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The decline continues

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    #422
    devlinio
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 172 ✭✭devlinio


    dulpit wrote: »
    Seems like The Times Ireland is growing at a consistent pace, every few months seems to have a new hire.

    The Times puzzles me actually - the editorial line it takes seems the complete opposite of the mothership in London.. It seems to be working here though...

    I interviewed at the Irish Times last Year for a software development position on their graduate programme. I'm still bitter I didn't get it, as it seemed a great place to work. They had vacancies for about 10 different jobs though.


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    #423
    caff
    Registered Users Posts: 954 ✭✭✭caff


    The weekend editions seem to have more long form investigative articles, what I would consider real journalism. The dailies are just full of fluff and endless opinion articles not a lot I would read.


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    #424
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    We are not 'time starved' (vommit!) at the weekends allowing for long form.


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    #425
    jmcc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,291 ✭✭✭jmcc


    IRE60 wrote: »
    Interesting! I'm reliably informed that the M-F edition of the IT is seeing decline like the rest of the market. However the Saturday edition is not seeing anything like that decline, even with a price increase.
    It also seems to be on sale for two days rather than one. Newspapers used to deal with news and magazines did analysis. The weekend editions are more like magazines than newspapers with a kind of something for everyone approach.
    Many publishers get a real lift from Saturday sales and, on average, there's a 50% increase in sales of the Saturday edition on the average M-F sales*.

    So maybe there is a shift towards the Saturday edition
    It might be interesting to see how the content in the Saturday editions has changed.
    The Guardian charges a premium for the cover price on saturday and gets a huge lift in sales. The Saturday edition of the Guardian delivers 52% of the total revenue the Guardian takes in the Republic.

    *for the papers that split their abc certs to show M-F and Sat sales
    And the Guardian also has the Observer for Sundays, I think. It is a staggering figure though.

    Regards...jmcc


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    #426
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,535 ✭✭✭JTMan


    IRE60 wrote: »
    I'm reliably informed that the M-F edition of the IT is seeing decline like the rest of the market. However the Saturday edition is not seeing anything like that decline, even with a price increase.

    A lot of that comes from the success of the Irish Times 'weekend' digital package that includes a newspaper on a Saturday but not a weekday newspaper.

    It is believable that some publications will eventually only publish in print at the weekends.

    All that said, the Sunday market, on average, is declining, in percentage terms, at pretty much the same rate as the daily market.


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    #427
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    jmcc wrote: »

    And the Guardian also has the Observer for Sundays, I think. It is a staggering figure though.


    So if you take the Observer then the Guardian Media Group take 70% of their revenue in Ireland at the weekend!


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    #428
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    devlinio wrote: »
    I interviewed at the Irish Times last Year for a software development position on their graduate programme. I'm still bitter I didn't get it, as it seemed a great place to work. They had vacancies for about 10 different jobs though.

    The other candidates were better than you. Simple as.


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    #429
    irishgrover
    Registered Users Posts: 2,496 ✭✭✭irishgrover


    Yurt! wrote:
    The other candidates were better than you. Simple as.

    I don't think that the poster implied otherwise. I exclusively inferred that his/her bitterness came from that fact that it would have been a great place to work


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    #430
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    Yurt! wrote: »
    The other candidates were better than you. Simple as.

    Get a grip, will you.


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    #431
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    IRE60 wrote: »
    Get a grip, will you.

    [Mod Edit - deleted due to personal abuse]


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    #432
    flogen
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 10,243 Mod ✭✭✭✭flogen


    Yurt - stick to the topic at hand and avoid attacking other posters


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    #433
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,535 ✭✭✭JTMan


    Warren Buffett on the future of the newspaper industry here.


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    #434
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    JTMan wrote: »
    Warren Buffett on the future of the newspaper industry here.

    'toast'!


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    #435
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    This group just made a bid for the indo

    https://www.mediahuis.be/en/

    Interesting portfolio of brands - strong online - maybe its just whats needed.


