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Donald Trump bans tik toc and we chat

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    #32
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    joseywhales wrote: »
    I'm still not understanding the value of these apps. I mean I have email, I can send attachments has there been any fundamental functional advancement from this point?

    Well, from my pov in China, with wechat I can do pretty much everything. With money on the account, I can secure cinema tickets, order food, check bus times, etc all within the app, without needing a secondary app. I can also translate Chinese pretty well, whether it's an article, or a menu I'm looking at directly, or have someone speaking to me, with the app translating their speech for me.

    It's a really useful tool.

    I used to be the same. Email only, and I tended to avoid phone usage, but the convenience of wechat is remarkable. It's a dozen of individual apps combined within a single program.


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    #33
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 18,905 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    joseywhales wrote: »
    I'm still not understanding the value of these apps. I mean I have email, I can send attachments has there been any fundamental functional advancement from this point?

    There's no advancement to any of these communication apps over bog standard email.

    The only thing I can think of that's been of any real use is Whatsapp free phone calls. But even then, I already had Skype.

    It's all just about kids adopting the newest thing. There aren't any kind of determinable advantages over what has come before. A girl I know has about 20 something different comms apps that all do the same thing. She's glued to her phone 24/7 checking them all day.


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    #34
    JJayoo
    Registered Users Posts: 6,561 ✭✭✭JJayoo


    Good, all chinese companies are puppets to the state


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    #35
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    JJayoo wrote: »
    Good, all chinese companies are puppets to the state

    Except they're not. Many people have a far too simplistic notion of what China is like.

    The "State" isn't unified. Even with Xi as supreme leader, the CCP is very divided with a number of powerful factions. Considering the wealth that top/medium leaders in the CCP have, many have their links to the three pillars of Chinese power. The Military, Business, or Criminal organisations. Government is the primary pillar but each faction has their own powerbases linked to an external group, where their wealth/influence comes from. With each faction protecting the independence of their foundation so that other factions can't threaten their income streams.

    And so with Business, companies aren't puppets of the State. Various factions have tried repeatedly to rein in the power of the major companies in China, with minor success. Large Chinese companies are, like the military, often seen as being outside the law. So, you'll see a wide range of government oversight regarding Businesses, but some companies are essentially immune. At least for a few decades, until a shift in the politics, makes them vulnerable to another faction.

    For smaller companies, only those businesses who received direct funding, have to provide company shares to the government. Usually it's between 20-40% of the overall shares, but it's still not enough to take control over the company itself.

    While China is very different in many ways than the west, don't be so quick to assume the CCP is absolute in it's power, or that they're unified. They're not. Especially over the main period of economic boom, where companies raked in the cash, and therefore increased their ability to bribe within a very corrupt society.


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    #36
    JJayoo
    Registered Users Posts: 6,561 ✭✭✭JJayoo


    The above post is nonsense.


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    #37
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    JJayoo wrote: »
    The above post is nonsense.

    haha... no debate? no argument? Nothing to show why it's nonsense. Pathetic.

    ok then, prove that "all chinese companies are puppets to the state".


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    #38
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Klaz, you will be well aware that every Chinese tech company is compelled to dance to the tune of the Party. And you're also well aware of what happens to individuals or organisations that don't say 'how high' when the Party says 'jump.' You're winding-up to fill another China related thread with the whole "you don't know China" rigmarole.


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    #39
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    And seeing as you're calling another poster's contribution 'pathetic', it's as plain as the nose on your face what is expected of these tech companies. Every company over a certain size is required to have party cadres in their ranks; Tencent, Bytedance; Hauwei - every one you care to name in every industry you care to mention. If you worked closely with Chinese companies (yes I'm pulling that card) as partners, you get accustomed to spotting who they are pretty quickly.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/03/05/huawei-would-have-to-give-data-to-china-government-if-asked-experts.html


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    #40
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Yurt! wrote: »
    Klaz, you will be well aware that every Chinese tech company is compelled to dance to the tune of the Party. And you're also well aware of what happens to individuals or organisations that don't say 'how high' when the Party says 'jump.' You're winding-up to fill another China related thread with the whole "you don't know China" rigmarole.

