Dublin - Metrolink (Swords to Charlemont only)

LXFlyer · 14-01-2021 12:53pm

Business cases tend not to be published until significantly after the project has started construction and will be heavily redacted where commercially sensitive information is included.

In the case of LUAS Cross-City it was published well into the construction period.

jumpinsheep · 24-01-2021 4:16pm

One of the latest Dublin Commuter Coalition tweet (23rd Jan 21):
"Metrolink will begin Construction next Summer. BusConnects will begin implementation this year. The Public want to have a say in these projects. Public consultation is a good thing."

tweet link: https://twitter.com/DublinCommuters/status/1352772447834173441?s=20
They seem quite confident with that timeline, however the operational deadline of 2027 is no longer shown in the current website (e.g. see Key Facts , Cost Forecasting > The Business Case) VS Key Facts and Project Timeline pages from the archived Metrolink website.

I guess the Metrolink construction would need to start in multiple places at the same time, to potentially be operational by 2027 as initially proposed, rather than starting with TBM at one end of the line and build stations progressively.

1huge1 · 25-01-2021 10:02am

I'm assuming by "next" summer, they mean Summer of 2022? That seems reasonable.

cgcsb · 25-01-2021 11:03am

No official estimate of completion time yet but 2027 is completely out at this stage I'd say.

AngryLips · 25-01-2021 11:09am

Are they planning a staged opening or for it to happen at once?

riddlinrussell · 25-01-2021 12:36pm

AngryLips wrote: »

Are they planning a staged opening or for it to happen at once?

I'd imagine all at once, with things like signalling etc along the line to be tied together I don't think the time between a section being 'complete' and the whole project being complete would be in any way significant?

Sam Russell · 25-01-2021 12:46pm

riddlinrussell wrote: »

I'd imagine all at once, with things like signalling etc along the line to be tied together I don't think the time between a section being 'complete' and the whole project being complete would be in any way significant?

Unless they do the bit north of the M50 as a separate project, doing both at the same time, but the northern bit is shorter and could be done quicker.

Pete_Cavan · 25-01-2021 1:24pm

cgcsb wrote: »

No official estimate of completion time yet but 2027 is completely out at this stage I'd say.

Wasn't the original timeline based on the initial scope which included upgrading Green Line to Metro and more tunneling? Has a timeline been given for the current scope? They plan to split construction across three civil works contracts which might make things a bit faster, having multiple companies pouring resources into different elements rather than one resourcing the whole lot.

I wouldn't say 2027 is completely out the window for the current scope if everything runs to plan and no further delays. If the RO is approved before the end of 2022 and procurement has been advanced during that time, you could possibly see construction start in early 23 which gives four full years to the start of 27. It could conceivably be open by end of 27 but that requires full RO approval within 18 months, construction commencing within months of RO approval and then no major delays during construction.

jumpinsheep · 25-01-2021 8:47pm

Was checking if there was anything in the news about Metrolink and found this article (6th Jan 21):
https://dublingazette.com/news/covid-transport-59202/
[...]
"Just months ago Finance Minister Pascal Donohue said capital projects such as the Dublin MetroLink could be deferred because of the Covid-19 crisis and its impact."
[...]
"However despite this, Transport Minister Eamon Ryan believes the three major projects will get under way in 2022 because “we can’t afford not to do it”."
[...]
"“I don’t have the full cost estimates yet. I’m confident I can get it through government quickly that these are the right strategic investments.
“Metro will take five years to build but once we start it gives a signal to the housing sector it’s happening, that’s where you build. And probably the most important thing we have to do is going to transport-led housing development.”"
[...]

Not sure how much the Finance Minister Pascal Donohue can influence (either positively or negatively) the Metrolink project.

Podge_irl · 25-01-2021 8:57pm

jumpinsheep wrote: »

Not sure how much the Finance Minister Pascal Donohue can influence (either positively or negatively) the Metrolink project.

It is a massive distortion of what Donohue said. He said that the govt had no plans to defer anything and that the large infrastructure projects would in fact be a key part of the recovery from COVID-19, however they could not guarantee that some of the contractors would not face delays due to the pandemic impacting their ability to deliver.

Pixel Eater · 26-01-2021 11:44am

jumpinsheep wrote: »

One of the latest Dublin Commuter Coalition tweet (23rd Jan 21):
"Metrolink will begin Construction next Summer. BusConnects will begin implementation this year. The Public want to have a say in these projects. Public consultation is a good thing."

I'm not convinced that public consultations is necessarily a good thing. Great in theory but in practice they slow the whole process down massively and can be used to dilute or even scupper entire projects. At least how they are done here.

p_haugh · 26-01-2021 8:36pm

Bit of an update (see full thread):

https://twitter.com/DublinCommuters/status/1354105330167382017?s=20

Rulmeq · 02-02-2021 7:25am

Out of interest have they said if they are going to use overhead wires, or 3rd rail for this?

1huge1 · 02-02-2021 9:51am

Rulmeq wrote: »

Out of interest have they said if they are going to use overhead wires, or 3rd rail for this?

Is it normal to see overhead wires in underground sections?

LXFlyer · 02-02-2021 10:53am

Rulmeq wrote: »

Out of interest have they said if they are going to use overhead wires, or 3rd rail for this?

Overhead wires.

1huge1 wrote: »

Is it normal to see overhead wires in underground sections?

