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New watch 'lost' in post - What next

  • 25-08-2020 12:02am
    #1
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭


    Just looking for an opinion since one of you may have had a similar problem.

    Bought a brand new Seiko from webshop in Germany. A lovely 2020 alpinist in black. Comes with DHL and their local delivery partner is an post as it turned out.

    After two weeks no watch I ask how much longer and I'm told we have it marked as delivered. I reply no watch here and they send me tracking but it doesnt say my address not even my town and anyway I didnt get it. So they say sorry we launch a query with DHL and could take a couple of weeks.

    Not happy but say ok I can live with 2 weeks. Next day I make an enquiry with an post and I'm told in an email this item was not addressed to my address. I send that on to the seller and continue to wait for the DHL query. Which comes back after 4 weeks saying nope it's delivered and we have a signature too.

    Again I'm talking to seller and he says he will open a dispute with DHL. Which is on the wait for yet another two weeks by now. Seller says he has to wait for that.

    At this point I think I've been way too patient and I dont really care who messed up where or what courier nicked the watch or not, I just want out.

    So what can I do next? Watch was paid for with paypal where I also logged a dispute. That dispute needs to be escalated soon or expires is my understanding.

    Thx


«1

Comments

  • #2
    saccades
    Registered Users Posts: 1,252 ✭✭✭saccades


    CalamariFritti wrote: »
    Just looking for an opinion since one of you may have had a similar problem.

    Bought a brand new Seiko from webshop in Germany. A lovely 2020 alpinist in black. Comes with DHL and their local delivery partner is an post as it turned out.

    After two weeks no watch I ask how much longer and I'm told we have it marked as delivered. I reply no watch here and they send me tracking but it doesnt say my address not even my town and anyway I didnt get it. So they say sorry we launch a query with DHL and could take a couple of weeks.

    Not happy but say ok I can live with 2 weeks. Next day I make an enquiry with an post and I'm told in an email this item was not addressed to my address. I send that on to the seller and continue to wait for the DHL query. Which comes back after 4 weeks saying nope it's delivered and we have a signature too.

    Again I'm talking to seller and he says he will open a dispute with DHL. Which is on the wait for yet another two weeks by now. Seller says he has to wait for that.

    At this point I think I've been way too patient and I dont really care who messed up where or what courier nicked the watch or not, I just want out.

    So what can I do next? Watch was paid for with paypal where I also logged a dispute. That dispute needs to be escalated soon or expires is my understanding.

    Thx


    DHL is 10 days wait before opening a dispute. Your contract is with the seller who argues with DHL - you don't care about DHL, the seller agreed to provide you with a watch. Escalate the PayPal dispute using the an post email if the seller won't supply you a replacement watch. They can claim from DHL.


  • #3
    njburke
    Registered Users Posts: 1,012 ✭✭✭njburke


    I had the same happen with a watch from eBay. PayPal is your friend here. Opened a dispute and contacted seller who wouldn't confirm the address he sent to, wait two weeks, then eBay step in and resolve, PayPal refunded me an hour after eBay stepped in.


  • #4
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    In my case its impossible to say what happened. Bought with Paypal which automatically uses the the correct address eircode and everything. Seller swears he sent it to that address. AnPost says it went elsewhere why we will never know they say address wasn't right. Not that thats any of my business really. Thats seller business. It became my business when original DHL query came back with delivered and they have a signature. They sent me the signature and its my first name but obviously not signed by me. Learned later that anPost dont actually have the customer sign anything atm (covid). Terminal doesnt get handed over.

    Its messy and could go on for a while but I dont want to be part of it.

    I have another few days until PayPal case expires. Asked seller one last time to refund before I escalate.


  • #5
    893bet
    Registered Users Posts: 8,734 ✭✭✭893bet


    Just escalate now. No advantage to waiting.


  • #6
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,616 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    Paypal usually is on the buyer's side, act sooner than later. If you get the watch and your money you can always refund the seller later.