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    #436
    jmcc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,291 ✭✭✭jmcc


    IRE60 wrote: »
    This group just made a bid for the indo

    https://www.mediahuis.be/en/

    Interesting portfolio of brands - strong online - maybe its just whats needed.
    145.6 million according to RTE.
    https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2019/0430/1046479-independent-news-and-media/

    10.5c a share. Bit of a wipeout for Dinny considering the amount he spent acquiring his shares. (29.88%)

    Mediahuis annoucement on offer:
    https://www.mediahuis.be/en/recommended-cash-offer-for-independent-news-media-plc-by-mediahuis-nv/

    Regards...jmcc


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    #437
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,535 ✭✭✭JTMan


    What is a huge day for Irish media.

    What is Mediahuis game? What will they do with INM?

    Having read a dozen or so articles, from the last few years, translated from Belgian about Mediahuis, it seems that the Mediahuis strategy is consolidation, cost controls, debt, digital focus and legacy closures.

    - Mediahuis have closed several print plants. The INM Citywest print plant is toast. Either the IT print the titles or they get printed in Belgium and shipped in.
    - The free news articles on Independent.ie are toast. Mediahuis will put in a paywall and sound like they are in a rush to do so.
    - Cost cutting will continue. Mediahuis cut 82 jobs after an acquisition in Belgium.
    - Mediahuis have an interest in radio stations. Could Communicorp be in their sights?
    - One Belgian media analyst thinks that Mediahuis will go after the weaker elements of INM first and that may include some regionals.
    - I read before that The Reach PLC INM joint venture with The Irish Daily Star could be effected if INM is acquired due to a term in their joint venture contract. Could Reach PLC acquire the remaining 50% of the The Irish Daily Star?

    Interesting times ahead.


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    #438
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    I see they have a Dutch version of De Echo.


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    #439
    expectationlost
    Registered Users Posts: 11,753 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    the new owner of INM is the chair of KBC...


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    #440
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    Looking at JT's comments:

    I believe the conventional thinking is that there will be one plant - here. Citywest is leased and the equip is written down at this point. Some staff may transfer to the IT plant and the only (main) cost thereafter is redundancy. Cost of flying in from Belgium is prohibitive.

    The paywall issue is fascinating. Michael Doorley said recently that their current setup prohibits them from putting the paper behind a paywall! So, I think a platform migration and a paywall would be number one on the list.

    Jobs - word on the street is that there is very little blood left in that stone, however, Albert Pierrepoint always found another neck to slip a noose over.

    Radio - I'd see a long and protracted spat with Comp authority. However the IT have a hand in that pie now - but their weekly market share of newspaper sales is about 20% now (not including regionals) whereas the Indo is about 38% - big difference if you are the watchdog.

    I'm sure there are a few 'pigs in the poke' that could be disposed of. I think also looking at the Mediahuis portfolio they might lend a hand perhaps in the car or property sites that the Indo have. The regionals are having a torrid time and I'm sure that one or two are underwater. You'd have to find a buyer - but you will at the right price.

    Daily Star - that was always going to be interesting this year. If memory serves - the deal was that there was a buyout option every 5 years at a multiple that was ridiculous by current profits. It was a handcuffing exercise. But there was a part if the parent company was sold - Reach now have the option to buy 100% of the title here (owning it all in the UK anyway). It acts under license (or like it anyway) here but I think Reach have the option to buy it at a particular multiple.

    Absolutely interesting times for IN&M and the wider media.


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    #441
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,535 ✭✭✭JTMan


    word on the street is that there is very little blood left in that stone

    INM are going to have to get more blood out of the stone. Sales are declining by circa 9% per year. Costs need to keep going down by a similar percentage each year or they will find themselves in deeper water sooner rather than later. Editorial roles can continue to be cut and replaced with copy and paste content, page numbers can continue to be cut and printing is ripe for closure.
    IT have a hand in that pie now

    I can't get my head around why the IT have not sold the Landmark Media radio stations yet.
    The regionals are having a torrid time and I'm sure that one or two are underwater

    Yeah, I downloaded the Nenagh Guardian annual return from the CRO website, just to get an understanding of how on earth some of the regionals are still surviving (albeit many have closed). The Nenagh Guardian is loosing 250k per year. I bet that is not an isolated case. I bet INM are humming on what to do with the underwater regionals, balancing up P&L numbers with the fact that they bring in printing and distribution revenue to other parts of the business. Maybe some of the regionals will close after INM have sold off the printing presses.
    the deal was that there was a buyout option every 5 years at a multiple that was ridiculous by current profits

    Interesting. Might explain why INM cut fees to the Star by 1 million in 2017. Maybe they were helping keep its head above water and thus Reach at bay.


