weekend won't be a penalty next month, we might not like the new rules but they are what they are - while fully accepting this one is not mandatory.
    I've no real issue with it other than the whole idea of "golfing your ball" round the course might be taking a bit of a hit in a theoretical sense. Then again its more or less just saying that OOB is really just a hazard that costs you two shots to get out of now. Meh, non issue IMO, play the rule and it is what it is.


  • Registered Users Posts: 960 ✭✭✭paulos53


    I have it from a reliable source that if the Local Rule is adopted for a Competition, it will not be a counting Competition under CONGU rules (i.e. CONGU won't accept the rule)

    That is confirmed on the Congu website


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 879 ✭✭✭Montgolfier


    Russman wrote: »
    I sort of agree with your sentiment, but at the same time, rules change and we have to adjust our thinking, this might be one of those cases. What we think a rule "should" be doesn't really matter. Its more our long held belief than anything.
    Things that are penalties this weekend won't be a penalty next month, we might not like the new rules but they are what they are - while fully accepting this one is not mandatory.
    I've no real issue with it other than the whole idea of "golfing your ball" round the course might be taking a bit of a hit in a theoretical sense. Then again its more or less just saying that OOB is really just a hazard that costs you two shots to get out of now. Meh, non issue IMO, play the rule and it is what it is.

    The only real issue I would have is that rule encourages players to take liberties.
    Judging where a sliced or hooked ball goes obb from 200yds is not going to be accurate especially when guys believe the can hit drives 300yds.
    If they had a drop zone at the beginning of the fairway drop for 4 at least it would be consistent.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,091 ✭✭✭backspin.


    I am happy enough with this new OB rule. The sort of people who will take liberties will be the type who take liberties anyway elsewhere. Most 4 balls will be honest and judge the drop area appropriately. It will speed up play and taking your 4th shot instead of your 2nd is still punishing.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,560 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    backspin. wrote: »
    I am happy enough with this new OB rule. The sort of people who will take liberties will be the type who take liberties anyway elsewhere. Most 4 balls will be honest and judge the drop area appropriately. It will speed up play and taking your 4th shot instead of your 2nd is still punishing.

    It is punishing and I think it should only be excluded from matchplay, anything that speeds things up has to be tried out.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭HighLine


    Happy to see CONGU have excluded this local rule for handicap qualification purposes. Surprised to see some people are actually in favour of it.

    Whatever your opinion about the rule, it is obvious to me that the actual relief under the rule is not straight forward. Think of your own club and trying to explain the procedure for relief of a lost ball (in particular) to Paddy and Johnny. Just look at the diagram below and think about it. It will take a stupid amount of time.

    Thankfully I don't think any serious club will adopt this local rule.

    467619.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 40 reax


    slave1 wrote: »
    So you can put your tee shot way OOB/lost and drop onto the fairway and play your fourth...

    I don't believe this is the case. As with current arrangements it is up to your playing partners, specifically the person marking your card, to agree with your assessment. If you hit the ball OOB you play 3 off the tee. If you THINK you hit the ball OOB you play 3 off the tee. It's only if you genuinely think that you're in bounds and will find your ball that this rule will kick in. If I saw someone hit a ball OOB and proceeded to march up the fairway I would call him up on it!


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,781 ✭✭✭✭Seve OB


    reax wrote: »
    I don't believe this is the case. As with current arrangements it is up to your playing partners, specifically the person marking your card, to agree with your assessment. If you hit the ball OOB you play 3 off the tee. If you THINK you hit the ball OOB you play 3 off the tee. It's only if you genuinely think that you're in bounds and will find your ball that this rule will kick in. If I saw someone hit a ball OOB and proceeded to march up the fairway I would call him up on it!

    Did you read the rule?
    What would you be calling him out on?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 40 reax


    Seve OB wrote: »
    Did you read the rule?
    What would you be calling him out on?

    The first line of the rule states "If a provisional ball has not been played"
    Why would you not play a provo if there was a risk of not finding your ball or OOB? This rule was brought in purely related to pace of play. It was never designed to be a get out jail card with only a 2 shot penalty.
    Anyway it appears to be a moot point with the rule only counting for casual play and not qualifying comps


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