    Covid has really fekked up international post though, was waiting 3 months earlier this year for a watch to arrive so I know what it feels like.

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



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  • #7
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Thanks case escalated now, seller actually agreed to that. They must be just as fed up. Thanks everyone.


  • #8
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,616 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    CalamariFritti wrote: »
    Thanks case escalated now, seller actually agreed to that. They must be just as fed up. Thanks everyone.

    Any updates?

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



  • #9
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Thanks for asking, yes and no. Paypal case still not concluded, they extended their own deadline originally last Friday to the 13th. I guess they figured from the material submitted that both seller and I are in agreement and things are amicable and its with the carriers now.

    In the meantime - apparently as a consequence to the dispute with DHL - I got a form from an Post where I had to sign and declare that I didnt receive the watch through them or any other means. Seller informed me today they were contacted by DHL and it goes into 'regulation' whatever that means. I assume it means insurance.

    So no money yet but pretty confident things will work out soon both for the seller and myself.

    Replacement is off the table too since I have decided on something a little classier in the meantime. :D


  • #10
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Paypal has decided against me. I actually cant believe it given the material attached to the case./

    They just reiterated the courier's position, 'the item has been delivered'. Which is the whole point of the case. It has been delivered just not to me. Which anPost confirmed in an email to me which I attached to the Paypal case.

    To say that I'm raging is an understatement. Buyer protection my arse. Using them 15 years easily, never a problem. First time there is a problem they prove themselves to be useless.

    Now I just have to hope that the seller is honest enough to pursue this with DHL To the end. Other than that I'll be off to my solicitor.

    Anyone any other ideas?


  • #11
    893bet
    Registered Users Posts: 8,734 ✭✭✭893bet


    Did they ship to a different address than is on PayPal? Has that been presented?

    PayPal usually dose with buyer so that is very strange.


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  • #12
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    I can't say for certain what address it went to, how could I. I know my Paypal address is 100% correct and the seller swears that's where they sent it to. AnPost says and I quote 'The Delivery Services Manager in XXXXXXX has confirmed that this item was not addressed to your address in XXXXXXX.'

    In my personal opinion the most likely explanation is someone in AnPost nicked it and they dont want to admit that so they make up some story about delivered to a different address.

    The 'nicked' bit irks me a bit of course but in the end I dont really care. Just don't want to get stung for it.

    What bugs me with Paypal is I have that AnPost statement in writing (email) and I submitted it to the Paypal case, too. How they can decide against me I have no idea. If I was a customer with 'history' ye maybe, but I'm using them more or less since they exist and never a problem.


  • #13
    Fitz II
    Registered Users Posts: 2,527 ✭✭✭Fitz II


    I can see this from both sides honestly, hard situation.


  • #14
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Well I can't and I doubt you would see it that way if in my shoes. AnPost stating it wasn't addressed to me. Doesnt get more clear cut than that IMO.

    Clear cut as in I didnt receive it and thats all that matters to me and the transaction outcome. Money back and sort it out between yourselves. Thats how I see it.


  • #15
    Fitz II
    Registered Users Posts: 2,527 ✭✭✭Fitz II


    CalamariFritti wrote: »
    Well I can't and I doubt you would see it that way if in my shoes. AnPost stating it wasn't addressed to me. Doesnt get more clear cut than that IMO.

    Just to play devils advocate....say you were the seller and you posted it off all correct and this happened, what would you fell is your liability...total loss? Not getting at you here now, I know you are cross and I see you point. In these things everyone has to assume honesty of the parties involved.


  • #16
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Fitz II wrote: »
    Just to play devils advocate....say you were the seller and you posted it off all correct and this happened, what would you fell is your liability...total loss? Not getting at you here now, I know you are cross and I see you point. In these things everyone has to assume honesty of the parties involved.