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    #442
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,618 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    JTMan wrote: »
    I can't get my head around why the IT have not sold the Landmark Media radio stations yet.

    No buyers.

    Newscorp would never be allowed an active shareholding in RedFM due to full ownership of the other two Cork stations. Plus total media % could become troublesome with the two papers and the existing 6 stations.

    Communicorp wouldn't be allowed look at it

    Who else is there? The incredibly complicated nest of co-ownership around Nova/Sunshine/4FM/East Coast wouldn't have any useful synergies and whether they could raise the cash is another question.


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    #443
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,535 ✭✭✭JTMan


    The IT could sell Beat 102-103 FM and WLR FM to the Wireless Group (News UK). The tiny 17% stake in RedFM could be sold to the other small shareholders in this entity.


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    #444
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    At the end of the day, the IT don't seem to be in any rush to jettison the stations. Maybe they might keep them!


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    #445
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,535 ✭✭✭JTMan


    There have being loads of posts on Twitter lately of people leaving INM. Interesting post today from a Sunday World journalist who was turfed out.

    Another excellent well researched article in the WSJ today on the future of the newspaper industry. In the US, only 3 newspapers have successfully made the transition to a paywall model, just 3, for the rest many have blown huge sums on paywalls with little return. INM - take note.


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    #446
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,535 ✭✭✭JTMan


    April ABC numbers here and here. The slow death of print continues.


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    #447
    Muahahaha
    Registered Users Posts: 19,610 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    That is some hammering Denis O'Brien is taking on his purchase of IMN, something like an 85% loss on his investment. And all over a grudge match with the O'Reillys, I'd say they are laughing now. Shareholders arent happy either with the low price being offered for their shares.


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    #448
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    yea - took a bath on that one circa 450m! But maybe he sees the writing on the wall and take a few mill now as opposed to fcuk all in the short term.



    Interesting times ahead.


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    #449
    Muahahaha
    Registered Users Posts: 19,610 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    IRE60 wrote: »
    yea - took a bath on that one circa 450m! But maybe he sees the writing on the wall and take a few mill now as opposed to fcuk all in the short term.



    Interesting times ahead.

    I'd say it is a combination of him both seeing the writing on the wall and also needing the money, little though at it is he is in a lot of trouble with Digicel right now, their bonds are trading at 9% and are now listed by the ratings agencies as junk status and if he doesnt get more investors on board soon the whole deck of cards could come tumbling down. Ever since his failed IPO of Digicel (which the O'Reillys had a hand in thwarting as their revenge on him) his business has been in complete free fall.


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    #450
    IRE60
    Registered Users Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭IRE60


    Muahahaha wrote: »
    I'd say it is a combination of him both seeing the writing on the wall and also needing the money, little though at it is he is in a lot of trouble with Digicel right now, their bonds are trading at 9% and are now listed by the ratings agencies as junk status and if he doesnt get more investors on board soon the whole deck of cards could come tumbling down. Ever since his failed IPO of Digicel (which the O'Reillys had a hand in thwarting as their revenge on him) his business has been in complete free fall.
    Yea - it was the quintessential Celtic tiger pissing contest with IN&M and Digicel being the mats on the floor!


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    #451
    jmcc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,291 ✭✭✭jmcc


    IRE60 wrote: »
    Yea - it was the quintessential Celtic tiger pissing contest with IN&M and Digicel being the mats on the floor!
    Bit more complex than that. Both O'Reilly (Valentia consortium) and O'Brien were after Eircom. O'Reilly's gang won with the help of the FF/PD government (changing the legislation of employee share deals).

    Regards...jmcc


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