Perfectly normal - plenty of examples.

Rulmeq · 02-02-2021 3:34pm

LXFlyer wrote: »

Overhead wires.

Cool, I think they look better.

1huge1 · 02-02-2021 3:42pm

Cool, I've never seen overhead wires in an underground station/tunnel before.

Definitely a plus from a safety aspect too.

tallaghtfornia · 02-02-2021 4:55pm

LXFlyer wrote: »

Overhead wires.

Perfectly normal - plenty of examples.

City Hall Sydney Australia would be a perfect example of this.

Amirani · 02-02-2021 5:11pm

https://www.thejournal.ie/sinkhole-phibsborough-road-5341330-Feb2021/

Tunnel portal in place at Crossguns Bridge. Ahead of schedule and not even in the original plans...

Pete_Cavan · 02-02-2021 8:29pm

They better not decide that they need another ground investigation after that!

cgcsb · 02-02-2021 9:23pm

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

They better not decide that they need another ground investigation after that!

Surely not, at least not without a further round of consultation, this time Castletownbere residents will get to give their views.

Sam Russell · 02-02-2021 9:27pm

Rulmeq wrote: »

Out of interest have they said if they are going to use overhead wires, or 3rd rail for this?

O/H @ 1500 VDC as per Dart.

BonnieSituation · 02-02-2021 11:58pm

1huge1 wrote: »

Cool, I've never seen overhead wires in an underground station/tunnel before.

Definitely a plus from a safety aspect too.

Happens in Hannover where the trams go straight under the city centre,

jumpinsheep · 04-02-2021 3:53pm

p_haugh wrote: »

Bit of an update (see full thread):

https://twitter.com/DublinCommuters/status/1354105330167382017?s=20

Would be nice to know why hasn't that drawing been first published by TII in their official Metrolink website > Artist's Impression page.

The tweet mention "rarely seen" (where before?) but that drawing doesn't seem to be included in any other existing public document in the Reports page (unless I missed it and I'll be happy to be pointed to).

Also interesting, are these other recent tweets from the Dublin Commuter Coalition (link: twitter.com/DublinCommuters/status/1356722117870510080?s=20). While it is for BusConnect (and I'm well aware that BusConnect is not a topic for this thread), I'd like to highlight the following:

We have confirmation that the new BusConnects network implementation will not start in March as planned before COVID. [...] They didn't publicly announce a March 2021 rollout. The timetables above are from the May 2020 implementation strategy which we received through freedom of information. The September 2020 report said it would be launched in "early 2021".[...]

Thanks to a FOI request, they were able to publicly share that BusConnect project is experiencing delay - wonder if there would be ground to submit a FOI request about Metrolink, with the aim to obtain a similar and accurate project status?

Last official update in the Metrolink website was in Dec 2020; they refer to an update made in October (2020 I guess?) but the News page in their website only shows an update in Feb and Dec 2020 - does anyone know more about that Oct update they mention or where to find it?

Here's the reference and screenshots attached:

TII continues to develop the MetroLink scheme in preparation for the Railway Order application which it anticipates will be made in June 2021. Preparation of the Preliminary Business Case is also well advanced in accordance with the summary timetable issued with the October update.

yascaoimhin · 02-03-2021 2:48pm

I wish Metrolink would throw us a crumb of info to wet our appetites.

So many people think the project isn't going forwards after the debacle in Ranelagh 2 years ago.

marno21 · 02-03-2021 7:24pm

yascaoimhin wrote: »

I wish Metrolink would throw us a crumb of info to wet our appetites.

So many people think the project isn't going forwards after the debacle in Ranelagh 2 years ago.

No news is good news in this instance. Project is currently being prepared for submission for planning

We should see a submission to ABP and the commencement of the procurement process of MetroLink in the next 6 months.

Going by Metrolink’s own plans, this thread is a sleeping giant atm that will really take off shortly.

cgcsb · 03-03-2021 2:22pm

marno21 wrote: »

No news is good news in this instance. Project is currently being prepared for submission for planning

We should see a submission to ABP and the commencement of the procurement process of MetroLink in the next 6 months.

Going by Metrolink’s own plans, this thread is a sleeping giant atm that will really take off shortly.

Hope you're right. So long overdue already. Need to see some digging

hinfeyg2 · 03-03-2021 5:55pm

Any idea/speculation on how covid will affect this? Budget wise?

CatInABox · 03-03-2021 6:02pm

hinfeyg2 wrote: »

Any idea/speculation on how covid will affect this? Budget wise?

I doubt that this will be affected by the budget, it seems that most central banks and the ECB are preaching that you can't spend enough money right now.

Also, there's a sense that the irish economy will recover pretty fast, what with the amount of savings that Irish people have, which should reduce any perceived covid deficit.

Sam Russell · 03-03-2021 7:05pm

CatInABox wrote: »

I doubt that this will be affected by the budget, it seems that most central banks and the ECB are preaching that you can't spend enough money right now.

Also, there's a sense that the irish economy will recover pretty fast, what with the amount of savings that Irish people have, which should reduce any perceived covid deficit.

The Gov could offer some form of Metrolink Bond that would soak up some of this huge stash of cash sitting in bank earning zero interest. A five year bond earning a low few percent tax free might do it. The ESB used to offer bonds at one time, I think.

Dublin - Metrolink (Swords to Charlemont only)

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