    True and I get that viewpoint. Honesty and believing doesnt come into it in front of the law. But even if you just look at the legal viewpoint only. I received it legally if they can provide proof I signed for it. Which they won't be able to do.

    Spoke to solicitor briefly about it a few weeks ago. Kind of a free legal advice through work thing. Only question he asked was will they have your signature for this? I say no impossible. He says case closed so.

    In any case there is still the anPost statement saying it wasn't addressed to me. That should be me out of the picture for sure already?


  • #17
    Fitz II
    Registered Users Posts: 2,527 ✭✭✭Fitz II


    Well looking at this again the big question I have is if An Post know it was not addressed to you, then they must know the address it was addressed to...thats just logic. So did they deliver it to a different address? Did they get a signature at that address? Assuming it was a signed for service?


  • #18
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Fitz II wrote: »
    Well looking at this again the big question I have is if An Post know it was not addressed to you, then they must know the address it was addressed to...thats just logic. So did they deliver it to a different address? Did they get a signature at that address? Assuming it was a signed for service?

    I have it verbally from local postmaster - which is not worth a thing - that it went elsewhere. Signature was provided which is on the tracking record too (which doesnt state my address or even my town). Signature is my first name in scrawly writing. Not from me anyway.

    But I also learned signatures aren't customer signatures at the moment anyway because of covid. The delivery guys dont hand the terminal over but scribble something themselves.

    Its just a mess.


  • #19
    Fitz II
    Registered Users Posts: 2,527 ✭✭✭Fitz II


    CalamariFritti wrote: »
    I have it verbally from local postmaster - which is not worth a thing - that it went elsewhere. Signature was provided which is on the tracking record too (which doesnt state my address or even my town). Signature is my first name in scrawly writing. Not from me anyway.

    But I also learned signatures aren't customer signatures at the moment anyway because of covid. The delivery guys dont hand the terminal over but scribble something themselves.

    Its just a mess.

    Well seems to be an an post issue so, or DHL more likely. How nice are your neighbours, any dodgy one?


  • #20
    Deep Thought
    Registered Users Posts: 4,383 ✭✭✭Deep Thought


    Did you report it to the Garda?

    Same happened to me and PayPal asked me to report and then to add the Garda reference to the details.

    The narrower a man’s mind, the broader his statements.



  • #21
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    It didnt get into my town even. No dodgy neighbours too. It just went awry in anPost - either genuine mess-up or theft - and now no one wants to pay for it.

    And thats where my issue is. Delivery is a seller problem. Its clear that I didnt receive it so I should get money back and then they can sort it out between themselves.

    Not that I'm going to go hungry without the money but its a substantial sum and I'm not letting it go, no way. Simply cant understand the paypal decision. Paypal was my only short term leverage really.


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  • #22
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Deep Thought wrote: »
    Did you report it to the Garda?

    Same happened to me and PayPal asked me to report and then to add the Garda reference to the details.

    I didnt simply because its not actually my issue yet as such. Delivery is a seller problem. Can't really report theft of something that I never received.

    All I know is that I didnt get it and an anPost statement that it wasn't addressed to me. And that nobody wants to be on the hook for it. Whatever else I learned is just verbal - not worth anything right now. Not enough to go to the guards with I think.

    If in the end this is not going to work out for me I may go to the guards depending on what solicitor says.


  • #23
    Cienciano
    Registered Users Posts: 14,223 ✭✭✭✭Cienciano


    Was there a tracking number? Did it tell you the delivery location?


  • #24
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Cienciano wrote: »
    Was there a tracking number? Did it tell you the delivery location?

    Yes there is a tracking number. But for delivery location is has the anpost depot name in the next big town, not my address or even town or post office. Not sure what to make of that.