    Yurt, don't put words in my mouth, and don't dismiss my opinions so quickly. The other poster made a blanket statement about all Chinese companies being puppets of the state. Which is not true. What I did describe above is reasonably accurate.
    Yurt! wrote: »
    And seeing as you're calling another poster's contribution 'pathetic', it's as plain as the nose on your face what is expected of these tech companies. Every company over a certain size is required to have party cadres in their ranks; Tencent, Bytedance; Hauwei - every one you care to name in every industry you care to mention. If you worked closely with Chinese companies (yes I'm pulling that card) as partners, you get accustomed to spotting who they are pretty quickly.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/03/05/huawei-would-have-to-give-data-to-china-government-if-asked-experts.html

    I described his response as pathetic because he didn't try to argue anything. Simply threw in a single sentence which did nothing to refute what I said, or prove what he previously said.

    And I agree with you regarding the tech companies, since they come under the area of the "protected" industries which China considers to be part of the national security. And as such, they are controlled far more than other industries. See... your post was specific and was logical. His, wasn't.

    And Yurt, I have worked closely with Chinese companies before, both state owned and independent, firstly as a management consultant and then later as a trainer.


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    #41
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Yurt, don't put words in my mouth, and don't dismiss my opinions so quickly. The other poster made a blanket statement about all Chinese companies being puppets of the state. Which is not true. What I did describe above is reasonably accurate.



    I described his response as pathetic because he didn't try to argue anything. Simply threw in a single sentence which did nothing to refute what I said, or prove what he previously said.

    And I agree with you regarding the tech companies, since they come under the area of the "protected" industries which China considers to be part of the national security. And as such, they are controlled far more than other industries. See... your post was specific and was logical. His, wasn't.

    And Yurt, I have worked closely with Chinese companies before, both state owned and independent, firstly as a management consultant and then later as a trainer.

    If this is true, and given what you posted initially, you have totally misread how organisations function in your host country and have limited read on how the party interacts with and pulls the strings in key and sensitive industries. Any organisation of scale is riddled with party cadres and their duty is to ensure that the company falls in line with party policy and stays in its lane. I honestly think what's going on is one of the following is: a. You have the blinkers on,
    ;b. You're simply not paying attention; or c. You're exaggerating your interactions with Chinese firms.


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    #42
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Yurt! wrote: »
    If this is true, and given what you posted initially, you have totally misread how organisations function in your host country and have limited read on how the party interacts with and pulls the strings in key and sensitive industries. Any organisation of scale is riddled with party cadres and their duty is to ensure that the company falls in line with party policy and stays in its lane. I honestly think you have a. The blinkers on, b. You're simply not paying attention, or c. You're exaggerating your interactions with Chinese firms.

    Yurt. I'm not exaggerating my experience with Chinese firms. Hell, I haven't stated my experience with Chinese firms at all. You're the one throwing that out there.

    Also I haven't stated anything that doesn't agree or disagree with what you said about Chinese firms. You keep wanting to put words in my mouth. Did I say that there weren't Party representatives in companies? nope. Hell, a large portion of the overall population are party members, and there is a culture of conforming to what the party direction is.

    Argue against what I write... stop throwing in suggestions of what I didn't write. But yes, companies have both government direction, and their own independence depending on which factions (cliques) they are connected to, within the party. Hence Xi's anti-corruption campaign, which essentially targeted his enemies, including businesses which are associated with his opponents, while protecting those within his own sphere of influence.

    But yes, the CCP has been increasing it's control over all private business over the last few years, establishing far more representatives at all levels of management. At the same time though, not all companies are controlled to the manner that JJayoo suggested, in that they're all puppets. They're independent until the CCP decides it wants control.


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    #43
    bobbyy gee
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭bobbyy gee


    judge blocks trumps wechat man

    https://thehill.com/policy/technology/517292-judge-blocks-trump-administration-wechat-ban


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    #44
    bobbyy gee
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭bobbyy gee


    trump wants 5 billion dollars for tik tok

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/20/business/trump-education-fund/index.html


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    #45
    bobbyy gee
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭bobbyy gee


    bobbyy gee wrote: »
    trump wants 5 billion dollars for tik tok

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/20/business/trump-education-fund/index.html
    https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/20/business/trump-education-fund/index.html


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