  • #25
    fat bloke
    Registered Users Posts: 5,812 ✭✭✭fat bloke


    Sounds like a right mess. Very disappointing service from all angles in terms of entrusting cash and goods exchange to supposedly trustworthy intermediaries. What's the seller's position on it now? Was it not a shop purchase? I'd have thought a shop to have reputational concerns and perhaps insurance cover for such things. You upheld your end of the bargain by paying for the item. It's the seller's responsibility to supply you with the product isn't it?


  • #26
    geotrig
    Registered Users Posts: 1,713 ✭✭✭geotrig


    Its really sounds like your case is with an post really and if they have provided in writing that you didn't receive it they should be footing the bill as they acknowledge they handled it and to an incorrect address ,your heresay from the postmater seems a bit odd and not sure what it does for your case.
    The seller probably printed a paypal address label and attached and sent with dhl (the german post service to be clear) and they in turn handed over to an post.

    I had a similar issue a few years ago from an item from amazon to me when it was handed over to the carrier here they delivered to an address up country , i know exactly where as there was an equivalent address in said town .they would not go back and retreive the parcel .luckily amazon where real easy about it and just resent the goods but to me the problem was with the irish carrier.

    the county was printed slightly funny ,i.e first 3 letters but the carrier didn't really put any thought into it.

    Can you query the outcome with paypal ?


  • #27
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,616 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    I think get something into the Gardai sooner than later. Someone else is wearing a watch you paid for. The covid no signature crap is doing you no favours though.

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



  • #28
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,405 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Thanks for all the input guys. I appealed the outcome with Paypal and at least they accepted the appeal. I agree with covid& signatures the situation is even messier than it would be in normal times.

    I am having good correspondence with the seller all the time so I'm getting info from all angles. Everyone is just trying to wriggle out of it. Seller told me that something must have come back from anpost to DHL that DHL didnt like 'cos last week they tried to fob him off saying he was shipping 'dangerous goods' (battery). Couldn't make it up.


  • #29
    Cienciano
    Registered Users Posts: 14,223 ✭✭✭✭Cienciano


    CalamariFritti wrote: »
    Yes there is a tracking number. But for delivery location is has the anpost depot name in the next big town, not my address or even town or post office. Not sure what to make of that.

    I asked because the most common "scam" on certain websites is sending things to the wrong address. I'm guessing the same tracking number is given to a few people. If it was a tracking number from a courier that displays the delivery address, obviously you'd know straight away.
    But the fact that it was a website in germany would seem that it's a genuine mistake, the items that are usually "wrong address" from my experience are cheap aliexpress stuff, probably because people couldn't be arsed following it up.


  • #30
    Del2005
    Registered Users Posts: 18,871 ✭✭✭✭Del2005


    geotrig wrote: »
    Its really sounds like your case is with an post really and if they have provided in writing that you didn't receive it they should be footing the bill as they acknowledge they handled it and to an incorrect address ,your heresay from the postmater seems a bit odd and not sure what it does for your case.
    The seller probably printed a paypal address label and attached and sent with dhl (the german post service to be clear) and they in turn handed over to an post.

    I had a similar issue a few years ago from an item from amazon to me when it was handed over to the carrier here they delivered to an address up country , i know exactly where as there was an equivalent address in said town .they would not go back and retreive the parcel .luckily amazon where real easy about it and just resent the goods but to me the problem was with the irish carrier.

    the county was printed slightly funny ,i.e first 3 letters but the carrier didn't really put any thought into it.

    Can you query the outcome with paypal ?

    The OP has no case with An Post or DHL, their contract is with the seller and the seller has to deal with the delivery companies.

    OP I'd be onto my bank to start a charge back against PayPal, they had their chance now use your next level of protection.


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  • #31
    Ciaranis
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭Ciaranis


    As a regular and long-time PayPal user, I'm quite alarmed that they found against you on this issue. Unless you're opening disputes left, right and centre (which I'm quite sure you're not), they should have your back. I'm sure justice will prevail, but if you have to resort to chargeback to get it, I'd ask serious questions of PayPal's judgment.


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